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E
I don't agree with your perception Mitspa. This is not a hill I want to die on and I don't know why you think we have to see it your way?
I disagree.. this story of A+S has been debated and will continue to be debated, no doubt, until we see the other side
So, maybe you might try and allow others their own thoughts
respectfully
I disagree.. this story of A+S has been debated and will continue to be debated, no doubt, until we see the other side
So, maybe you might try and allow others their own thoughts
respectfully
E
ok, this is low...and shows your desire to win at all costs. NO ONE is relating to me as a legalist. I am a staunch defender of exactly the opposite in every thread on the subject that I post in...as ANYONE will attest
it is EXACTLY the opposite of what you are saying...honestly, what is wrong with you?
it is EXACTLY the opposite of what you are saying...honestly, what is wrong with you?
L
Well, I appreciate that you remember I like A.Wommack ember and I don't take what you posted as any kind of dig. But I don't always agree with all Andrew Wommack says. He doesn't believe we Christians will be raptured before the tribulation., I do. And he also believes if a Christian decides to turn away from God, they will be lost.. I don't agree with that. Based on my own experience with condemnation., I know how the mind can be deceived and how people allow feelings of condemnation to color their view of God. satan used that tactic with Adam and Eve in the garden. But when 'our hearts condemn us God is greater than our hearts.' Also, we are "sealed" by the HolySpirit of Promise. I can't agree with Andrew W. on all but I do agree on a lot.
It's so important for me as a believer to take the good from other Christians whether they be teachers I listen to or fellow believers in life and in a chat room. Leave the things I don't agree with yet still respect and listen to them. Taking the nutritious hay and leaving the straw as they say. I can appreciate much of what Andrew says about healing and grace and I do.
What he has said here I'm in agreement with. We Christians cannot afford to be open to sin because sin will give satan access to our lives by opening a door. The Bible tells us these strong holds that are set up in our minds must be cast down by the power of the HolySpirit and the Word as we cooperate by faith. "casting down imaginations and every high thing that ex-halts itself above the knowledge of God."
Yes, holiness is a fruit of salvation not the root. We need to know and believe what God says about us and not what the enemy accuses us of. Holiness is a by product of grace and truth by Jesus Christ. I like Andrew W. and use his commentary a lot on these forums. He has much more to say on this subject. Have you used his on line commentary?
It's been very helpful to cut and paste here. Blessings!
E
I think we have the same viewpoint on AW. I have difficulty with his thoughts and teaching on healing myself. And yet I do believe God can and does heal.
I like his plain and unflowery approach. It would prob be hard to find anyone to agree with 100%, but I think he can listened to and a person can decide for themself ... I like his encouragement and positive outlook
Thanks Lynn!
M
Its fine that some folks don't see what I have presented...I think its rather evident but just looking for a honest discussion from those that disagree in what the scriptures actually say in context. I would make several points throughout the New Testament and Old that God does not deal with believers in the manner we see here, with the points I have made I hope some will reconsider and even pray about how they see this passage. All I desire is a honest discussion within the truth of the Word.
E
I am sometimes called a legalist because I uphold the moral standards of grace and Gods right to judge the world... I hope we can deal withy each other with more understanding from now on ? 
I am a very straightforward person...I am not flowery and condescending nor am I going to hand out sweet words ...but I am sincere and trustworthy...I would rather have an arguement with someone and try and resolve things than pretend everything is ok...
I have every confidence in going forward with you as long as we give each other room to breathe...I have no doubt of your sincereity but that does not mean we are in total agreement
But, I am coming more and more to understand that the important thing is to see Christ in each other and love that person as part of the same body
I apologize for saying 'what is wrong with you?' I have been quite hurt around these forums lately and just kind of kicked out at you
hugs in Jesus...
An interesting question...
If this was God’s protective hand, keeping the church from being deceived by this unsaved couple—as some allege, and which they apparently find very consoling—then why did “great fear” come “upon the whole church”?
It would seem that the church would be thrilled that "unbelieving outsiders" would be taken down by God, keeping the church even safer. After all, "believers" were in no danger here......... were they?
Just going by the Scripture, in context, ya know.
Just something to think about.
If this was God’s protective hand, keeping the church from being deceived by this unsaved couple—as some allege, and which they apparently find very consoling—then why did “great fear” come “upon the whole church”?
It would seem that the church would be thrilled that "unbelieving outsiders" would be taken down by God, keeping the church even safer. After all, "believers" were in no danger here......... were they?
Just going by the Scripture, in context, ya know.
Just something to think about.
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Kind of like,why did God not overthrow nations like Sodom and Gomorrah,and it is probably because we only need one example in the Bible on how not to behave that way,so it might of only happened once as an example not to behave that way,which it might have happened at some other time,but we only need one example on how not to act that way.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land?
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Whiles it remained, was it not thine own? and after it was sold, was it not in thine own power? why hast thou conceived this thing in thine heart? thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God(Acts 5:3-4).
It appears that the moral of the story is do not make a promise to God,and then do not keep it,for it sounds like the Bible is saying it is his land,and he can do whatever he wants with the money of the land,but he made a promise to God to give all the money to the disciples,and then only gave a partial amount.
Also the Bible says great fear fell on the Church concerning this,so do not make a promise to God and not keep it,but of course you probably will not drop dead,but you will be guilty of it that you will pay for later if not repented of it.
[SUP]32 [/SUP]And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart and of one soul: neither said any of them that ought of the things which he possessed was his own; but they had all things common.
