CONDEMNATION IS THE ROOT CAUSE

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Under this interpretation...

We "might" become children of God. So we are not really children of God?

Under this interpretation...

We have a real issue because it appears we didn't really get brought to God.

New International Version
For Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring you to God. He was put to death in the body but made alive in the Spirit.

But it's easy to understand, what Paul is saying in 2 Co 5 is that Jesus being made sin so that we "might" be the righteousness of God is a statement saying, if we shall receive Him.

We know this because the first verse right BEFORE it says, "be reconciled to God".

1 Peter 3:18 is also in the subjunctive mood. No guarantee. Christ died so that he might be leading us towards GOD. You interpret that verse to mean the point of justification; a done deal. But that's not what it's saying. Christ leading us to GOD is a life-long process.

IN 2 Corinthians 5:20, Paul was urging Christians to be reconciled to GOD, which indicates that reconciliation is a process, not just a one-time event as you are interpreting it. This undermines the point you're trying to make.

There is no other scripture that even comes close to saying that we are the righteousness of GOD. Quite the opposite.

Stating that we are the righteousness of GOD contradicts imputed righteousness.

If we are the righteousness of GOD that means we are perfect. That is a gnostic idea.

 

[Grace777x70]

1 Peter 3:18 is also in the subjunctive mood. No guarantee. Christ died so that he might be leading us towards GOD. You interpret that verse to mean the point of justification; a done deal. But that's not what it's saying. Christ leading us to GOD is a life-long process.

IN 2 Corinthians 5:20, Paul was urging Christians to be reconciled to GOD, which indicates that reconciliation is a process, not just a one-time event as you are interpreting it. This undermines the point you're trying to make.

There is no other scripture that even comes close to saying that we are the righteousness of GOD. Quite the opposite.

Stating that we are the righteousness of GOD contradicts imputed righteousness.

If we are the righteousness of GOD that means we are perfect. That is a gnostic idea.

The usage of the Greek word "hina" which means "so that" is before "He might bring us to God" It is a statement of fact. Jesus died for our sins so that He might bring us to God.


1 Peter 3:18 (NASB)
[SUP]18 [/SUP] For Christ also died for sins once for all, the just for the unjust, so thatHe might bring us to God, having been put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the spirit;


The subjunctive mood in Greek in some cases is used because a "dependent clause" has been made. In this case - "Jesus died for sins once for all" - this is the dependent clause.

Here is an example = "I went to the bank so that I may give you some money." - going to the bank was the "dependent clause"


Here is the resource for this: ( I realize this conflicts with some religious beliefs )

Quote:

The subjunctive mood is used in both independent (main) and depended (subordinate) clauses.

Source:

More Detailed Use of the Greek Subjunctive Mood - Framed View


You need to understand the new creation in Christ in order to understand what happened to us in our inner man - created in righteousness and holiness in Christ.

The whole gospel will be a complete mystery to us until we get revelation of what Christ has done for us. You need to know what being "born-again" means.

Without this understanding it makes us what to establish our own righteousness and to "maintain" it. Romans 1:16-17 says that in the gospel the righteousness of God is revealed from faith to faith. The righteous shall live by faith.

Romans 10:3 (NASB)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] For not knowing about God's righteousness and seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God.

 

[Grace777x70]

(snip)

IN 2 Corinthians 5:20, Paul was urging Christians to be reconciled to GOD, which indicates that reconciliation is a process, not just a one-time event as you are interpreting it. This undermines the point you're trying to make.

(snip)

.

Concerning being reconciled to God that you mentioned. Here is what scriptures say about that.

Romans 5:10 (NASB)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] For if while we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life.

- having been reconciled = aorist indicative passive = a one time event in the past which happened to us


Colossians 1:21 (KJV)
[SUP]21 [/SUP] And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled.

- hath he reconciled = aorist indicative = one time event in the past.

2 Cor. 5:19-20 is Paul simply saying for people to reconcile yourselves to God by "believing" ( there's that stumbling block word again ) in what Christ has done.

Because God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself so believe it. 2 Cor 5:17-21. Therefore if anyone be "in Christ" they are a new creation!

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

You need to understand the new creation in Christ in order to understand what happened to us in our inner man - created in righteousness and holiness in Christ.

The whole gospel will be a complete mystery to us until we get revelation of what Christ has done for us. You need to know what being "born-again" means.

