What is the Difference Between "Happiness" and "Joy"?

[seoulsearch]

Hey Everyone,

This is actually a personal question I've always wondered: what is the difference between "being happy" and having "the joy of the Lord"?

Several months ago I read a devotional about a pastor who visited two women in the same day and noted the extreme differences in their outlooks on life.

The first woman was in her 40's, had a nice family and good husband, had all their bills paid, but was never happy. She wearily complained to the pastor about all the things she felt were wrong in her life, and never mentioned all the good things the pastor noticed. Nothing was ever right, and even when it was good, it could always be improved upon.

The second woman was in her 80's, was disabled with lots of health issues, and was living on a fixed income. But she joyfully told the pastor about all the wonderful blessings God had given her in her daily life, and made a note in her date book (about her meeting with the pastor), "Had a visitor--yet another happy day."

The first woman was obviously not happy, and she had no joy.

The second woman, I'm guessing, wasn't exactly happy with some of the challenges she was facing, but her joy was more than obvious (provided she was being honest and not just putting on a show. I've been in churches a long time, and yes, I'm cynical like that.)

* Which woman can you relate to in your own life? (I will flat-out confess--I am Woman #1, hands down.)

* What is the difference between happiness and joy?

* How is is possible to have joy but not happiness? And is it possible to be happy but not have joy?

I'm looking forward to your answers!!

And I hope everyone has a good day that's filled with both joy AND happiness.

 

[JeniBean]

Hey Everyone,

This is actually a personal question I've always wondered: what is the difference between "being happy" and having "the joy of the Lord"?

Several months ago I read a devotional about a pastor who visited two women in the same day and noted the extreme differences in their outlooks on life.

The first woman was in her 40's, had a nice family and good husband, had all their bills paid, but was never happy. She wearily complained to the pastor about all the things she felt were wrong in her life, and never mentioned all the good things the pastor noticed. Nothing was ever right, and even when it was good, it could always be improved upon.

The second woman was in her 80's, was disabled with lots of health issues, and was living on a fixed income. But she joyfully told the pastor about all the wonderful blessings God had given her in her daily life, and made a note in her date book (about her meeting with the pastor), "Had a visitor--yet another happy day."

The first woman was obviously not happy, and she had no joy.

The second woman, I'm guessing, wasn't exactly happy with some of the challenges she was facing, but her joy was more than obvious (provided she was being honest and not just putting on a show. I've been in churches a long time, and yes, I'm cynical like that.)

* Which woman can you relate to in your own life? (I will flat-out confess--I am Woman #1, hands down.)

* What is the difference between happiness and joy?

* How is is possible to have joy but not happiness? And is it possible to be happy but not have joy?

I'm looking forward to your answers!!

And I hope everyone has a good day that's filled with both joy AND happiness.

I am hands down a person who finds joy in every circumstance and tries very hard to make others around me happy.

Is there a difference is them. Hmmm....as I said I find Joy in everything and this makes me happy. I wholeheartedly feel this is a choice on how to live. Things in my life are no where near perfect, however my perfect will be in heaven. So why not find the good in all the crud that surrounds us?

 

[seoulsearch]

I guess I should clarify what I mean when I'm saying that I am definitely Woman #1 in the example.

In everyday life, I have a good game face, and in my heart, I mean it when it comes to the people I'm around. I have people in my life I love dearly and am ever-thankful for, and I express this to them often. I take my "calling" as someone meant to uplift and encourage seriously and try to build others up (give them joy), even though I make a lot of mistakes.

But the place where I falter is in my private life with God. I'm outwardly "happy" and genuinely joyful around other people most of the time. But when I get alone with God, I'll tell Him how I'm REALLY feeling--mostly about life, or purpose (and my feeling of a lack thereof), Christianity (aka, the Bible Discussion Forum, church expectations), social issues, etc., and... it's not pretty.

Something I've been discussing with God a lot lately is that in our jobs, no matter how hard you work or how much you achieve, management will always see room for improvement and want you to do more. I understand--this is what keeps businesses afloat and keeps them ahead of the game.

