3 Miseries of Legalism

[atwhatcost]

Legalism is attempting to earn God’s approval with our works. It is man’s attempt to qualify himself to stand before God on his own merits. We are recovering legalists, for there was a time, before Christ rescued us, when we attempted to find our joy in ourselves, our salvation by ourselves. Now we trust His perfect and sufficient work for us on the cross instead of our works.

But because we are recovering legalists, we still wrestle with returning to our good deeds to alleviate our guilty consciences, earn God’s favor, or distinguish ourselves from other people. Because of this, the apostle Paul reminds us of the misery and futility of legalism. “Christ has liberated us to be free. Stand firm then and don’t submit again to a yoke of slavery” (Galatians 5:1).

With legalism:

Your joy is never full

If we seek God’s approval in our own works, our joy is never full. We are burdened down with a yoke of slavery. Christ is of no benefit to those who seek salvation in themselves (Galatians 5:2), which means joy always alludes the legalist as joy is found only in Him. As C.S. Lewis stated, “God cannot give us a happiness and peace apart from Himself, because it is not there. There is no such thing.”

Your work is never finished

Legalism is exhausting because there is always something else to do. As believers in the Galatian churches considered circumcision to attempt to earn God’s favor, Paul declared that “every man who gets himself circumcised…is obligated to keep the entire law.” In other words, if you want to stand on your own works, you have to be able to keep all of the law, which none of us can. If you want to achieve, the work never ends. The work is never over. Thankfully, grace is received, not achieved. And the work is over as Jesus yelled out, “It is finished.”

Your standing is never secure

Legalism leaves people wondering if they are ever secure, if their works are ever enough. They are not. If our works could be sufficient, then Christ died for nothing (Galatians 2:21). So Christ is alienated from those who seek to justify themselves by their own works (Galatians 5:4). But for those of us who trust Christ and His finished work on the cross, our standing is secure, not because of us but because of Him. Those who realize and confess their weakness and need for grace are secure. Those who think they are strong in themselves are never secure. - 3 Miseries of Legalism - Eric Geiger

Eric had me up until the my work is never finished. Well, sorry, but that's true. Granted the work will finish one day, but that's called "glorification." Sanctification is all about putting in the effort to do God'a work. And yes, it's exhausting, but I have to get this house/me ready to spend eternity glorifying God.

Anarchy isn't any better than legalism.

 

[blood_bought]

Oh, But it is not condemned as legalism, unless actuall legalism is being taught.

the problem is people do not want to discuss obedience, they want to discuss how one is saved . if we do not get that right, we can not go on to other things, we have to stick with milk, and not meat.

faithfulness is impossible without obedience.

Overcoming is no the same as being perfect.

The danger is thinking one has overcome and they have made it when they have not. For then they will be "holier than thou" and think they have done growing, when in reality, they have a long ways to go.

i can agree with this, and haven't said otherwise. but we cannot reduce salvation to "having been received by a one-time confession of faith".

overcoming is accomplished by faithfulness. faithfulness is evidenced in deeds.

Yes, because they had gods truth in their hands, and let it slip through. Imagine how much more pain they will suffer for eternity.

righteousness is a target that must be hit, as opposed to missing the mark. the Gospel is Good News, but easy greasy grace is just not biblical.

 

[atwhatcost]

Imo, "legalism" is a code word for people who don't want to go to Church. These people seem to want God to conform to them on their time.

The "going to church" is merely Commandment #3 in your church. (Commandment #4 for most other churches. lol) Do you really think "legalism" is just sticking with one commandment?

 

[SeaBass]

The op did not even talk about those verses. You took a conversation and went around it, and did not even discuss the topic which was started.

You need to learn how to discuss things. If you want to discuss the topic at hand, answer his questions, if you want to discuss the 4 verses. there are more than enough threads where they would fit into the discussion.

Those verses prove one must do works to be accepted with God. So it is a biblical fact one must do works to be accepted with God, the only question that remains is what kind of works must one do to be accepted with God.

 

[atwhatcost]

spoken like a true catholic and legalist.

Legalism is a person who goes to church to be saved, and Not because He is saved, and wants to spend as much time as he can with Gods familiy.

Of course, to a legalist, you can not understand this concept, your religion has blinded you to this truth.

Really? Granted I keep most legalists on ignore so I have no idea what the two legalists said before MW wrote something, but you're going to pick on MW first? Really really?

Hey, MW is coming from his background, and I got to say, he's not wrong there. In the Catholic Church the legalists do tend to think they're exempted from going to church. He's really right there. The only reason he's not right completely is because he simply doesn't know how legalism raises its blasted head apart from his denomination.

