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The reason is that your future sin has been dealt with, as well. Jesus paid the price for all sin, including your future sin. If he didn't pay for future sin, then the penalty of sin is death. You would have to die. Or, Jesus would have to have been crucified again and again since the foundation of the world (as the scriptures state, in Hebrews). But thank God, His sacrifice was once and for all! Praise God, yes!?
Don't make Jesus' blood common as the blood of bulls and goats. His blood doesn't cover sin, it takes it away! When God looks at you, He sees you righteous because you are in Jesus. He sees Jesus, not you and your faults. He sees your Savior and the imputed righteousness. We took Adam's sin, Jesus took our sin, and then we received Jesus' righteousness. A three part imputation! His righteousness has been imputed to you and you stand before God without condemnation.
You don't need to die now so that you stop sinning because in God's eyes your sins of scarlet are as white as snow, and the Word even goes on to say that He remembers them no more. You are cleansed, washed and sanctified in Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of the Lord.
Don't make Jesus' blood common as the blood of bulls and goats. His blood doesn't cover sin, it takes it away! When God looks at you, He sees you righteous because you are in Jesus. He sees Jesus, not you and your faults. He sees your Savior and the imputed righteousness. We took Adam's sin, Jesus took our sin, and then we received Jesus' righteousness. A three part imputation! His righteousness has been imputed to you and you stand before God without condemnation.
You don't need to die now so that you stop sinning because in God's eyes your sins of scarlet are as white as snow, and the Word even goes on to say that He remembers them no more. You are cleansed, washed and sanctified in Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of the Lord.
M
Is it wrong to not trust God? Is it wrong to take Jesus sacrifice as nothing? Is it wrong to not die of the flesh? Is it wrong to put self before God? Is it wrong to follow your own plan instead of God's? Do you have to forgive? Is it wrong to make God a liar?
These are just a few of the question that should be asked in place of yours. Suicide says "No" to all this. God says "Yes"
Then there's questions like these: Who owns you? Who owns your body? Who has the rights to it? Suicide says "I do" God says "I do"
God says-" that He made us with a purpose, fearfully, and wonderfully, that with Him we have a hope and a future. That Jesus died so you could not only live eternally but have an abundant life here."
Suicide says- "that you were made to die, your worthless, meaningless, nothing, that there will never be any hope or any future, so why even live. "
I could go on and on, but suicide is wrong unfortunately and goes against everything God says and wants for us. Suicide makes itself your master instead of God, and with all those lies hitting you, they are sure coming from the Father of them. Sin is lawlessness in the simplest form, sin= death. Suicidal spirit has sin and death written all over it, where sin is God's wrath is, hell is God's wrath. Therefore, suicide=lawlessness, lawlessness=sin, sin=death, death=hell.
That's how I see it. And a smiley to take away the gloom from this topic
These are just a few of the question that should be asked in place of yours. Suicide says "No" to all this. God says "Yes"
Then there's questions like these: Who owns you? Who owns your body? Who has the rights to it? Suicide says "I do" God says "I do"
God says-" that He made us with a purpose, fearfully, and wonderfully, that with Him we have a hope and a future. That Jesus died so you could not only live eternally but have an abundant life here."
Suicide says- "that you were made to die, your worthless, meaningless, nothing, that there will never be any hope or any future, so why even live. "
I could go on and on, but suicide is wrong unfortunately and goes against everything God says and wants for us. Suicide makes itself your master instead of God, and with all those lies hitting you, they are sure coming from the Father of them. Sin is lawlessness in the simplest form, sin= death. Suicidal spirit has sin and death written all over it, where sin is God's wrath is, hell is God's wrath. Therefore, suicide=lawlessness, lawlessness=sin, sin=death, death=hell.
That's how I see it. And a smiley to take away the gloom from this topic
T
Is it wrong to not trust God? Is it wrong to take Jesus sacrifice as nothing? Is it wrong to not die of the flesh? Is it wrong to put self before God? Is it wrong to follow your own plan instead of God's? Do you have to forgive? Is it wrong to make God a liar?
