Word of Faith - a Look at what the Bible says!

[LanceA]

So, what is it about WoF that people are so irked by?

I mean, I understand what you're saying. So you and I agree that sickness is not God's will. Does that mean, you and I believe that it is God's will to heal?

What is this hyper religiosity?! Sincere question, because I 'think' I'm classified WoF agreeing to the teachings of JP and I have no idea what is so wrong with it.

I think the biggest quirk people have concerning WoF is the name it claim it philosophy. There are groups that go overboard with "if I want it God will give it to me". This has been my understanding of some negative's toward WoF.

 

[AbigailZeke]

see, no one said they think sickness is God's will

that is part of the WOF disinformation package they learn in WOF ed 101

and it is said so often, that people like you believe it

yet no one has said that!

yes Jesus conquered death........hmmmmmmmmm

what does that mean to you?

do you expect you will not experience death?

I don't believe you understand the conversation

are you able to even acknowledge that NO ONE has stated we think God wants to make or makes people sick?

on the other hand, do you acknowledge that the very same God destroyed nations for the sake of His name because they were so demonic He wiped them out?

does the flood not ring a wake up call?

it's not really a complicated subject...however when folks reach conclusions based on really bad exegetical renderings, doctrine gleaned by taking verses out of context and slamming them together to create an amalgam of erroneous teaching and display hostility when questioned and twist words to make it sound like we hate God, then you will always end up NOT listening and falling for an unsubstantiated argument to the tune of 'we think God strikes people with cancer'

I believe God heals...I have seen it for myself...and I believe in the gifts...what I don't believe in, is the hyper religiosity that condemns everyone but those it agrees with

the worst sort of errors occur in church because that is where the devil attacks the hardest

I know God destroyed nations but I don't believe it was just for His Name's sake. I mean, yes, He is God, and under the law, gentiles were condemned (heck, everyone was condemned except the one who found 'favour' in His eyes (Noah). He did it for His people, for redemption (Jesus) to come. The flood is just one example of the many times God preserved the seed of Eve (Gen 3:15). This is an entirely different subject, though, so I won't expound on it here.

 

[AbigailZeke]

I think the biggest quirk people have concerning WoF is the name it claim it philosophy. There are groups that go overboard with "if I want it God will give it to me". This has been my understanding of some negative's toward WoF.

Ugh. Then they're talking about a different kind of WoF. The heretic type. Or rather, call it 'name it claim it' that's easier to classify.

But if these guys know WoF so well, how is it then that some of what they call WoF believers also believe in God's sovereignty. I mean, that is obviously contrary to 'name it claim it.' Either these people who follow that kind of WoF are blinded (or slow in understanding), or the term WoF is completely misunderstood, or rashly labeled on someone without even knowing what they're talking about.

I wonder about this because some preachers I listen to are labelled WoF, yet, I never heard them do the name it claim it stuff. They do teach that if they want something (not talking about healing, as healing is an entirely different subject), for example, like material stuff, there's this "if the want/desire is from God, He will provide" - and this does not mean, going out soliciting for a new car because 'God will provide.'

How about this, if people really want to know WoF (name it claim it) to be able to rebuke them and lead people to the truth (which is the right thing to do), how about people do a little research.

TLDR: WoF is a largely confusing term applied (and misapplied) to different teachings, making them appear as one.

 

[Stephen63]

Ugh. Then they're talking about a different kind of WoF. The heretic type. Or rather, call it 'name it claim it' that's easier to classify.

But if these guys know WoF so well, how is it then that some of what they call WoF believers also believe in God's sovereignty. I mean, that is obviously contrary to 'name it claim it.' Either these people who follow that kind of WoF are blinded (or slow in understanding), or the term WoF is completely misunderstood, or rashly labeled on someone without even knowing what they're talking about.

I wonder about this because some preachers I listen to are labelled WoF, yet, I never heard them do the name it claim it stuff. They do teach that if they want something (not talking about healing, as healing is an entirely different subject), for example, like material stuff, there's this "if the want/desire is from God, He will provide" - and this does not mean, going out soliciting for a new car because 'God will provide.'

How about this, if people really want to know WoF (name it claim it) to be able to rebuke them and lead people to the truth (which is the right thing to do), how about people do a little research.