Without this understanding it makes us what to establish our own righteousness and to "maintain" it. Romans 1:16-17 says that in the gospel the righteousness of God is revealed from faith to faith. The righteous shall live by faith.

Romans 10:3 (NASB)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] For not knowing about God's righteousness and seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God. [/B][/SIZE]

This is the way the gnostics thought. A special l̶e̶n̶s̶ knowing was needed to see who you really were, an eternal spirit being. They considered Christians to be carnal and unable to see the mystery that they were already perfect because they were hung up on religion.

 

[Grace777x70]

This is the way the gnostics thought. A special l̶e̶n̶s̶ knowing was needed to see who you really were, an eternal spirit being. They considered Christians to be carnal and unable to see the mystery that they were already perfect because they were hung up on religion.

It will really come in handy to believe in being born-again and that we are "in Christ" now because of what Christ has done for us. We are called "believers" for a reason.

There is no higher revelation then to know Jesus and what He has done for us in His great love and grace and mercy.

Grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.


Acts 26:14 - listen to the words of the Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[Angela53510]

Good post.

If Hebrews said, those who willfully sin can't be forgiven, then we'd all be in trouble.

Book of John tells us that the Holy Spirit has come to convict of sin. Because of unbelief in Christ.

Corinthians tells us those who are in Him, have become the righteousness of God because Christ became sin for them. So do we suddenly have unrighteousness and we are no longer the righteousness of God unless we confess? I wonder if Scripture actually means we are the righteousness of God? I wonder if sanctification is us actually realizing who we are in Christ?

C.

Instead of wondering if sanctification is some self aware kind of process, try reading the Bible, which is very clear about the meaning and the way of sanctification. Sanctification means become closer to the image of Christ. You can realize all you want that you are in Christ - but it has to be reflected by changes in your life.

"And we all, with unveiled face, beholding the glory of the Lord,are being transformed into the same image from one degree of glory to another. For this comes from the Lord who is the Spirit." 2 Cor. 3:18



1. The first stage in our walk with God is justification - Romans 5:1

"Therefore, since we have been justified by faith, wehave peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ." Romans 5:1

The verb here is in the passive tense. It is something done to us by the Holy Spirit. It is not of ourselves.

"For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God,9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast.10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them." Eph. 2:8-10

Notice that justification, the first step, is followed by "doing good works" which is part of our sanctification.


2. Sanctification. As above, sanctification consists in part of doing good works - not in our own strength, but through the leading of the Holy Spirit, who has prepared these works in advance.

It also means changing our outward behaviour, in response to the inward change. A person who continues to practice sin and feel that they do not have to confess or change their behaviour, is not being sanctified.

"Do not lie to one another, seeing that you have put off the old self with its practices 10 and have put on the new self, which is being renewed in knowledge after the image of its creator." Col. 3:9-10

Even Paul did not claim to have reach perfection, and he notes that he is still working on attaining the goal.

"Not that I have already obtained this or am already perfect, but I press on to make it my own, because Christ Jesus has made me his own." Phil. 3:12

Renewing of the mind is also important in the process of sanctification - that means reading the Word of God. But it means much more than that. It means conforming our minds to the will of God. It means understanding the will of God for all Christians, and for our own lives. Again, the word "be transformed" in the Greek is passive - meaning God is the one who initiates and changes us - for his glory!

"I appeal to you therefore, brothers, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual worship.2 Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect." Romans 12:1-2

Obviously, Paul is concerned here about people who are Christians and but are conformed to the world. He says we are to offer our bodies as a living sacrifice. This means, we do not sin, or follow the world and we certainly obey God's commands in the New Testament, as well as the laws he has written on our hearts when we are saved.

"You yourselves are our letter of recommendation, written on our hearts, to be known and read by all.3 And you show that you are a letter from Christ delivered by us, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts." 2 Cor. 3:2-3

Notice this passage above does NOT say we will never sin again, or we do not need to obey any laws. It says that the laws are written on our hearts. So we walk with Christ, who helps us to live out these laws written on our hearts. And should we disobey these laws? Well, that is sin!