These are just a few of the question that should be asked in place of yours. Suicide says "No" to all this. God says "Yes"
Then there's questions like these: Who owns you? Who owns your body? Who has the rights to it? Suicide says "I do" God says "I do"
God says-" that He made us with a purpose, fearfully, and wonderfully, that with Him we have a hope and a future. That Jesus died so you could not only live eternally but have an abundant life here."
Suicide says- "that you were made to die, your worthless, meaningless, nothing, that there will never be any hope or any future, so why even live. "
I could go on and on, but suicide is wrong unfortunately and goes against everything God says and wants for us. Suicide makes itself your master instead of God, and with all those lies hitting you, they are sure coming from the Father of them. Sin is lawlessness in the simplest form, sin= death. Suicidal spirit has sin and death written all over it, where sin is God's wrath is, hell is God's wrath. Therefore, suicide=lawlessness, lawlessness=sin, sin=death, death=hell.
That's how I see it. And a smiley to take away the gloom from this topic
These are just a few of the question that should be asked in place of yours. Suicide says "No" to all this. God says "Yes"
Then there's questions like these: Who owns you? Who owns your body? Who has the rights to it? Suicide says "I do" God says "I do"
God says-" that He made us with a purpose, fearfully, and wonderfully, that with Him we have a hope and a future. That Jesus died so you could not only live eternally but have an abundant life here."
Suicide says- "that you were made to die, your worthless, meaningless, nothing, that there will never be any hope or any future, so why even live. "
I could go on and on, but suicide is wrong unfortunately and goes against everything God says and wants for us. Suicide makes itself your master instead of God, and with all those lies hitting you, they are sure coming from the Father of them. Sin is lawlessness in the simplest form, sin= death. Suicidal spirit has sin and death written all over it, where sin is God's wrath is, hell is God's wrath. Therefore, suicide=lawlessness, lawlessness=sin, sin=death, death=hell.
That's how I see it. And a smiley to take away the gloom from this topic
Hey Ben,
I liked what the guy in the beginning of this thread said about Samson. I, too, had not seen that one.
But on the other hand (yikes), Jesus said of Judas Iscariot that it would have been better if that one had never been born. I have always thought that to mean he is in hell.
Matt 26:24 The Son of man goeth as it is written of him: but woe unto that man by whom the Son of man is betrayed! it had been good for that man if he had not been born.
The reason I bring up Judas is because after his betrayal, scripture says he repented (or felt remorse, by some translations), before hanging himself.
Matt 27:3 Then Judas, which had betrayed him, when he saw that he was condemned, repented himself, and brought again the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests and elders,
Matt 27:4 Saying, I have sinned in that I have betrayed the innocent blood. And they said, What is that to us? see thou to that.
Matt 27:5 And he cast down the pieces of silver in the temple, and departed, and went and hanged himself.
Conclusion to draw from this?
I liked what the guy in the beginning of this thread said about Samson. I, too, had not seen that one.
But on the other hand (yikes), Jesus said of Judas Iscariot that it would have been better if that one had never been born. I have always thought that to mean he is in hell.
Matt 26:24 The Son of man goeth as it is written of him: but woe unto that man by whom the Son of man is betrayed! it had been good for that man if he had not been born.
The reason I bring up Judas is because after his betrayal, scripture says he repented (or felt remorse, by some translations), before hanging himself.
Matt 27:3 Then Judas, which had betrayed him, when he saw that he was condemned, repented himself, and brought again the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests and elders,
Matt 27:4 Saying, I have sinned in that I have betrayed the innocent blood. And they said, What is that to us? see thou to that.
Matt 27:5 And he cast down the pieces of silver in the temple, and departed, and went and hanged himself.
Conclusion to draw from this?
M
I love that about the blood of Jesus and agree. Yet, the Bible makes it clear we are to die of self, and that we are to confess our sins and that He is faithful to forgive when we do so, if not we call God a liar. We are forgiven but we aren't perfect, repentance isn't a one time thing it's a lifestyle. It's how we die, it's sanctification which is God's will for us.
