Woman Pastor Explains Her Abortion

[Smoke]

I appreciate that I usually don't have to read beyond your first sentence to see you're incorrect. We live in the age of grace, my friend, and no more killings have to take place, so no, God isn't instructing anyone to kill babies, then write about the need to have the continued right to kill babies.

Man, Christianity has sunk to the lowest depths of evil incarnate when believers in Christ advocate the killing of unborn babies then often times follow through with what they preach. God have mercy on us.

Actually, I was absolutely correct in that God has commanded and call His children to kill children and infants. The reasoning is something man tries to make sense of to "justify" God's actions that we generally think would be cruel and unusual. The reasoning for why God commands something is less important than the actual obedience to the law. If he said "Don't drink Kool Aid", we don't say, "God said not to drink Kool Aid because it has sugar in it and sugar is bad". Granted, sugar isn't good for you, but the reasoning for why God commanded us not to drink Kool Aid has less to do about sugar and more to do with our obedience to His word. That is the story of God testing Abraham. It was a test of obedience to his word. You're trying to make this about something that it's not.

I'm also not sure who is "advocating" the killing of unborn babies. Let me get this straight... because I refuse to condemn this woman and blast her christianhood when we don't have all the facts, I'm "advocating" killing the unborn? Ha... Indeed, God have mercy on us all.

 

[Smoke]

The God I serve doesn't advocate killing unborn children. You can take that to the bank, or your local DNC headquarters, doesn't matter to me. Either way, your presumptions that God, though doubtful, may have instructed this woman to kill her baby goes beyond the scope of anything rational or glorifying. You're too weak to admit you're wrong, and that's okay for now because I'm praying God will open your eyes. He opened mine.

Then I would invite you to follow the one true God, the God of the Holy Bible.

I believe the bible to be the word of God. The God I serve HAS advocated the killing of infants and children. Granted, His reasoning and calling for it may seem unnecessary in the new covenant, but I refuse to put God in a box and say "He can't do something". However unlikely, the fact God has advocated this is to deny the Christian God of the bible and the bible itself. She obviously feels she made the right decision based on her conviction, even if you and I disagree with her action. The woman pastor sinned out of ignorance but if she's a true believer and accepts Christ as her Savior, you are in no position of denying Christ's blood from atoning for her sin.

 

[PennEd]

Actually, I was absolutely correct in that God has commanded and call His children to kill children and infants. The reasoning is something man tries to make sense of to "justify" God's actions that we generally think would be cruel and unusual. The reasoning for why God commands something is less important than the actual obedience to the law. If he said "Don't drink Kool Aid", we don't say, "God said not to drink Kool Aid because it has sugar in it and sugar is bad". Granted, sugar isn't good for you, but the reasoning for why God commanded us not to drink Kool Aid has less to do about sugar and more to do with our obedience to His word. That is the story of God testing Abraham. It was a test of obedience to his word. You're trying to make this about something that it's not.

I'm also not sure who is "advocating" the killing of unborn babies. Let me get this straight... because I refuse to condemn this woman and blast her christianhood when we don't have all the facts, I'm "advocating" killing the unborn? Ha... Indeed, God have mercy on us all.

God HAD. PAST tense instructed to kill every man woman and child. And the reason IS important. God is NOT allah, who is capricious, and fickle.

The point stands, and hasn't been, nor can be refuted, that if the unborn baby is a human being, why does someone have the authority to murder it, unless that authority comes from the Almighty? Where does God give ANYONE the authority to murder unborn children?

 

[Smoke]

God HAD. PAST tense instructed to kill every man woman and child. And the reason IS important. God is NOT allah, who is capricious, and fickle.

The point stands, and hasn't been, nor can be refuted, that if the unborn baby is a human being, why does someone have the authority to murder it, unless that authority comes from the Almighty? Where does God give ANYONE the authority to murder unborn children?