And so, I ask God things like, "Lord, I know I'm supposed to be content with what I have... But where is the line between contentment and wanting to see 'improvements' in my life, too? Am I only allowed to work myself to the bone to meet others' views of 'improvement' but not hope for tangible results in my own life, too?"

These are the things I talk to God about all the time.

And the prayers I'm having during these moments are definitely not happy or joyful.

 

[phil36]

Its a good topic and a very important one for Christians. We easily fall for cultures way of happiness..materialism and selfishness.. Happiness is a feeling, this alone should help us understand the need for real joy not a fleeting emotional feeling. If we chase feelings then we will never have real contentment nor joy.

Joy on the other hand comes from the christian life in Christ... When we set our minds on Christ. Spurgeon would say when you 'set your mind on the things of God, who He is and what He has done', then you begin to see the fruit of joy. Why do I use Spurgeon well, here is a guy who suffered from depression and yet could only speak of the joy he had in the Lord, even in his darkest moments. Happy feelings will not see you through such times.

Phil4:

4 Rejoice in the Lord always. I will say it again: Rejoice! 5 Let your gentleness be evident to all. The Lord is near. 6 Do not be anxious about anything, but in every situation, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, present your requests to God. 7 And the peace of God,which transcends all understanding, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus.
8 Finally, brothers and sisters, whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things.


John 15:

9 “As the Father has loved me, so have I loved you. Now remain in my love. 10 If you keep my commands, you will remain in my love, just as I have kept my Father’s commands and remain in his love. 11 I have told you this so that my joy may be in you and that your joy may be complete.




Also, remember a single burning coal will soon lose its heat and go out.. We need each other, christian fellowship is good for us.

Anyhow, you can be happy and have no joy...that would be like chasing the wind - pointless.

Christians can have real joy in Christ in any situation no matter how bad..that Joy is the contemptment in Him, for who He is, what He has done and will do. No one can rob you of that kind of real joy.

Keep in the truth and renew your mind (Psalm1, Romans 12:2), Pray (1 Cor 15:14; Psalm 122:6).

Anyhow just a short reply..

 

[Willie-T]

I've mentioned several times about my Art Teacher who wrote this on the Whiteboard one of the many days I was moping around, feeling sorry for myself:

"To be happy, just forget about you."

I think if we listen to the adage that creates an acronym out of the word, JOY.....

J esus first
O thers second
Y ourself last.

.... we have, right there in our hands, the formula for being happy in the joy of the Lord.

 

[seoulsearch]

I've mentioned several times about my Art Teacher who wrote this on the Whiteboard one of the many days I was moping around, feeling sorry for myself:

"To be happy, just forget about you."

I think if we listen to the adage that creates an acronym out of the word, JOY.....

J esus first
O thers second
Y ourself last.

.... we have, right there in our hands, the formula for being happy in the joy of the Lord.

I would like to ask though, what happens when you get burned out on serving other people?

I've often said, the Christian Culture is a Catch 22. People will tell you, "Just start looking around and put your focus on other people." And if that's what you've done for a long time, you can burn out--sometimes severely.

Other Christians will then want to know (I'm not saying this about you at all, Willie, just people in general) exactly what you think you've been "doing for the Lord" because they want to be able to measure/judge/make a ruling on whether you've been "doing enough" for God or not, or if the work you're choosing to do "actually counts" when it comes to serving the Lord.

At the same time, you also have the Christians who will quote the passage about "not letting your left hand know what your right hand is doing" (or did I get the hands mixed around... I'll have to look it up...) and then criticizing you for "bragging about all your good deeds."

Either way, they're shoving you in a pit and saying it's your own problem and your own fault.

I can blatantly admit--my main purpose in studying the Bible so hard and participating in so many things has often been because I felt I needed a way to defend myself from other Christians, not necessarily because I was trying to get closer to the Lord. For me, it's almost become a form of "Karate"--to be used in self-defense--when other Christians attack (which you can count on them doing, again and again.)

I used to keep a detailed list of all the classes, ministries, outreach events and so forth that I participated in--NOT because I was trying to be boastful, but because simply because I felt I needed some kind of "proof" when other Christians told me that if I'd just spend more time serving others, I'd find that magical unicorn of Christian Contentment.