Isn't suicide trampling over the blood of Jesus anyway? Like Hitler was a Christian, Crusaders were Christians, KKK were Christians, does that mean their future sins were forgiven? Do they get to go to heaven? I don't think so. They traded the truth of God for a lie. Same for suicide. Jesus died to give us life, what is a person saying to Him when they take that very life He gave? I don't' think it's good
Isn't suicide trampling over the blood of Jesus anyway? Like Hitler was a Christian, Crusaders were Christians, KKK were Christians, does that mean their future sins were forgiven? Do they get to go to heaven? I don't think so. They traded the truth of God for a lie. Same for suicide. Jesus died to give us life, what is a person saying to Him when they take that very life He gave? I don't' think it's good
A
I say this as someone who came very close to it at one time, so I do understand the desire.
For Bible reference: Pro. 3:5-6
"Trust in the Lord with all your heart and do not lean on your own understanding. In all your ways acknowledge him, and he will make straight your paths."
Suicide is not that.
It's a permanent outcome to a short situation. The only problem is when you're there it feels eternal.
Then again, quite often, (if not all the time), the person who is to that point has lost the ability to think clearly, so it's probably a mental disability. I know in my case it was closely related to I couldn't take the pain any longer and no one was giving me hope that the pain would ever end. A doctor actually told me to "grin and bear it."
So, I don't know how the brain works to judge honestly if it is or isn't sin.
For Bible reference: Pro. 3:5-6
"Trust in the Lord with all your heart and do not lean on your own understanding. In all your ways acknowledge him, and he will make straight your paths."
Suicide is not that.
It's a permanent outcome to a short situation. The only problem is when you're there it feels eternal.
Then again, quite often, (if not all the time), the person who is to that point has lost the ability to think clearly, so it's probably a mental disability. I know in my case it was closely related to I couldn't take the pain any longer and no one was giving me hope that the pain would ever end. A doctor actually told me to "grin and bear it."
So, I don't know how the brain works to judge honestly if it is or isn't sin.
STARTING WITH THAT MADE UP THEOLOGY.
There are only two kinds of people, Unsaved sinners who remain unforgiven, and Saved Sinners who are forgiven, solely because of what HE DID ON THE CROSS.
Mark 3:28-29 (HCSB)
[SUP]28 [/SUP]I assure you: People will be forgiven for all sins and whatever blasphemies they may blaspheme.
[SUP]29 [/SUP]But whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness, but is guilty of an eternal sin”—
Are you suggesting that Jesus did not tell the truth here?
Are you suggesting that YOU are not a sinner?
Romans 14:23 (NKJV)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] But he who doubts is condemned if he eats, because he does not eat from faith;
for whatever is not from faith is sin.
So tell us, how much of your DAILY LIFE is NOT FROM FAITH.
Romans 3:10 (NRSV)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] as it is written: "There is no one who is righteous, not even one;
Romans 7:14-25 (NIV)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] We know that the law is spiritual; but I am unspiritual, sold as a slave to sin.
[SUP]15 [/SUP] I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do.
[SUP]16 [/SUP] And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good.
[SUP]17 [/SUP] As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out.
[SUP]19 [/SUP] For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do--this I keep on doing.
[SUP]20 [/SUP] Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
[SUP]21 [/SUP] So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me.
[SUP]22 [/SUP] For in my inner being I delight in God's law;
[SUP]23 [/SUP] but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members.
[SUP]24 [/SUP] What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death?
[SUP]25 [/SUP] Thanks be to God--through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, I myself in my mind am a slave to God's law, but in the sinful nature a slave to the law of sin.
1 Timothy 1:15 (ESV)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] The saying is trustworthy and deserving of full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came
into the world to save sinners, of whom I am the foremost.
GEE your theory that we can get rid of our SIN NATURE, does not hold much water.
1 Corinthians 15:52 (YLT)
[SUP]52 [/SUP] in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, in the last trumpet, for it shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we--we shall be changed:
Romans 1:22-23 (ASV)
[SUP]22 [/SUP] Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
[SUP]23 [/SUP] and changed the glory of the incorruptible God for the likeness of an image of corruptible man, and of birds, and four-footed beasts, and creeping things.
WE are not the one's who earn righteousness. GRACE is receiving what we DO NOT DESERVE and CANNOT EARN.
Revelation 7:14 (NKJV)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] And I said to him, "Sir, you know." So he said to me, "These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and washed their {sin stained} robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
Philippians 3:12-16 (HCSB)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] Not that I have already reached ⌊the goal⌋ or am already fully mature, but I make every effort to take hold of it because I also have been taken hold of by Christ Jesus.