"This is the message we have heard from him and proclaim to you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.6 If we say we have fellowship with him while we walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth.7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus his Son cleanses us from all sin.8 If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.10 If we say we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us." 1 John 1:5-10

Notice at no point does it say we are to ignore the sin in our lives. Because we all sin, until the day Jesus returns (Part 3) Instead, 1 John is written directly to Christians, and talks about the fellowship we have with him as we walk in the light. And yes, the blood of Christ cleanses us from all unrighteousness. But part of sanctification requires that we examine our hearts and our consciences, and confess those sins to God. That is the ONLY way we can progress in our walk with God. While I do not believe we can lose our salvation, we can certainly miss out on walking with Christ in the joy of our salvation, if we fail to confess our sins.

Any denial of this step, is going to result in a lack of progress or sanctification. We simply need to confess our sins, and every single person sins. I do not care what any internet preachers or popular teachers say! This is addressed to Christians.

John's answer to the difficulties of not walking in the light, and instead walking in darkness because of a failure to confess our sins, is that God can change us and rests in the work of Jesus Christ. Forgiveness and purity can only come through the shed blood of Jesus Christ, (1 John 1:7), who makes the forgiveness of sins possible. The response to each sin, each error is that a divine work of restoration and cleansing is necessary for anyone to continue "walking in the light."

If spirituality is isolated from the commonplace events of every day living, if the material things of the world are irrelevant to God, spiritual enlightenments might ignore mundane issues such as morality.

But John's words are unremitting! Such an attitude of ignoring sin, is deliberately deceptive, for it ignores the reality of sin. It is not ignorance but a cover up. Truth is not something abstract, like a moral code that has been neglected. Truth describes God himself. Truth is personal - Jesus Christ himself is truth! (John 14:6) The gospel of John describes the Spirit as the Spirit of truth (John 14:7; 15:26; 16:13) Therefore, people who do not have the truth "in them" are lacking an essential characteristic of God's presence within their innermost being.

John gives a stern warning! People who walk in sin are in great jeopardy! Their only recourse is confession. The appeal to confession in verse 9 is balanced by verse 8 above. Verse 9 has a third class conditional statement. But it is not intended to be a mere condition, it is an exhortation, a warning and perhaps even a command! Sinfulness is inherent in our lives, and confession must be the Christian's heartfelt reflex.

Confession is successful (and this is critical to John's argument) because of the character of God. His forgiveness is not an act of mercy, as if he were setting aside some usual disposition in response to a religious act of penitence. It is essential not to oppose these two ideas, God's loving-kindness (chesed in Hebrew, pistos - Greek.) and his justice or righteousness (Greek - dikaios). His faithfulness to us has prompted him to make a way for our purification and thereby satisfy his demand for righteousness.

Confession enjoys the good character of God, and is empowered by it. Two consequences necessarily follow: forgiveness and purification. To forgive (aphelia in Greek) also means "to let go" (as a debt - Luke 7:43) and so John indicates that our sins are removed from God's accounting. To purify (1:7 - cleanse) cries a different nuance an suggests the removal of the residual effects of sin, consequences that linger (such as a stain). Therefore, there is hope. The past and its errors as well as the future and its propensity toward sinfulness are both addressed.

One final thing is the word confess (homologomen - 1:9) according to Bauer, specifically means in this verse:

"to concede that something is true - grant, admit, confess. With focus on admission of wrongdoing" pg 708 Bauer.

In fact, just because homologeo is made up of two words, does not means we can translate it something like "same word." Sometimes that works in compound words in Greek, but most of the time a very different meaning results from the joining of two words.


3. The final stage in our journey with Christ is glorification. That is the promise we have that when we die, our spirits will go to be with Christ (2 Cor. 5:6-8) Since nothing unclean can enter heaven (Rev. 21:27) we are made perfect at that point. The sanctification of the whole person - body, soul, and spirit - will finally be complete when Jesus returns and we receive glorified bodies.

"And I am sure of this, that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ." Phil. 1:6

Please note that this work will not be complete till the day of Jesus Christ. We are not perfect right now, and therefore the command to confess our sins applies to us. Anything else is heresy!

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

It will really come in handy to believe in being born-again and that we are "in Christ" now because of what Christ has done for us. We are called "believers" for a reason.

There is no higher revelation then to know Jesus and what He has done for us in His great love and grace and mercy.

Grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.


Acts 26:14 - listen to the words of the Lord Jesus Christ.

Believe in being born again? I've never read that in the bible. I've always read believe in Christ. Believing in being born again sounds like faith in one's spiritual nature. Salvation by knowing who we really are.

