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J

jasonj

Guest
#1
#1
when believers are driven apart by scripture. the church is in chaos, everyone thinks they know the truth and oppose the other guy who thinks he knows. scripture should divide non believers with believers, never should it divide Gods chosen believers. The world has long ago corrupted the churches doctrine, otherwise there would never be so many denominations and arguments. how can we agree on Jesus, and let the details kill the unity he calls us to? how is his prayer that believers in Him are one and yet we cant discuss scripture without it turning to childish insults and no one hearing and everyone speaking different "truths" its silly to think we have things figured out when we cant mature because of the bitterness one man "youre a false teacher"..the other " nope, you are"...im rubber your glue ??? it is no wonder to me the church in large is unappealing to people. where is the family? the Love? who holds their tongue when no fruit is to be had? if everyone is contending for the true faith, yet no one agrees......its a shame to me that we have a bond as great as Christ, and cast stones and place stumbling blocks rather than encourage, and lift up. The truth is the ones out there acting in the words and teachings of Christ are far greater to God than any that argue and pretend they alone understand the gospel. knowledge raises YOUR bar, lack of knowledge and simply doing what He taught is the only true Gospel. Go Love people and share The simple gospel and trust God to work out the details and transform the mind. we should ever examine our own behavior and not only the "doctrines" we think are right. If we aren't doing what Jesus taught, we are fooling ourselves plainly. and storing up judgement for our own self and any who follow our example.

I Love discussion about scripture for the purpose of reaching truth in a mature and humble manner, its extremely hard to find in my world. I am wondering who is slow to speak and humble to listen? who prays for the ones we condemn? who will actually lay down our extra for those who need all around us in the world? who is it that truly follows the teachings of Christ. I believe with all I am, not everyone is called to teach, or edify others, the majority of us are called to humbly listen and learn from Christ. If you aren't praying daily for Gods wisdom and understanding of His word, you don't understand. If you are so learned in scripture that you are beyond correction, either you are called of God to teach based on the wisdom you pray for daily in humility, or you know so little that you should forget it and just work on Loving another person. I cant imagine Jesus is too happy with the behavior of at least a majority of His people. If your Christianity is words it is useless. if it is all about you, it is useless. if it doesn't bring a major change to your life, you are not yet there. everythong is done with arguing backbiting, murmuring, criticizing, arguing some more, we make enemies of those who are eternally bound to us.

My heart hurts when I Look too closely at modern Christians for the most part. wonderful people all, who lack maturity to know what is worth arguing about, and what is best left to prayer and petition. if we do not learn to Love one another, all the details and word for word scripture is powerless to us, and pointless to discern. There is a purpose in this life for Christians...to be a light in darkness, to offer true Love where the worlds love is long cold. that is the most powerful thing to affect another person for Jesus Christ. help a single mother put food on her table, help an elderly widow pay a monthly bill, take that friend of your kids who has no dad around to the ball game, encourage Him....visit the lonely in nursing homes......if we do things like this and the many more we think of....when we speak about Jesus, it will have weight to the person because we are offering Love that they may not really know elsewhere. to Love people in truth with action, putting in time, effort, even when it isn't conveinient for us or we may miss a ball game or tv show ect this alone reaches the heart hardened by the world. those mistreated respond to love, those who are poor and needy respond to help and kindness, those who are cast aside or overlooked, they respond to someones company and even a shoulder to cry on......Love in truth by laying our desires, wants, our extra for the sake of others. however we are able that will bring people to Christ, not shouting scripture, nor pointing out their sin while overlooking our own. God bless and if I don't see yall again, may the peace and Love of Christ abound from Him to you and also to all of them. I emplore you to examine yourself with a magnifier, and with honesty according to all the knowledge that you possess. and act upon what you find, act in what you know to be true. action is the truth of what we are called to. to Love, not to say I love everyone but to go love others who need it. without this, there is no church.
 