So, yo. Give him a break. Do you know what legalism looks like in the Presbyterian Church? The Methodist Church? The Baptists? AoG? Simply not understanding other denoms or nondenoms doesn't automatically make you wrong about your own denom. And, it doesn't make you an expert on his denom. Give the guy a break and do what you usually do -- fight the ones who are going to disagree, because they are the only sinless people worthy of disagreeing. Yeesh. You've got the heart. You have to aim better at who to use that heart on.

 

[SeaBass]

1. Those who sin have never known God (personally) ie, were never saved.

Do you sin? If so, by your own words your sinning proves you were never saved.

 

[Is]

The verses I posted prove that obedient works are necessary in order to be accepted and to continue to be accepted with God...quit doing the works required of God and become a reproach to God

I read this the other day and it made me think maybe we aren't saved when we are born again.

And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man's work, pass the time of your sojourning here with fear. 1Peter 1:17

If we're saved when we accept Jesus as our Lord and Saviour, why would we have be in fear?

 

[SeaBass]

I read this the other day and it made me think maybe we aren't saved when we are born again.

And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man's work, pass the time of your sojourning here with fear. 1Peter 1:17

If we're saved when we accept Jesus as our Lord and Saviour, why would we have be in fear?

Fear in having reverence (Heb 12:28) and awe (Psa 33:8) not fear as in terror, dread.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

faithfulness is impossible without obedience.

You have it backwards. Obedience is not possible without faith. It may look like obedience, Talk like obedience, smell or taste like it. But without faith it is impossible to please God (obey his will)

i can agree with this, and haven't said otherwise. but we cannot reduce salvation to "having been received by a one-time confession of faith".

I agree, We can not reduce it to a mere confession. We have to reduce it to a one time living breathing receiving faith.

anything else is legalism

overcoming is accomplished by faithfulness. faithfulness is evidenced in deeds.

yep. but it is still not perfect. It still would be condemned if it fell under the law by itself (apart from Christ)

righteousness is a target that must be hit, as opposed to missing the mark. the Gospel is Good News, but easy greasy grace is just not biblical.

The mark is the law. No one can live under the law and survive, Paul could not do it. I can not do it, You can not do it. If you think you can, You are fooling yourself.

You prove how what you claim to be easy grace is not so easy, So many people want to twist it to work. and miss out on it.

My faith is not easy, it is not based on ANYTHING I CAN SEE (my actions, my growth, My son or my non sin) it is based solely on God. that is what it is called faith.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Those verses prove one must do works to be accepted with God. So it is a biblical fact one must do works to be accepted with God, the only question that remains is what kind of works must one do to be accepted with God.

That is not the topic of this op. either stick to the topic. or leave please.

Thank you.

 

[Is]

"For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost. And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, If they shall fall away, to re-new them again unto repentence; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. Hebrews 6:4-6


Wouldn't this be proof if we're not doing Gods's will we are not saved?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Do you sin? If so, by your own words your sinning proves you were never saved.

So, if that is true, WHo is john talking about?

instead of making open ended argments, Stick to the word and try to explain what John really meant.

 

[blondieindahouse]

"For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost. And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, If they shall fall away, to re-new them again unto repentence; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. Hebrews 6:4-6


Wouldn't this be proof if we're not doing Gods's will we are not saved?

The falling away here mentioned, is an open and avowed renouncing of Christ, from enmity of heart against him, his cause, and people, by men approving in their minds the deeds of his murderers, and all this after they have received the knowledge of the truth, and tasted some of its comforts. Of these it is said, that it is impossible to renew them again unto repentance. Not because the blood of Christ is not sufficient to obtain pardon for this sin; but this sin, in its very nature, is opposite to repentance and every thing that leads to it.
Matthew Henry commentary

 

[SeaBass]

That is not the topic of this op. either stick to the topic. or leave please.

Thank you.

The OP stated:

Legalism is attempting to earn God’s approval with our works. It is man’s attempt to qualify himself to stand before God on his own merits. We are recovering legalists, for there was a time, before Christ rescued us, when we attempted to find our joy in ourselves, our salvation by ourselves. Now we trust His perfect and sufficient work for us on the cross instead of our works.

I simply posted verses that prove one must do works to be approved by God, the issue that remains is what type of works must one to to be accepted with God. The work Christ came to earth and did does not make the OP approved/accepted unto God but Christ's obedient works unto the Father (Phil 2:8,9) exalted Christ.

 

[SeaBass]

"For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost. And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, If they shall fall away, to re-new them again unto repentence; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. Hebrews 6:4-6


Wouldn't this be proof if we're not doing Gods's will we are not saved?