TLDR: WoF is a largely confusing term applied (and misapplied) to different teachings, making them appear as one.

It's not confusing when it's true definition is locked in.

Word of Faith (also known as Word-Faith or simply Faith) is a worldwide Christian movement; it teaches that Christians can access the power of faith or fear through speech. Its distinctive teachings are found on the radio, Internet, television, and in many Christian churches. The basic doctrine preached is that of wealth and health through the declaration of what the Bible (The word of God) said with regards to living wealthy and healthy (Neo-charismatic movement).

Evangelist E.W. Kenyon (1867–1948) is usually given credit as the originator of Word of Faith teaching.(ALWAYS INVESTIGATE THE FOUNDER OF A TEACHING!)
Kenyon's principal disciple was Kenneth Hagin Sr., the recognized "father" of the Word of Faith movement. Hagin (1917–2003) believed that it is God's will that believers would always be in good health, financially successful, and happy.
Hagin's principal disciple was Kenneth Copeland who, with his wife, Gloria, is the unofficial leader of the Word of Faith movement. While Copeland remains the leader of the Word of Faith movement, several newer mass media Word of Faith preachers have eclipsed him in popularity, viz., Joel Osteen, Benny Hinn, Joseph Prince and Joyce Meyer.

Teachings

The Word of Faith movement has many distinctive teachings including physical, emotional, financial, relational, and spiritual healing or prosperity for any who has the right belief-filled confession.[SUP][1][/SUP] The movement emphasizes choosing to speak the promises and provisions that the speaker wants, that is in agreement with the Bible, as an act of faith and agreement with God's plans and purposes. They believe this is what Jesus meant in Mark 11:22–23[SUP][bible 1][/SUP], when he said believers shall have whatsoever they say and pray with faith. The term word of faith itself is derived from the biblical passage Romans 10:8[SUP][bible 2][/SUP] which speaks of the word of faith that we preach.[SUP][2][/SUP]

 

[Stephen63]

CONTINUED.....

Prosperity

Word of Faith teaching holds that God wants his people to be prosperous, which includes finances, good health, good marriages and relationships, i.e. to live generally prosperous lives in all areas. Word of Faith teaches that God empowers his people (blesses them) to achieve the promises that are contained in the Bible.[SUP][5][/SUP] Because of this, suffering does not come from God, but rather, from Satan. As Kenneth Copeland's ministry has stated, the idea that God uses suffering for our benefit is considered to be "a deception of Satan" and "absolutely against the Word of God." [SUP][6][/SUP] Additionally, if someone is not experiencing prosperity, it is because they have given Satan authority over their lives. God will not do anything at all unless the person invites him to.[SUP][7][/SUP]
It is argued that Jesus and the apostles were financially wealthy,[SUP][8][/SUP] owning homes, having monetary resources and businesses. The following arguments have been offered for this claim:

1. Jesus' ability to travel without apparently working to earn a living for three years
2. References by Jesus and the apostles to owning homes[SUP][9][/SUP]
3. Jesus had a treasurer (Judas Iscariot)[SUP][9][/SUP]
4. Jesus consorting with the upper echelons of society
5. The businesses that each of the apostles apparently owned/worked in[SUP][10][/SUP]

This is contrary to the traditional view of Jesus, who is often viewed as being a poor, wandering teacher.[SUP][11][/SUP] Based on the concept that Jesus and his apostles were arguably wealthy, as well as the historical examples of his people having great wealth, and the promises for financial prosperity throughout the Old and New Testaments, Word of Faith proponents teach that modern believers also have access to the "blessing" and may also become financially wealthy.[SUP][12][/SUP] Teachers like Kenneth Copeland assert the concept of total prosperity is validated by the teachings of the Apostle John: "Beloved, I wish above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in health, even as thy soul prospereth" (3 John 2[SUP][bible 5][/SUP]). Copeland posits that “as the seeds of prosperity are planted in your heart, in your will and in your emotions...they eventually produce a great financial harvest."[SUP][13]

In other words, Prosperity teaching is core to the doctrine, & not an added branch of it.[/SUP]

 

[Stephen63]

continued.....

