If only the information were accurate.
Yes, especially when it's clearly documented.
Invalid. Appeal to motive.
Christmas
- Thread starter laura_charlotte
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
If only the information were accurate.
Yes, especially when it's clearly documented.
Invalid. Appeal to motive.
Just to name a couple...
Do you say halleluyah? I believe that is Hebrew meaning "praise Yah" (who is Yah? is that one of the names they tried to erase from the translations?).
How about "amen"?
Nothing to do with removing proper names?
That's rich with deceit and you probably don't even know it...
The proper names were removed by the Jewish Sanhedrin because they did not want people saying the names of Elohim out loud, and replaced with questionable titles such as "God" and "Lord".
Jer 23:26 How long shall this be in the heart of the prophets that prophesy lies? yea, they are prophets of the deceit of their own heart;
Jer 23:27 Which think to cause my people to forget my name by their dreams which they tell every man to his neighbour, as their fathers have forgotten my name for Baal.
That has continued from days of old even to now...
Rom 2:24 For the name of YHWH is blasphemed among the Gentiles through you, as it is written.
Let me ask you, what's your name when you go to another country?
I answer to only my name.
Luke 2
2 In those days Caesar Augustus issued a decree that a census should be taken of the entire Roman world. [SUP]2 [/SUP](This was the first census that took place while[SUP][a][/SUP] Quirinius was governor of Syria.) [SUP]3 [/SUP]And everyone went to their own town to register.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]So Joseph also went up from the town of Nazareth in Galilee to Judea, to Bethlehem the town of David, because he belonged to the house and line of David. [SUP]5 [/SUP]He went there to register with Mary, who was pledged to be married to him and was expecting a child. [SUP]6 [/SUP]While they were there, the time came for the baby to be born, [SUP]7 [/SUP]and she gave birth to her firstborn, a son. She wrapped him in cloths and placed him in a manger, because there was no guest room available for them.
[SUP]8 [/SUP]And there were shepherds living out in the fields nearby, keeping watch over their flocks at night. [SUP]9 [/SUP]An angel of the Lord appeared to them, and the glory of the Lord shone around them, and they were terrified. [SUP]10 [/SUP]But the angel said to them, “Do not be afraid. I bring you good news that will cause great joy for all the people. [SUP]11 [/SUP]Today in the town of David a Savior has been born to you; he is the Messiah, the Lord. [SUP]12 [/SUP]This will be a sign to you: You will find a baby wrapped in cloths and lying in a manger.”
[SUP]13 [/SUP]Suddenly a great company of the heavenly host appeared with the angel, praising God and saying,
[SUP]14 [/SUP]“Glory to God in the highest heaven,
and on earth peace to those on whom his favor rests.”
[SUP]15 [/SUP]When the angels had left them and gone into heaven, the shepherds said to one another, “Let’s go to Bethlehem and see this thing that has happened, which the Lord has told us about.”
[SUP]16 [/SUP]So they hurried off and found Mary and Joseph, and the baby, who was lying in the manger. [SUP]17 [/SUP]When they had seen him, they spread the word concerning what had been told them about this child, [SUP]18 [/SUP]and all who heard it were amazed at what the shepherds said to them. [SUP]19 [/SUP]But Mary treasured up all these things and pondered them in her heart. [SUP]20[/SUP]The shepherds returned, glorifying and praising God for all the things they had heard and seen, which were just as they had been told.
How many other people did the Lord send an angel to announce their birth?
Matthew 2
2 After Jesus was born in Bethlehem in Judea, during the time of King Herod, Magi[SUP][a][/SUP] from the east came to Jerusalem [SUP]2 [/SUP]and asked, “Where is the one who has been born king of the Jews? We saw his star when it rose and have come to worship him.”
[SUP]3 [/SUP]When King Herod heard this he was disturbed, and all Jerusalem with him. [SUP]4 [/SUP]When he had called together all the people’s chief priests and teachers of the law, he asked them where the Messiah was to be born. [SUP]5 [/SUP]“In Bethlehem in Judea,” they replied, “for this is what the prophet has written:
[SUP]6 [/SUP]“‘But you, Bethlehem, in the land of Judah,
are by no means least among the rulers of Judah;
for out of you will come a ruler
who will shepherd my people Israel.’[SUP][b][/SUP]”
[SUP]7 [/SUP]Then Herod called the Magi secretly and found out from them the exact time the star had appeared. [SUP]8 [/SUP]He sent them to Bethlehem and said, “Go and search carefully for the child. As soon as you find him, report to me, so that I too may go and worship him.”
