Mysticism & righteousness

PeterJens · Jun 19, 2016

Getting ones heart right and sorting out how you choose is the calling. Maybe you never read EG points or the rest.
Sin is sin, but walking in righteousness is seeing need and meeting it.

God does not demand "perfection" God asks us to learn love and let it out of our hearts. That is a purified heart.
I am simply saying this is possible, you can do it. Like forgiveness you talked about before, it takes time, but everyone can get there. Now it appears to me hyper-grace denies this or as Ben said desiring to sin less. This is just cynism and because he does not see the end goal. I am daring to say I do. Is that so hard to understand? People can taste, touch and feel it which is why we start to follow Christ. How is it after years, still people feel lost and empty, defeated without focus?

Is it because they have arrived but have not understood it, and are now dis-satisfied and want something more, rather than exploring what is, engaging with others, developing friendship, encouraging, serving and being with others. We so often want to be heros, when God says speak to that person in need there and just share, share love, share openness.

The world measures success, God measures love from the heart.

Grace777x70 · Jun 19, 2016

Stunnedbygrace said:

Yes..I have been. Pray and speak out boldly the gospel of the grace of Christ as it has the power to change all of us in every area of our lives!

jaybird88 · Jun 19, 2016

Grace777x70 said:

There must be something else going on as this is just endless confusion going from one thing to another without any reference to anything.

Anyway, I'll let you try to get into his mind to see what is going on. I think it is wise for me just to stay clear of him and just post scriptures and let them do the talking.

this is how i feel everyday lol

oyster67 · Jun 19, 2016

I noticed that in the OP, there is mention of "those who have tasted". The Scriptural context that comes to mind for me is not one of a blessing, but is one of warning and a deep, dark curse:

(Heb 6:4 [KJV])
For [it is] impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,

(Heb 6:5 [KJV])
And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,

(Heb 6:6 [KJV])
If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put [him] to an open shame.

StripeSocks · Jun 19, 2016

Re: Mysticism & righteousness & humoR

I [SUP]think[/SUP]I can explain, for whoever has an ear to hear. Or perhaps it is just a good joke.

A man, a religious man, maybe a Christian, is in a car accident. Horrific. He thinks he has died.
He looks up and sees a sign. It says, "HELL."

TI heart aslan Teddy Bear by super_awesome_shirtshe other man, someone who is mentally ill, maybe (whatever we decide that means

), from a different perspective, same accident, (standing on different ground though,) sees the same sign. As he sees it, it's the sign for a gas station which he recognizes. Same sigN.

I'm tempted to explain this riddle, and I suppose I'd better

so, When sufficiently tired / tried, I will give the answer. [SUB]OR at least, what I think the answer is

[/SUB]& as always, Jesus Loves U.

Stunnedbygrace · Jun 19, 2016

PeterJens said:

It isn't that anyone here believes we cannot walk in righteousness and holiness. It is that we believe it is only possible by abiding in Christ and walking in the Spirit because his holiness is perfect and stringent and no amount of human effort can meet it. Not if anger in your heart means you have already murdered.

The answer is not to play around with Jesus' words either to try to make Him to have meant something else. If He says that if you have anger in your heart, you have already murdered, you either believe this or you don't. You yourself, Peter, argued that anger was NOT murder a few days ago. You said it was just LIKE or similar to murder. But that's not what Jesus said. He said it WAS murder.

PeterJens · Jun 19, 2016

I see the idea here. We have arrived all is safe, unless you agree, you are in need.
What I write is irrelevant because you are actually in heaven now, no change required. That is a mystics response.

Maybe one day you will understand, I doubt it. I think once you accept you do not have to do anything in response to the cross and Christ, the gospel will never touch you. That is the divide, because the idea of failure can never happen, or a bad conscience, or the Lord ever rejecting you. Fear is a sin, even fear of God. Judgement of God is taken for granted you have passed clean. But listen to Paul who was not arrogant at all

Therefore, my dear friends, as you have always obeyed—not only in my presence, but now much more in my absence—continue to work out your salvation with fear and trembling.
Phil 2:12

In your gospel this is being instructed to sin by Paul which means your ideas about fear and sin must be wrong, 100% wrong.

What your group loves to do is discredit people with absolutes and slide in a seemingly sensible idea but with a serious lie within it. Most do not care to look or see what is going on. Are there sheep here or is this just another distraction?

I appears nothing will move you guys because you have heard it all before and are set 100% where you are. Sin, you live with it. So I have to say I part understand you have no doubts or interest in really engaging just repeating the same words. So until we meet Jesus and Jesus tells you where you really are goodbye.

PeterJens · Jun 19, 2016

Stunnedbygrace said:

There is a problem. Jesus is pointing at your heart needs to be sorted. If you are interested in cleaning your heart, then that is good. From the grace camp the count has been zero. Love from the heart, not interested.