D

Depleted

Guest
#2
#2
jasonj said:
when believers are driven apart by scripture. the church is in chaos, everyone thinks they know the truth and oppose the other guy who thinks he knows. scripture should divide non believers with believers, never should it divide Gods chosen believers. The world has long ago corrupted the churches doctrine, otherwise there would never be so many denominations and arguments. how can we agree on Jesus, and let the details kill the unity he calls us to? how is his prayer that believers in Him are one and yet we cant discuss scripture without it turning to childish insults and no one hearing and everyone speaking different "truths" its silly to think we have things figured out when we cant mature because of the bitterness one man "youre a false teacher"..the other " nope, you are"...im rubber your glue ??? it is no wonder to me the church in large is unappealing to people. where is the family? the Love? who holds their tongue when no fruit is to be had? if everyone is contending for the true faith, yet no one agrees......its a shame to me that we have a bond as great as Christ, and cast stones and place stumbling blocks rather than encourage, and lift up. The truth is the ones out there acting in the words and teachings of Christ are far greater to God than any that argue and pretend they alone understand the gospel. knowledge raises YOUR bar, lack of knowledge and simply doing what He taught is the only true Gospel. Go Love people and share The simple gospel and trust God to work out the details and transform the mind. we should ever examine our own behavior and not only the "doctrines" we think are right. If we aren't doing what Jesus taught, we are fooling ourselves plainly. and storing up judgement for our own self and any who follow our example.

I Love discussion about scripture for the purpose of reaching truth in a mature and humble manner, its extremely hard to find in my world. I am wondering who is slow to speak and humble to listen? who prays for the ones we condemn? who will actually lay down our extra for those who need all around us in the world? who is it that truly follows the teachings of Christ. I believe with all I am, not everyone is called to teach, or edify others, the majority of us are called to humbly listen and learn from Christ. If you aren't praying daily for Gods wisdom and understanding of His word, you don't understand. If you are so learned in scripture that you are beyond correction, either you are called of God to teach based on the wisdom you pray for daily in humility, or you know so little that you should forget it and just work on Loving another person. I cant imagine Jesus is too happy with the behavior of at least a majority of His people. If your Christianity is words it is useless. if it is all about you, it is useless. if it doesn't bring a major change to your life, you are not yet there. everythong is done with arguing backbiting, murmuring, criticizing, arguing some more, we make enemies of those who are eternally bound to us.

My heart hurts when I Look too closely at modern Christians for the most part. wonderful people all, who lack maturity to know what is worth arguing about, and what is best left to prayer and petition. if we do not learn to Love one another, all the details and word for word scripture is powerless to us, and pointless to discern. There is a purpose in this life for Christians...to be a light in darkness, to offer true Love where the worlds love is long cold. that is the most powerful thing to affect another person for Jesus Christ. help a single mother put food on her table, help an elderly widow pay a monthly bill, take that friend of your kids who has no dad around to the ball game, encourage Him....visit the lonely in nursing homes......if we do things like this and the many more we think of....when we speak about Jesus, it will have weight to the person because we are offering Love that they may not really know elsewhere. to Love people in truth with action, putting in time, effort, even when it isn't conveinient for us or we may miss a ball game or tv show ect this alone reaches the heart hardened by the world. those mistreated respond to love, those who are poor and needy respond to help and kindness, those who are cast aside or overlooked, they respond to someones company and even a shoulder to cry on......Love in truth by laying our desires, wants, our extra for the sake of others. however we are able that will bring people to Christ, not shouting scripture, nor pointing out their sin while overlooking our own. God bless and if I don't see yall again, may the peace and Love of Christ abound from Him to you and also to all of them. I emplore you to examine yourself with a magnifier, and with honesty according to all the knowledge that you possess. and act upon what you find, act in what you know to be true. action is the truth of what we are called to. to Love, not to say I love everyone but to go love others who need it. without this, there is no church.
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While your words ring true too, aren't you doing the exact thing you're complaining about? You start with there are too many denominations. Really? My denomination split directly because the denomination we were part of decided to preach humanism over God. It preached what is now the Joel-Osteen version of feel-good-humanity gospel, instead of what God says in his word. Should we have stayed? That denomination is still around. Others have recently left because now they're accepting homosexual pastors. Should they have stayed?

And then you go from there to blaming the church for lack of humility and honest discussion, before continuing to blame it for the actions you think THEY should do.

What's the difference between you and "they?"
 
J

John146

Senior Member
#3
Jan 13, 2016
16,785
3,568
113
#3
Welcome to the church of the Laodiceans, many Bibles, many different views on doctrines, very little evangelism, rich, neither cold nor hot, etc...
 
Budman

Budman

Senior Member
#4
Mar 9, 2014
4,153
1,998
113
#4
If you actually want chaos, have everyone just hold hands and sing Kumbaya and chuck truth right out the window. If you want unity at the expense of the truth, that unity isn't worth a hill of beans. The Catholic church is attempting to do just that - trying to gather all religions together with the mantra that we have more in common than we have differences.

