Gospel of the Kingdom vs the Gospel Paul preached

[DP]

Looks like you are somewhat read up on anti-dispensational dogma.
But your ad hominem against Darby by using Irving and McDonald is unproven.
Sticking to Scriptural proof of what you actually believe rather than only attacking the stance of another will give you more mileage...but it may also open your view to attacks as well, but at least you will be more credible.

If we're talking about what God's Word actually teaches, and you want to claim Scriptural proof... then let's see you disprove the Scriptures which watchman showed us that Christ's coming to gather His Church is after... the tribulation:

http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/5660-scriptures-prove-post-trib-rapture.html

 

[John146]

Matthew 24:14, "And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come."

Has the gospel of the kingdom been preached in all the world? What happens when the gospel of the kingdom is preached in all the world? Has the end come?

Paul said the gospel he preached went out in all the world, preached to all nations, and preached to every creature under heaven. The end has not come.

 

[JaumeJ]

Sitting here thinking about this thread, the gravity of error strikes me profoundly.

Pleae realize there is only one gospel given in the New Testament, which, by the way, is the New Testament, and that is the gospel of Jesus Christ.

Do not confuse the Good News with anything other than the Good News given to us by Jesus Christ.

Do not credit any other flesh than Jesus Christ's as having another gospel.

There is only one gospel, and as Paul teaches, if any man teaches a gospel other than that delivered to us by Jesus Christ, let him be cursed.

This teaching is sure and true, do not vary, for allowing some variance is allowing all.

 

[John146]

Sitting here thinking about this thread, the gravity of error strikes me profoundly.

Pleae realize there is only one gospel given in the New Testament, which, by the way, is the New Testament, and that is the gospel of Jesus Christ.

Do not confuse the Good News with anything other than the Good News given to us by Jesus Christ.

Do not credit any other flesh than Jesus Christ's as having another gospel.

There is only one gospel, and as Paul teaches, if any man teaches a gospel other than that delivered to us by Jesus Christ, let him be cursed.

This teaching is sure and true, do not vary, for allowing some variance is allowing all.

As to my previous post, why hasn't the world come to an end? The gospel has gone out. Please don't spiritualize it, take it literally.

And remember, the New Testament is not in force until after the death of the testator (Hebrews 9:16-17). Not until after the resurrection happened did the disciples start to understand why Jesus came. The disciples were not preaching the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ before it happened. No one on this board has proven they did. Just because you haven't seen this in Scripture, doesn't make it untrue.

Does anyone on this board believe in the millennial reign of Christ? A literal kingdom of Israel where the Lord Jesus is King of Kings for a 1,000 years?

 

[DP]

As to my previous post, why hasn't the world come to an end? The gospel has gone out. Please don't spiritualize it, take it literally.

And remember, the New Testament is not in force until after the death of the testator (Hebrews 9:16-17). Not until after the resurrection happened did the disciples start to understand why Jesus came. The disciples were not preaching the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ before it happened. No one on this board has proven they did. Just because you haven't seen this in Scripture, doesn't make it untrue.

Does anyone on this board believe in the millennial reign of Christ? A literal kingdom of Israel where the Lord Jesus is King of Kings for a 1,000 years?

I believe in the literal kingdom of Israel where Jesus is King of kings and Lord of lords for a thousand years, as... written.

You're trying to create some kind of proof from the idea that because no one preached Christ crucified and resurrected until after it happened is moot. That because His crucifixion was first written of in the OT prophets (Ps.22), and ... Paul was actually not the first to preach Christ crucified after His death and resurrection. Paul (then Saul) right after the passion of Christ was still deceived and working against Christ by following the Pharisees, and even held the coats of those who stoned Stephen (Acts 7). In Acts 8, Apostle Philip is shown witnessing The Gospel of Christ crucified to a Gentile Ethiopian, and baptizing him in Christ Jesus.

 

[John146]

Ok, the literal Kingdom on earth is not the eternity of the soul. The gospel of the kingdom is the good news of the kingdom of Israel where Jesus is King. This message was good news to the Jews and was preached to the Jews only. The disciples were not to take this message to the Samaritans or the Gentiles. What was kept hid was the fact that this King had to die on a cross for sins before the physical kingdom could be given. Since the nation of Israel as a whole rejected Jesus, the kingdom was not given, yet. The gospel of the kingdom is not about the salvation from sins, but rather the promised kingdom to the nation of Israel. The OT prophets prophesied of both, but the cross was hidden. The prophets never spoke of a cross. We can look back and see the types and shadows because we have the rest of the story. I never said that Paul was the only one that preached the gospel of Jesus Christ, but the full measure and implications of the cross to the Church (doctrine) was given to Paul to preach. The kingdom will go back into effect after the Church is raptured, then this gospel will be preached to all the world through the 2 witnesses and 144,000 male Jews.