All I hear is accept future sins are forgiven or no engagement. That is just refusal to believe the heart can be changed or even acknowledging there is a point to it. And anger is an interesting issue, but you again just want to block the point.
If you actually believed in emotional transformation you would go beyond this. But grace7 appears to be your teacher.

There is nothing else. The door is open, but most close it, thinking the sermon on the mount is condemning and not the key to the path. If you do not walk the path, there is no end. So I can say no more, that is the end of my witness and contribution. I came to learn and ask and find how people responded. You all have taught me well.

Without proper one to one engagement this medium does not work. There is so much more in knowing another than just these words, and everyone reflects their own problems back at themselves, which change all the benefits.

God bless you, and may Christ lead you into life.

gb9 · Jun 19, 2016

PeterJens said:

heart change is real, and 100% should happen for everyone who claims Christ as lord. it should be every believer's goal to not sin everyday. but the fact is, we will. all of us. so, we confess, repent move on with our walk with Christ.

if you, peter, or anyone choose not to accept this as reality, then you do not walk in reality. it is that simple.

Grace777x70 · Jun 19, 2016

Peter I will leave you with my testimony: I trust it will speak to you of how the love and grace of our Lord has dealt with me.

This is my testimony of what the gospel of the grace of Christ has done in my life:

I have a great passion for Christ!..here is what knowing Him because of the revelation of the gospel of the grace of Christ has done for me.

I was praying one morning and thinking about how the grace of Christ has affected me. I had the scripture come up in my spirit where the Pharisees were arguing about whether a man was born blind or not after Jesus healed him. Of course the Pharisees were trying to discredit the message of Jesus. The man said.." All I know is that I was born blind but now I see."

This is what the gospel of the grace of Christ has done in my life:
I realize that these beliefs in the grace of God....especially the acceptance grace and the total forgiveness that Jesus bought and paid for with His blood....that these can be offensive to our religious beliefs and what we have been taught in church. ( they were initially to me as well )

This gospel of the wondrous grace of Christ has had a beautiful affect on me. I am more in love with Jesus and the Father more then ever....in love with studying His word....praying in the spirit constantly with a heart full of joy!

This gospel has given me a compassion for other people and to reach out in love to them. To give more than I ever have with a heart full of love.

To live a holier life in Him...to be a witness of the life and love of our Lord in me.

If these are the horrible fruit of the grace of Christ in me....I want more!.....give me more grace please my Lord and God!

I am living a much fuller life now, more deeply in love with Jesus and the Father then ever before or ever dreamed was possible and I am just starting.

I am free from the horrible religion of self-effort, having the love of God pour out in me to help others now that I understand the grace that is in Christ then I did when I was doing the self-performance based gospel ( which is not the gospel )

I was blind but now I see. I see Jesus and His finished work for me!

It will always be in eternity "Worthy is the Lamb"..

It will never be.."Worthy is the Lamb......and me..because I did my own D.I.Y self-righteousness/holiness to help Jesus out"

It has always been about Jesus and His life manifesting in and through us to bring life to us and others around us and it will always remain that way for all eternity.

RobbyEarl · Jun 19, 2016

Re: Mysticism & righteousness & humoR

StripeSocks said:

Your riddle is not a riddle at all. A mentally ill person has a one way ticket to heaven if they were raised in a christian home. Some mental illness is caused by demonic oppression or possession. That is why Paul would say to stay with your unbelieving spouse so that your children are protected. Who knows what we see at deaths door, I have prayed over severely injured folks and prayed in the Spirit and got a response that even the doctors were amazed. I will say that most (not all ) is by demonic means, God did not create them that way, but because of sin, it happens and even Christian family's have to deal with it. I know my brother has a sister in law who is mentally ill because her mother and father kept her locked in a closet till she was 15 years old, she ate and defecated in that closet. She was a foster child and adopted by my brothers Mother in law. Raised in a christian home. She is nicest person you would ever meet, she is 60 but has the mind of an eight year old. But put on some Gospel music and she is praising God. She will ask you every ten minute if it's gonna rain. But she is sweet and loves God and will not miss church.

Stunnedbygrace · Jun 19, 2016

PeterJens said:

You have it there. I know others think you don't. It just has to go in order.
If I didn't know my sins were forgiven, I would try to hide what's in my heart from God because I would be terrified.
So He came the first time to do away with that fear.
So now I can boldly go to Him and confess my sins and get the help I need from Him.
I don't have to try to hide them from myself and Him with a bunch of justifications for what I did.
Then, when I admit I need help and my heart and mind are sick, He fixes my sicknesses.

It all has to start with the forgiveness or who on earth would EVER be bold enough to approach Him???