Faith and confession

Within Word of Faith teaching, a central element of receiving from God involves "confession". This doctrine is often referred to as "positive confession" or "faith confession" by practitioners. While similar, the teaching should not be confused with Norman Vincent Peale's positive thinking theology. Peale's teaching was marked by its focus on the individual, as evidenced by his oft-spoken statement, "Faith in God and believe in oneself".[SUP][14][/SUP] Noted Word of Faith teachers, such as Kenneth E. Hagin and Charles Capps, have argued that God created the universe simply by speaking it into existence (Genesis 1[SUP][bible 6][/SUP]), and that humans have been endowed with the ability (power) to speak things into existence. Thus, making a "positive confession" (by reciting a promise of scripture, for example), and believing that which God says, accesses the resurrection power that was released when Christ was raised from the dead Ephesians 1:19-20[SUP][bible 7][/SUP] Ephesians 3:20[SUP][bible 8][/SUP], which causes those things to come into fruition. This teaching is interpreted from Mark 11:22-23[SUP][bible 9][/SUP]. A more recent variant of positive confession is decree and declare.[SUP][15][/SUP] Word of Faith preachers have likened faith to a "force".[SUP][16][/SUP]
Likewise, according to Word of Faith teaching, "negative confession" can yield negative results, and hence believers should be conscious of their words. This is argued on the interpretation of Proverbs 18:21[SUP][bible 10][/SUP], "Life and death are in the power of the tongue, and they that love them will eat the fruit thereof", also Numbers 14:28[SUP][bible 11][/SUP], "...saith the Lord, as you have spoken in my ears, so will I do", among other scriptures.

 

[Stephen63]

continued.....

'Little gods' controversy

Many Word of Faith teachers have sought to emphasize the full meaning of the believer's status as a child of God (through Christ) by using phrases such as "little gods" to describe them, a practice that has garnered some criticism from some other segments of the Christian community. Kenneth Hagin wrote that God "made us in the same class of being that he is himself," and that the believer is "called Christ" because "that's who we are, we're Christ!"[SUP][25][/SUP] According to Hagin, by being "born again", the believer becomes "as much an incarnation as Jesus of Nazareth".[SUP][26][/SUP] Hagin like Kenyon reasons that humans are made in God’s image. Since God is spirit, then humans must essentially be spirit as well and ‘in God’s class’,[SUP][27][/SUP][SUP][28][/SUP] and thereby ‘gods’.[SUP][27][/SUP][SUP][29][/SUP] Kenneth Copeland says Adam was "not a little like God... not almost like God...",[SUP][30][/SUP]and has told believers that "You don't have a God in you. You are one." Based primarily on the Psalms 82:6[SUP][bible 12][/SUP], which says "I have said, Ye are gods and all of you, children of the Most High," this was also corroborated by Jesus making reference to this scripture in John 10:34[SUP][bible 13][/SUP].[SUP][31][/SUP] A common theme in Word of Faith preaching is that God created man as "an exact duplication of God's kind." (Hebrews 1:3[SUP][bible 14][/SUP], John 14:12[SUP][bible 15][/SUP], etc.)[SUP][32][/SUP] In all of this, there is no argument of man's ability to exist and operate independently of God, but rather, the emphasis is on what the believer can become in God.[SUP][33][/SUP]
Suffer the Children, a documentary highlighting some of the teachings of the Word of Faith movement, has a video clip of Creflo Dollar teaching the "little gods" doctrine to his congregation based on the notion that "everything reproduces after its own kind":[SUP][34][/SUP]

Dollar: "If horses get together, they produce what?"

Congregation: "Horses!"
Dollar: "If dogs get together, they produce what?"
Congregation: "Dogs!"
Dollar: "If cats get together, they produce what?"
Congregation: "Cats!"
Dollar: "So if the Godhead says 'Let us make man in our image', and everything produces after its own kind, then they produce what?"
Congregation: "gods!"

Dollar: "gods. Little "g" gods. You're not human. Only human part of you is this flesh you're wearing."​

 

[Stephen63]

continued.....