The bible says that we know Jesus by doing his words. Salvation by simply knowing something in the mind (like our identity) is salvation by knowing (gnosis).

G1108 γνῶσις gnosis (gno`-sis) n.
1. knowing (the act)

 

[Cee]

You're ignoring the entire context.

It says be reconciled to God. He is talking about God making His appeal through us to the world.

If you don't think you're reconciled to God, why/how do you think you are sealed with Holy Spirit, God Himself.

C.

1 Peter 3:18 is also in the subjunctive mood. No guarantee. Christ died so that he might be leading us towards GOD. You interpret that verse to mean the point of justification; a done deal. But that's not what it's saying. Christ leading us to GOD is a life-long process.

IN 2 Corinthians 5:20, Paul was urging Christians to be reconciled to GOD, which indicates that reconciliation is a process, not just a one-time event as you are interpreting it. This undermines the point you're trying to make.

There is no other scripture that even comes close to saying that we are the righteousness of GOD. Quite the opposite.

Stating that we are the righteousness of GOD contradicts imputed righteousness.

If we are the righteousness of GOD that means we are perfect. That is a gnostic idea.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Corinthians tells us those who are in Him, have become the righteousness of God because Christ became sin for them. So do we suddenly have unrighteousness and we are no longer the righteousness of God unless we confess? I wonder if Scripture actually means we are the righteousness of God? I wonder if sanctification is us actually realizing who we are in Christ?

No, that's called gnosticism.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

I do not think sanctification is realizing who we are in Christ...
Sanctification is a process of renewing our minds to come into agreement with God about many things. (i.e: anger in our heart is to have ALREADY murdered - it's a big one - many don't believe Jesus on this). Once we come into agreement with God on a matter, (I'm a murderer) see we can't change it, ask to be healed, He heals and restores. We grow in our knowledge of God and become more like the One who bought us.

What was realized in the above example is: I'm a murderer and not only that but I'm a SERIAL murderer and not only that but I can't stop murdering and resenting.

The truth was seen and admitted by me.

 

[Cee]

Thank you for your reply, Angela.

I think we are closer than you realize.

Romans 8:30 And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also glorified.

Is this Scripture? Is this true? If so we are justified and glorified now.

As far as your reply about Sanctification, I'll pull up the exact Scripture you used:

"And we all, with unveiled face, beholding the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from one degree of glory to another. For this comes from the Lord who is the Spirit." 2 Cor. 3:18

I took your reply to be a little belittling considering I don't remember ever talking to you.

You said this...

"Instead of wondering if sanctification is some self aware kind of process, try reading the Bible"

Yet the Scripture you quoted is exactly that, awareness of Christ, and who He is, which leads us to a greater understanding of who He is...

1 Co 13:22 For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I have been fully known.

Once again "we see". A Scripture that is also about awareness and the context is about transformation. Without pulling up the entire context it's talking about growing up in God. And Paul says we shall know as we are already known. This has a lot to do with self-awareness. So why you would say something to me like "try reading the Bible" comes off rather rude and ridiculous to me.

And let me talk about sin now... since you wanted to discuss it with me.

Did you realize Scripture says ANYTHING outside of faith is sin? Do you realize that "faith" is also linked up with sight? Or awareness?

Hebrews 11:1 Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen.

Faith is living in a confidence of things not seen. It's trusting that what God says about us through His Spirit, that we ARE new creations, that we are justified, that we are One with Him. Is actually true. Even when our behavior doesn't line up...

Did you realize that behavior and identity are connected in Scripture many times? Did you realize that people actually live out of their identity? Which is why Scripture is loaded with things, like "In Christ". We believe "better things about you", this isn't who you are, good trees don't bear bad fruit, or that Jesus said apart from Him we can nothing because He is the Vine and we are the branches, or how Hebrews tells us to strive for rest and because Israel didn't they didn't enter in to it.

That's what renewing of the mind is. And I agree with you. That we prove the will of God to the degree our mind is renewed. That's actually straight out Scripture, Romans 12:2.

Romans 12:2 Do not be conformed to this world,but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect.[SUP][

[/SUP]Interesting this Scripture tells us that transformation happens by renewing our mind. That's interesting sounds a lot like self-awareness again. In fact it tells us we discern the will of God through our mind being renewed. That's another word about seeing and awareness.

