Losing Salvation

[roaringkitten]

Jude wrote about defending the gospel ok but your idea of how it is to be done is not a one size fits all approach Paul addressed the statute to " The unknown god" would not that statute to this so-called unknown god be offencive ?
by what I think some believe Paul should have done; is say to the Greeks: you false teacher! and supporters of heresies ! You damnable teaching you do. That would have been ok but Paul did not do that did he? I am not allowing one to contend anything about water baptism in fact I posted very clearly what it is I think the bible says about salvation.

I guess my objective is not to prove those who post in the BDF that I am right and they are wrong because so many examples in the Word of God shows me a more excellent way LIke Paul did. I think Paul said it as the Holy Spirit gave it to him " That I might be all things to all men that I might win some."

But I could be wrong

nopetome is exactly right about Jude 1:3. We are talking about the gospel here, we're not talking about all the other topics of the BDF. The people of Mar's hill were simply lost men with vain philosophies. They aren't comparible to "heretics" that corrupt the gospel which is why Paul didn't rebuke them as such. Paul preached in different ways according to the situation and audience. He sometimes reproved, rebuked, and other times exhorted(2 Tim 4:2). Paul did do lots of rebuking to those who corrupted the gospel message(ie Gal 1:6-9). And Saul(Paul) does say this about "proving":

"But Saul increased the more in strength, and confounded the Jews which dwelt at Damascus, proving that this is very Christ." Acts 9:22

Paul was right wasn't he about Jesus? Yes he was trying to prove himself right about Christ, and he did so through the Scriptures(ie: Acts 17:2). Why are people acting like "damnable heresy" is a curse word or something? Every person who teaches another gospel is teaching a gospel that can't save. A gospel that can't save keeps people on the path to hell! That's why it is called "damnable heresy" in the Word. Paul even mentioned about damnable heresies in 2 Pet 2:1, so you can be sure he was speaking about this much throughout his ministry. My goal isn't to prove that I'm right about the hundreds of topics we see on the BDF(the negotiables), but to prove the truth from the Scriptures about the gospel(the non-negotiable).

 

[RobbyEarl]

nopetome is exactly right about Jude 1:3. We are talking about the gospel here, we're not talking about all the other topics of the BDF. The people of Mar's hill were simply lost men with vain philosophies. They aren't comparible to "heretics" that corrupt the gospel which is why Paul didn't rebuke them as such. Paul preached in different ways according to the situation and audience. He sometimes reproved, rebuked, and other times exhorted(2 Tim 4:2). Paul did do lots of rebuking to those who corrupted the gospel message(ie Gal 1:6-9). And Saul(Paul) does say this about "proving":

"But Saul increased the more in strength, and confounded the Jews which dwelt at Damascus, proving that this is very Christ." Acts 9:22

Paul was right wasn't he about Jesus? Yes he was trying to prove himself right about Christ, and he did so through the Scriptures(ie: Acts 17:2). Why are people acting like "damnable heresy" is a curse word or something? Every person who teaches another gospel is teaching a gospel that can't save. A gospel that can't save keeps people on the path to hell! That's why it is called "damnable heresy" in the Word. Paul even mentioned about damnable heresies in 2 Pet 2:1, so you can be sure he was speaking about this much throughout his ministry. My goal isn't to prove that I'm right about the hundreds of topics we see on the BDF(the negotiables), but to prove the truth from the Scriptures about the gospel(the non-negotiable).

The reason why Paul had little success at Mars hill or Athens is because He tried to intellectually convince them and did not make the cross and Him Crucified the main theme of His speech. That is why in Corinth He said "I have determined to know nothing among you save Christ and Him Crucified" and was able to establish a church there and not so at mars hill.

 

[B1Davanda]

Thats not what the bible says. It says there are those who have tasted and known that God is good. They understood truth, but left that truth, and that they cannot come back- they WERE saved and lost their salvation.

No, you misunderstand.
Salvation by faith in Christ alone wasn't good enough in their own eyes.

