LIFE UNDER THE NEW COVENANT :)

[FreeNChrist]

"The branch of the vine does not worry, and toil, and rush here to seek for sunshine, and there to find rain. No; it rests in union and communion with the vine; and at the right time, and in the right way, is the right fruit found on it. Let us so abide in the Lord Jesus.” Hudson Taylor

 

[UndoubtingThomas]

Yes, we are back there, to where those who are born again
of the Holy Spirit of God are walking after the Spirit.

Born again means to be born as Spirit which means after the flesh is shed (your earthly body dies). You can die and not know Jesus and be denied from being born again in the Spirit. Begotten is the term for those still walking in the flesh that come back to God after being born unto Him and deserting Him..

 

[Grace777x70]

It looks like to me the whole context is about service and preaching the gospel.

1 Corinthians 9:19-27 (NASB)
[SUP]19 [/SUP] For though I am free from all men, I have made myself a slave to all, so that I may win more.

[SUP]20 [/SUP] To the Jews I became as a Jew, so that I might win Jews; to those who are under the Law, as under the Law though not being myself under the Law, so that I might win those who are under the Law;

[SUP]21 [/SUP] to those who are without law, as without law, though not being without the law of God but under the law of Christ, so that I might win those who are without law.


[SUP]22 [/SUP] To the weak I became weak, that I might win the weak; I have become all things to all men, so that I may by all means save some.

[SUP]23 [/SUP] I do all things for the sake of the gospel, so that I may become a fellow partaker of it.

[SUP]24 [/SUP] Do you not know that those who run in a race all run, but only one receives the prize? Run in such a way that you may win.

[SUP]25 [/SUP] Everyone who competes in the games exercises self-control in all things. They then do it to receive a perishable wreath, but we an imperishable.

[SUP]26 [/SUP] Therefore I run in such a way, as not without aim; I box in such a way, as not beating the air;

[SUP]27 [/SUP] but I discipline my body and make it my slave, so that, after I have preached to others, I myself will not be disqualified.

 

[AbigailZeke]

Maybe its the angle we come at it -- but to me the key is realizing it is "both" -- It is Christ doing the work - He is the starting point and the finishing point and everything inbetween! But it is also me working -- if I just expect things to happen because I am born again (that is - if I expect good deeds will effortlessly flow forth while I am humbly believing that it is not me ) I will find myself living a weak, inefficient, lukewarm Christianity.

Paul says in Ephesians 2:8-10 that we are saved by grace through faith - and then we become the "workmanship" of God. So, yes, 100% God does the work in us and through us - but I am also 100% engaged in my own faculties, will, and desires -- and at least for me this is not effortless and automatic - it takes everything that I have - and I gladly and willingly give my all for my King and Redeemer!

Yes, maybe it's the angle. I think I see your point. The best example I can think of right now for my point of view would be a tree (like my avatar xD). God waters it. The tree bears fruit. The tree is just being a tree... doing tree things. But it bears fruit because of Gods taking care of it. See what I mean?

 

[Grace777x70]

Jesus said that He is the Vine and we are the branches. The branch does not produce it's own fruit by what it does. It is just being itself - a branch. The Life of the Vine comes through it and that Life produces fruit. The branch "bears" the fruit of the Life of the Vine in it.

The branch receives everything it needs from the Vine because it is one with it. This "oneness" is what brings about the good fruit but the Vine doesn't say to the branch. "Thou must produce fruit" - no....the Vine brings the nourishment/Life it needs to be what it already is - a branch that can bear fruit.

The branch is 100% dependent on the life of the Vine which is why Jesus said - without Me - you can do nothing. Jesus lived by His Father inside of Him.

Jesus said that He wasn't doing the works - but His Father in Him was doing the good works. We are in the exact same boat as Jesus - only we are in Christ and He is in us. It is the Father in us through Jesus going the good works. We get to participate with Him as we get transformed by the Holy Spirit and we get our minds renewed.

The really good news in all of this is that we get rewarded for participating in the works that God has already prepared beforehand that He is doing in and through us.

How is this already prepared ahead of time before it is even done? Don't have a clue, as Jesus was slain before the foundation of the world too. That's God's department.

 

[Cee]

These posts are crazy to me. Seriously. Only God can bring us into a place that our love for others is willing to sacrifice all. Nothing we do can force this. It's an agape love that is experienced by knowing His liberating, exhilarating, unconditional love. If anyone thinks they can "force works" out of themselves or others, they have a tiny, tiny view of what God considers good works.

