So what about the fourth commandment?

[Grace777x70]

Paul who knew the law better then anyone had this to say about the purpose of the law.

The purpose of the law was :

1) To reveal our sinful state. Rom 3:20

2) To inflame sin Rom 7:8

3) To minister death in us Rom 7:10-11

4) To lead us to Christ Gal 3:24

The law is good, holy and spiritual but we are in the flesh. Jesus fulfilled all the law! When we read the law we should be seeing Jesus in it. Jesus did not save us so that we could go back to the law.

But the purpose of the law was not for righteousness or salvation at all, it was to manifest sin in our lives, so that the purpose of grace which is in Jesus is to manifest salvation. Grace does not set aside the law, but completely satisfied it.

Col 2:13-15 is where in says that Christ "disarmed" satan having cancelled out the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us and He nailed it to the cross.

Satan uses the law against us. Satan comes and says to you - you broke the law - you are condemned now according to the law. BUT our Lord took that punishment for breaking that law for us. When Christ takes away the condemnation of the law which satan uses against when he accuses us - he is being "disarmed".

If disarmed means anything - it means he did have a weapon but now he doesn't because of our Lord. We are NOT under Law but grace now because we are in Christ. How great is our salvation in Him!

Colossians 2:15-17 (NASB)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] When He had disarmed the rulers and authorities, He made a public display of them, having triumphed over them through Him.

[SUP]16 [/SUP] Therefore no one is to act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day—

[SUP]17 [/SUP] things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ.

 

[Ahwatukee]

Mistakes in the first few sentences....no need to read any more.
Since when do the Commandments, spiritual, holy, just and good come from/have been used by the power of darkness ?
Jesus must have followed the devil all His human life according to your opinion...because HE kept His Fathers Commandments ! You are as good as saying the devil was His father .
Please think about what you are implying. And why is it so hard , or impossible to respect and observe the Sabbath day as Jesus kept it ? I would just like to know ....since we are told that the commandments are not hard to keep .
I am sure I could say more if I read all your post....not that you would want to hear it !

It's no wonder why Jesus says that many will say to me on the day "Lord, Lord." I feel sorry for you because you say you trust in Christ for salvation, while at the same time trusting in your own efforts. What part of "Jesus kept the law on our behalf" didn't you understand? What part of "we are under a new covenant" didn't you understand? New covenant means not the same as the old covenant. Remember, if you are are trying to keep the law, then you have to keep the entire law, not just slivers of it. And when you break it in one place, you've broken the entire law.

It is amazing to me how much is said regarding the works of the law vs. salvation by grace through faith and you and others continue to gain favor with God by your own efforts. Whenever you bring in your own requirements along side of Christ's sacrifice, it is like saying that his sacrifice was insufficient.

We are saved by trusting in Christ as the One who provided salvation for. So when we add requirements along side of that, we are not trusting in Christ. Those who think that they are going to be commended for keeping the Sabbath or the ten commandments or abstaining from certain foods as an aid to salvation will be in for a very big let down. An eternal let down.

A true believers faith should be completely in Christ as the One who provided salvation, perfectly and completely.They will have a zealousness for good works, but not to obtain or maintain salvation, but to glorify God. I pray that God will open your spiritual eyes his true salvation. For anyone who trusts in their own efforts for salvation will not inherit the kingdom of God.

 

[Dan_473]

To love God is to keep His Commandments 1Joh 5v3, Deut 5v29. Jesus did !!!
Jesus was of the same Spirit as God His Father, yet Jesus never said He did not need to keep any Commandments...while WE who claim HIS Spirit do....don't you think that a bit ODD ? what makes us better than Him ?

before we move on, did you want to answer this question

"does Jesus say that loving God fulfills all the commandments?"

 

[Ahwatukee]

Mistakes in the first few sentences....no need to read any more.
Since when do the Commandments, spiritual, holy, just and good come from/have been used by the power of darkness ?
Jesus must have followed the devil all His human life according to your opinion...because HE kept His Fathers Commandments ! You are as good as saying the devil was His father .
Please think about what you are implying. And why is it so hard , or impossible to respect and observe the Sabbath day as Jesus kept it ? I would just like to know ....since we are told that the commandments are not hard to keep .
I am sure I could say more if I read all your post....not that you would want to hear it !