The promulgation of this teaching is one of the most contentious doctrines to its critics, who consider it heresy. Mormonscholar Stephen E. Robinson, whose religion, citing the Bible and primitive church fathers, teaches that man can becomegods after eons of exaltation, has declared the "little gods" teaching heretical.[SUP][35][/SUP][SUP][36][/SUP] Conversely, mainstream Christianity regards this Mormon teaching as heretical as well, and entirely disputes any purported biblical basis for the Mormon view. Many Evangelical critics have asserted that the "little gods" teaching is, in fact, cultic; Hank Hanegraaff, for example, contends the 'little gods' doctrine is on a par with the teaching of the Maharishi Mahesh Yogi and Jim Jones.[SUP][37][/SUP] Justin Peters, whose first encounter with Word of Faith doctrine came at the age of 16 when a faith healer "slayed [him] in the spirit" in an attempt to cure his cerebral palsy, states in A Call for Discernment that the reason the Word of Faith movement holds so tenaciously to "health and wealth" tenets is because of the "little gods" teaching: "A god should never be sick, and a god should never be poor."[SUP][38][/SUP] In response, Word of Faith defenders have claimed the teaching is simply underscoring the biblical view of the believer's "true identity in Christ".

Critics, such as Christian apologist and CARM founder Matt Slick and Bible critique author W. Gary Phillips, believe referencing scriptures Psalms 82:6 and John 10:34, where it is said that men are gods, is using these Scriptures out of context.[SUP][39][/SUP] The biblical application of these verses is addressed to the Judges of Israel where they were called gods, not because they were divine, but because they represented the true and only God when they judged the people. The Hebrew and Greek words used in both Scriptures for "gods" can also be applied to magistrates and used to describe someone as "mighty".[SUP][40]

[/SUP]When a Mormon says it's heresy, that's saying something!!

 

[AbigailZeke]

Sorry Stephen, but your definition of WoF sounds exactly like the law of attraction.

Don't misunderstand, I am against law of attraction as well, and certainly against 'name it claim it.'

 

[LanceA]

continued.....

The promulgation of this teaching is one of the most contentious doctrines to its critics, who consider it heresy. Mormonscholar Stephen E. Robinson, whose religion, citing the Bible and primitive church fathers, teaches that man can becomegods after eons of exaltation, has declared the "little gods" teaching heretical.[SUP][35][/SUP][SUP][36][/SUP] Conversely, mainstream Christianity regards this Mormon teaching as heretical as well, and entirely disputes any purported biblical basis for the Mormon view. Many Evangelical critics have asserted that the "little gods" teaching is, in fact, cultic; Hank Hanegraaff, for example, contends the 'little gods' doctrine is on a par with the teaching of the Maharishi Mahesh Yogi and Jim Jones.[SUP][37][/SUP] Justin Peters, whose first encounter with Word of Faith doctrine came at the age of 16 when a faith healer "slayed [him] in the spirit" in an attempt to cure his cerebral palsy, states in A Call for Discernment that the reason the Word of Faith movement holds so tenaciously to "health and wealth" tenets is because of the "little gods" teaching: "A god should never be sick, and a god should never be poor."[SUP][38][/SUP] In response, Word of Faith defenders have claimed the teaching is simply underscoring the biblical view of the believer's "true identity in Christ".

Critics, such as Christian apologist and CARM founder Matt Slick and Bible critique author W. Gary Phillips, believe referencing scriptures Psalms 82:6 and John 10:34, where it is said that men are gods, is using these Scriptures out of context.[SUP][39][/SUP] The biblical application of these verses is addressed to the Judges of Israel where they were called gods, not because they were divine, but because they represented the true and only God when they judged the people. The Hebrew and Greek words used in both Scriptures for "gods" can also be applied to magistrates and used to describe someone as "mighty".[SUP][40]
[/SUP]When a Mormon says it's heresy, that's saying something!!

Can I ask where you got your information from. I don't see where you copy and pasted your info from. Thanks

 

[HisHolly]

Actually KC and KH did not agree on some things. Sure KC went to his meetings but to say he was his principal disciple, I disagree.. Others you folks never mention spent far more time with KH.

It's not confusing when it's true definition is locked in.

