What are the Consequences of Falling from Grace?

[Goodnewsman]

I don't believe you can "fall from grace. or lose your salvation but you better believe you can "leave" your salvation and walk away from God. and as a tree falls that's were it lays.

the only thing worse than "no security" is "false security" it makes someone feel they are right when they are not.

that's why I believe that Calvinism is far worse than Catholicism!

 

[FreeNChrist]

I don't believe you can "fall from grace. or lose your salvation but you better believe you can "leave" your salvation and walk away from God. and as a tree falls that's were it lays.

the only thing worse than "no security" is "false security" it makes someone feel they are right when they are not.

that's why I believe that Calvinism is far worse than Catholicism!

That we, as Christians, have eternal security because it is assured by Christ Himself, is not a belief that originates in or that is exclusive to Calvinism.

 

[Goodnewsman]

unconditional eternal security does have it's roots deep into Calvinism. may I ask you a couple questions?

1.) when you willfully sin, do you pray and ask God to forgive you? if so, why?
2.) as a Christian do you fight the devil or does the devil tempt you? if so why?

I promise you one thing, the devil (who knows the bible better than any of us) does not believe in unconditional eternal security. if he did he would leave me alone

 

[Yet]

Financial problems, sickness, etc..stop tithing. This puts a curse on you. See: Gal. 3:10

 

[Grace777x70]

okie dokie James...

 

[Magenta]

"Simon, Simon, Satan has asked to sift all of you as wheat. But I have prayed for you, Simon, that your faith may not fail. And when you have turned back, strengthen your brothers."

 

[FreeNChrist]

unconditional eternal security does have it's roots deep into Calvinism. may I ask you a couple questions?

1.) when you willfully sin, do you pray and ask God to forgive you? if so, why?
2.) as a Christian do you fight the devil or does the devil tempt you? if so why?

1. No
2. No and yes. Yes, because he's the devil, it's what he does.

 

[Grace777x70]

Amen!....I noticed that Jesus didn't pray that Peter himself wouldn't fail.. because he did.. .but that his "faith" would not fail.. which it didn't.. Peter came back when the Lord called to him...Paul even said that Jesus went to see Peter after His resurrection but that is not recorded anywhere in scripture...perhaps Peter told Paul the story?..

"Simon, Simon, Satan has asked to sift all of you as wheat. But I have prayed for you, Simon, that your faith may not fail. And when you have turned back, strengthen your brothers."

 

[JesusIsAll]

I promise you one thing, the devil (who knows the bible better than any of us) does not believe in unconditional eternal security. if he did he would leave me alone

The devil being malevolent, the father of lies and murder, John 8:44, lusting after evil and going about as a roaring lion, devouring, would indicate a creature of malevolent nature, that does any evil he can against God's creation, noting that his own often crash and burn, badly, and, of course, windup damned: he destroys his own. I've never been certain the devil even respects his dupes, as much as those he can't fool, but, in any event, he's an "equal opportunity" destroyer, history proves, many Christian martyrs and such. There is also that sin which leads to death, 1 John 5:16, where the Lord can take a person home, before their time, which is the result of getting caught up in evil. Scripture is clear we're at war with evil spiritual forces, Ephesians 6:12, the devil and demons not seeking to just leave you be, though resist him and he flees, James 4:7.

The notion the devil knows scripture with proper comprehension is questionable, since spiritual things of God are discerned via the Holy Spirit, and presumably good angels needing to look into the things of Christ, 1 Peter 1:12. I like what Adrian Rogers once said, that the devil is a "brilliant knucklehead." I think he's cleverly deceptive, very wise in a snake fashion, from much practice, can quote scripture like any false prophet, but with perhaps an absence of true comprehension, wouldn't attribute him as having Spirit-filled knowledge or wisdom, such understanding, 1 Corinthians 2:14. If a natural man requires the Holy Spirit to understand the things of God, why would the devil not, he who is even an evil spirit? I believe there are some very low mentalities in the realm of demons.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

unconditional eternal security does have it's roots deep into Calvinism. may I ask you a couple questions?

1.) when you willfully sin, do you pray and ask God to forgive you? if so, why?
2.) as a Christian do you fight the devil or does the devil tempt you? if so why?

I promise you one thing, the devil (who knows the bible better than any of us) does not believe in unconditional eternal security. if he did he would leave me alone

Nah, He does not leave you alone because you have eternal security and he knows it. He has to keep coming after you to convince you that you are not secure so he can make you give up or question Gods grace..