They wouldn't accept the righteousness which is by faith in Christ, and would rather find a way to have their OWN righteousness count somehow.

If a person doesn't want Jesus as Savior, there is no more, in a sense for them, sacrifice for sin, for the only sacrifice for sin that God accepts now, is that of His only begotten Son who shed His blood and died on the cross for us.

If you reject this gift, there remains no more sacrifice for sin, because God will not accept any other way to Him.

I hope you are not trusting in anything you attempt to do...not water-baptism, not your own obedience, not your own confession or repentence or best behavior.

I hope you see that it's not by works of righteousness which WE have done, but it's by faith in Him and His sacrifice for you by faith, or nothing.

Please don't let this discourage you, though.
Some ppl think this is a one-time decision, and that God is shutting the person out, but that's not necessarily the case.

Of course, it's not good to harden our heart, and the bible even talks about God hardening ppl's hearts that are just determined they want no parts of His grace, mercy, and love.

But God tells us to forgive 70×7...unlimited, and certainly He is willing to do the same for anyone that turns from their own self-righteousness or trying to find a way other than by Jesus, and turns to Him by faith alone.

He's a loving and forgiving God and Father, the Good Shepherd, our Savior, and anyone who comes to Him by faith He will not cast out.

While we were YET sinners- implying before He takes our sins away. If it were the case that no one has to do anything, then why are some saved but most are not?

Because they refuse to receive His Gift by FAITH,
and want to climb in some other way.

While we were still in our sins, Christ died for us.
He didn't demand our obedience or good-works,
as if the human race could or would clean itself up first.

No. While the whole human race was right smack in the middle of all our sins, He stepped into our world, went to the cross, and died for us.

What amazing love, how can it be?
That Thou, my God, would die for me?!!!

 

[BeyondET]

What's this Mars hill thing, y'all talking about the mega church that folded just couple years ago?

 

[psychomom]

What's this Mars hill thing, y'all talking about the mega church that folded just couple years ago?

that totally made it worth signing back in and jumping to the end of the thread!

i think the mega-church was named for the passage in Acts 17.

but you knew that, right? in any case, you made my day.

 

[BeyondET]

that totally made it worth signing back in and jumping to the end of the thread!

i think the mega-church was named for the passage in Acts 17.

but you knew that, right? in any case, you made my day.

no I didn't know about Acts 17
i just heard about the mega church going belly up lol

your welcome

 

[fredoheaven]

This is a false dichotomy because unworthiness doesn't preclude obedience. The bible clearly witnesses that GOD gives grace to those who obey him.

God's grace is given for undeserving, God's blessing is given to those who obey Him.

 

[RobbyEarl]

Rejoicing over a church failing?

 

[breno785au]

IF we can lose our Salvation by sinning, then does this mean we need to be Re-baptized every time we lose our Salvation?

Notice i said IF.

I'd have to live by the beach if that were true.

 

[BenFTW]

I'd have to live by the beach if that were true.

Might have to grow some gills. lol

I can already see someone reading this, religious by mindset, and think "How can they joke about sin like this!?" The joke is not in reference to sin but false doctrine.

 

[B1Davanda]

a person that has been genuinely saved can lose their salvation. Although it is a difficult thing to, as Jesus said he would leave the 99 and go after the one. It is a miserable life often leading to alcohol and drugs. Paul would say those that endure to the end as well as others who make the same statement. Eternally security is true but, unconditional eternal security is false.

Why would losing your salvation be a difficult thing 'to do'?
Just tell Jesus you changed your mind,
this whole eternal life thing isn't for you,
tell Him bye-bye,
and go do drugs and rob a bank or something.
Sounds pretty easy.

Well, except for the bank-robbing,
but what the hey,
you're already gonna spend eternity in hell,
so it might be worth the effort.
---------------------------------
Btw...
Should those with 'Conditional Eternal Security'
trust in God's 'Conditional Love' ?