 

[Chester]

Yes, maybe it's the angle. I think I see your point. The best example I can think of right now for my point of view would be a tree (like my avatar xD). God waters it. The tree bears fruit. The tree is just being a tree... doing tree things. But it bears fruit because of Gods taking care of it. See what I mean?

Great! I like your example.

 

[Chester]

Jesus said that He is the Vine and we are the branches. The branch does not produce it's own fruit by what it does. It is just being itself - a branch. The Life of the Vine comes through it and that Life produces fruit. The branch "bears" the fruit of the Life of the Vine in it.

The branch receives everything it needs from the Vine because it is one with it. This "oneness" is what brings about the good fruit but the Vine doesn't say to the branch. "Thou must produce fruit" - no....the Vine brings the nourishment/Life it needs to be what it already is - a branch that can bear fruit.

The branch is 100% dependent on the life of the Vine which is why Jesus said - without Me - you can do nothing. Jesus lived by His Father inside of Him.

Jesus said that He wasn't doing the works - but His Father in Him was doing the good works. We are in the exact same boat as Jesus - only we are in Christ and He is in us. It is the Father in us through Jesus going the good works. We get to participate with Him as we get transformed by the Holy Spirit and we get our minds renewed.

The really good news in all of this is that we get rewarded for participating in the works that God has already prepared beforehand that He is doing in and through us.

How is this already prepared ahead of time before it is even done? Don't have a clue, as Jesus was slain before the foundation of the world too. That's God's department.

Ah - I don't think I disagree - but your emphasis is pushing my anti-OSAS buttons - I better get out of here before I have to make more apologies!

Example: "It is just being itself -- a branch"
Take the word "just" out of your quote and it is much better = "It is being itself -- a branch"
(a subtle difference - but I think a better approach!)

 

[Cee]

If we see God's love as conditional is it any wonder if our love for each other is conditional?

But that's NOT the love Paul describes in 1 Co 13.

Love never fails.
Love always hopes.
Love keeps no record of wrongs.

C.

 

[Chester]

These posts are crazy to me. Seriously. Only God can bring us into a place that our love for others is willing to sacrifice all. Nothing we do can force this. It's an agape love that is experienced by knowing His liberating, exhilarating, unconditional love. If anyone thinks they can "force works" out of themselves or others, they have a tiny, tiny view of what God considers good works.

Yeah, I can understand why you think we are being crazy - maybe we are.

I think I can completely agree with your post (#46)

We are just hashing over our part in the process. I know - it is all God and all about God - right! I agree!

But if that was actually all there was to it - I would argue you don't even need to make any effort on your own at all - don't move your muscles, etc. - God will do it all . . . -- if this was so - you would never get out of bed in the morning - you do have to decide to move your muscles and you have to move them -- but it is 100% God who made you and you can't even begin to do it without Him!

Still sound crazy? It doesn't to me! I rejoice that I can engage all of my abilities and faculties to serve the Lord!

 

[Cee]

I love your answer

You obviously love the Lord and you know Him.

If I may ask you a question,

Why do you rejoice that you can engage all of your abilities and faculties to serve the Lord?

What is it that drives you? Did you have a personal experience or what is it that you understand about Him?

Guess that's 3 questions.

Yeah, I can understand why you think we are being crazy - maybe we are.

I think I can completely agree with your post (#46)

We are just hashing over our part in the process. I know - it is all God and all about God - right! I agree!

But if that was actually all there was to it - I would argue you don't even need to make any effort on your own at all - don't move your muscles, etc. - God will do it all . . . -- if this was so - you would never get out of bed in the morning - you do have to decide to move your muscles and you have to move them -- but it is 100% God who made you and you can't even begin to do it without Him!

Still sound crazy? It doesn't to me! I rejoice that I can engage all of my abilities and faculties to serve the Lord!

 

[Chester]

I love your answer

You obviously love the Lord and you know Him.

If I may ask you a question,

Why do you rejoice that you can engage all of your abilities and faculties to serve the Lord?

What is it that drives you? Did you have a personal experience or what is it that you understand about Him?

Guess that's 3 questions.

Ah! Maybe my passion come from my working with young people . . .

I see youth leaving the church because it is a dull boring dry place where you have to sit and listen to a sermon and there is nothing exciting to do or be! Go to the football game and you can have fun and yell! Youth are made with strength and passion and resolve.