If You did not have eternal security, He would leave you alone. because you would take yourself out.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I don't believe you can "fall from grace. or lose your salvation but you better believe you can "leave" your salvation and walk away from God. and as a tree falls that's were it lays.

the only thing worse than "no security" is "false security" it makes someone feel they are right when they are not.

that's why I believe that Calvinism is far worse than Catholicism!

Calvanists may have their issues.. and many problems with some of their doctrines. But saying they are worse than catholics is like saying the disciples of Christ were worse than the Pharisees.

 

[JesusIsAll]

Nah, He does not leave you alone because you have eternal security and he knows it. He has to keep coming after you to convince you that you are not secure so he can make you give up or question Gods grace..

If You did not have eternal security, He would leave you alone. because you would take yourself out.

Probably take ourselves out within a few hours of being saved, in terms of attaining to God's requirement of perfect holiness. In my opinion, we don't really need to reach for complex explanations as to what the terms are of the devil operating this or that way. A roaring lion seeks prey. It's just what lions do. The devil does as the evil do, the ethic of an evil doer to do just that, evil. It's his nature, his game, ultimately to kill and destroy, lay anything he can of God's creation waste. For a soul he can't waste, he's still content to waste the body. I'm not thinking he's roaming about, weighing a person's stand on eternal security as whether to strike, if God allows, any more than a cat would evaluate a bird's song, before eating it. It's an agenda driven by narcissism and hatred, much he does, well, "for the hell of it."

 

[JesusIsAll]

That we, as Christians, have eternal security because it is assured by Christ Himself, is not a belief that originates in or that is exclusive to Calvinism.

Quite so! It has a little to do with the sure promises of God, what's in the Bible, methinks, which is also to say, of the critics, who are you to say anything contrary to what some of us spiritually know [epignosis] to be true? It's like saying, "Don't believe your lying eyes." (A lot of that is going around...) Alright, some of you guys asked for it!

"I believe in the eternal security of the believer and in the insecurity of the make-believer." J. Vernon McGee

John 3:15-16 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

John 3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath [present tense] everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

John 10:27-29 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

1 John 4:4-6 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them. We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

1 Peter 1:5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

John 6:37-40 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise [never] cast out. For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me. And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God.

Romans 11:29 For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. [Luke 11:13, 1 Corinthians 12]

Romans 11:6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

2 Corinthians 1:22 And who has also put his seal on us and given us his Spirit in our hearts as a guarantee.

2 Corinthians 5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

1 John 5:13 I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.

1 John 4:13 Hereby know we that we dwell in him, and he in us, because he hath given us of his Spirit.

Romans 8:16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God.

Hebrews 10:14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

Philippians 1:6 And I am sure of this, that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ.

Ephesians 1:13-14 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that Holy Spirit of promise, which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

Ephesians 4:30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.

Ephesians 2:8-9 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Romans 8:33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth. Who is he that condemneth? [the devil, deceivers] It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

1 John 5:10-13 Whoever believes in the Son of God has the testimony in himself. Whoever does not believe God has made him a liar, because he has not believed in the testimony that God has borne concerning his Son. And this is the testimony, that God gave us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.

Hebrews 13:5 Let your conversation be without covetousness; and be content with such things as ye have: for he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee.

1 John 2:19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.

1 John 2:25 And this is the promise that he hath promised us, even eternal life.

Titus 1:2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began.

Ephesians 1:4-5 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will.

2 Thessalonians 2:13-14 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth: Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.

1 John 5:4 For everyone who has been born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.

Romans 9:16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.

Psalm 34:22 The Lord redeems the life of his servants; none of those who take refuge in him will be condemned.

Hebrews 7:24-25 But this man, because he continueth ever, hath an unchangeable priesthood. Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them.

Hebrews 6:17-20 Wherein God, willing more abundantly to shew unto the heirs of promise the immutability of his counsel, confirmed it by an oath: That by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us: Which hope we have as an anchor of the soul, both sure and stedfast, and which entereth into that within the veil; Whither the forerunner is for us entered, even Jesus, made an high priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.

1 Thessalonians 1:5 For our gospel came not unto you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Ghost, and in much assurance; as ye know what manner of men we were among you for your sake.

2 Timothy 1:12 For the which cause I also suffer these things: nevertheless I am not ashamed: for I know whom I have believed, and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I have committed unto him against that day.

Jude 24-25 Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy, to the only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen.

Romans 8:29-30 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

Romans 8:38-39 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

 

[Goodnewsman]

wow! I don't have time right now to fully respond to your first answer of "no" that you don't ask God to forgive you when you sin.(Lord willing tomorrow) I was assuming you professed to be saved.

have you never asked yourself the question "why does the devil tempt me or fight me" if he (devil) believed in unconditional eternal security why would he waste his time on you if he knew there was no way he could get you to fall?