I can keep going of course, I can show you countless Scriptures that connect seeing, awareness, understanding with behavior. And I could show you Scriptures where God says flat out, we are forgiven, He remembers our sin no more, or I could show you Eph 3-4, where it discusses the "eyes of our heart", renewing the spirit of our minds by "putting off the old man" and "putting on the new man", and that we are to forgive as we are already forgiven.

But I won't because I believe you are well versed in Scripture and me simply referring to them is enough, but that doesn't mean that I haven't spent plenty of time in Scripture and with God as well. I do read my Bible. And I do know the Word of God. Which are not the same thing.

C.

Instead of wondering if sanctification is some self aware kind of process, try reading the Bible, which is very clear about the meaning and the way of sanctification. Sanctification means become closer to the image of Christ. You can realize all you want that you are in Christ - but it has to be reflected by changes in your life.

"And we all, with unveiled face, beholding the glory of the Lord,are being transformed into the same image from one degree of glory to another. For this comes from the Lord who is the Spirit." 2 Cor. 3:18



1. The first stage in our walk with God is justification - Romans 5:1

"Therefore, since we have been justified by faith, wehave peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ." Romans 5:1

The verb here is in the passive tense. It is something done to us by the Holy Spirit. It is not of ourselves.

"For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God,9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast.10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them." Eph. 2:8-10

Notice that justification, the first step, is followed by "doing good works" which is part of our sanctification.


2. Sanctification. As above, sanctification consists in part of doing good works - not in our own strength, but through the leading of the Holy Spirit, who has prepared these works in advance.

It also means changing our outward behaviour, in response to the inward change. A person who continues to practice sin and feel that they do not have to confess or change their behaviour, is not being sanctified.

"Do not lie to one another, seeing that you have put off the old self with its practices 10 and have put on the new self, which is being renewed in knowledge after the image of its creator." Col. 3:9-10

Even Paul did not claim to have reach perfection, and he notes that he is still working on attaining the goal.

"Not that I have already obtained this or am already perfect, but I press on to make it my own, because Christ Jesus has made me his own." Phil. 3:12

Renewing of the mind is also important in the process of sanctification - that means reading the Word of God. But it means much more than that. It means conforming our minds to the will of God. It means understanding the will of God for all Christians, and for our own lives. Again, the word "be transformed" in the Greek is passive - meaning God is the one who initiates and changes us - for his glory!

"I appeal to you therefore, brothers, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual worship.2 Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect." Romans 12:1-2

Obviously, Paul is concerned here about people who are Christians and but are conformed to the world. He says we are to offer our bodies as a living sacrifice. This means, we do not sin, or follow the world and we certainly obey God's commands in the New Testament, as well as the laws he has written on our hearts when we are saved.

"You yourselves are our letter of recommendation, written on our hearts, to be known and read by all.3 And you show that you are a letter from Christ delivered by us, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts." 2 Cor. 3:2-3

Notice this passage above does NOT say we will never sin again, or we do not need to obey any laws. It says that the laws are written on our hearts. So we walk with Christ, who helps us to live out these laws written on our hearts. And should we disobey these laws? Well, that is sin!

"This is the message we have heard from him and proclaim to you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.6 If we say we have fellowship with him while we walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth.7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus his Son cleanses us from all sin.8 If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.10 If we say we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us." 1 John 1:5-10

Notice at no point does it say we are to ignore the sin in our lives. Because we all sin, until the day Jesus returns (Part 3) Instead, 1 John is written directly to Christians, and talks about the fellowship we have with him as we walk in the light. And yes, the blood of Christ cleanses us from all unrighteousness. But part of sanctification requires that we examine our hearts and our consciences, and confess those sins to God. That is the ONLY way we can progress in our walk with God. While I do not believe we can lose our salvation, we can certainly miss out on walking with Christ in the joy of our salvation, if we fail to confess our sins.

Any denial of this step, is going to result in a lack of progress or sanctification. We simply need to confess our sins, and every single person sins. I do not care what any internet preachers or popular teachers say! This is addressed to Christians.

John's answer to the difficulties of not walking in the light, and instead walking in darkness because of a failure to confess our sins, is that God can change us and rests in the work of Jesus Christ. Forgiveness and purity can only come through the shed blood of Jesus Christ, (1 John 1:7), who makes the forgiveness of sins possible. The response to each sin, each error is that a divine work of restoration and cleansing is necessary for anyone to continue "walking in the light."

