Can these translations be trusted 100%? Imagine you holding up the NIV and claiming to others that it's the word of God knowing it contains errors. What does God think about any translation that is not His word (and contains errors)? Do you believe God would want us claiming that translation is His word? His word is perfect. His word is without error. His word can be trusted as truth. Do you have that? Do you have a book you can trust in and call it God's word?
ROMANS, CHAPTER 8
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In which you provided zero evidence. The simple fact is, the King James Bible has never been "revised". There have been different editions of the King James Bible, in which the Gothic type was changed to Roman type, the spelling of various English words was updated, some minor punctuation changes were made, and several minor printing errors were corrected, but the underlying Hebrew and Greek texts have never changed at all.
Paul makes a very cogent and well-reasoned argument, and it spans several chapters -- this is only part of it. try & follow:
so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death
(Romans 6:3)
we are buried with him by baptism into death
(Romans 6:4)
we have been planted together in the likeness of his death
(Romans 6:5)
our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed
(Romans 6:6)
in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin
(Romans 6:10-11)
For he that is dead is freed from sin.
(Romans 6:7)
Know ye not, brethren, how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?
(Romans 7:1)
Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ
(Romans 7:4)
now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held
(Romans 7:6)
Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
(Romans 7:17)
Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
(Romans 7:20)
I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord!
So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God;
but with the flesh the law of sin.
(Romans 7:25)
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus
(Romans 8:1)
For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath
made me free from the law of sin and death.
(Romans 8:2)
if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin;
but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
(Romans 8:10)
whom he did predestinate, them he also called:
and whom he called, them he also justified:
and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
What shall we then say to these things?
If God be for us, who can be against us?
(Romans 8:30-31)
Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect?
It is God that justifieth.
(Romans 8:33)
(Romans 6:3)
we are buried with him by baptism into death
(Romans 6:4)
we have been planted together in the likeness of his death
(Romans 6:5)
our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed
(Romans 6:6)
in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin
(Romans 6:10-11)
For he that is dead is freed from sin.
(Romans 6:7)
Know ye not, brethren, how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?
(Romans 7:1)
Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ
(Romans 7:4)
now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held
(Romans 7:6)
Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
(Romans 7:17)
Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
(Romans 7:20)
I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord!
So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God;
but with the flesh the law of sin.
(Romans 7:25)
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus
(Romans 8:1)
For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath
made me free from the law of sin and death.
(Romans 8:2)
if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin;
but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
(Romans 8:10)
whom he did predestinate, them he also called:
and whom he called, them he also justified:
and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
What shall we then say to these things?
If God be for us, who can be against us?
(Romans 8:30-31)
Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect?
It is God that justifieth.
(Romans 8:33)
Who is he that condemneth?
It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again,
who is even at the right hand of God,
who also maketh intercession for us.
(Romans 8:34)
It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again,
who is even at the right hand of God,
who also maketh intercession for us.
(Romans 8:34)
[HR][/HR]
yea, verily -- who is it that condemneth?
the law? nay - for to it we have died, having been immersed into Him which also died, and which also was raised.
Therefore thou art inexcusable, O man, whosoever thou art that judgest:
for wherein thou judgest another, thou condemnest thyself;
or thou that judgest doest the same things.
(Romans 2:1)
for wherein thou judgest another, thou condemnest thyself;
or thou that judgest doest the same things.
(Romans 2:1)
¿comprenden ustedes?
♥
♥
You forgot to mention the end of Rom 6: 4,
"We SHOULD walk in the newness of life".
And you forgot to mention the end of Rom 8: 1.
"Who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit ".
(removed) Please do not make personal attacks thank you
Last edited by a moderator:
You really are mixed up, aren't you? Besides abducting this whole thread, I mean!
"But when the fullness of time had come, God sent forth his Son, born of woman, born under the law,5 to redeem those who were under the law, so that we might receive adoption as sons.6 And because you are sons, God has sent the Spirit of his Son into our hearts, crying, “Abba! Father!”7 So you are no longer a slave, but a son, and if a son, then an heir through God." Gal. 4:4-7
The fullness of time was when Jesus came. There are many reasons for this.
1. There was a common language throughout the known word - Greek (lingua franca). Alexander the Great started this in the 3rd century BC, with his "hellenization" of the world. Even the Jews mostly lost their Hebrew, which is why the OT had to be translated from Hebrew into Greek, called the Septuagint. Oh yes, it was claimed that Greek translation was totally inspired, and the only Word of God. Except there are many differences between the Greek translation and the original Hebrew. But fortunately, most of the Jews knew where these differences were, and were careful with which version they used. A politically unified realm preserved a linguistically unified people.
Anyway, the point of having Greek was that the gospel was easily spread, because everyone spoke Greek, at least as a second language.