But our Christianity sometimes says - come to God , sit down, let Him love you, and He will do everything . . . And they (the youth) get bored . . .

Don't get me wrong - Yes, yes, yes, -- young people must experience and know the love of God at a deep intimate level - that is the starting point . . .

But youth want a reason to live and work and they have a passion and zeal that need to be harnessed - and if they are going to serve the Lord with all of their passions - they will need leaders and mentors to follow -- hence that is the desire and passion of my life . . . to engage all of my abilities and faculties to serve the Lord!

 

[Cee]

I agree they need to know His love intimately!!!

How about for you though? Why do you want to passionately serve Him??? What is about Him that makes you want to do this?

Ah! Maybe my passion come from my working with young people . . .

I see youth leaving the church because it is a dull boring dry place where you have to sit and listen to a sermon and there is nothing exciting to do or be! Go to the football game and you can have fun and yell! Youth are made with strength and passion and resolve.

But our Christianity sometimes says - come to God , sit down, let Him love you, and He will do everything . . . And they (the youth) get bored . . .

Don't get me wrong - Yes, yes, yes, -- young people must experience and know the love of God at a deep intimate level - that is the starting point . . .

But youth want a reason to live and work and they have a passion and zeal that need to be harnessed - and if they are going to serve the Lord with all of their passions - they will need leaders and mentors to follow -- hence that is the desire and passion of my life . . . to engage all of my abilities and faculties to serve the Lord!

 

[Chester]

I agree they need to know His love intimately!!!

How about for you though? Why do you want to passionately serve Him??? What is about Him that makes you want to do this?

I was lost - and now I am found!
I was astray - and He took me in!

I went my own way - He sought me out, found me, and gave me redemption through His cross and resurrection . . .
I could search the whole world over and find no other who could be what He is to me.

He is my Saviour; He is my Master; He is my Everything; He is my reason for living; and that is only the beginning . . .

 

[Chester]

I agree they need to know His love intimately!!!

How about for you though? Why do you want to passionately serve Him??? What is about Him that makes you want to do this?

I like you -- you know how to push my buttons and get me going! Do you want to know more about my God?

 

[OneFaith]

God's law hasn't changed, only the way we obey it. It is no longer written on tablets (physical) but is written on our hearts (spiritual). The physical lamb, the physical tabernacle, the physical way is made obsolete, nailed to the cross. The physical way, the blood of bulls and lambs never took away sin debt, just postponed it. This way was only a shadow, the reality is found in Christ- spiritually His blood does save, unlike the physical blood of animals. Just as in Jesus' parables, comparing physical things to spiritual things to better our understanding, the Old Testament is the physical, the New Testament is the spiritual. It's like if you held a cross up to a wall and seen it's shadow- both are in the shape of a cross, but the shadow is not the real cross.

In the same way, doing God's law physically is not the real law, the real way is doing it spiritually- loving God and your neighbor prevents you from stealing from them or murdering them- love therefore fulfills the law. Someday, when you no longer have a physical body, and you are being judged by God, can you present Him the blood of a physically perfect lamb? No, physicality will be gone. The only things that will be real and usable will be spiritual- like Christ's blood. We are not covered in Christ's blood physically, but spiritually.

Now that we have Christ and grace- the real way that works, some still insist on going back to the old way- to be back under Moses intead of Christ. The Bible says this is like a wife having two husbands at the same time (Romans 7:1-4). Are we still under God's law like they had in the Old Testament? Yes. God's law still exists. Are we under the old physical way of doing it? No. Well if the Ten Commandments tell us not to murder, and Christ tells us not to murder, what's the difference? Spiritual vs physical. Under Christ if I hate my brother, I'm already guilty of murder in my heart. David slain his tens of thousands physically. But now Ephesians six tells us our battle is spiritual, and how to fight it.

 

[renewed_hope]

I was really tested yesterday at work. I have a coworker who is just flat out hateful and will do anything to make herself look superior even if it means planting something to make another person appear in a negative light. I was ready to tell her off when I suddenly asked myself if I did that what it would solve and the answer was nothing. I called up a guy I work with who inspired me to kill of that hateful bitterness and downright jealous attitude with kindness because if I do they wouldn't want to talk to me about anything which I'm okay with haha. But then I applied what the Bible says about loving those who persecute you and how we can apply the fruits of the Spirit. We can't control how another person acts, but we can control our response to it which is the self control part of all of it

I firmly believe if we wait and call on him he will direct our steps in how to handle the most sensitive tasks even when we may not see eye to eye.