It won't work.

The truth remains the truth no matter who it offends. As a Christian, isn't it better to stand up for what is right and be hated for it, than to just "agree to disagree" and be loved by this lost, sin-soaked world?
 
C

Chuckt

Guest
#5
#5
Jason,

God is called "The Word" and He spoke. He is Lord and we are accountable to what He said.

There were thirteen tribes of Israel because different people needed different things and God allows for differences.
What we will have in the last days are the anti-Christ and a one world religion worshipping the beast so I want to be different.

But divisions are the result of children tossed to and fro with every wind of doctrine and it isn't the fault of people who believe doctrine but it is the fault of people who don't believe God.

The reason we can't have everyone agree is because people start to entertain their own ideas instead of what scripture says. They aren't disciplined with sitting under a teacher for a length of time.

The other problem is that I feel there are a number of people in this forum who are either unchurched or don't have very good pastors in my opinion and I'm not going to point out who they are but I think some of them are trying.

So if you see a problem, teach the word and be patient because that is the only way for you to get people on the right path with God.

Chuck
 
P

popeye

Guest
#6
#6
Why worry over doctrinal differences?

If a certain board is poisonous,go to another.

There are good discussions. Good people.
Lots of different motives. Get new strategies instead of getting some across the board disappointment with a forum
 
C

Chuckt

Guest
#7
#7
popeye said:
Why worry over doctrinal differences?

If a certain board is poisonous,go to another.

There are good discussions. Good people.
Lots of different motives. Get new strategies instead of getting some across the board disappointment with a forum
Click to expand...
Regardless of some people having frustration here, there are enough people coming here that there are opportunities.

Look for the opportunities, help those who are open and let the ones that want to be lost stay lost.
 
Willie-T

Willie-T

Banned
#8
Feb 7, 2015
22,418
413
0
#8
"Scriptures" are the excuse. PRIDE is the driver.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#9
#9
Hey Jason, thanks for proving Christianity is so dangerous to satan and his war effort, that he attacks it so hard, he causes all these divisions.. Praise God
 
Utah

Utah

Banned
#10
Dec 1, 2014
9,701
251
0
#10
Jason, I'm a Pharisee slayer. How they choose to be slayed is entirely up to them. I try slaying them with God's grace in a loving manner, but when they refuse to embrace it, well, I no doubt fit your OP. I truly respect your heart and passion, but I will not lay down and passively watch anyone be a stumbling block against others seeking God's grace.
 
U

un2him

Senior Member
#11
Jan 16, 2016
205
3
18
#11
Words bring forth life or death.

We as creative spiritual beings should know this better then others.

The unity comes as we cleanse our soul of judgement.... replacing it with love and mercy. All of us are God's children each on their own personal journey and at varying stages of maturity.


  • Lust – to have an intense desire or need: “But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart” (Matthew 5:28).
  • Gluttony – excess in eating and drinking: “for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags” (Proverbs 23:21).
  • Greed - excessive or reprehensible acquisitiveness: “Having lost all sensitivity, they have given themselves over to sensuality so as to indulge in every kind of impurity, with a continual lust for more” (Ephesians 4:19).
  • Laziness – disinclined to activity or exertion: not energetic or vigorous: “The way of the sluggard is blocked with thorns, but the path of the upright is a highway” (Proverbs 15:19).
  • Wrath – strong vengeful anger or indignation: “A gentle answer turns away wrath, but a harsh word stirs up anger” (Proverbs 15:1)
  • Envy – painful or resentful awareness of an advantage enjoyed by another joined with a desire to possess the same advantage: “Therefore, rid yourselves of all malice and all deceit, hypocrisy, envy, and slander of every kind. Like newborn babies, crave pure spiritual milk, so that by it you may grow up in your salvation” (1 Peter 2:1-2).
  • Pride - quality or state of being proud – inordinate self esteem: “Pride goes before destruction, a haughty spirit before a fall” (Proverbs 16:18).

Is good that one examines himself for even the thoughts have substance and that energy should always build and create not take away from the kingdom.
 