If spirituality is isolated from the commonplace events of every day living, if the material things of the world are irrelevant to God, spiritual enlightenments might ignore mundane issues such as morality.

But John's words are unremitting! Such an attitude of ignoring sin, is deliberately deceptive, for it ignores the reality of sin. It is not ignorance but a cover up. Truth is not something abstract, like a moral code that has been neglected. Truth describes God himself. Truth is personal - Jesus Christ himself is truth! (John 14:6) The gospel of John describes the Spirit as the Spirit of truth (John 14:7; 15:26; 16:13) Therefore, people who do not have the truth "in them" are lacking an essential characteristic of God's presence within their innermost being.

John gives a stern warning! People who walk in sin are in great jeopardy! Their only recourse is confession. The appeal to confession in verse 9 is balanced by verse 8 above. Verse 9 has a third class conditional statement. But it is not intended to be a mere condition, it is an exhortation, a warning and perhaps even a command! Sinfulness is inherent in our lives, and confession must be the Christian's heartfelt reflex.

Confession is successful (and this is critical to John's argument) because of the character of God. His forgiveness is not an act of mercy, as if he were setting aside some usual disposition in response to a religious act of penitence. It is essential not to oppose these two ideas, God's loving-kindness (chesed in Hebrew, pistos - Greek.) and his justice or righteousness (Greek - dikaios). His faithfulness to us has prompted him to make a way for our purification and thereby satisfy his demand for righteousness.

Confession enjoys the good character of God, and is empowered by it. Two consequences necessarily follow: forgiveness and purification. To forgive (aphelia in Greek) also means "to let go" (as a debt - Luke 7:43) and so John indicates that our sins are removed from God's accounting. To purify (1:7 - cleanse) cries a different nuance an suggests the removal of the residual effects of sin, consequences that linger (such as a stain). Therefore, there is hope. The past and its errors as well as the future and its propensity toward sinfulness are both addressed.

One final thing is the word confess (homologomen - 1:9) according to Bauer, specifically means in this verse:

"to concede that something is true - grant, admit, confess. With focus on admission of wrongdoing" pg 708 Bauer.

In fact, just because homologeo is made up of two words, does not means we can translate it something like "same word." Sometimes that works in compound words in Greek, but most of the time a very different meaning results from the joining of two words.


3. The final stage in our journey with Christ is glorification. That is the promise we have that when we die, our spirits will go to be with Christ (2 Cor. 5:6-8) Since nothing unclean can enter heaven (Rev. 21:27) we are made perfect at that point. The sanctification of the whole person - body, soul, and spirit - will finally be complete when Jesus returns and we receive glorified bodies.

"And I am sure of this, that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ." Phil. 1:6

Please note that this work will not be complete till the day of Jesus Christ. We are not perfect right now, and therefore the command to confess our sins applies to us. Anything else is heresy!

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

ARE being transformed is far different from saying ALREADY are but just don't know it yet and just haven't realized it yet.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

And we all, with unveiled face, beholding [/FONT]the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from one degree of glory to another. For this comes from the Lord who is the Spirit." 2 Cor. 3:18

1 Co 13:22 For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I have been fully known.

2 Corinthians 3:18 and 1 Corinthians 13:22 are not describing the same thing.

The latter is simply saying that we don't see Christ clearly now, just as the image in an ancient mirror would be imperfect and flawed.

The former is describing how the glory of the lord is reflected (or mirrored) off of us as we behold his glory, just as it was reflected off of Moses' face when he beheld the lord face to face. That verse says nothing about looking at Christ in a mirror.

 

[Ariel82]

Just one simple question remains. We know that God has forgiven us. How often are we to ask him to forgive us?

Every time we feel like we mess up and want His help fixing what we tried to do alone and without His guidance.

 

[UnderGrace]

Did you realize that behavior and identity are connected in Scripture many times? Did you realize that people actually live out of their identity? Which is why Scripture is loaded with things, like "In Christ". We believe "better things about you", this isn't who you are, good trees don't bear bad fruit, or that Jesus said apart from Him we can nothing because He is the Vine and we are the branches, or how Hebrews tells us to strive for rest and because Israel didn't they didn't enter in to it.

So true and Amen! Cee thank you for clearly reminding us of who we are in Christ and to live in that identity.

