Who's flesh (sarx)? Saint's flesh (like Adam before the fall) or our flesh, after the fall?
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Who's flesh (sarx)? Saint's flesh (like Adam before the fall) or our flesh, after the fall?
M
Mitspa
Guest
Dude..this is just silly and makes no sense... We know that sin is in the flesh and that we crucify the Old Man in our minds daily ...Im still not sure how you think this makes Christ a sinner?
M
Mitspa
Guest
I have already told you a dozen times...a flesh without sin... Is it like Adam before the fall...im sure it is.
M
Mitspa
Guest
No I just don't want you to change my post in your quotes... as to say something I did not say.... That will get you into trouble here...just quote what folks say and deal with it, without changing other members words.
Christ didn't come to legally save folks like Adam, before the fall. Why? Adam before the fall didn't need saving. Think it out
I guess you referencing this? "Christ Jesus (took) indwelling sin?"
Notice I replaced "had" with "took" in parenthesis. That means it wasn't your word....I used "took" because I've consistently said (and you won't listen) that Christ never HAD a sinful nature. We have sinful natures. Christ assumed us and therefore took us into Himself. Our nature was never His by divine right!
Can you tell me, using only the immediate context of Romans 6:6, what is Paul stating:
Romans 6:6 knowing this, that our old self was crucified with Him, in order that our body of sin might be done away with, so that we would no longer be slaves to sin"
But first, let me tell you what it can't mean:
The legalistic among us (and I don't think that you're legalistic) will use Rom 6:6 to state that they no longer have a body indwelt with sin (i.e. the sin nature). Of course in doing this they must also state that they are without sin. Well, that's baloney. No one is living Christ's spotless life, no one. So Romans 6:6 can't mean that the believer no longer as a sinful nature and that he never sins.
And, BTW, you've been hard on me calling me a troll, but I've come back at you. That's my nature, but it's wrong.
So through God's grace I'll endeavor to be curious to you as a brother in Christ.
I apologize for my rudeness to you.
Romans 6:6 knowing this, that our old self was crucified with Him, in order that our body of sin might be done away with, so that we would no longer be slaves to sin"
But first, let me tell you what it can't mean:
The legalistic among us (and I don't think that you're legalistic) will use Rom 6:6 to state that they no longer have a body indwelt with sin (i.e. the sin nature). Of course in doing this they must also state that they are without sin. Well, that's baloney. No one is living Christ's spotless life, no one. So Romans 6:6 can't mean that the believer no longer as a sinful nature and that he never sins.
And, BTW, you've been hard on me calling me a troll, but I've come back at you. That's my nature, but it's wrong.
So through God's grace I'll endeavor to be curious to you as a brother in Christ.
I apologize for my rudeness to you.
M
Mitspa
Guest
He took our sin on the Cross... what part of that is not reaching your understanding? He did not have indwelling sin (sin in the flesh)
M
Mitspa
Guest
Yes don't change peoples post when you quote them...that's not right here and will get you into trouble with the mods.
M
Mitspa
Guest
He Paul is saying a lot of things but that In Gods mind ..we as sinful men in the flesh have died with Christ.. That God reckons His death as our own... Its does not say or even imply in any way that Christ Jesus had indwelling sin in His Body.
I've quoted Rom 6:6/7:4, both state that "you" died in Christ. There's only one type of "you" and that is a fallen child of Adam indwelt with the sin nature. I don't know why you are resisting the obvious.
Do you think that if Christ, as the son of man, borrowed our life indwelt with sin that, that would make Him a sinner? If so, how?
Okay, so you are saying this (paraphrased):
"our sinful self was reckoned dead when Christ was crucified so that our body of sin might be done away with... "
I'm sure that's how you read it, but I believe you are placing your own preconceived ideas into the text. I don't mean anything bad by this because it's natural to do.
Here's how Paul stated it (I'm using the NASB):
"Our old self was crucified with Him, in order that our body of sin might be done away"
This states that "our old self", which is linked to "our body of sin", was crucified WITH (Christ).
Last edited:
OOps He is / was not a sinner but the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
John 1:29 - The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
M
Mitspa
Guest
It don't matter what I think..it matters what Gods Word says...It says He knew no sin and no sin was in Him.
Roms 6... in NO WAY suggest that Christ had sin indwelling sin...so you can post it until your fingers fall off, but the truth remains.
2Co 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
1Pe 2:22 Who did no sin, neither was guile found in his mouth:
1Jo 3:5 And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
Heb 4:15 for we have not a chief priest unable to sympathise with our weaknesses, but one tempted in all things in like manner--apart from sin;
Joh 14:30 Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me.
M
Mitspa
Guest
Ro 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
Now this seems rather strait forward to me...it in no way suggest that Christ had sin in the flesh, but that we have power over our own sin.
Rom 6:6 states that "our old self", which is linked to "our body of sin", was crucified WITH (Christ). If my "old self" with it's "body of sin" was crucified with Him, then both these things were in Him as the son of man.
M
Mitspa
Guest
Ro 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
Here is what Roms 6:6 says in context...I don't even understand what point you think your making?...but clearly it is not in anyway nor can it be read in anyway to suggest that Jesus had indwelling sin.
So you can post it and add your error to it a million times..but it don't change the truth that Jesus did not have sin until He took our sin on the Cross.
M
Mitspa
Guest
I don't know what point you think your making ?..but clearly Christ did not have sin in the flesh.
2Co 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
1Pe 2:22 Who did no sin, neither was guile found in his mouth:
1Jo 3:5 And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
Heb 4:15 for we have not a chief priest unable to sympathise with our weaknesses, but one tempted in all things in like manner--apart from sin;
Joh 14:30 Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me.
2Co 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
1Pe 2:22 Who did no sin, neither was guile found in his mouth:
1Jo 3:5 And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
Heb 4:15 for we have not a chief priest unable to sympathise with our weaknesses, but one tempted in all things in like manner--apart from sin;
Joh 14:30 Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me.