[SUP]13 [/SUP] Brothers, I do not consider myself to have taken hold of it. But one thing I do: Forgetting what is behind and reaching forward to what is ahead,
[SUP]14 [/SUP] I pursue as my goal the prize promised by God’s heavenly call in Christ Jesus.
[SUP]15 [/SUP] Therefore, all who are mature should think this way. And if you think differently about anything, God will reveal this also to you.
[SUP]16 [/SUP] In any case, we should live up to whatever ⌊truth⌋ we have attained.
Well look at that, we are not given a sinless, incorruptible body until after we are raised from the dead, and the only exception is those who are still alive when HE comes to call out HIS Bride to go to the Wedding of the Lamb.
OH MY, if it was not for the BLOOD OF THE LAMB, NONE of us would make it to heaven.
G
.You believe you lost your salvation because you took to a bottle and about drank yourself to death. Your focus is not on Jesus Christ and His integrity to keep you. You think it is based upon your integrity and behavior.
You focus on your integrity and character to keep you instead of the Saviors integrity. You are creature focused and not Creator focused. THATS WHAT I MEAN BY THAT.
~~~~~~
A believer who commits suicide.........NOTHING<NOTHING>NOTHING can separate us from the love of Christ.
I believe you are a child in Christ and I should be calling you "son" or "child."
You focus on your integrity and character to keep you instead of the Saviors integrity. You are creature focused and not Creator focused. THATS WHAT I MEAN BY THAT.
~~~~~~
A believer who commits suicide.........NOTHING<NOTHING>NOTHING can separate us from the love of Christ.
I believe you are a child in Christ and I should be calling you "son" or "child."
ONE, truly born again believers will not be here when the Mark of the Beast law in implemented, we have been invited to be at the the Wedding of the Lamb, which will take place at the same time, in HEAVEN in the New City Jerusalem.
TWO, those who turn to Believe in Jesus AFTER the Bride of Christ is called out of this earth, if they are TRUE believers, they will REFUSE that mark and be beheaded.
THREE, I am not the one that chose a wolf face for my Avatar.
Besides I supported all of my beliefs with the Supporting Scriptures, you have not.
http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/95283-calling-out-bride-go-wedding-lamb-23.html
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K
There is no verse that says suicide is wrong.But the concept of life having value is.Life is a gift from God,only He has a right to take it. The Bible tells us we have purpose,God had a plan for us and knew us in the womb.Murder is wrong and so is self murder.There are so many people sick in hospital beds that would love to have more time,it is wrong to take your own life that God has blessed you with.That said churches need to be prepared to help those in distress and depression and give them hope.
There are two mentions of when to commit suicide in the bible that I can find. Each one seems to be to avoid or atone for a sin. One is from the guilt of killing others in Proverbs 28:17 and the second is the tying of a millstone around one's neck to drown one's self instead of causing a child to stumble in Matthew 18:6. I don't know if it will save them or only make their punishment less severe.
BlackDove, I've talked to you for a bit and you really are a sweet kid. But I just have to say this..
Just because you don't agree with someone or someone doesn't agree with you doesn't make them "wolves".
Everyone has different beliefs and interpret scripture differently. Sometimes it's wright and sometimes it's wrong. But that doesn't make them a "wolf"
BenFTW makes very good points.
I've seen MANY of his posts. Though I may not believe or agree with everything he says. He really does speak from the heart and trys to help others understand. When someone does point something out that he says is wrong or worded wrong he listens. (From what I've noticed)
A "wolf" wouldn't be willing to learn from others.
Please watch what you call others on here. It will get you banned sooner or later if you're not careful.
P
Words fail me, and that is saying something.
I had to take a couple of moments to compose myself.
You draw the most asinine conclusions from the most straightforward posts.
Stopping sinning isn't a work. How in the world did you come to that conclusion? You can't be that slow...surely.
Sin isn't allowed in heaven. After I stopped drinking I had to repent of it. Being a drunkard is a sin.
My focus, for me to come to that conclusion, was completely and specifically based on heaven, Christ, and finding my way back to His favor.
You're just not very bright, and that is being kind about it.