You actually help make my point. God "has", past tense, instructed to man to kill infants and children. I'm not saying the reason ISN'T important, I'm saying obedience to His commandment is far more important than for His children to "make sense" of whatever He commands. Nevertheless, there is a clear precedent of where God "has" made this commandment, however doubtful we are that He will do it again.

I haven't refuted the point that the unborn baby is a human being. The only authority that could justifiably take the life of the unborn child is God the Father himself. Now, I'm very comfortable saying I don't think He did, however, I'm not putting God in a box... I don't know what He told this woman. Worst case scenario, the woman sinned out of ignorance, I'm confident the blood of Jesus Christ makes her clean again.

 

[OathKeeper]

Don’t believe the propaganda that this woman actually does deliver. She works for one of the most politically driven churches in America. They actively promote radical left wing ideologies, regardless of whether or not they are scripturally sound.

The church has a long history of being politically motivated towards liberal and cultural mainstream agendas. They even have an active LGBT ministry in the church. They seem to be more inclined to preach what left wing ideology teaches, rather than what the Bible teaches to be righteous and moral.

Below is a Wiki link to the church that Amy Butler works for.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riverside_Church

Here’s an example of Amy Butler addressing religious leaders in Washington D.C. You can get an idea of how her (and the church that she works for), always try and push their agendas…even with voting. Below is a YouTube link to just one example. In it she says…“We will vote, we will make climate a top issue whenever we vote.”

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0mzPt4Gags

Don’t be fooled by the “this makes you think” story that Amy Butler is telling you. It is nothing more than an attempt to get into the hearts and minds of Christians for a particular political agenda. Trust in what you read in scripture, and do what you know is morally right and written on your hearts.

 

[Utah]

Actually, I was absolutely correct in that God has commanded and call His children to kill children and infants. The reasoning is something man tries to make sense of to "justify" God's actions that we generally think would be cruel and unusual. The reasoning for why God commands something is less important than the actual obedience to the law. If he said "Don't drink Kool Aid", we don't say, "God said not to drink Kool Aid because it has sugar in it and sugar is bad". Granted, sugar isn't good for you, but the reasoning for why God commanded us not to drink Kool Aid has less to do about sugar and more to do with our obedience to His word. That is the story of God testing Abraham. It was a test of obedience to his word. You're trying to make this about something that it's not.

I'm also not sure who is "advocating" the killing of unborn babies. Let me get this straight... because I refuse to condemn this woman and blast her christianhood when we don't have all the facts, I'm "advocating" killing the unborn? Ha... Indeed, God have mercy on us all.

You keep going back to Abraham. We live in the age of grace. Christ was the last child to be slain by God's Command. That's reality. I'm gathering that you love the Lord, and for that I rejoice, but you've been spoon fed too much political correctness and its blurred your insight to God's desires for us.

 

[Utah]

Then I would invite you to follow the one true God, the God of the Holy Bible.

I believe the bible to be the word of God. The God I serve HAS advocated the killing of infants and children. Granted, His reasoning and calling for it may seem unnecessary in the new covenant, but I refuse to put God in a box and say "He can't do something". However unlikely, the fact God has advocated this is to deny the Christian God of the bible and the bible itself. She obviously feels she made the right decision based on her conviction, even if you and I disagree with her action. The woman pastor sinned out of ignorance but if she's a true believer and accepts Christ as her Savior, you are in no position of denying Christ's blood from atoning for her sin.

First and foremost, always and forever, Jesus Christ is my Lord and Savior, and with respect to all but apologies to no one I proclaim the saving grace of Jesus Christ alone, for without Hom, no one gets to the Father.

How's that for faith in Jesus?

Hope you approve because I know God does.

 

[Utah]

You actually help make my point. God "has", past tense, instructed to man to kill infants and children. I'm not saying the reason ISN'T important, I'm saying obedience to His commandment is far more important than for His children to "make sense" of whatever He commands. Nevertheless, there is a clear precedent of where God "has" made this commandment, however doubtful we are that He will do it again.