[SUP]9 [/SUP]After they had heard the king, they went on their way, and the star they had seen when it rose went ahead of them until it stopped over the place where the child was. [SUP]10 [/SUP]When they saw the star, they were overjoyed. [SUP]11 [/SUP]On coming to the house, they saw the child with his mother Mary, and they bowed down and worshiped him. Then they opened their treasures and presented him with gifts of gold, frankincense and myrrh. [SUP]12 [/SUP]And having been warned in a dream not to go back to Herod, they returned to their country by another route.
How many people do you know that God placed a star in the sky to announce their birth?
I don't know about you but I think God thought it was important enough to inspire two people to write about it.
UMM Jesus WAS NOT BORN in Jerusalem. There was no room in the inn because of this
Luke 2
2 In those days Caesar Augustus issued a decree that a census should be taken of the entire Roman world. [SUP]2 [/SUP](This was the first census that took place while[SUP][a][/SUP] Quirinius was governor of Syria.) [SUP]3[/SUP]And everyone went to their own town to register.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]So Joseph also went up from the town of Nazareth in Galilee to Judea, to Bethlehem the town of David, because he belonged to the house and line of David. [SUP]5 [/SUP]He went there to register with Mary, who was pledged to be married to him and was expecting a child. [SUP]6 [/SUP]While they were there, the time came for the baby to be born, [SUP]7 [/SUP]and she gave birth to her firstborn, a son. She wrapped him in cloths and placed him in a manger, because there was no guest room available for them.
The temple was in Jerusalem NOT Bethlehem.
K
keepitsimple
Guest
Nah ... it has nothing to do with fear. And like you said, it's up to the individual how they choose to honour the birth of our Saviour ..... whether the day is correct or not. Some never accept God's grace and freedom in Christ either. Hope you have a very merry and blessed Christmas
E
Ella85
Guest
K
Karraster
Guest
Nah ... it has nothing to do with fear. And like you said, it's up to the individual how they choose to honour the birth of our Saviour ..... whether the day is correct or not. Some never accept God's grace and freedom in Christ either. Hope you have a very merry and blessed Christmas
..whether the day is correct or not? That's what I'm talking about. If it's not correct it's a lie. Why celebrate a lie when the truth is much easier to live? Is our identity tied up in traditions of man, or the truth of Messiah? Traditions of the religious leaders of Messiah's day was what He set about to correct, and now we have the truth, and are supposed to be living out the life He has shown us. But you say grace is why we can now lie and He is ok with that?
We should never be afraid of the truth. Sure, we will have to make adjustments to our lifestyles along the way as more truth is shown to us, but it is very much worth the effort.
Well Jimmie, why don't you show us the scriptures that instruct us to keep xmas and Ishtar? Put your money where your mouth is.
K
kennethcadwell
Guest
Colossians 2:16
Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holiday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holiday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
Col 2:17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.
What is it that is coming that xmas is a shadow of?
What does this have to do with anything I've said? My point, made on numerous threads now, is that Christmas didn't originate from Saturnalia, Sol Invictus, or another pagan holiday. As an alternative, based on source material (Hippolytus, Clement of Alexandria, John Chrysostom, etc..), I think it originated from the idea that Jesus was conceived and crucified on the same day.
Clearly such a thing is certainly legendary, and there is no command that "you have to observe Christmas" (where have I ever said that anyway???), but it's not pagan in origin. An argument can be made for a winter birth, but proving 25 Dec is impossible. John Chrysostom was the first to do this based on the courses of the priests in the temple; a recent attempt has been made by Roger Beckwith (Calendar and Chronology, Jewish and Christian).
K
kennethcadwell
Guest
The point that is made in this chapter is that what ever we do, as long as we are doing it for God. Nobody has the right to judge us on them because all of them will cease eventually and are meaningless now when it comes to salvation. Rather you eat ham or don't eat ham does not determine salvation, if you celebrate a holiday or don't celebrate one it does not determine salvation, and so on and so on.............
What determines salvation is your faith and obedience to the Lord Jesus Christ, not in food, holidays, a Sabbath day rather you do it on Saturday, Sunday, or everyday, works of the mosaic laws ( following them ). None of those things but being in Christ matter. If I celebrate Christmas for the birth of our Lord and Savior, I am not following a pagan custom. Same with Easter, if I do for the Lord then it is not paganistic.