You keep listening to teachers with itching ears, you keep believing doctrine that isn't in the bible. It is going to get you in deep trouble.
You're trying to establish your own righteousness, either in ignorance of Gods' righteousness or in disregard of it. Either way it bodes trouble for you.
I had to take a couple of moments to compose myself.
You draw the most asinine conclusions from the most straightforward posts.
Stopping sinning isn't a work. How in the world did you come to that conclusion? You can't be that slow...surely.
Sin isn't allowed in heaven. After I stopped drinking I had to repent of it. Being a drunkard is a sin.
My focus, for me to come to that conclusion, was completely and specifically based on heaven, Christ, and finding my way back to His favor.
You're just not very bright, and that is being kind about it.
You keep listening to teachers with itching ears, you keep believing doctrine that isn't in the bible. It is going to get you in deep trouble.
You're trying to establish your own righteousness, either in ignorance of Gods' righteousness or in disregard of it. Either way it bodes trouble for you.
"You're trying to establish your own righteousness", says the guy who was, and I quote, "finding my way back to His favor" after having "stopped drinking." I don't say this to mock you, or have a "Gotcha!" moment. I say this to reveal to you that you felt your sin alienated you from the Lord, when He was there all along, never forsaking you. When your lips touched the bottle, he was present. Guess what? Even when you were with the bottle in hand, because you are in Christ, you are the righteousness of God in Jesus Christ. That isn't a license to sin, its a revelation that what you were doing no longer aligns with who you now are in Jesus. That you have been set free from that bondage by His grace and sin has no dominion over you.
Its good that you have been set free from being a drunkard, and congrats. You are right, it is a sin. However, just realise, that God loved you before you put the bottle down and still loves you the same after you put it down. He surely is not grieved any longer by your drinking, because he knows how devastating it can be to His children; surely He rejoices in your triumph. Just keep in mind His favor was ever present, you were always in His good graces because you are in Jesus.
Its good that you have been set free from being a drunkard, and congrats. You are right, it is a sin. However, just realise, that God loved you before you put the bottle down and still loves you the same after you put it down. He surely is not grieved any longer by your drinking, because he knows how devastating it can be to His children; surely He rejoices in your triumph. Just keep in mind His favor was ever present, you were always in His good graces because you are in Jesus.
First, depression affects 10% of the population in North America. That means for every 10 people, 1 is depressed, sooner or later.
Second, depression is a condition where the BRAIN does not work properly. It is lacking in Seratonin, Dopamine, and other neurotransmitters. It is helped by medication. It is NOT a sin condition, but an ILLNESS.
Third, there is some very wrong theology driving the posts who claim someone who suicides is going to hell. That bad theology is thinking that your salvation hangs in the balance of every move, every act, every deed, and every sin, and that your actions will lose your salvation. Instead of the shed blood of Christ on the cross.
Fourth - God is merciful. He extends grace and forgiveness to the hurting. He knows the hearts of people unlike some of the people in this forum, who wreak condemnation on the hurting.
Make no mistake, the only people going to hell are those who do not believe in Christ. We do need to obey and follow Jesus, but only God can know if he has saved a person who commits suicide. And remember - it is GOD who saves not we by our choices.
Our job is to show compassion and love to those who are suffering. A job which it seems many in this forum are failing at!
Second, depression is a condition where the BRAIN does not work properly. It is lacking in Seratonin, Dopamine, and other neurotransmitters. It is helped by medication. It is NOT a sin condition, but an ILLNESS.
Third, there is some very wrong theology driving the posts who claim someone who suicides is going to hell. That bad theology is thinking that your salvation hangs in the balance of every move, every act, every deed, and every sin, and that your actions will lose your salvation. Instead of the shed blood of Christ on the cross.
Fourth - God is merciful. He extends grace and forgiveness to the hurting. He knows the hearts of people unlike some of the people in this forum, who wreak condemnation on the hurting.
Make no mistake, the only people going to hell are those who do not believe in Christ. We do need to obey and follow Jesus, but only God can know if he has saved a person who commits suicide. And remember - it is GOD who saves not we by our choices.
Our job is to show compassion and love to those who are suffering. A job which it seems many in this forum are failing at!