Are the people who drowned in the flood of Noah doomed forever?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
You don't seem to understand that a redeemed life (that of a believer) would not look like this:

...every inclination of the thoughts of their hearts was only evil continually.

For example, King David committed some terrible sins, but God still called him a man after His own heart. David's every thought wasn't evil continually, that's for sure. Paul calls himself the chief of sinners and yet he we know He pursued God like nobody's business. There's not much more that can be said.
 
Some people are really having some exegetical issues with the text in Genesis, I see.

The Bible is very clear that MAN WAS WICKED! That means they were not believers, and not following God.

They did not lose their salvation, because they never had it in the first place. They perished!

"and that by means of these the world that then existed was deluged with water and perished." 2 Peter 3:6

I really have to wonder about some people, who are twisting the Old Testament into a reading which was never even implied or given!
 
Angela53510 said:
Some people are really having some exegetical issues with the text in Genesis, I see.

The Bible is very clear that MAN WAS WICKED! That means they were not believers, and not following God.

They did not lose their salvation, because they never had it in the first place. They perished!

"and that by means of these the world that then existed was deluged with water and perished." 2 Peter 3:6

I really have to wonder about some people, who are twisting the Old Testament into a reading which was never even implied or given!
Click to expand...

Yes, this is key! Thank you, Angela.
 
"Now the earth was corrupt in the sight of God, and the earth was filled with violence. God looked on the earth, and behold, it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted their way upon the earth. Then God said to Noah, 'The end of all flesh has come before Me; for the earth is filled with violence because of them; and behold, I am about to destroy them with the earth.'"

The only exception to this in collective humanity was Noah. "The LORD said, 'I will blot out man whom I have created from the face of the land, from man to animals to creeping things and to birds of the sky; for I am sorry that I have made them.' But Noah found favor in the eyes of the LORD."
 
I can't help but think that the post saying that the young children(unable to decide for or against God),babies and the unborn would have been saved. As far as Jesus speaking to the spirits that lived in Noah's time, I heard somewhere that He may have been speaking to the fallen angels, which makes some sense, considering that it wasn't mentioned that he spoke to the spirits of the fallen at the time of Moses 40 years in the desert.
 
onlinebuddy said:
It's clear that there is no repentance after death; so the spirits whom Jesus preached to were not the people that died in the flood. We do not know for sure what that verse is talking about. The spirits sound more like evil spirits than humans.

BTW, how does the correct translation read 1 Pet 3:19?
Click to expand...

Thanks for mentioning what the verse was in the NIV 1984, 1 Peter 3:19 was rendered like this (other verses added for context):

1 Peter 3:18-20 NIV 1984

For Christ died for sins once for all, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring you to God. He was put to death in the body but made alive by the Spirit, through whom also he went and preached to the spirits in prison who disobeyed long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built. In it only a few people, eight in all, were saved through water.

This is an inaccurate translation because the Greek word they translate as preached really has to do with proclamation and not preaching.

The newer NIV (despite its gender-neutral faults and other issues) actually gets this right. This is how it is correctly rendered in 1 Peter 3:18-20 NIV:

1 Peter 3:18-20 NIV

For Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring you to God. He was put to death in the body but made alive in the Spirit. After being made alive, he went and made proclamation to the imprisoned spirits— to those who were disobedient long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built. In it only a few people, eight in all, were saved through water,

Thanks. God bless my brothers and sisters in Christ. :)
 
onlinebuddy said:

I like the point you made about the three types of revelations.

Now,you are saying that although a believer may lose his life (by physical death) due to a particular sin, their life on the whole may not be worthy of hell, and that they stand a chance of being saved.

I believe that in the OT as well as the NT days, salvation comes through faith and by grace.
If those who died in the flood would have responded by faith, they would have found favor in God's eyes, just as Noah did. So the reason they died in the flood was that they had no faith.
I'm sure that God gave them enough chances to repent, but their sins were so great that God was sorry he had even created mankind, and he grieved in his heart. [Genesis 6:6]
So these were wicked and rebellious people.
Click to expand...

And I can understand that. So you feel that all of the unborn children were eternally lost?

God bless.
 
Wasn't able to edit, wanted to clarify the time I meant. I would have to do the math again but I think his father died five years before the Flood and his grandfather the very year of the Flood.

God bless.
 
Kaycie said:
It says Noah and his family were the only righteous on the earth. It's God's judgement call, but Noah tried to persuade them for a hundred years while the ark was being built. They had their opportunity to obey God and did not. And God says you must obey Him in order to go to heaven. Now I can observe and conclude that 1+1=2, it may seem obvious to me, but it is still not my judgement call to make. God allows me to judge between right and wrong in myself and in others, but He does not allow me to judge a person's soul, not even my own. I forget where the verse is, but I remember reading that on judgement day a person thought they would not make it into heaven, but they did. Such a person bypassed humble and was way too hard on them self. No one is without having sinned, but you're ok if you obey.
Click to expand...

Truly we do not render judgment but we are commanded to use discernment among those professing Christ. For example, do we not judge if we believe we need to restore brethren we feel are overtaken in a fault?