Just because we can argue and debate that these are not the exact dates the birth, death and resurrection these fell on, does not make them wrong to do. For the bible clearly states that if you give the day to God, and all you do in it to Him then there is nothing you are doing that is wrong.
-
The Watch Tower Society views all birthday celebrations as acts of worship;
ergo: seeing as how their Jesus Christ was only "a" god instead of "the" god,
then in their mind's eye it would be a violation of the very first of the ten
commandments to honor his birth.
» Note that I used a past tense verb when I spoke of the Watch Tower
Society's Jesus Christ. That's because the Watch Tower Society's Jesus
Christ is still dead.
The reason for it is given on page 237 of the April 15, 1963 issue of the
Watch Tower magazine; where it's stated: "If Jesus were to take his body of
flesh, blood, and bones to heaven and enjoy them there, what would this
mean? It would mean that there would be no resurrection of the dead for
anybody. Why not? Because Jesus would be taking his sacrifice off God's
altar."
Seeing as how human life is entirely physical in Watch Tower theology, then
since Jesus Christ's body never returned to life; he does not exist.
Who then was raised from the dead as Jesus Christ? Well it wasn't Jesus
Christ; it was an angel named Michael. According to the Watch Tower
Society, Michael the arch angel volunteered to come to the earth and die for
the sins of the world. But in order to do so, he had to relinquish his angel life
in order to become a human life. In other words: Michael had to die; and
seeing as how there is no such thing as an afterlife existence in Watch Tower
Society theology; then when Michael died, he went entirely out of existence.
So then, the resurrection that traditional Christianity knows as Jesus Christ's
resurrection was actually Michael's when God created him back into
existence to his former self as an angel. Confusion abounds over this
because the Society's Michael retained the human name Jesus Christ when
he returned to heaven.
The Society goes on to say that Michael's appearances as a human being
after he was created back to his former self as an angel were done is a
"materialized" body that even had replications of the wounds that the real
Jesus Christ received while undergoing crucifixion; including the incision that
a soldier's spear made in his side. In other words: Michael's resurrection
appearances were done in what we know today in movie technology as an
avatar.
========================================
The Watch Tower Society views all birthday celebrations as acts of worship;
ergo: seeing as how their Jesus Christ was only "a" god instead of "the" god,
then in their mind's eye it would be a violation of the very first of the ten
commandments to honor his birth.
» Note that I used a past tense verb when I spoke of the Watch Tower
Society's Jesus Christ. That's because the Watch Tower Society's Jesus
Christ is still dead.
The reason for it is given on page 237 of the April 15, 1963 issue of the
Watch Tower magazine; where it's stated: "If Jesus were to take his body of
flesh, blood, and bones to heaven and enjoy them there, what would this
mean? It would mean that there would be no resurrection of the dead for
anybody. Why not? Because Jesus would be taking his sacrifice off God's
altar."
Seeing as how human life is entirely physical in Watch Tower theology, then
since Jesus Christ's body never returned to life; he does not exist.
Who then was raised from the dead as Jesus Christ? Well it wasn't Jesus
Christ; it was an angel named Michael. According to the Watch Tower
Society, Michael the arch angel volunteered to come to the earth and die for
the sins of the world. But in order to do so, he had to relinquish his angel life
in order to become a human life. In other words: Michael had to die; and
seeing as how there is no such thing as an afterlife existence in Watch Tower
Society theology; then when Michael died, he went entirely out of existence.
So then, the resurrection that traditional Christianity knows as Jesus Christ's
resurrection was actually Michael's when God created him back into
existence to his former self as an angel. Confusion abounds over this
because the Society's Michael retained the human name Jesus Christ when
he returned to heaven.
The Society goes on to say that Michael's appearances as a human being
after he was created back to his former self as an angel were done is a
"materialized" body that even had replications of the wounds that the real
Jesus Christ received while undergoing crucifixion; including the incision that
a soldier's spear made in his side. In other words: Michael's resurrection
appearances were done in what we know today in movie technology as an
avatar.
========================================
such joyless people. I honestly pray none of you had children that you raised in joyless christmas-less homes. If you did, my heart breaks for how miserable their childhood must have been, being the family with the crazy religious nut parents while everyone else enjoyed the holidays.
Which are a shadow of (things to come); but the body (is) of Christ.”
the word (is) was added, this verse should reads
let no one tell you right or wrong about things, but the body of christ(the church)
27Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular.
8Therefore let us (keep the feast)