 

[Complete_In_Him]

All that we have in the Lord is lovely, peace, love, comfort, contentment of soul, "think on these things" the scripture influences us, for good reason, it is extremely pleasant to be heavenly minded.

A good question might be what is the "object" and source of our joy? The joy of the Lord is a good personal study. I find the greatest happiness in small things, simple things, like seeing a bird get a worm or splash in a bath... a smile from another, or a rainbow as I commute, a sweet scent on the air during Spring. Flying a kite, good lord it is the best medicine, EVER!


God gives His Christians to the world, not that we should be the policemen of another's faith, but ambassador's in Christ's stead, "Not that we have dominion over your faith, but are helper's of your joy."

 

[seoulsearch]

P.S. I know, I know.

NOW the response will be, "Well of course all those things didn't work, Seoul, you didn't do them with the right attitude. If you'd been doing them unto the Lord and not just for your own purposes..." [it would have worked and the heavenly aura of Christian love and contentment would have fallen upon you.]

Sigh. As I said, you can never win with the Christian Culture. Many of the things I did was because I was so desperately seeking a deeper relationship with God, and the state of my heart would be something only He would know (and be able to judge.)

 

[FreeNChrist]

Happiness is based in "happenings"....external things that positively affects your life in one way or another. Happiness can come and go. But the joy that comes from Christ, which is the fruit of the Spirit, that wells up from within, is lasting joy. Joy that we can have even in the midst of the trials we all endure.

Interestingly, the Greek word for Grace, charis, was derived from the root word char, which means "well-being, that which was pleasant and delightful." Another derivative from char was chara, the Greek word for "joy". Charis had a double meaning; beauty, charm, attractiveness, that which is lovely and delightful, and also the expression of kindness, favor, friendliness.

 

[Willie-T]

I would like to ask though, what happens when you get burned out on serving other people?

I've often said, the Christian Culture is a Catch 22. People will tell you, "Just start looking around and put your focus on other people." And if that's what you've done for a long time, you can burn out--sometimes severely.

Other Christians will then want to know (I'm not saying this about you at all, Willie, just people in general) exactly what you think you've been "doing for the Lord" because they want to be able to measure/judge/make a ruling on whether you've been "doing enough" for God or not, or if the work you're choosing to do "actually counts" when it comes to serving the Lord.

At the same time, you also have the Christians who will quote the passage about "not letting your left hand know what your right hand is doing" (or did I get the hands mixed around... I'll have to look it up...) and then criticizing you for "bragging about all your good deeds."

Either way, they're shoving you in a pit and saying it's your own problem and your own fault.

I can blatantly admit--my main purpose in studying the Bible so hard and participating in so many things has often been because I felt I needed a way to defend myself from other Christians, not necessarily because I was trying to get closer to the Lord. For me, it's almost become a form of "Karate"--to be used in self-defense--when other Christians attack (which you can count on them doing, again and again.)

I used to keep a detailed list of all the classes, ministries, outreach events and so forth that I participated in--NOT because I was trying to be boastful, but because simply because I felt I needed some kind of "proof" when other Christians told me that if I'd just spend more time serving others, I'd find that magical unicorn of Christian Contentment.

Please note that I am not saying to simply involve yourself with serving others.... but rather, to first, develop within yourself, a loving concern for them. Just "doing" some stuff for others isn't going to accomplish much more than help you feel you have fulfilled some "lawful; requirement. That kind of thing is fairly short-lived. It actually invites burn-out.

 

[Lynx]

Happiness depends on circumstances. Joy depends on the person who has joy. You are happy because something good happened. You have joy because you choose to.

Consider Philippians chapter 4:
[SUP]10 [/SUP]But I rejoiced in the Lord greatly, that now at the last your care of me hath flourished again; wherein ye were also careful, but ye lacked opportunity.
[SUP]11 [/SUP]Not that I speak in respect of want: for I have learned, in whatsoever state I am, therewith to be content.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]I know both how to be abased, and I know how to abound: every where and in all things I am instructed both to be full and to be hungry, both to abound and to suffer need.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me.


