Can the Trinity be Biblically proven?

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jaybird88

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valiant said:
They baptised in the NAME of Jesus which was YHWH, Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
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bible says Jesus it does not say Father, Son, etc etc all names the same so either will do

There ARE no texts pre-Rome. The church in Rome was founded by Pentecost returnees.
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no pre rome text because rome destroyed them all. i remember the rome that killed Jesus, the 12, st Paul, burned down the Lords temple and much more. pre Christian, post Christian makes no difference, i dont trust them. if i lived in the days of the philistines and they took over my town, kidnapped everyone, burned all our holy scriptures, murdered all our priest, and then told us all that they were the new mouth and church chosen to speak for the Lord, i wouldnt believe them, would you?
 
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bluto

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I don't get it jaybird. Since Jesus Christ is identified as God in numerous places and so is the Father and the Holy Spriit identified as God and yet there is only "ONE" why are you denying the obvious right in front of your eyes? And btw, in what respect is Jesus, the Father and the Holy Spirit are the one God? And I've asked this question hundreds of times? Please give me an example of a son that does not share the same nature as its father? :eek:

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
 
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garee

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Mar 28, 2016
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valiant said:
Not in the same way as God the Father. God the Father has 'produced' no children. The titles of Father and Son indicate the closeness of relationship
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I view them as two attributes of one God. God is supernatural (without a beginning) He has no mother or father. He remains without form.

John 10:30 I and my Father are one.
 
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bluto

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Aug 4, 2016
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garee said:
I view them as two attributes of one God. God is supernatural (without a beginning) He has no mother or father. He remains without form.

John 10:30 I and my Father are one.
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In what respect garee are the Father and the Son one according to John 10:30? :eek:

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
 
J

jaybird88

Guest
#1,285
#1,285
bluto said:
I don't get it jaybird. Since Jesus Christ is identified as God in numerous places and so is the Father and the Holy Spriit identified as God and yet there is only "ONE" why are you denying the obvious right in front of your eyes?
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this would be because my eyes do not ignore so many scriptures that say otherwise. i see no point in bending, twisting and ignoring scriptures just to make a doctrine work that neither Jesus not the Father taught.

And btw, in what respect is Jesus, the Father and the Holy Spirit are the one God? And I've asked this question hundreds of times? Please give me an example of a son that does not share the same nature as its father? :eek:

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
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not sure what your asking, a cup can be full of the ocean yet the cup is not the ocean.
 
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bluto

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Ok jaybird, let me try it this way? We already know that God the Father is referred to as God in the Bible. We also know that Thomas at John 20:28 declared to Jesus Christ that Jesus Christ was his Lord and God. Thomas an orthodox Jews referred to Jesus Christ as God. Then at Acts 5:4, "While it remained unsold, did it not remain your own? And after it was sold, was it not under your control? Why is it that you have conceived this deed in your heart? You have not lied to men, BUT TO GOD."

Here again, the Apostle Peter refers to the Holy Spirit as God. So, can you kindly explain how I am bending, twisting and ignoring scriptures just to make a doctrine work that neither Jesus not the Father taught? Since statements/verses in the Bible are always true then why are you not accepting the teaching of those scriptures I just provided you?

And regarding your last sentence, "not sure what your asking, a cup can be full of the ocean yet the cup is not the ocean." This was directed to the other poster garee. However, I will answer your question anyway. And God the Father who has a Son will pass along His nature to that Son which is a universal law. So in the case of Jesus Christ He is the Son of God on His Fathers side and the Son of Man on His mothers side. In short, Jesus Christ has two natures, one of Deity and one of human. This is not hard to understand! And notice I did not even mention the trinity because there is no need. :eek:

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
 
Q

Quasar92

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Aug 19, 2016
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valiant said:
.

The Holy Spirit is NOT the Father of Our LORD Jesus Christ, nor is He the father of Jesus. Nowhere in these Scriptures is that stated. He worked upon Mary so that the everlasting Son could be born in her womb as man..
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The Scriptures reveal how they refute your continual attempt to rationalize away the truth they convey, exposing the man-made doctrine you are possessed in supporting! In addition to the facts posted in 1251, the Holy Spirit, who is God, producing Jesus by the virgin Mary, in Mt.1:20 and in Lk.1:35, review a few of the following Scriptures telling us the Father, the title of the Holy Spirit, is revealed as the Father of Jesus!