1 Jn 3:10 as long as one continues to not do righteousness (God's will) he continues to not be of God.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

The OP stated:

Legalism is attempting to earn God’s approval with our works. It is man’s attempt to qualify himself to stand before God on his own merits. We are recovering legalists, for there was a time, before Christ rescued us, when we attempted to find our joy in ourselves, our salvation by ourselves. Now we trust His perfect and sufficient work for us on the cross instead of our works.

I simply posted verses that prove one must do works to be approved by God, the issue that remains is what type of works must one to to be accepted with God. The work Christ came to earth and did does not make the OP approved/accepted unto God but Christ's obedient works unto the Father (Phil 2:8,9) exalted Christ.

The op gave three reasons why

You have failed to answer even 1 reason.

I guess we should all assume since you do not wish to answer ANY of the things the op brought up. That you would agree with them.

Thank you for your time.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

1 Jn 3:10 as long as one continues to not do righteousness (God's will) he continues to not be of God.

Yet he can try to be righteous all he wants, yet he will still fall short of the glory of God (miss the mark, Sin, etc etc)

So he still would not be of God.

 

[SeaBass]

So, if that is true, WHo is john talking about?

instead of making open ended argments, Stick to the word and try to explain what John really meant.

It is an "excuse" offered by some proponents of eternal security that if a Christian sins then that is proof he was never really saved, ex Judas sinned proves he was never really saved, Simon (Acts 8) sinned proving he was never really saved.

Therefore if Judas' and Simon's sinning supposedly proves they were never really saved then ANYONE's sinning prove they were never really saved...true for one true for all.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

It is an "excuse" offered by some proponents of eternal security that if a Christian sins then that is proof he was never really saved, ex Judas sinned proves he was never really saved, Simon (Acts 8) sinned proving he was never really saved.
Therefore if Judas' and Simon's sinning supposedly proves they were never really saved then ANYONE's sinning prove they were never really saved...true for one true for all.

Well I never heard this excuse before. Can you show me where someone ever used this excuse? Because that is not what it is saying at all.

and can you show me what it is actually saying (this is the second time I have asked. again you went and did something other than what was asked. Does it not bother you when people do this to you? so why do you do it to others?

 

[SeaBass]

The op gave three reasons why

You have failed to answer even 1 reason.

I guess we should all assume since you do not wish to answer ANY of the things the op brought up. That you would agree with them.

Thank you for your time.

The OP:

But because we are recovering legalists, we still wrestle with returning to our good deeds to alleviate our guilty consciences, earn God’s favor, or distinguish ourselves from other people. Because of this, the apostle Paul reminds us of the misery and futility of legalism. “Christ has liberated us to be free. Stand firm then and don’t submit again to a yoke of slavery” (Galatians 5:1).

With legalism:

Your joy is never full

If we seek God’s approval in our own works, our joy is never full. We are burdened down with a yoke of slavery. Christ is of no benefit to those who seek salvation in themselves (Galatians 5:2), which means joy always alludes the legalist as joy is found only in Him. As C.S. Lewis stated, “God cannot give us a happiness and peace apart from Himself, because it is not there. There is no such thing.”

Your work is never finished

Legalism is exhausting because there is always something else to do. As believers in the Galatian churches considered circumcision to attempt to earn God’s favor, Paul declared that “every man who gets himself circumcised…is obligated to keep the entire law.” In other words, if you want to stand on your own works, you have to be able to keep all of the law, which none of us can. If you want to achieve, the work never ends. The work is never over. Thankfully, grace is received, not achieved. And the work is over as Jesus yelled out, “It is finished.”

Your standing is never secure

Legalism leaves people wondering if they are ever secure, if their works are ever enough. They are not. If our works could be sufficient, then Christ died for nothing (Galatians 2:21). So Christ is alienated from those who seek to justify themselves by their own works (Galatians 5:4). But for those of us who trust Christ and His finished work on the cross, our standing is secure, not because of us but because of Him. Those who realize and confess their weakness and need for grace are secure. Those who think they are strong in themselves are never secure.




The OP has explaining to do:

does the OP exclude ALL works from being accepted with God?

Does the OP try and (mis)use Gal 5:1 to free man from the obeying/keeping the law of Christ in order to be accepted with God?

What does the OP mean by one's work is never finished? Rev 2:26 the ones that overcome are the ones the keepeth (present tense) Christ's works.

Does the OP understand that Gal 2:21 and Gal 5:4 refers to works of the OT law and not obedience to Christ's NT?