The reason why Paul had little success at Mars hill or Athens is because He tried to intellectually convince them and did not make the cross and Him Crucified the main theme of His speech. That is why in Corinth He said "I have determined to know nothing among you save Christ and Him Crucified" and was able to establish a church there and not so at mars hill.

What is your determinant for success.

no I didn't know about Acts 17
i just heard about the mega church going belly up lol

your welcome

Oops! Guess I was wrong. Looks like maybe Paul WAS unsuccessful. It only took 2000 years, but that's like, what, 2 days in bible time?

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Rejoicing over a church failing?

emergent church. Definitely.

 

[psalm6819]

There are those who believe grace is their own personal possession which they can never lose because it is eternal. In other words, because GOD has given it to them, he can never take it away, no matter what they do.

yes, that pretty much covers it, but hyper gracers don't trample it, we treasure it because we know what it cost the Father and the terrible price that our Lord Jesus paid.

 

[RobbyEarl]

Why would losing your salvation be a difficult thing 'to do'?
Just tell Jesus you changed your mind,
this whole eternal life thing isn't for you,
tell Him bye-bye,
and go do drugs and rob a bank or something.
Sounds pretty easy.

Well, except for the bank-robbing,
but what the hey,
you're already gonna spend eternity in hell,
so it might be worth the effort.
---------------------------------
Btw...
Should those with 'Conditional Eternal Security'
trust in God's 'Conditional Love' ?


What is your determinant for success.

Oops! Guess I was wrong. Looks like maybe Paul WAS unsuccessful. It only took 2000 years, but that's like, what, 2 days in bible time?

Because I have done it along with others and my life was a pure hell, filled with alcohol and sexual immorality and drugs. I was in the literal pig slop and I came to myself and said "i would rather have Jesus than this crap". So I called on Him and slowly He set me free. The others are still to this day bound and addicted and have been turned over to a debased mind. I pray for them,but they don't even want to talk about it.

 

[psalm6819]

Grow a brain and quit lying about me. I said his questions were ignorant. You turned that around to say that I was talking about him.

and you wonder that you have no credibility here? You accuse one man of lying and another of ignorant questions....

(BTW that IS talking about someone)

 

[Grace777x70]

and you wonder that you have no credibility here? You accuse one man of lying and another of ignorant questions....

Amen.....the questions are legitimate questions that will expose the false teaching that is being promoted. They won't answer because they know the answers will expose what is really happening here.

He and others were only asked about 5x times now. This speaks volumes!

Romans 16:17-18 (KJV)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

and you wonder that you have no credibility here? You accuse one man of lying and another of ignorant questions....

(BTW that IS talking about someone)

Who are you to say I have no credibility? You only speak for the lawless-grace clan. I'm honored to be despised by them.

 

[Grace777x70]

oh brother.....

 

[psalm6819]

Who are you to say I have no credibility? You only speak for the lawless-grace clan. I'm honored to be despised by them.

I don't depise you, I feel sorry for you. I do not doubt your salvation, I'm sorry you don't see how valuable you are to God,

He invested everything (Jesus Christ) in you and He won't throw that away. He promised NEVER to leave or forsake us.

To all those that say we can walk away from God... just where ya gonna go? you can run but ya can't hide.

His goodness will draw you back to repentance. That's not a dirty word to those of us who believe in His grace.

 

[Persuaded]

Amen.....the questions are legitimate questions that will expose the false teaching that is being promoted. They won't answer because they know the answers will expose what is really happening here.

He and others were only asked about 5x times now. This speaks volumes!

Romans 16:17-18 (KJV)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Now I beseech you, brethren,mark them whichcause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.

I asked the questions because I really want to know.
I will confess I am ignorant of what these people believe.
I just want to know when it happens, i.e. what sin leads to that loss. When do you know? Have you ever been there and how did you become saved again. Do you have to be baptised again.
Some may think these questions are ignorant, but I want to know.
I will answer any question I am asked no matter how foolish I may think it is.
Why will you not do the same?