2 Samuel 7:14"I will be his father, and he will be my son. When he does wrong, I will punish him with a rod wielded by men, with floggings inflicted by human hands."

1 Chronicles 17:13
​"I will be his father, and he will be my son. I will never take my love away from him, as I took it away from your predecessor."

​Psalms 2:7
​"I will proclaim the LORD's decree: He said to me, "You are my son; today I have become your father."

Matthew 3:17
​"And a voice from heaven said, "This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased."

Mark 1:11
​"And a voice came from heaven: "You are my Son, whom I love; with you I am well pleased."

​Luke 3:22
​"and the Holy Spirit descended on him in bodily form like a dove. And a voice came from heaven: "You are my Son, whom I love; with you I am well pleased."

​Acts 13:33
​"he has fulfilled for us, their children, by raising up Jesus. As it is written in the second Psalm: "'You are my son; today I have become your father."

Hebrews 1:5
​"For to which of the angels did God ever say, "You are my Son; today I have become your Father"? Or again, "I will be his Father, and he will be my Son"?

Hebrews 5:5

"In the same way, Christ did not take on himself the glory of becoming a high priest. But God said to him, "You are my Son; today I have become your Father."


Quasar92
 
Q

Quasar92

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Aug 19, 2016
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valiant said:
God the Father and God the Holy Spirit are, along with the Son,One Being but three persona. The Father and the Son are NOT separate entities, they ARE distinct persona within the One Being.

Your verses do not say otherwise.
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Mt.1:20 and Lk.1:35 clearly refute the above attempt to sweep the Holy Spirit, [who's title is Father, as all men have who produce children of their own] who is also the Father of Jesus, under the carpet, is never going to alter the Scriptures that refute your being deceived into making two persons out of only one! God is the Holy Spirit AND Father of Jesus, as documented in 1251, and in Mt.1:20 and in Lk.1:35. Your continual contribution of personal opinion is completely meaningless.


Quasar92.
 
Z

ZacharyB

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Oct 10, 2015
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Quasar92 said:
You are NEVER going to prove a man made doctrine (the Triune Godhead?)
through God's Word, the Bible, Jesus or any of His disciples.
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The Word came down from heaven and became flesh
(to be "called" Jesus and the Son of God) ... courtesy of Gabriel in Luke 1.
IMO, the Word was/is the Second person of the Trinity.
And Revelation 19:5(?) says Jesus is the Word of God.
 
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valiant

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Mar 22, 2015
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#1,290
Originally Posted by valiant
Not in the same way as God the Father. God the Father has 'produced' no children. The titles of Father and Son indicate the closeness of relationship
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garee said:
I view them as two attributes of one God. God is supernatural (without a beginning) He has no mother or father. He remains without form.

John 10:30 I and my Father are one.
Click to expand...
So you think the Son is only an attribute of God. The Scripture makes clear that He is more than an attribute. The Father sent the Son to be the Savior of the world. How do you send an attribute? There were inter-personal relationships between the two. How do you have interpersonal attributes?

When Jesus said 'I and My Father are one' He meant one in aim and intention. See context.

In eternity there was a Threeness in the Godhead. One being but three persona. The titles Father and Son were given from human language to help explain their relationship. Though essentially equal, the One subordinated Himself to carry out the work of redemption. Thus it is said 'the Father sent the Son'. But the word Son indicated that He was of the same nature as the Father. That was what it was designed to teach. But it must not be pressed into saying that therefore the Father came first. For that was not so.
 
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bluto

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Aug 4, 2016
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Come on quasar, what in the world do these two verses have to do with Jesus as the Son of God?


"2 Samuel 7:14"I will be his father, and he will be my son. When he does wrong, I will punish him with a rod wielded by men, with floggings inflicted by human hands."

1 Chronicles 17:13
​"I will be his father, and he will be my son. I will never take my love away from him, as I took it away from your predecessor."

Why would Jesus need "flogging/punishment?" And how can the Father take His love away from His one and only begotten Son like the Father did from his predecessor? You sure are clueless on exegeting the scriptures from their context and applying them wrongly. :eek:

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
 
V

valiant

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Mar 22, 2015
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#1,292
Originally Posted by valiant
God the Father and God the Holy Spirit are, along with the Son,One Being but three persona. The Father and the Son are NOT separate entities, they ARE distinct persona within the One Being.