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Galatians+6:1&version=KJV

We have judged ourselves spiritual and them not to be.

And do we not judge when we seek to pull them from the fire?

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Jude+1:22-23&version=KJV

I agree we are not render judgment on an eternal basis, but we do judge, and need to, and as long as that judgment is the result of our views being in agreement with God's I don't think we will offend God. The Gospel will offend the unbelieving, but we continue in our evangelistic as well as ministering efforts nonetheless.

God bless.
 
Okay, just one question I will pose to anyone willing to reply: did the Ark save Noah eternally?

God bless.
 
P1LGR1M said:
And I can understand that. So you feel that all of the unborn children were eternally lost?

God bless.
Click to expand...
Good point. There must have been unborn children, infants and children below the age of accountability. I believed that they are saved.
 
onlinebuddy said:
Good point. There must have been unborn children, infants and children below the age of accountability. I believed that they are saved.
Click to expand...

As do I.

Now, if you don't mind me asking, how were they saved?

And one other: what kind of death do we see in the Flood?

God bless.
 
Gr8grace said:
Ever heard of the sin unto death? It is for Christians/believers only. I believe there were MANY believers that died in the flood. They were so negative to God...........they died the sin unto death(extreme divine discipline/physical death)and God took them home.

No one gets another chance to be saved after death. And we have to understand that God is perfectly Just. Nobody in that flood who was not saved, was "surprised" on how they could have been saved. God is fair and just and is willing that none perish. He gets His gospel to every soul, they WILLINGLY reject it. Hell doesn't "surprise" anyone.
Click to expand...
I am just learning what 1 John 5:16 is trying to say. It talks about a sin that leads to death (physical, disciplinary death, just as in the case of Ananias and Saphira).
Then there is sin that does not end up in physical consequential death(chastising). The Apostle John is telling the believers to pray for that person who has sinned (and is alive), so that he or she may repent and be forgiven.

Coming back to the flood, apart from unborn children, infants and children below the age of accountability, etc., there may be people who have had faith for a major portion of their lives, and yet did not believe in the message of Noah. They therefore committed a sin that led to death (physical). Yes, they could not repent of that final sin of disbelief, since they died in the flood. However, it is likely that when God looks at their entire life(He is perfectly just and does not delight in condemning), he will see that the graph of their faith was high at many times. Therefore there is a ray of hope (only God knows) that they may be saved when the long run is considered.
This is just a thought, and I'm not sure.

So, are we to judge anyone? No. That's not our job. We are not even capable of doing that. None of us can say with confidence that all that died in the flood were condemned, or that some were saved. God has not revealed everything to us.
In the light of events such as the flood of Noah, Annanias and Saphira and the Galileans of Luke 13:1 who were killled by Pilate, we can only learn on thing: to take a good look at our own lives, and remember that time is short.
 
Kaycie said:
I forget where the verse is, but I remember reading that on judgement day a person thought they would not make it into heaven, but they did. Such a person bypassed humble and was way too hard on them self. No one is without having sinned, but you're ok if you obey.
Click to expand...
I wonder what verse you are talking about. I have never come across such a story in the Bible :D
Yes, know that there were people who thought they would make it but didn't [Mt 7:23]
So, if you find that verse, please let me know.
 
Angela53510 said:
"and that by means of these the world that then existed was deluged with water and perished." 2 Peter 3:6
Click to expand...
That verse makes everything so clear.
The context of 2 Peter is that some scoffers were saying that the second coming of Jesus would not happen. Peter is telling the disciples that Jesus would sure come the second time, and the scoffers would be destroyed, just as the flood of Noah came and destroyed the ungodly. Thanks.
 
Angela53510 said:
Some people are really having some exegetical issues with the text in Genesis, I see.
Click to expand...

Some people believe that since we have Adam's corrupted nature, believers can be as bad as non-believers, and yet be saved. So all the blame gets shifted on the corrupted self we have inherited from Adam.
They fail to see that although we have our sinful tendencies, we have been given the Holy Spirit, and are called to be set apart.
 
P1LGR1M said:
Okay, just one question I will pose to anyone willing to reply: did the Ark save Noah eternally?

God bless.
Click to expand...
I guess they passed the test of the flood, while the rest of mankind failed the test.
After that Noah and his sons did have the remaining part of their lives on earth. (They did not go to heaven after the flood :)) They had to continue to believe and rely on the grace of God.
They did not live perfect lives after that. Noah did get drunk one fine day and allow his daughters to sleep with him. Ham disrespected his father and got cursed.
Nevertheless, Jesus descended from the lineage of Noah and Shem.
 
onlinebuddy said:
I guess they passed the test of the flood, while the rest of mankind failed the test.
After that Noah and his sons did have the remaining part of their lives on earth. (They did not go to heaven after the flood :)) They had to continue to believe and rely on the grace of God.
They did not live perfect lives after that. Noah did get drunk one fine day and allow his daughters to sleep with him. Ham disrespected his father and got cursed.
Nevertheless, Jesus descended from the lineage of Noah and Shem.
Click to expand...
May I correct, it was Lot who slept with his daughters.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom
Back