Please notice this came right after Philippians 4:8. You know, that verse about talking about good things.

Well, that answers the OP. But I get the feeling there is a different matter at hand for you seoulsearch. I'll reply to that in my next post.

 

[seoulsearch]

Please note that I am not saying to simply involve yourself with serving others.... but rather, to first, develop within yourself, a loving concern for them. Just "doing" some stuff for others isn't going to accomplish much more than help you feel you have fulfilled some "lawful; requirement..

I understand what you're saying, Willie. When I was in school or other obligations, I did what I was obligated to do.

Once I left that environment, I chose things I had a genuine interest in and concern for. And if I tried something and didn't like it, I would fulfill my commitment and, upon release, choose something else.

While some serving has been out of necessity (being a greeter at church isn't one of my favorite jobs, but I know it's necessary for the church to function), I was passionate about many things (you can tell because I mention them often.)

However, as you know, working with people can be very draining (especially for an introvert), and because I'm around people all day already at work, I've resorted to looking for ways to help without having to deal with a lot of people (such as cleaning and preparing bulletins.)

 

[seoulsearch]

Well, that answers the OP. But I get the feeling there is a different matter at hand for you seoulsearch. I'll reply to that in my next post.

Forget joy and happiness.

What kind of a feeling does one get when they know they have a Lynx crawling around inside their head?!

 

[Willie-T]

I understand what you're saying, Willie. When I was in school or other obligations, I did what I was obligated to do.

Once I left that environment, I chose things I had a genuine interest in and concern for. And if I tried something and didn't like it, I would fulfill my commitment and, upon release, choose something else.

While some serving has been out of necessity (being a greeter at church isn't one of my favorite jobs, but I know it's necessary for the church to function), I was passionate about many things (you can tell because I mention them often.)

However, as you know, working with people can be very draining (especially for an introvert), and because I'm around people all day already at work, I've resorted to looking for ways to help without having to deal with a lot of people (such as cleaning and preparing bulletins.)

Both my wife and I do that a lot. I'm very critical of most people. Not a good thing, but I recognize it, and so do not overload myself with direct contact with situations I know will be an aggravation. But there are many things to do that will give you a break from constant, elbow-to-elbow contact.

 

[PoetMary]

Hey Everyone,

This is actually a personal question I've always wondered: what is the difference between "being happy" and having "the joy of the Lord"?

Several months ago I read a devotional about a pastor who visited two women in the same day and noted the extreme differences in their outlooks on life.

The first woman was in her 40's, had a nice family and good husband, had all their bills paid, but was never happy. She wearily complained to the pastor about all the things she felt were wrong in her life, and never mentioned all the good things the pastor noticed. Nothing was ever right, and even when it was good, it could always be improved upon.

The second woman was in her 80's, was disabled with lots of health issues, and was living on a fixed income. But she joyfully told the pastor about all the wonderful blessings God had given her in her daily life, and made a note in her date book (about her meeting with the pastor), "Had a visitor--yet another happy day."

The first woman was obviously not happy, and she had no joy.

The second woman, I'm guessing, wasn't exactly happy with some of the challenges she was facing, but her joy was more than obvious (provided she was being honest and not just putting on a show. I've been in churches a long time, and yes, I'm cynical like that.)

* Which woman can you relate to in your own life? (I will flat-out confess--I am Woman #1, hands down.)

* What is the difference between happiness and joy?

* How is is possible to have joy but not happiness? And is it possible to be happy but not have joy?

I'm looking forward to your answers!!

And I hope everyone has a good day that's filled with both joy AND happiness.

First of all, I would posit that Woman #1 was neither happy, NOR joyful. She experienced COMFORT and SECURITY in her life, but she wasn't experiencing pleasure (happiness) or any kind of greater connection to purpose, other people, and God (joy).

I have a feeling that lots of folks would describe happiness as fleeting and joy as lasting. I'm going to use information from Brene Brown to describe these ideas. Based on her work, the difference between happiness and joy is the accompanying experience of vulnerability. So, I could eat a good meal and experience happiness...the pleasure of that good meal. However, if I ate a good meal and experienced JOY, my pleasure in the meal would be accompanied by vulnerability...the sense of the inherent temporal nature of the meal and an understanding that there will never be another meal like it.