There are no mistakes whatsoever. What it is, is your disregard for the truth of scripture when it is presented. Those truths mentioned above are from the word of God.

 

[Ahwatukee]

if someone does not obey the 4th commandment,
this means they are "breaking" the 4th commandment.
it is fairly simple.

Your post above demonstrates that you are trusting in your own efforts. You keep saying that these are not requirements for salvation, but if that were true you wouldn't continue promoting the keeping of the works of the law. Let me be clear: you can keep the Sabbath, abstain from foods, etc., but when it is a requirement for salvation, then it becomes a problem, because you are no longer trusting in Christ as the One who fulfilled the law.

In testifying of Christ I have never told anyone to keep the ten commands, abstain from certain foods, keep the Sabbath on a certain day, or any other works of the law. What I do tell them is to read the word of God, begin to pray and follow Christ. Christ freed us from the curse of the law and there many in these last days who have been deceived and are deceiving others by attempting to bring them back under the works of the law. This is in fulfillment of the following:


"For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths. "

The above is what you are doing by promoting the law. When myself and others provide scripture showing that we are saved by grace through faith apart from the works of the law, all you do is distort scriptures' meaning of the law by slicing and dicing it. You don't have to keep this, but you do have to keep these others. I say what Paul said:

"May I never boast except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ"

 

[disciplemike]

Your post above demonstrates that you are trusting in your own efforts. You keep saying that these are not requirements for salvation, but if that were true you wouldn't continue promoting the keeping of the works of the law. Let me be clear: you can keep the Sabbath, abstain from foods, etc., but when it is a requirement for salvation, then it becomes a problem, because you are no longer trusting in Christ as the One who fulfilled the law.

I like to call it obeying the King!
To suggest that we should intentionally not obey the King is silly.

 

[Grandpa]

I like to call it obeying the King!
To suggest that we should intentionally not obey the King is silly.

You're right. This is silly.

 

[Ahwatukee]

I like to call it obeying the King!
To suggest that we should intentionally not obey the King is silly.

Hi disciplemike,

Nowhere did I say anything about not obeying the King. What we are and have been saying--according to scripture--is that, we are not under the law, but under a new covenant. We follow in a new way, led by the spirit. Jesus met the righteous requirements of the law in order to free us from the power it had over us, which leads to death. Salvation is not about the keeping of ordinances, but about following Christ and being transformed into His image.

As believers, our only hope and claim to forgiveness and eternal life should be Christ crucified. Any works that we do should be done, not to obtain or maintain salvation--for Christ already provided that--but should be to glorify God. And by doing so we are also building up our treasures in heaven. Jesus met the righteous requirements of the law freeing us from it. By not being under the law, sin has lost its power. we can't break the law if there is no law to break.

I truly wish that you could understand, for if you did, you would not be promoting the works of the law. This deception of the mixing of the works of the law mixed in with grace, is just one of the many lies that Satan has brought into the church to pollute it and to rob believers of our freedom in Christ. I truly pray that the Spirit would open your spiritual eyes to the truth.



"For sin is the sting that results in death, and the law gives sin its power. But thank God! He gives us victory over sin and death through our Lord Jesus Christ." (NLT)

 

[disciplemike]

By not being under the law, sin has lost its power. we can't break the law if there is no law to break.
"

So you are saying there is no law now?
Sir, that contradicts what Messiah has told us.

 

[beta]

There are no mistakes whatsoever. What it is, is your disregard for the truth of scripture when it is presented. Those truths mentioned above are from the word of God.

In your haste to 'negate my post you have 'inadvertently approved of it !!! (truths mentioned above being mine) for one moment I thought you were actually agreeing with me, lol.

 

[beta]

It's no wonder why Jesus says that many will say to me on the day "Lord, Lord." I feel sorry for you because you say you trust in Christ for salvation, while at the same time trusting in your own efforts. What part of "Jesus kept the law on our behalf" didn't you understand? What part of "we are under a new covenant" didn't you understand? New covenant means not the same as the old covenant. Remember, if you are are trying to keep the law, then you have to keep the entire law, not just slivers of it. And when you break it in one place, you've broken the entire law.