 

[Cee]

I like you -- you know how to push my buttons and get me going! Do you want to know more about my God?

Of course I do! And I believe when people know Him like we do, they will love Him like we do!! Because He's so incredible. In every. single. way. How can you know the most Beautiful, Glorious, Loving, Kind, Gentle, Peaceful, Wise Being Ever and not fall in love???

 

[ladylynn]

It is actually Satan who tapes the video with his memory capacity.


Revelation 12:10 (NIV)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] Then I heard a loud voice in heaven say: “Now have come the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God, and the authority of his Messiah. For the accuser of our brothers and sisters, who accuses them before our God day and night, has been hurled down.

Exactly Hawkins! It's the devil who is the accuser of the brethren. he is our enemy who effectively uses condemnation against us when we are weak in the knowledge of the truth... not aware of our standing in Christ. Many believers fall because of the lie that we are condemned by God for our sins.
The truth is we have been given as a free gift the righteousness and right standing IN Christ.

When in FACT there is no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus and we are constantly reminded if our heart condemns us God is greater than our hearts. We must listen to the truth and not the lies that our arch enemy throws at us when using those horrid firey darts. The battle is in our minds and as our minds are being renewed, (and we each should be actively participating in allowing this process by reading His Word) we learn that all the enemy has are his lies. We are beloved in Christ. By grace through faith.

The accuser has no testimony against us any more. We have Christ's righteousness that was given to us by Jesus Himself. If we know and believe this truth, we will be set free and able to daily accept another fresh revelation of the gift of no condemnation in Christ. This truth needs to be daily settled in our minds. Salvation; the gift that keeps on giving.

 

[ladylynn]

I grew up thinking that God recorded any little sin I did with a great big X in the records of heaven. Then I needed to pray and cry and repent and confess long enough and hard enough that he would relent and forgive me!

(Actually my "belief" wasn't quite that bad - but it may as well have been)

That is the devil's technique, not our loving Father's approach to sin (in the Christian's life).

I'm sorry to say there are many believers who are still stuck in that lie that keeps them from knowing the true extent of what God has done IN Christ for them. Like you Chester , i used to think the same thing about God marking down every bad thought vs every good one. And you are right!! that is the devil's technique. Not our loving Fathers approach.

At the end of the day, had I not confessed with many tears and sick gut emotions as I believed was due God., those sins were still there the next morning!! I honestly tried before going to bed to remember any sin I committed that day so those sins were not held to my account the next morning when I woke up.

I hated waking up the next day with those sins still on me. So I would set my alarm on getting up at 4 a.m. having plenty of time to show God how sorry I was by confessing with tears and gut wrenching remorse during my Bible reading time. What a way to look forward to your Bible reading and fellowship with the Father???!!!!

No wonder many times I was defeated before even getting out of bed!! Soon my sins out weighed my good actions and there was no way to get it all cleaned up again for all the times I avoided the Bible reading and prayer. I must not have been that sorry if I didn't enjoy this Bible time! More guilt and condemnation on top of guilt and condemnation.

So the whole crazy scenario went on each year. Weeks of trying to always be "spiritual" and never think anything wrong. I could easily not "do" sin like not lie or cheat or steal from the store. But what about the mind? How could I always think holy thoughts?? Especially if people were doing wrong to me that day or days?

Going and confessing every thought was over whelming. Soon I avoided praying because the guilt of the verse "be sure your sin will find you out".. came to mind and I couldn't give the proper heart felt time of crying that I felt God insisted on if I really was sorry. So the sins all built up to this huge crescendo.

So probably 2x a month I'd have this major break down of crying and begging God's forgiveness and cleansing. I didn't know that Jesus took care of all my sin and guilt and shame. I didn't know I could thank God for sending Jesus and He paid for all my sins including those in my mind. I didn't know for so many years that His grace, unmerited love and favor were already mine not only for the time I first believed and was saved but for all the days after.

The truth is that my standing was sure IN Christ and grace to forgive and forget was available all the time every moment of every day because Jesus LIVES. Grace is unmerited un earned favor given because Jesus already paid for me.

So all my guts revolting, my tears and all that work I thought God wanted and liked and even required of me to show how really sorry I was were lies of the enemy. I believed for those lies for many many years.