What you have written is so edifying. We can never proclaim this Good News in all its fullness enough times, there are so many born again believers who need to come to this deeper understanding of their position in Christ.

. I do read my Bible. And I do know the Word of God. Which are not the same thing.

I know that for myself, when I began to understand these truths about who we are in Jesus, the scripture finally began to make sense, it was like a light had been tuned on and the Holy Spirit just led me, because I was understanding and believing that I could abide in the Word of God

 

[Cee]

Here let me explain it like this...

Our spirit is joined with His Spirit.

1 Co 6:17 But he who is joined to the Lord becomes one spirit with him.

Our soul (mind, will, emotions) is being renewed.

2 Co 5:17 Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old has passed away; behold, the new has come.

This is an elemental teaching...

Eph 4:20But that is not the way you learned Christ!— 21assuming that you have heard about him and were taught in him, as the truth is in Jesus, 22to put off your old self,[SUP]f[/SUP] which belongs to your former manner of life and is corrupt through deceitful desires, 23and to be renewed in the spirit of your minds, 24and to put on the new self, created after the likeness of God in true righteousness and holiness.

The act of being righteous and holy is right there. Your new self is created in righteousness and holiness. Fact.
Your old self is dead. Fact.
You are still understanding this.
And going through a process: put off old man/put on new man.

But what a minute my behavior isn't lining up? Well that's because you still don't understand who you are in Christ.

Think that's not important? Let's check the book.

Philemon 1:6 I pray that your partnership in the faith may become effective as you fully acknowledge every good thing that is ours in Christ.

Effectiveness = Fully acknowledging every good thing that is ours in Christ.

That sure sounds like understanding who we are in Christ to me. And Paul even goes so far to say our effectiveness depends on it.

But let's talk about BEHAVIOR. I'll use the Scripture everyone refers to about Behavior to show you the pattern in Scripture so you'll see it for yourself from now on.

1 Co 6:9Or do you not know that the unrighteous[SUP]b[/SUP] will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality,[SUP]c[/SUP] 10nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.

Whoa C. that sure looks a LOT like that our behavior can disqualify us from entering in the Kingdom of God. And I agree it can! If you're not a new creation. Let's look at the next verse. But for thinking sake let's consider these 2 verses as behavior. Paul is pointing to their behavior and saying what are you doing!!! (Which shows us that Christians struggle with behavior issues even though they are in Christ, it's called being a baby.)

11And such were some of you. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

Now if you miss this, you'll skip past a beautiful passage of Scripture, Paul is saying your behavior will not inherit you the kingdom of God. Time to grow up! And how does PAUL grow them up? He tells them who they are. Say Identity.

First Paul shows them their Behavior and then he links it up with their identity. And he says this isn't who you are. Wow, that sure sounds like Paul thinks self-awareness of who we are in Christ is super important. Especially considering the context of behavior not lining up and not inheriting the Kingdom of God.

But did Jesus say this?

Matt 7:18 A good tree can't produce bad fruit, and a bad tree can't produce good fruit.

Well then why are Christians who are now branches in the Vine struggling to bear good fruit?

Renewing. Of. The. Mind.

Romans 13:14 Instead, clothe yourselves with the Lord Jesus Christ, and make no provision for the desires of the flesh.

This pretty much what Paul said in Eph 4, put on Christ! And make no room for desires of the flesh. Well that sure sounds like focusing on behavior doesn't it!

Galatians 5:16 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.

Paul's not crazy here. He's not saying well you need to not make room for the flesh and then later saying oh by the way the flesh is dead. NO! What he is doing is taking people into an understanding of WHO THEY ARE IN CHRIST.

Galatians 2:20 I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I now live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me.

You know what's crazy to me? Is that if I say it's I who no longer live, but Christ in me, people would think I was crazy, but it's simply believing and agreeing with Scripture, can I get an AMEN? (Which actually means so be it, or I agree).

People read Scripture, but then when someone actually believes it and agrees with it, it's like whoa brother you're getting a little "prideful" there or a little "deceived". What the heck? I actually do believe I am a new creation. I believe I am one with Christ. I believe His law is written on my heart and my mind. I actually DO desire the things of God. I actually don't regard myself according to the flesh, but by the spirit and I do the best I can to do the same for others also. (Still growing in that area)

Did yo know the Scripture right before it that says we are new creations, says don't regard anyone according to the flesh? But the spirit? That it actually links that up to being a new creation?