I haven't refuted the point that the unborn baby is a human being. The only authority that could justifiably take the life of the unborn child is God the Father himself. Now, I'm very comfortable saying I don't think He did, however, I'm not putting God in a box... I don't know what He told this woman. Worst case scenario, the woman sinned out of ignorance, I'm confident the blood of Jesus Christ makes her clean again.

God is not commanding anyone to kill their babies. Period. Stop with your stupidity. Proclaiming God's covenant of grace is not putting God in s box. Again, stop with your stupidity. Me beginning to thinks you're a left wing troll. A Christian, but a left wing spoon fed troll nonetheless.

 

[PennEd]

You actually help make my point. God "has", past tense, instructed to man to kill infants and children. I'm not saying the reason ISN'T important, I'm saying obedience to His commandment is far more important than for His children to "make sense" of whatever He commands. Nevertheless, there is a clear precedent of where God "has" made this commandment, however doubtful we are that He will do it again.

I haven't refuted the point that the unborn baby is a human being. The only authority that could justifiably take the life of the unborn child is God the Father himself. Now, I'm very comfortable saying I don't think He did, however, I'm not putting God in a box... I don't know what He told this woman. Worst case scenario, the woman sinned out of ignorance, I'm confident the blood of Jesus Christ makes her clean again.

1st off, what does God's commands to Israel, to kill the inhabitants of the promised land, because the Lord knew they would contaminate His people with false Idol worship to to the exact gods that DO demand infant murder, namely Molech, have to do with this woman murdering her baby?

Also, numerous times, myself and others have said that this sin the woman committed, doesn't mean she is lost, or Christ's blood doesn't cover her's, and everyone elses sin. Why do you keep erecting this strawman argument?

The point is, she is not only saying her sin needs no repenting, and that it's not sin at all, but also PROMOTING this sin to other women.

 

[Smoke]

God is not commanding anyone to kill their babies.

I never said he was, only that he HAS biblically, and that I don't know what He told the woman pastor.

Stop with your stupidity. Proclaiming God's covenant of grace is not putting God in s box.

Of course it's not... but stating God "couldn't" or "wouldn't" when he already has in the past IS putting God in a box. Don't do it.

I've only ever said the blood of Jesus Christ covers her sin if she is a true believer and she did in fact sin out of ignorance.

Again, stop with your stupidity. Me beginning to thinks you're a left wing troll. A Christian, but a left wing spoon fed troll nonetheless.

I don't doubt you'd presume to know my political standings even though you're ignorant of my personal beliefs. You've already took away the pastors christianhood without knowing all the facts. You've already assumed I was an abortion apologist when I stated Christ's atonement covers our sins that we make in error. What you think of me is of little importance when you show a history of verbally attacking people who differ from you in this thread. You can be an internet warrior and talk tough, but it's not going to make your beliefs better or holier than mine. We accept the same Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior...

 

[Smoke]

1st off, what does God's commands to Israel, to kill the inhabitants of the promised land, because the Lord knew they would contaminate His people with false Idol worship to to the exact gods that DO demand infant murder, namely Molech, have to do with this woman murdering her baby?

Also, numerous times, myself and others have said that this sin the woman committed, doesn't mean she is lost, or Christ's blood doesn't cover her's, and everyone elses sin. Why do you keep erecting this strawman argument?

The point is, she is not only saying her sin needs no repenting, and that it's not sin at all, but also PROMOTING this sin to other women.

You either don't know what a strawman argument is or you're ignorant (uninformed) that people have already said she can't be a christian because of what she did. It's not a strawman to address that fact, no more than it was a strawman when I pointed out that you can't ignore portions of her post and assuming there was an "overriding" reason for why she made her decision. It's dishonest and unfair.