J

Jasper37

Junior Member
#12
Mar 3, 2016
18
2
3
#12
I loved your post Jason.
Very wise words.
Jesus spoke of taking the log out of our own eye before we attempt to take the splinter out of another's.
There is one truth, Jesus lived, died and was resurrected so that we may have eternal life.
Christianity is simple, love God and love others.
Every law falls under these two commands.
We are not the moral police or the theology Gestapo.
Thoughtful discussion is great, God gave us a brain and a mouth to use them.
But as long as our brothers and sisters believe in Jesus, in who He claimed to be then
 
Grace777x70

Grace777x70

Banned
#13
Nov 22, 2015
20,436
1,430
0
#13
LOL..I like that.."Pharisee slayer".....does that apply to Judaizers too that come in after the word is preached to nullify the grace of Christ?


Utah said:
Jason, I'm a Pharisee slayer. How they choose to be slayed is entirely up to them. I try slaying them with God's grace in a loving manner, but when they refuse to embrace it, well, I no doubt fit your OP. I truly respect your heart and passion, but I will not lay down and passively watch anyone be a stumbling block against others seeking God's grace.
Click to expand...
 
Utah

Utah

Banned
#14
Dec 1, 2014
9,701
251
0
#14
Grace777x70 said:
LOL..I like that.."Pharisee slayer".....does that apply to Judaizers too that come in after the word is preached to nullify the grace of Christ?
Click to expand...
Most definitely! :)

Judaizers who wish to follow the Law of Moses have my blessings, and I am truly happy for them, but when they throw daggers at believers in Christ who choose not to follow the Law of Moses, then my blessings morph into something less pleasant. :)
 
HeRoseFromTheDead

HeRoseFromTheDead

Senior Member
#15
Sep 4, 2012
14,424
689
113
#15
Grace777x70 said:
LOL..I like that.."Pharisee slayer".....does that apply to Judaizers too that come in after the word is preached to nullify the grace of Christ?
Click to expand...
That what pharisee means. They are as dangerous as the gnostics/mystics who pervert the grace of GOD.
 
T

thepsalmist

Guest
#16
#16
1 COR 11:18-19

18 For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it.
19 For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#17
#17
Utah said:
Most definitely! :)

Judaizers who wish to follow the Law of Moses have my blessings, and I am truly happy for them, but when they throw daggers at believers in Christ who choose not to follow the Law of Moses, then my blessings morph into something less pleasant. :)
Click to expand...
As it shouldl be for anyone who tries to spread the filth of a gospel of salvation is based on how well we do in life, and not on the cross period..
 
T

thepsalmist

Guest
#18
#18
Utah said:
Most definitely! :)

Judaizers who wish to follow the Law of Moses have my blessings, and I am truly happy for them, but when they throw daggers at believers in Christ who choose not to follow the Law of Moses, then my blessings morph into something less pleasant. :)
Click to expand...

20 But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;
21 Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.

Jesus does not advocate returning evil for evil - ever ...

Pray for your enemies
Love your neighbor
Love your brothers

You seem to be boasting that a love that crumples under adversity is GOOD ... but we are called to better things.
 
Yonah

Yonah

Senior Member
#19
Oct 31, 2014
1,074
103
48
#19
Seems to me if your secure in your faith and the truth you have been blessed to have received then anyone who is trying to teach falsehood, their words will fall to the ground, what? is not the word the sword of truth? do we not hold fast to the truth?
If you feel threatened by people who teach what you see as the falsehood
, then you must ask yourself these questions. The only way to fight against false doctrine is with the word, not our opinions or complaints about how wrong it is, if what they believe is the truth it will stand any and all scrutiny when compared to the word, if it be false that falsehood will surely be exposed, so rather then withstand the lies with insults and railing, why not draw your sword and defend the word with the word, after all our Savior showed us this way.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#20
#20
Yonah said:
Seems to me if your secure in your faith and the truth you have been blessed to have received then anyone who is trying to teach falsehood, their words will fall to the ground, what? is not the word the sword of truth? do we not hold fast to the truth?
If you feel threatened by people who teach what you see as the falsehood
, then you must ask yourself these questions. The only way to fight against false doctrine is with the word, not our opinions or complaints about how wrong it is, if what they believe is the truth it will stand any and all scrutiny when compared to the word, if it be false that falsehood will surely be exposed, so rather then withstand the lies with insults and railing, why not draw your sword and defend the word with the word, after all our Savior showed us this way.
Click to expand...
I do not fight for myself. I have no need to.

I and people like UTAH fight for the people who are not secure, or even know the truth, who may be led astray by these false prophets and false teachers..
 
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