It is amazing to me how much is said regarding the works of the law vs. salvation by grace through faith and you and others continue to gain favor with God by your own efforts. Whenever you bring in your own requirements along side of Christ's sacrifice, it is like saying that his sacrifice was insufficient.

We are saved by trusting in Christ as the One who provided salvation for. So when we add requirements along side of that, we are not trusting in Christ. Those who think that they are going to be commended for keeping the Sabbath or the ten commandments or abstaining from certain foods as an aid to salvation will be in for a very big let down. An eternal let down.

A true believers faith should be completely in Christ as the One who provided salvation, perfectly and completely.They will have a zealousness for good works, but not to obtain or maintain salvation, but to glorify God. I pray that God will open your spiritual eyes his true salvation. For anyone who trusts in their own efforts for salvation will not inherit the kingdom of God.

There are 'NO OWN efforts when we DO what GOD says !
It's called 'Doing the work of God or 'Doing God's WILL !
You see... some of us recognize AUTHORITY over us until we are perfected and completed as obedient children.....
while some think they no longer need to learn anything....least of all obedience ! Heb 5v8,9.

 

[RobbyEarl]

What is being discussed is a simple thing but yet complicated. In the OT they were obligated to keep the law and if they broke the law, they must offer up a sacrifice for atonement. This was done as it was symbolic of the Cross, it did not remove sin, but only covered it. Meaning that the nature of sin was still present in the individual, Meaning they could help but to sin as it was their nature, they had no choice, sin was imminent.

In the NT, When we are saved, the chains of sin are broken and we no longer desire the fruits of sin, as long as our faith is placed in the work of the cross. But here comes the sneaky part. We have been redeemed in spirit and our minds are being renewed by the Word of God (Jesus). yet remain in these flesh bodies that are prone to sin. The redemption of the body happens at the rapture or at the end of the trib. Meaning if you are saved before the rapture then your body is redeemed at the rapture. If you are saved after the rapture and are killed then your body is redeemed at the great white throne judgement. if you live through the the trib then you remain in this flesh body. However, there is no longer a tempter.

So what it boils down to is, if your faith is in law, then you fail and not be accepted, but if your faith is in the cross then you will by spirit keep the morality of God as long as your faith is in Christ. The Holy Spirit will work in you and through as long as faith is in Christ. By judging if you keep law or not excludes you from the work of the Holy Spirit, because He will not work in you unless your faith is in the Cross of Christ. Because the Cross of Christ is the only thing the Father will accept and nothing else.

Amen.

 

[beta]

before we move on, did you want to answer this question

"does Jesus say that loving God fulfills all the commandments?"

1Joh 5v3 For 'this is the love of God that we keep his commandments.

v2 ....when we love God and keep his commandments.

 

[beta]

1Joh 5v3 For 'this is the love of God that we keep his commandments.

v2 ....when we love God and keep his commandments.

Yes, all 10 INcluding the first 4 !

 

[AbigailZeke]

Hmm so much emphasis on our righteousness. Reason why the law is still in effect. It hasn't served its purpose yet.

 

[beta]

Hmm so much emphasis on our righteousness. Reason why the law is still in effect. It hasn't served its purpose yet.

Would you like to define what/which law you are talking about ? Many laws were given in the OT.

 

[AbigailZeke]

Would you like to define what/which law you are talking about ? Many laws were given in the OT.

I am talking about the law as a whole. You understand what it is.

 

[beta]

I am talking about the law as a whole. You understand what it is.

Was the law as a whole abolished ? all of them ?
so now we can be LAW_LESS ? is that what you mean ?

 

[AbigailZeke]

Was the law as a whole abolished ? all of them ?
so now we can be LAW_LESS ? is that what you mean ?

You know how the law works. By the law's standard, we have always been, law_less.

James 2:10 ASV For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one point, he is become guilty of all.

 

[beta]

You know how the law works. By the law's standard, we have always been, law_less.

James 2:10 ASV For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one point, he is become guilty of all.

I know what James says....
do YOU know which law he was referring to ? obviously you think that the 'whole law in it's entirety was abolished. Scripture says NOT !
Please tell which laws were abolished on the cross and which were not !