1 Peter 5:8-9 (KJV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:
[SUP]9 [/SUP] Whom resist stedfast in the faith, knowing that the same afflictions are accomplished in your brethren that are in the world.

notice: we have an adversary called the devil....again the devil doesn't believe your doctrine of unconditional eternal security. if he did he would leave us Christians alone

 

[FreeNChrist]

wow! I don't have time right now to fully respond to your first answer of "no" that you don't ask God to forgive you when you sin.(Lord willing tomorrow) I was assuming you professed to be saved.

have you never asked yourself the question "why does the devil tempt me or fight me" if he (devil) believed in unconditional eternal security why would he waste his time on you if he knew there was no way he could get you to fall?

1 Peter 5:8-9 (KJV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:
[SUP]9 [/SUP] Whom resist stedfast in the faith, knowing that the same afflictions are accomplished in your brethren that are in the world.

notice: we have an adversary called the devil....again the devil doesn't believe your doctrine of unconditional eternal security. if he did he would leave us Christians alone

He cannot rob us of our salvation but he can and does try to rob us of the joy of our salvation.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Probably take ourselves out within a few hours of being saved, in terms of attaining to God's requirement of perfect holiness. In my opinion, we don't really need to reach for complex explanations as to what the terms are of the devil operating this or that way. A roaring lion seeks prey. It's just what lions do. The devil does as the evil do, the ethic of an evil doer to do just that, evil. It's his nature, his game, ultimately to kill and destroy, lay anything he can of God's creation waste. For a soul he can't waste, he's still content to waste the body. I'm not thinking he's roaming about, weighing a person's stand on eternal security as whether to strike, if God allows, any more than a cat would evaluate a bird's song, before eating it. It's an agenda driven by narcissism and hatred, much he does, well, "for the hell of it."

performance based gospels always fail. We either realize we do not add up. Or we lower Gods standard and make it our own. Much like the OT people did. they made these Gods of wood and stone, and then instituted a gospel they could meet themselves..

Satan is the master of getting people to do this, he is the first one who commited adultry on God.. And set himself up as God.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

wow! I don't have time right now to fully respond to your first answer of "no" that you don't ask God to forgive you when you sin.(Lord willing tomorrow) I was assuming you professed to be saved.

have you never asked yourself the question "why does the devil tempt me or fight me" if he (devil) believed in unconditional eternal security why would he waste his time on you if he knew there was no way he could get you to fall?

1 Peter 5:8-9 (KJV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:
[SUP]9 [/SUP] Whom resist stedfast in the faith, knowing that the same afflictions are accomplished in your brethren that are in the world.

notice: we have an adversary called the devil....again the devil doesn't believe your doctrine of unconditional eternal security. if he did he would leave us Christians alone

Why do I have to ask God to forgive me, Do I question his promise? His Grace?

You only beg a person to forgive you when you do not trust that they will.

I know God forgave me, I do not have to beg or ask. His forgiveness is unconditional. That's why I can go to him as an Abba Father, and not as a dictator.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Why do I have to ask God to forgive me, Do I question his promise? His Grace?

You only beg a person to forgive you when you do not trust that they will.

I know God forgave me, I do not have to beg or ask. His forgiveness is unconditional. That's why I can go to him as an Abba Father, and not as a dictator.

Because Christ has the keys that lock and no man can open, and that unlock and no man can close. GOD forgives. He didn't "forgave" sin you haven't committed. Forgiveness is guaranteed and waiting if you want it. Don't confuse justification with daily cleansing.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Because Christ has the keys that lock and no man can open, and that unlock and no man can close. GOD forgives. He didn't "forgave" sin you haven't committed. Forgiveness is guaranteed and waiting if you want it. Don't confuse justification with daily cleansing.

Sadly, I fear you do not know God at all.

God, who foretold the 4 gentile kingdoms, Who foretold literal events thousands of years in advance, Who knows the end of the age, and foretells us how it will all work out. Who David said knew him completely while he was in his mothers womb.

This same God deos not know what Sins I am going to commit. and did not know about them when he died (now this is scary, because how could he suffer for them if he did not know them).

You want to beg God to forgive you, Feel free. I thank God every day for saving my eternal soul. and forgiving me for all the trash I did that day..

 

[skylove7]

He cannot rob us of our salvation but he can and does try to rob us of the joy of our salvation.

Amen!!!!!!!