[SUP]33 [/SUP]And with great power gave the apostles witness of the resurrection of the Lord Jesus: and great grace was upon them all.
[SUP]34 [/SUP]Neither was there any among them that lacked: for as many as were possessors of lands or houses sold them, and brought the prices of the things that were sold,
[SUP]35 [/SUP]And laid them down at the apostles' feet: and distribution was made unto every man according as he had need(Acts 4:32-35).
That is how the early Church operated,at least in this instance,and Ananias,and his wife,must of went along with it,but did not go through with it,keeping some of the money.
It would appear that this is how God operates,that no money is our own personal money,but our finances,and possessions,are to supply our needs,and the needs of others,as best we can,but God will not be so mad if you neglect the poor by not doing so,but if you make a promise to God and not keep it,it is seriously wrong.
I believe Ananias,and his wife,made a promise to God to give all their money,going along with the people that were doing the same,and then did not follow through on it,but kept some of the money.
I believe the only thing we would have to do is repent of not caring about the poor like we should,by not selling possessions that are not needed,and God would not be so mad about that to drop us dead,but do not make a promise to God that you will do it,and not do it,for that is more terrible,but I believe God will not drop anybody dead,for we have the example in Acts 5 that tells us not to make a promise to God,and not keep it,like God does not drop anybody dead for being homosexual,although Sodom and Gomorrah is an example not to act that way.
Remember,watch what you say,and do not make a promise to God,and not keep it,so I think it is better to say,I will do the best I can,and not make any promises,but of course God will know if you are overextending yourself in a zeal to make Him happy,and your intentions are good,but if it is a promise that is within your grasp,do not make it,and not keep it.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land?
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Whiles it remained, was it not thine own? and after it was sold, was it not in thine own power? why hast thou conceived this thing in thine heart? thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God(Acts 5:3-4).
It appears that the moral of the story is do not make a promise to God,and then do not keep it,for it sounds like the Bible is saying it is his land,and he can do whatever he wants with the money of the land,but he made a promise to God to give all the money to the disciples,and then only gave a partial amount.
Also the Bible says great fear fell on the Church concerning this,so do not make a promise to God and not keep it,but of course you probably will not drop dead,but you will be guilty of it that you will pay for later if not repented of it.
[SUP]32 [/SUP]And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart and of one soul: neither said any of them that ought of the things which he possessed was his own; but they had all things common.
[SUP]33 [/SUP]And with great power gave the apostles witness of the resurrection of the Lord Jesus: and great grace was upon them all.
[SUP]34 [/SUP]Neither was there any among them that lacked: for as many as were possessors of lands or houses sold them, and brought the prices of the things that were sold,
[SUP]35 [/SUP]And laid them down at the apostles' feet: and distribution was made unto every man according as he had need(Acts 4:32-35).
That is how the early Church operated,at least in this instance,and Ananias,and his wife,must of went along with it,but did not go through with it,keeping some of the money.
It would appear that this is how God operates,that no money is our own personal money,but our finances,and possessions,are to supply our needs,and the needs of others,as best we can,but God will not be so mad if you neglect the poor by not doing so,but if you make a promise to God and not keep it,it is seriously wrong.
I believe Ananias,and his wife,made a promise to God to give all their money,going along with the people that were doing the same,and then did not follow through on it,but kept some of the money.
I believe the only thing we would have to do is repent of not caring about the poor like we should,by not selling possessions that are not needed,and God would not be so mad about that to drop us dead,but do not make a promise to God that you will do it,and not do it,for that is more terrible,but I believe God will not drop anybody dead,for we have the example in Acts 5 that tells us not to make a promise to God,and not keep it,like God does not drop anybody dead for being homosexual,although Sodom and Gomorrah is an example not to act that way.
Remember,watch what you say,and do not make a promise to God,and not keep it,so I think it is better to say,I will do the best I can,and not make any promises,but of course God will know if you are overextending yourself in a zeal to make Him happy,and your intentions are good,but if it is a promise that is within your grasp,do not make it,and not keep it.
E
Well at least your looking at my point lol Thank you
Ac 5:10 Then fell she down straightway at his feet, and yielded up the ghost: and the young men came in, and found her dead, and, carrying her forth, buried her by her husband.
11 And great fear came upon all the church, and upon as many as heard these things.
12 ¶ And by the hands of the apostles were many signs and wonders wrought among the people; (and they were all with one accord in Solomon's porch.
13 And of the rest durst no man join himself to them: but the people magnified them.
14 And believers were the more added to the Lord, multitudes both of men and women.)
I see these passages are clearly connected in intention...if you take out the judgment made against A and S then verse 13 and 14 don't make any sense...in context they make perfect sense.
lol Thank you Ac 5:10 Then fell she down straightway at his feet, and yielded up the ghost: and the young men came in, and found her dead, and, carrying her forth, buried her by her husband.
11 And great fear came upon all the church, and upon as many as heard these things.
12 ¶ And by the hands of the apostles were many signs and wonders wrought among the people; (and they were all with one accord in Solomon's porch.
13 And of the rest durst no man join himself to them: but the people magnified them.
14 And believers were the more added to the Lord, multitudes both of men and women.)
I see these passages are clearly connected in intention...if you take out the judgment made against A and S then verse 13 and 14 don't make any sense...in context they make perfect sense.
No Actually it does not.
Vs 12 is saying the apostles did alot of miracles. It is not in context of what happened before. it is a series of events which happened after..
Acts is a narrative of things occurring like a historical record. It does not mean each different area is related to another, remember there was no chapter and verse separation in the original letters. Men added those.