Your verses do not say otherwise
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Quasar92 said:
Mt.1:20 and Lk.1:35 clearly refute the above attempt to sweep the Holy Spirit, [who's title is Father, as all men have who produce children of their own] who is also the Father of Jesus, under the carpet,
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You are all mixed up. Show me where the Holy Spirit is ever called the Father of Jesus in the NT. You are suggesting that a god cohabited with a woman. That is PAGANISM.

What was being shown was how God came into the world as a man, and that this was made possible by the operation of the Spirit. He did NOT cohabit with Mary. You are disgusting.

Is never going to alter the Scriptures that refute your being deceived into making two persons out of only one!
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You are pathetic. God in eternity WAS ALWAYS one Being and three persona. Just because you can't understand it with your puny mind does not negate the fact. The Scripture reveals it clearly.


God is the Holy Spirit AND Father of Jesus, as documented in 1251, and in Mt.1:20 and in Lk.1:35.
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Rubbish. The eternal Son (John 3.16; 8.58) became Jesus, and was always distinct from the Father.

The personal Holy Spirit, was SENT by the Father in His Name? (John 14.25), How could He then BE the Father? You are utterly confused.
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bluto

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Aug 4, 2016
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valiant said:
So you think the Son is only an attribute of God. The Scripture makes clear that He is more than an attribute. The Father sent the Son to be the Savior of the world. How do you send an attribute? There were inter-personal relationships between the two. How do you have interpersonal attributes?

When Jesus said 'I and My Father are one' He meant one in aim and intention. See context.

In eternity there was a Threeness in the Godhead. One being but three persona. The titles Father and Son were given from human language to help explain their relationship. Though essentially equal, the One subordinated Himself to carry out the work of redemption. Thus it is said 'the Father sent the Son'. But the word Son indicated that He was of the same nature as the Father. That was what it was designed to teach. But it must not be pressed into saying that therefore the Father came first. For that was not so.
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Actually valiant when you said this: "When Jesus said 'I and My Father are one' He meant one in aim and intention. See context." it is true they are one in aim and intention but the immediate context is that the Son and the Father are equal in nature/essence. This is why at John 10:33 says, "The Jews answered Himn, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for BLASPHEMY; and because You, being a man MAKE YOURSELF GOD."

Jesus Christ has just said (vs29) that the sheep are equally safe in His hand and in His Father's hand. The power of the Son is equal to that of the Father, and while this the contextual point of reference, much more is implied especially from John 10:30 which literally reads, "I and the Father WE are one." One which is "hen" in Greek is a neuter number to indicate equality of essence, attributes, design, will, and work. So "one" asserst their unity of essence or nature as identical.

In fact the Jews ask Jesus at vs24, "How long will You keep us in suspense? If You are the Christ, tell us plainly." The point is the Jews understood Jesus correctly and there could be no mistaking His meaning. Look at John 10:31, "The Jews took up stones "AGAIN" to stone Him. Why? The "again" refers back to John 8:59, where the Jews at that time also attempted to stone Him for "BLASPHEMY." And what did Jesus say to warrant the blasphemy charge according to the Jews? John 8:58, "Jesus said to them, Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born I am." :eek: And keep up the good work valiant.

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
 
P

popeye

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No they are not "one being"

In rev,the son takes the scroll out of the Father's hand.

Two Beings.
 
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bluto

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Aug 4, 2016
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popeye said:
No they are not "one being"

In rev,the son takes the scroll out of the Father's hand.

Two Beings.
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Oh please popeye, was that before or after the tribulation? You need to pay attention because I specifically said they are one in "nature and essence." That is the whole point of John 10:30. So tell me, what did Jesus Christ say that caused the Jews to want to stone Him for blasphemy on numerous occasions? Two beings, ugh! :eek:

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
 
Q

Quasar92

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Aug 19, 2016
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bluto said:
Come on quasar, what in the world do these two verses have to do with Jesus as the Son of God?


"2 Samuel 7:14"I will be his father, and he will be my son. When he does wrong, I will punish him with a rod wielded by men, with floggings inflicted by human hands."

1 Chronicles 17:13
​"I will be his father, and he will be my son. I will never take my love away from him, as I took it away from your predecessor."

Why would Jesus need "flogging/punishment?" And how can the Father take His love away from His one and only begotten Son like the Father did from his predecessor? You sure are clueless on exegeting the scriptures from their context and applying them wrongly. :eek:

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
Click to expand...