​

 

[JaumeJ]

With God a thousand years is like a day when it has passed. There are seven days of creation. We are in the Hebrew year 5776 I believe with many years missing from the original calculations from Adam due to the law not to take away or add to the word of God.

With this in mind, the time was short from our Lord's first advent until now. It is just ending a week in the eyes of God. We are approaching the seventh day, and it will be here sooner than most realize due to the apostasy-teachings having taken over the teachings of the Word.

So what makes anyone even approach thinking God is slow?

 

[DP]

Ok, the literal Kingdom on earth is not the eternity of the soul. The gospel of the kingdom is the good news of the kingdom of Israel where Jesus is King. This message was good news to the Jews and was preached to the Jews only. The disciples were not to take this message to the Samaritans or the Gentiles. What was kept hid was the fact that this King had to die on a cross for sins before the physical kingdom could be given. Since the nation of Israel as a whole rejected Jesus, the kingdom was not given, yet. The gospel of the kingdom is not about the salvation from sins, but rather the promised kingdom to the nation of Israel. The OT prophets prophesied of both, but the cross was hidden. The prophets never spoke of a cross. We can look back and see the types and shadows because we have the rest of the story. I never said that Paul was the only one that preached the gospel of Jesus Christ, but the full measure and implications of the cross to the Church (doctrine) was given to Paul to preach. The kingdom will go back into effect after the Church is raptured, then this gospel will be preached to all the world through the 2 witnesses and 144,000 male Jews.

Matt 24:14
14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
KJV

Your teachers you follow instead of The Word of God on these matters ought to have made sure there was no reference to the "gospel of the kingdom" being preached to Gentiles, if it were meant ONLY to be preached to Jews.

Your whole theory you push here IS FALLEN, IS FALLEN, just like Babylon.

 

[John146]

Matt 24:14
14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
KJV

Your teachers you follow instead of The Word of God on these matters ought to have made sure there was no reference to the "gospel of the kingdom" being preached to Gentiles, if it were meant ONLY to be preached to Jews.

Your whole theory you push here IS FALLEN, IS FALLEN, just like Babylon.

Was it not only to the Jews at first? That's what Jesus said. The gospel of the kingdom will be preached to the whole world in the great tribulation. It is the announcement to the whole world that the kingdom is at hand, and literally, the kingdom will be at hand. The whole world will hear but most will reject. So when the gospel of the kingdom is preached to the whole world, then the end will come. This is not the gospel of the death, burial and resurrection in which has gone out into the whole world.

 

[DP]

Was it not only to the Jews at first? That's what Jesus said. The gospel of the kingdom will be preached to the whole world in the great tribulation. It is the announcement to the whole world that the kingdom is at hand, and literally, the kingdom will be at hand. The whole world will hear but most will reject. So when the gospel of the kingdom is preached to the whole world, then the end will come. This is not the gospel of the death, burial and resurrection in which has gone out into the whole world.

You're sounding like a record played over and over. You need to recognize the doctrine of men you're pushing is false and it has misled you.

And yes, the gospel of the kingdom IS about Christ's death and resurrection, because without that He would not be King nor have His Kingdom to come. The Gospel of God that Paul mentions many times in his Epistles goes all the way back to the OT Books, which is why he refers to the OT when preaching the Gospel.

But the charlatans you're heeding want you to separate God's Truth about His Plan of Salvation through His Son into a small corner of Scripture, just so they can push other devised false doctrines they have upon the deceived like yourself.

 

[John146]

You're sounding like a record played over and over. You need to recognize the doctrine of men you're pushing is false and it has misled you.

And yes, the gospel of the kingdom IS about Christ's death and resurrection, because without that He would not be King nor have His Kingdom to come. The Gospel of God that Paul mentions many times in his Epistles goes all the way back to the OT Books, which is why he refers to the OT when preaching the Gospel.

But the charlatans you're heeding want you to separate God's Truth about His Plan of Salvation through His Son into a small corner of Scripture, just so they can push other devised false doctrines they have upon the deceived like yourself.

Wow! You got me all wrong. Answer me this, will there be lost people in the millennium reign of Christ? Of course there will be. The gospel of the kingdom is not eternal salvation but the good news to the nation of Israel that their promised kingdom is here with their rightful king (broken record).