2 Co 5:16 From now on, therefore, we regard no one according to the flesh. Even though we once regarded Christ according to the flesh, we regard him thus no longer.

Yet somehow people think that this same author regarded himself by the flesh in Romans 7 which is completely against Romans 6 and 8!

One last thing...

Paul said if you desire any spiritual gift, especially desire prophesy. Any idea why?

1 Co 14:12So with yourselves, since you are eager for manifestations of the Spirit, strive to excel in building up the church.

And how do we build up the church??? Every apostle, prophet, teacher, etc given by God all has one focus...

11And he gave the apostles, the prophets, the evangelists, the shepherds and teachers,[SUP]d[/SUP] 12to equip the saints for the work of ministry, for building up the body of Christ, 13until we all attain to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to mature manhood,[SUP]e[/SUP] to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ, 14so that we may no longer be children, tossed to and fro by the waves and carried about by every wind of doctrine, by human cunning, by craftiness in deceitful schemes. 15Rather, speaking the truth in love, we are to grow up in every way into him who is the head, into Christ, 16from whom the whole body, joined and held together by every joint with which it is equipped, when each part is working properly, makes the body grow so that it builds itself up in love.

These key concepts made a lot of Scripture clearer to me. As a result, I love God more, I know His love more, I've seen many people set free by Him, seen people saved, I used to deal with fear, worry, anxiety, depression, I was immersed in addictions, but the Holy Spirit, our glorious teacher, has set me free. What's crazy to me are the people who focus on sin, etc are the ones who generally struggle the most with sin. Because whats our focus? Are we focusing on Him or sin? Self or Christ? Broken or whole? Stuck or free? Flesh or Spirit? Are we avoiding sin or chasing love? Are we turning toward God or only trying to "get free" still.

Jesus said whom the Son sets free IS free indeed! Paul knew it! He said he was free from the law of sin and death. And guess what he also said follow after his pattern. As he follows after Christ. You say you want to follow Christ? Well amen! Follow after the Spirit, because He tells you that you're crucified to the flesh and its passions, He convicts you of righteousness, He builds you up, comforts you, and stirs you up!! Jesus gave us the same glory His Father gave Him so we might be One! But unless 2-3 agree how can they walk together? We need to agree with what Scripture says about us. Because it is the truth that sets us free. We are free in Christ, but it is the truth that renews our mind to His Kingdom.

Because where the Spirit of the Lord is there IS freedom. And He is the Spirit of Truth!

C.

 

[Cee]

This is not true. It is an INWARD glory coming out of us. There is none of this reflecting stuff. Paul even compares Moses and says the outward glory he experienced was nothing compared to the inward glory we experience.

2 Corinthians 3:18 and 1 Corinthians 13:22 are not describing the same thing.

The latter is simply saying that we don't see Christ clearly now, just as the image in an ancient mirror would be imperfect and flawed.

The former is describing how the glory of the lord is reflected (or mirrored) off of us as we behold his glory, just as it was reflected off of Moses' face when he beheld the lord face to face. That verse says nothing about looking at Christ in a mirror.

 

[UnderGrace]

can I get an AMEN?

Certainly,


AMEN!

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

This is not true. It is an INWARD glory coming out of us. There is none of this reflecting stuff. Paul even compares Moses and says the outward glory he experienced was nothing compared to the inward glory we experience.

That's what the bible says. Christ's glory mirrored off of us, just as it was with Moses and his face shone from the glory reflecting off of it. You're conflating the two verses to make it look like when we look at ourselves (as in a mirror) we see Christ. Utter hogwash.

 

[Cee]

Comments like this are one of the reasons why I keep coming back, haha.

Scripture tells us when we honor a righteous man we can receive their reward. Keep honoring the Spirit in people and you will be able to receive their breakthroughs in your own life.

C.

So true and Amen! Cee thank you for clearly reminding us of who we are in Christ and to live in that identity.

What you have written is so edifying. We can never proclaim this Good News in all its fullness enough times, there are so many born again believers who need to come to this deeper understanding of their position in Christ.



I know that for myself, when I began to understand these truths about who we are in Jesus, the scripture finally began to make sense, it was like a light had been tuned on and the Holy Spirit just led me, because I was understanding and believing that I could abide in the Word of God