If she believes she is no need of being forgiven for her choice, the atonement covers that sin. How many times do we sin out of ignorance? We don't even know we sinned... but if we accept Christ as Savior and ask him to remove all sin, even the ones we aren't aware of, the ones we do out of ignorance, He will forgive us. If you don't believe this, then we have fundamental beliefs of the atonement of Jesus Christ/grace.

 

[Elizabeth619]

Luke 12:47-48 shows us that even those who sin out of ignorance are still held accountable. The punishment will be less than an intentional sin but still accountable

 

[PennEd]

You either don't know what a strawman argument is or you're ignorant (uninformed) that people have already said she can't be a christian because of what she did. It's not a strawman to address that fact, no more than it was a strawman when I pointed out that you can't ignore portions of her post and assuming there was an "overriding" reason for why she made her decision. It's dishonest and unfair.

If she believes she is no need of being forgiven for her choice, the atonement covers that sin. How many times do we sin out of ignorance? We don't even know we sinned... but if we accept Christ as Savior and ask him to remove all sin, even the ones we aren't aware of, the ones we do out of ignorance, He will forgive us. If you don't believe this, then we have fundamental beliefs of the atonement of Jesus Christ/grace.

Ummm... yeah, I think you are cornering the market on ignorance. You just erected another strawman. Where did I say she can't be a Christian?

You keep evading the ONLY pertinent question. If an unborn baby is a human being, why does this, or any other woman, get the authority to destroy her?

 

[Smoke]

Luke 12:47-48 shows us that even those who sin out of ignorance are still held accountable. The punishment will be less than an intentional sin but still accountable

Absolutely! Great scripture sister!

If the woman's heart was to defy God and she had a murderous heart about wanting to rid her body of the "inconvenient" child growing inside of her, she would be in even more hot water. Even then, she still has an opportunity to be made clean again through the atonement of Christ.

If the woman's heart was to protect her daughter from experience excruciating pain followed by her imminent death, protect her own life to mother her other children, and because she thought God wanted her to do... then she would receive "fewer blows".

Only God knows her heart. Only God has all the details. None of us are capable of judging another perfectly in the manner Christ has. Thanks for reminding us of that scripture.

 

[Smoke]

Ummm... yeah, I think you are cornering the market on ignorance. You just erected another strawman. Where did I say she can't be a Christian?

You keep evading the ONLY pertinent question. If an unborn baby is a human being, why does this, or any other woman, get the authority to destroy her?

I never said you said that... I said people have already stated she can't be a christian in this thread. Reread... I know you omit portions of posts and fabricate "overriding" reasons... but if you stop doing that and look at some of the posts in this thread, you'll know people have taken her christianhood away (or tried to anyways).

I answered the question... I can't make you read what I wrote. If you're ignorant of my answer, I'll answer it so you can be informed yet again. Only God can justifiably take the life of the unborn. The question is, did God approve of her decision? While it's possible He did, I doubt it. I won't condemn her or take her christianhood away because I'm ignorant (uninformed) to the full story... because I'm incapable of judging perfectly... because I don't know what God may have told her. If you want to put God in a box and say "God would/wouldn't ever do" something, by all means. We can agree to disagree on that.

 

[PennEd]

I never said you said that... I said people have already stated she can't be a christian in this thread. Reread... I know you omit portions of posts and fabricate "overriding" reasons... but if you stop doing that and look at some of the posts in this thread, you'll know people have taken her christianhood away (or tried to anyways).

I answered the question... I can't make you read what I wrote. If you're ignorant of my answer, I'll answer it so you can be informed yet again. Only God can justifiably take the life of the unborn. The question is, did God approve of her decision? While it's possible He did, I doubt it. I won't condemn her or take her christianhood away because I'm ignorant (uninformed) to the full story... because I'm incapable of judging perfectly... because I don't know what God may have told her. If you want to put God in a box and say "God would/wouldn't ever do" something, by all means. We can agree to disagree on that.