2. Pax Romana (Roman Peace) gave the heart of the empire freedom from warfare over an expanse of time and space previously unparalleld in Middle Eastern history. The roads and sea ways were safe, due to the Roman government chasing bandits and pirates away. Anyone breaking the laws were immediately executed, no questions asked! So it was a safe place to travel and to spread the gospel.
3. A direct outgrowth of the first two points was the development of the most advanced transportation and communication systems of the ancient world, never again matched till the Reformation.
4. A cosmopolitan spirit grew, particular in cities, which transcended national barriers. Old tribal distinctions or identities were breaking down, leaving people ripe for new religions or ideologies to fill the gap. The gospe would meet many felt needs in this climate.
5. Closely related was the elimination of many cross-cultural battlers to dialogue and the dissemination of new world views because of the cultural and political unification that was increasing.
6. As long as Christianity was viewed as just another Jewish sect, it received protection as a religio licitia. Throughout the book of Acts, all of which was completed by 62AD (before Nero's persecution) Romans rulers consistently came to the rescue of Christians, particularly Paul. Only by the decade of the 60's was it clear to all that Christianity was significant to transcending its Jewish roots and becoming a major world religions, at which point it was no longer granted the legal status it previously ignored.
7. Rome implemented the most enlightened and advanced judicial processes of antiqiuity. Although there were tyrants and de sports, due process of the law brought justice for at least Roman citizens. Jesus was not a citizen, but Paul was, and he repeatedly received the legal benefits of his citizenship. ( Acts 16:35-39; 22:23-29; 25:10-11)
Little wonder that many Christian historians are not only seen a theological but a historical application to Gal. 4:4 "When the fullness of time was come, God sent forth his Son." KJV
Nothing about the KJV being the "fullness of time" and in fact, that scripture points to Christ and how the world was ready to hear the gospel.
Which begs the question - Have you ever actually read the Bible? Because I think that would really help dispel all your misconceptions. No wait, you probably have read it, but didn't understand it because it was written in 15th century English. So where did you get this magical thinking that the KJV was referred to in Gal. 4:4 when even the KJV says the fullness of time was when God sent forth his Son? Or where did you get the false idea that the KJV was the only translation God used and blessed? And why are you so Anglo-centric? How can you eliminate the histories, languages and cultures of billions of people and millennia, in believing that only your arachic Early Modern English translation of the Bible is sanctioned by God?
D
Did you just hop on the bandwagon at Page Seven? Because that discussion already ran its course on this thread.
Or are you one of those people who think "keep repeating the same thing over and over again, and eventually everyone will believe it strictly because it was repeated?" Either way, Not my problem. YOUR problem.
Sorry. Not playing either of your games. I have a life and qualify under the "no condemnation" clause.
Or are you one of those people who think "keep repeating the same thing over and over again, and eventually everyone will believe it strictly because it was repeated?" Either way, Not my problem. YOUR problem.
Sorry. Not playing either of your games. I have a life and qualify under the "no condemnation" clause.
D
Funny thing about KJV from a writer's royalty POV. Anytime a writer has a book published he/she gets an advance on royalties. Usually 15% nowadays, but I don't know what percentage back in the 1600's in England. And after the book sells enough copies to make up for that advance, than the writer gets royalties from continuing sells. Still 15% in this day and age, and I still don't know what the terms were typically in England back then.
BUT those royalties only last 100 years. Less, if the author doesn't put it in a will that the royalties go to his/her heirs. No heirs and royalty dies at the death of the author. Mark Twain wrote his autobiography to be published only after 100 years after his death, especially so it didn't mess up the royalties to his kin. Most of the time, that's all an author gets is 100 years. BUT you can pay a fee to keep the royalties coming even after 100 years.
There is only one book in the history of publication that keeps making the heirs royalty checks centuries later. AND it keeps making royalty checks specifically because there is a large enough group of people who think it is THE ONLY book to be trusted completely, so the only book people insist must be bought and kept and used only. The Royal Family owns the copyrights to that book, so they continue to get the royalties even 400 years after it was first published. And they get the royalties to all the spin-offs to that book.
The original book was KJV and published in 1611. It was updated a bit and republished a few times closely after that first time, and it has even be updated a few more times but toted as the NKJV. All the royalties to that book are still given to the heirs of the one dubbed as "the author" even though "the author" didn't even write the book.
So, in a way, it really could have something to do with "just want to make money."
Other publishing-related note. All authors have guidelines to how much of a book can be quoted before the author makes money when someone quotes from their book. For the KJV, we're not allowed to quote more than 2000 verses, before we need permission to quote. (So maybe they aren't in it for the money. lol)
BUT those royalties only last 100 years. Less, if the author doesn't put it in a will that the royalties go to his/her heirs. No heirs and royalty dies at the death of the author. Mark Twain wrote his autobiography to be published only after 100 years after his death, especially so it didn't mess up the royalties to his kin. Most of the time, that's all an author gets is 100 years. BUT you can pay a fee to keep the royalties coming even after 100 years.