Not only are those two verses reference to Father referring to His Son , Jesus but so are the following, in addition to Mt.120 and Lk.1:35 that fully reveal, God, who is the Holy Spirit, is also the Father of Jesus. The term Father is the same title all men have who have produced children of their own. God is the Holy Spirit, according to Jn.4:24 and 2 Cor.3:17-18 and declared to be Holy in numerous other passages, who is as such, ONE person, not two! See also Jn.14:10, where Jesus said His Father lives in Him doing His work, who can be none other than the Holy Spirit!, fully supporting the Father and the Holy Spirit to be ONE person.

2 Samuel 7:14"I will be his father, and he will be my son. When he does wrong, I will punish him with a rod wielded by men, with floggings inflicted by human hands."

1 Chronicles 17:13
​"I will be his father, and he will be my son. I will never take my love away from him, as I took it away from your predecessor."

​Psalms 2:7
​"I will proclaim the LORD's decree: He said to me, "You are my son; today I have become your father."

Matthew 3:17
​"And a voice from heaven said, "This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased."

Mark 1:11
​"And a voice came from heaven: "You are my Son, whom I love; with you I am well pleased."

​Luke 3:22
​"and the Holy Spirit descended on him in bodily form like a dove. And a voice came from heaven: "You are my Son, whom I love; with you I am well pleased."

​Acts 13:33
​"he has fulfilled for us, their children, by raising up Jesus. As it is written in the second Psalm: "'You are my son; today I have become your father."

Hebrews 1:5
​"For to which of the angels did God ever say, "You are my Son; today I have become your Father"? Or again, "I will be his Father, and he will be my Son"?

Hebrews 5:5
"In the same way, Christ did not take on himself the glory of becoming a high priest. But God said to him, "You are my Son; today I have become your Father."


Quasar02
 
Q

Quasar92

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Aug 19, 2016
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popeye said:
No they are not "one being"

In rev,the son takes the scroll out of the Father's hand.

Two Beings.
Click to expand...

Reference to God being the Holy Spirit and the Father is attested to by Jesus in Jn.14:10, where He said His Father lives in Him, doing His work. Which can be none other than the Holy Spirit. Jesus is clearly a separate entity as all fathers and sons are.


Quasar92
 
Q

Quasar92

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Aug 19, 2016
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bluto said:
Come on quasar, what in the world do these two verses have to do with Jesus as the Son of God?


"2 Samuel 7:14"I will be his father, and he will be my son. When he does wrong, I will punish him with a rod wielded by men, with floggings inflicted by human hands."

1 Chronicles 17:13
​"I will be his father, and he will be my son. I will never take my love away from him, as I took it away from your predecessor."

Why would Jesus need "flogging/punishment?" And how can the Father take His love away from His one and only begotten Son like the Father did from his predecessor? You sure are clueless on exegeting the scriptures from their context and applying them wrongly. :eek:

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
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Reference in 2 Sam.7:14 is how God allowed Jesus to be treated as a sacrifice in payment for the sins of the world.


Quasar92
 
Q

Quasar92

Banned
#1,299
Aug 19, 2016
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#1,299
ZacharyB said:
The Word came down from heaven and became flesh
(to be "called" Jesus and the Son of God) ... courtesy of Gabriel in Luke 1.
IMO, the Word was/is the Second person of the Trinity.
And Revelation 19:5(?) says Jesus is the Word of God.
Click to expand...

See posts 1251, 1267, 1288 and 1289 and keep in mind, Jesus did not become the Son of God until in Mt.1:20 and in Lk.1:35.


Quasar92
 
Q

Quasar92

Banned
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Aug 19, 2016
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valiant said:
You are all mixed up. Show me where the Holy Spirit is ever called the Father of Jesus in the NT. You are suggesting that a god cohabited with a woman. That is PAGANISM.

What was being shown was how God came into the world as a man, and that this was made possible by the operation of the Spirit. He did NOT cohabit with Mary. You are disgusting.



You are pathetic. God in eternity WAS ALWAYS one Being and three persona. Just because you can't understand it with your puny mind does not negate the fact. The Scripture reveals it clearly.




Rubbish. The eternal Son (John 3.16; 8.58) became Jesus, and was always distinct from the Father.

The personal Holy Spirit, was SENT by the Father in His Name? (John 14.25), How could He then BE the Father? You are utterly confused.
.
Click to expand...

The above is a prime case of those who have no viable Scriptural argument to support their meaningless personal opinion. When you do have, then come back and I'll chew them up with the Scriptures that refute you as I have been doing previously! Capiche!


Quasar92
 
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