Brene Brown says that our culture has developed a sense of FOREBODING joy...that because joy requires vulnerability, we shy away from it by imagining worse case scenarios. So...back to the meal. I'm eating it and experiencing pleasure. I have a realization that this is fleeting. Instead of engaging with GRATITUDE for what I have in that moment and thereby leaning into both the joy and the vulnerability, I cut it off at the pass. I move into a scarcity mindset and then I OVEREAT because I fear no good meal will ever happen for me again. I have strangled vulnerability, but I've also lost joy.

Brene Brown says the #1 way to experience joy is to have a DAILY PRACTICE of gratitude. If we take time everyday to notice all that we have been given, then instead of fearing the vulnerability that accompanies joy, that vulnerability triggers in us a corresponding sense of gratitude.

So, I'm at my meal. I experience pleasure...the pleasure moves into joy. I have a sense of vulnerability and instead of squashing it, I begin to thank God for the lovely meal. I express gratitude for those who prepared it...for those who grew the food, etc. Suddenly, I'm right in that moment of joy.

 

[Lynx]

seoulsearch your OP spoke of happiness and joy, but your subsequent posts gave me the feeling that what you are really feeling is aimlessness. To put it bluntly, your life needs a focus.

(Nota bien: If I am wrong about this, please disregard the previous statements and everything following in this post.)

I have felt the same way before so I can understand and sympathize. Sometimes it's hard to find a reason to keep going when you think nothing you do will really ever matter. All you can do is keep working at a job to make money to keep living to keep working to keep making money to keep living to keep...

The surest cure I know is to find something that interest you enough to justify pouring your life into it. For some it's a hobby like stamp collecting or trick bikes. For some it is helping others in various ways (hint: that's why so many rich people turn to philanthropy - they have all the money they need and they still don't have the satisfaction the world told them they would get, so they turn to something else that will make them feel they have actually made a difference in the world.)

I'm reminded of a quote from someone wiser than I. "We speak of comfort and luxury as if they are necessary for happiness. All we need to make us really happy is something to be enthusiastic about." Me, I'm enthusiastic about music. I'm also a minor minister and I'm pretty enthusiastic about the stuff I do as a minister. (Most of it is not preaching, by the way, but you already knew that.) I have and I do things that I enjoy and have positive effects. I'm not rich, I'm not really poor, but I'm content with my life.

Try looking at your abilities, looking at what you enjoy, and finding something you can do that fits those. If you already have, keep trying. Life is really boring, frustrating and futile without something to be enthusiastic about.

 

[Lynx]

Forget joy and happiness.

What kind of a feeling does one get when they know they have a Lynx crawling around inside their head?!

Yeah, well you wouldn't believe what I found under the couch cushions in that place.

 

[seoulsearch]

I have a feeling that lots of folks would describe happiness as fleeting and joy as lasting. I'm going to use information from Brene Brown to describe these ideas. Based on her work, the difference between happiness and joy is the accompanying experience of vulnerability. So, I could eat a good meal and experience happiness...the pleasure of that good meal. However, if I ate a good meal and experienced JOY, my pleasure in the meal would be accompanied by vulnerability...the sense of the inherent temporal nature of the meal and an understanding that there will never be another meal like it.

This is a really interesting thought... I've never even considered vulnerability to be a part of joy... I'm going to have to ruminate on this one a while longer, because another underlying current is fear--the fear that the moment will pass and you won't have another moment that will be as good as the one currently being experienced.

And I have definitely felt this a lot in my life.

How about the rest of you?

 

[seoulsearch]

Yeah, well you wouldn't believe what I found under the couch cushions in that place.

Let's be honest here.

What you found... were a lot of (milk) chocolate bar wrappers.

*Braces herself for a Lynxian speech about the depravity of milk chocolate...*

 

[melita916]

i always viewed happiness as an emotion, which can change from one minute to the next.

i always viewed joy as a characteristic.