There is only one book in the history of publication that keeps making the heirs royalty checks centuries later. AND it keeps making royalty checks specifically because there is a large enough group of people who think it is THE ONLY book to be trusted completely, so the only book people insist must be bought and kept and used only. The Royal Family owns the copyrights to that book, so they continue to get the royalties even 400 years after it was first published. And they get the royalties to all the spin-offs to that book.
The original book was KJV and published in 1611. It was updated a bit and republished a few times closely after that first time, and it has even be updated a few more times but toted as the NKJV. All the royalties to that book are still given to the heirs of the one dubbed as "the author" even though "the author" didn't even write the book.
So, in a way, it really could have something to do with "just want to make money."
Other publishing-related note. All authors have guidelines to how much of a book can be quoted before the author makes money when someone quotes from their book. For the KJV, we're not allowed to quote more than 2000 verses, before we need permission to quote. (So maybe they aren't in it for the money. lol)
The "fullness of time" is a biblical concept pointing towards God's perfect timing. The birth of Christ is an example. The Church Age is another when the fullness of the Gentiles be come in. The Bible was translated in God's perfect timing. English was on the verge of being the dominant language on the planet and there was a sense of longing from the people to have a copy of God's word for their own.
Again, God promised to preserve His words for all generations. He did not promise to have it translated into every language. That would not stop the gospel from going out in all languages. The gospel is not bound by Greek or Hebrew or English.
Again, God promised to preserve His words for all generations. He did not promise to have it translated into every language. That would not stop the gospel from going out in all languages. The gospel is not bound by Greek or Hebrew or English.
you mean like the kjv?
because that's what the kjv is -- do you forget? -- it's a translation.
it's not "the preserved word" -- Jesus did not speak in Victorian English. Moses did not write in Victorian English. Daniel & Isaiah did not prophesy in Victorian English.
the "preserved word of God" is preserved in the language that the word was given.
well hey -- case in point -- the kjv is not 100% accurate; it copied a copying mistake in Romans 8:1
there are a lot of errors in the kjv.
the "Red Sea" does not exist in the middle east; that's "the Reed Sea."
there's no such thing as a cockatrice or unicorn -- should be a type of snake, and an aurochs.
1 John 3:6 should read that whoever abides in Him "does not continue in sin" -- not that they "sinneth not."
and a whole host of other little problems. other translations have their own translation problems. every time you translate, you lose nuance. but God give s His spirit, and He gives understanding. none of the errors in the kjv, niv, esv, nasb, etc. are so grave that the gospel is lost. they are all little things - some with theological inconsistencies of various scale, some more mundane. but with the spirit who guides us into all knowledge of Him, we don't need perfect word for word translation - sometimes Jesus does not quote word-for-word, nor do the disciples - why?
but this is where the word of God is truly preserved: in the hearts of those who are sealed by the same Spirit who is the Author of the book. if every copy was destroyed on earth, the Spirit could raise someone up to write it all down again.
why dont we look first unto those who spoke with himbefore those greeks and romans put their eyes unto
our lord jesus the only begotten son of god
who speak the will of his father
our lord god the father almighty who is good and doesnt lie
as it is written
:read:
8*The wind blows wherever it pleases. You hear its sound, but you don't know where the wind comes from or where it's going. That's the way it is with everyone born of the Spirit."
9*Nicodemus replied, "How can that be?"
10*Jesus told Nicodemus, "You're a well-known teacher of Israel. Can't you understand this?
11*I can guarantee this truth: We know what we're talking about, and we confirm what we've seen. Yet, you don't accept our message.
12*If you don't believe me when I tell you about things on earth, how will you believe me when I tell you about things in heaven?
:rofl: when a child told us about this
question "if were going to heaven do we have to speak like those
people who were using their language as basis for salvation"
then we told to that child "look how many times those angels talked to them using their own languages"
:ty:
godbless us all always
J
Except you have the Spirit of God [His Spirit], you are no child of His. The new creature is born and complete at the time of conception [belief], and there is no more saving to be done or are you saying that the Lord of your grace could not do the job the Holy Father sent Him to do??
One must grow and mature in the Spirit [word], but the transformation is complete.
It is the will of our Lord that we remain in this world at "Spiritual Birth" to continue His work and not be immediately taken home to the Holy Father [John 17], but there is no more saving to be done for the work of the Holy Spirit is once and complete for all time.
JTF
One must grow and mature in the Spirit [word], but the transformation is complete.
It is the will of our Lord that we remain in this world at "Spiritual Birth" to continue His work and not be immediately taken home to the Holy Father [John 17], but there is no more saving to be done for the work of the Holy Spirit is once and complete for all time.
JTF