Stunnedbygrace · Jun 19, 2016

And Peter, yes God does too demand perfection. He says, you must be holy because I am holy.
The whole purpose of His saving me is to make me His perfect bride, without spot or wrinkle.
But as Paul said, "I don't mean to say that I have already achieved these things or that I have already reached perfection. But I press on to possess that perfection for which Jesus Christ first possessed me."

garee · Jun 19, 2016

jaybird88 said:

Hi Jaybird88

No, its because there are different versions .Because in its original autographs it is God's perfect law that can quicken our souls and give us simply ones his understanding. Without it, as it is written we can know nothing of the God who wrote it with his finger.Therefore there would be no way to seek after Him who has no form so that we could understand Him .

garee · Jun 19, 2016

Hi BibleGuy

Total and not partial forgiveness is found in Christ. He does not offer a remnant of the grace from his reward for His labor of love or work of faith at Calvary. We walk in His righteousness because we rest in His eternal rest. Some refuse to enter his rest from their own works hoping they could be found with a righteousness of their own self. They refuse to mix the work of Christ's faith in what they do hear coming from His word. They forget the Lamb of God was slain from the foundation of the word, being outwardly witnessed by the 3 day demonstration during the first century reformation

Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world. Heb 4:1

No man will be or could be found with a righteousness of themselves, lest any man boast in empty pride. It is Christ the anointing Holy Spirit of God who works in us to both will and do His good pleasure as a imputed righteousness. Remember he is of one mind and always does whatsoever His soul pleases .It is Christ who can make our hearts soft for he performs that which is appointed to us.

So we do walk in a righteousness it’s just not of ourselves.

miknik5 · Jun 19, 2016

PeterJens said:

I have got to take my hat off to a condescending tone. I have stated here quite clearly why I reject mysticism yet these mystics want to say I have a good reason to reject them because of self righteousness.

What they are talking about is the righteousness that comes from obedience to Christ with a well spring of love set in your heart.

Their union with Christ is so complete, they will never stand as children of God, purchased and washed clean, they are merely shadows with Christ embossed over them is some odd union into eternity that they do not explain or understand.

On judgement day rather than relying on the work Christ has done in them, they stand as sinners in the hope Christ alone has bought them salvation without a response from themselves, because no response is worthy.

Those who HOPE in HIM are ________________________________________.

You can fill in the remainder of the above to see if this HOPE "disappoints".

Reference 1Peter 1

BeyondET · Jun 19, 2016

Here's a interesting write up i came across

https://thevalueofsparrows.com/2015...ge-and-rational-knowledge-by-peggy-wilkinson/

ukok102nak · Jun 19, 2016

:smoke: weve heared from those old folks in the valley that there is
someone before speaking as it is realy sound weird
because the story tells that he is willing to become evil in order for everyone
in the valley shall remain in the good side ... .

:8) he sacrificed himself unto the abyss along with all the evil things inside him
and never came back according to the old folks on that valley . ...

as we remember this we also searched
the holy scriptures if there were such a verse that explained about
the story of those old folks in the valley ... .

:happy: as it is written
:read:
Isaiah 9:2
The people who walk in darkness will see a bright light. The light will shine on those who live in the land of death's shadow.

:ty:

godbless us all always

ukok102nak · Jun 19, 2016

:now: This story explores different aspects of personal experience of God, including why God might want to make himself known personally to individual people, and why he doesn't do that to all people at all times. Common forms of religious experience include dreams, visions and near-death experiences, and mystical experiences.

:smoke: weve heared from those old folks in the valley that there is
someone before speaking as it is realy sound weird
because the story tells that he is willing to become evil in order for everyone
in the valley shall remain in the good side ... .

:8) he sacrificed himself unto the abyss along with all the evil things inside him
and never came back according to the old folks on that valley . ...

as we remember this we also searched
the holy scriptures if there were such a verse that explained about
the story of those old folks in the valley ... .

:happy: as it is written
:read:
Isaiah 9:2
The people who walk in darkness will see a bright light. The light will shine on those who live in the land of death's shadow.

:ty:

godbless us all always

breno785au · Jun 20, 2016

Re: Mysticism & righteousness & humoR

StripeSocks said:

I [SUP]think[/SUP]I can explain, for whoever has an ear to hear. Or perhaps it is just a good joke.

A man, a religious man, maybe a Christian, is in a car accident. Horrific. He thinks he has died.
He looks up and sees a sign. It says, "HELL." View attachment 153807

TI heart aslan Teddy Bear by super_awesome_shirtshe other man, someone who is mentally ill, maybe (whatever we decide that means

), from a different perspective, same accident, (standing on different ground though,) sees the same sign. As he sees it, it's the sign for a gas station which he recognizes. Same sigN.

I'm tempted to explain this riddle, and I suppose I'd better

so, When sufficiently tired / tried, I will give the answer. [SUB]OR at least, what I think the answer is

[/SUB]& as always, Jesus Loves U.

I wouldn't even know where to start to try and understand what this post means...

Mysticism & righteousness

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