Please use Scripture to explain to me why the end of the world has not come? Has the gospel of Jesus Christ gone out to all the world? Yes or no

 

[John146]

Explain to me what the gospel of grace is without using Paul's letters. The how's of Christ's death are revealed in the four gospels, but the whys and wherefores of Christ's death where not completely revealed until after His resurrection. Only then did the world find out that Christ died specifically for our sins and we must trust in Him for forgiveness of sins. The Lord Jesus Christ would reveal all the mysteries of His coming to the Apostle Paul.

 

[dcontroversal]

THERE IS NEITHER Jew nor Gentile in Christ...the two have become one...the Gospel has many layers..all are applicable to believers..both Jew and Gentile......Yes..there will be a literal Kingdom that the Lion of the Tribe of Judah will rule from....The Kingdom of God, Heaven, Christ..........

 

[John146]

THERE IS NEITHER Jew nor Gentile in Christ...the two have become one...the Gospel has many layers..all are applicable to believers..both Jew and Gentile......Yes..there will be a literal Kingdom that the Lion of the Tribe of Judah will rule from....The Kingdom of God, Heaven, Christ..........

Right, there is neither Jew nor Gentile in the body of Christ. But there was no body of Christ before the resurrection and one day, the body of Christ that is now, will be raptured. The 1,000 year reign of Christ is not eternity. It is the kingdom of heaven on earth.

 

[crossnote]

If we're talking about what God's Word actually teaches, and you want to claim Scriptural proof... then let's see you disprove the Scriptures which watchman showed us that Christ's coming to gather His Church is after... the tribulation:

http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/5660-scriptures-prove-post-trib-rapture.html

He threw up an endless barrage of verses (the JW's can give you an endless barrage too) and the got banned.

I'll just address his first one

Mt 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of heaven shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds from one end of heaven to the other.
There is no mistaking, the meaning of this verse, nor can you mistake when it will take place. The coming of the Son of man is immediately after the tribulation of those day.

The 'elect' spoken there is the tribulation saints comprised mostly of Jews, the same group He is speaking to in Mt 24.
The elect can pertain to any group God chooses to save at any particular time, not just the Church age elect, e.g...

Romans 11:5-7 KJVS
[5] Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace. [6] And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work. [7] What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded

 

[crossnote]

With God a thousand years is like a day when it has passed. There are seven days of creation. We are in the Hebrew year 5776 I believe with many years missing from the original calculations from Adam due to the law not to take away or add to the word of God.

With this in mind, the time was short from our Lord's first advent until now. It is just ending a week in the eyes of God. We are approaching the seventh day, and it will be here sooner than most realize due to the apostasy-teachings having taken over the teachings of the Word.

So what makes anyone even approach thinking God is slow?

Faulty logic. One day IS AS a thousand years. It doesn't say IS a thousand years as you are misapplying it.

 

[crossnote]

DP, you're not Watchmen are you?

 

[DP]

Wow! You got me all wrong. Answer me this, will there be lost people in the millennium reign of Christ? Of course there will be. The gospel of the kingdom is not eternal salvation but the good news to the nation of Israel that their promised kingdom is here with their rightful king (broken record).

Please use Scripture to explain to me why the end of the world has not come? Has the gospel of Jesus Christ gone out to all the world? Yes or no

The "gospel of the kingdom" Jesus preached is not about His Salvation? That... kind of thinking ought to be your Wow!, because it is so blatantly un-Biblical! How can a king be a king without a kingdom? Listening to men's false doctrines always leads the deceived away from common sense, as it has done to you.

 

[DP]

Explain to me what the gospel of grace is without using Paul's letters. The how's of Christ's death are revealed in the four gospels, but the whys and wherefores of Christ's death where not completely revealed until after His resurrection. Only then did the world find out that Christ died specifically for our sins and we must trust in Him for forgiveness of sins. The Lord Jesus Christ would reveal all the mysteries of His coming to the Apostle Paul.

Then how was it that Apostle Philip preached the Gospel to the Ethiopian in Acts 8, and baptized him, if that had to wait for Paul's commission?

 

[John146]

Remember, this is the first Gentile saved in Scripture and it comes right after the rejection of Stephen's sermon by the Jewish counsel leading to his death. Philip knew about the cross and forgiveness of sins and could use the shadows and types in the OT to lead the eunuch to the knowledge of Jesus Christ. In chapter 9, God would call out Saul to become the Apostle Paul who God would use to preach the entire truth of the death, burial and resurrection, as well as, the doctrine to the body of Christ which was given through revelation to the Apostle Paul.