I can feel my flesh wanting to lash out at you for bringing nastiness and dissension to the CC board. So my best course of action is to put you on ignore and pray the Lord softens your heart, and reduces the desire for attention you seem to crave. Not to mention that for being here for all of a week, you might want to shelve that pride.

The idea that God may have directed this woman to murder her own child is so twisted and abhorrent, and really an attack against His character, that true prayer and introspection is probably in order for you.

Have a blessed day!

 

[PinkDiamond]

I never said you said that... I said people have already stated she can't be a christian in this thread. Reread... I know you omit portions of posts and fabricate "overriding" reasons... but if you stop doing that and look at some of the posts in this thread, you'll know people have taken her christianhood away (or tried to anyways).

I answered the question... I can't make you read what I wrote. If you're ignorant of my answer, I'll answer it so you can be informed yet again. Only God can justifiably take the life of the unborn. The question is, did God approve of her decision? While it's possible He did, I doubt it. I won't condemn her or take her christianhood away because I'm ignorant (uninformed) to the full story... because I'm incapable of judging perfectly... because I don't know what God may have told her. If you want to put God in a box and say "God would/wouldn't ever do" something, by all means. We can agree to disagree on that.

I have zero reservations stating my opinion in black and white concerning this woman's Christianity. I don't have a negative opinion of her for having the abortion. She could be forgiven for that. I absolutely think her stance on abortion and political advocacy for abortion is shameful and as such shows she has zero regard for her own testimony, no respect for God, and has made a mockery out of her calling. She is encouraging and justifying sin. I would not want to be in her shoes when she has to answer to God for how she used her position within the church to advance his kingdom. Make no mistake the Scripture is clear that ministers are held to a higher standard than others and will be held accountable for how they led the flock. To encourage sin as a minister will not be deemed a trivial matter. It is up to God whether she has true salvation, but she will have to answer for this compromising stand she publicly took

And, make no mistake the rest of us will have to answer for our compromise as well. If we make a habit of defending sin and justifying sin with zero regard for scripture or the feelings of God on these issues, we will have much to feel shame and sorrow for. Attributing murder to the character of God is so offensive. This woman never even claimed to have been told by God to have an abortion. Even her mind didn't go there.

 

[Smoke]

I can feel my flesh wanting to lash out at you for bringing nastiness and dissension to the CC board. So my best course of action is to put you on ignore and pray the Lord softens your heart, and reduces the desire for attention you seem to crave. Not to mention that for being here for all of a week, you might want to shelve that pride.

The idea that God may have directed this woman to murder her own child is so twisted and abhorrent, and really an attack against His character, that true prayer and introspection is probably in order for you.

Have a blessed day!

If what I'm saying has been taken as "nastiness" or "dissension", I sincerely apologize. I wasn't trying to be nasty when I pointed out how you ignored portions of the woman's post and that you fabricate an "overriding reason". I was stating a fact that she clearly gave a multitude of reasons for why she made her decision without ever saying there was an overriding reason. You conveniently missed the posts where people discredited her christianhood because of her decision. You ignored my answer specifically to you that answered the question you asked me 2 or 3 times.

If you are not mentally strong enough to correspond civilly with a brother in Christ over topics you disagree on, then by all means, put me on ignore. I would even advise to leave any news/political/religious forum as there will be many people who disagree with you. I would hope you could learn temperament and have more mental maturity but I respect your decision if you decide to put me on ignore.

Have a blessed day to you too, brother!

 

[Susanna]

I don't get why people are getting so hot tempered. This is, after all, just an internet forum, so hold your horses and keep it civil.

 

[Smoke]

I don't get why people are getting so hot tempered. This is, after all, just an internet forum, so hold your horses and keep it civil.

Exactly right sister. In my short time here I've noticed a pattern of a couple people becoming internet warriors to anyone who disagrees with them civilly. Perhaps it's pride... perhaps it's miscommunication... regardless, we all accept Christ as our Savior and because of that we are brothers and sisters. As brothers and sisters, we shouldn't have a problem agreeing to disagree civilly.