Word of Faith (also known as Word-Faith or simply Faith) is a worldwide Christian movement; it teaches that Christians can access the power of faith or fear through speech. Its distinctive teachings are found on the radio, Internet, television, and in many Christian churches. The basic doctrine preached is that of wealth and health through the declaration of what the Bible (The word of God) said with regards to living wealthy and healthy (Neo-charismatic movement).

Evangelist E.W. Kenyon (1867–1948) is usually given credit as the originator of Word of Faith teaching.(ALWAYS INVESTIGATE THE FOUNDER OF A TEACHING!)
Kenyon's principal disciple was Kenneth Hagin Sr., the recognized "father" of the Word of Faith movement. Hagin (1917–2003) believed that it is God's will that believers would always be in good health, financially successful, and happy.
Hagin's principal disciple was Kenneth Copeland who, with his wife, Gloria, is the unofficial leader of the Word of Faith movement. While Copeland remains the leader of the Word of Faith movement, several newer mass media Word of Faith preachers have eclipsed him in popularity, viz.,Joel Osteen, Benny Hinn, Joseph Prince and Joyce Meyer.

Teachings

The Word of Faith movement has many distinctive teachings including physical, emotional, financial, relational, and spiritual healing or prosperity for any who has the right belief-filled confession.[SUP][1][/SUP] The movement emphasizes choosing to speak the promises and provisions that the speaker wants, that is in agreement with the Bible, as an act of faith and agreement with God's plans and purposes. They believe this is what Jesus meant in Mark 11:22–23[SUP][bible 1][/SUP], when he said believers shall have whatsoever they say and pray with faith. The term word of faith itself is derived from the biblical passage Romans 10:8[SUP][bible 2][/SUP] which speaks of the word of faith that we preach.[SUP][2][/SUP]

 

[Stephen63]

Sorry Stephen, but your definition of WoF sounds exactly like the law of attraction.

Don't misunderstand, I am against law of attraction as well, and certainly against 'name it claim it.'

I'm pasting this to prove that these things weren't ADDED to WOF, they were there at the beginning!

There are some that don't believe everything stated here, but they still believe in a heretical doctrine, nevertheless.

 

[Stephen63]

Actually KC and KH did not agree on some things. Sure KC went to his meetings but to say he was his principal disciple, I disagree.. Others you folks never mention spent far more time with KH.

You got some names to help shed light on this? I would appreciate it.

 

[Grace777x70]

Sorry Stephen, but your definition of WoF sounds exactly like the law of attraction.

Don't misunderstand, I am against law of attraction as well, and certainly against 'name it claim it.'

Sometimes people "twist" what is actually being said to make it "appear" to be saying something else. I have seen that over and over again with people that don't agree with what someone believes. And sometimes what they are saying is true but it's just that they don't agree with it and so of course then it becomes heresy.

They take a "snippet" of a sermon or what was said and not show it in context and thus throw a whole new meaning to things. I could do the same for the apostle Paul. He said that "If we are beside ourselves...it is for you". 2 Cor. 5:13 - Greek word for "besides ourselves - = insane "

This means that Paul was saying that he was crazy in the head and so now we can tell all the world that Paul was insane - because he said so himself and scripture does not lie. See how we can distort things by not seeing the whole context of what was being said?

This is the self-proclaimed heretic hunter's favorite weapon.

 

[Stephen63]

continued.....

Jesus died spiritually

Jesus died spiritually (sometimes abbreviated JDS) is a view of the substitutionary atonement of Christ in which Jesus is considered to have suffered both physical death (on the cross) and spiritual death (in Hell) as the complete penalty for sin. In this view, spiritual death (defined as separation from God) is considered the ultimate penalty for original sin, and proponents assert that Jesus must have suffered the complete penalty for sin in order for his substitutionary sacrifice to be effective. Accordingly, those who support the JDS view also teach that Jesus was spiritually born again at his resurrection. Not all Word of Faith teachers believe that Jesus died spiritually. Many actually believe something similar to the Harrowing of Hell. The Word of Faith group does believe that the Harrowing of Hell was part of the plan of redemption. The Word of Faith movement does teach that Jesus himself was never a sinner and on the cross Jesus was forsaken by God for humanity paying the price for all sins.
E.W. Kenyon, a minister who is important to the Word of Faith movement and some other Pentecostal denominations popularized the idea that Jesus died spiritually in his books What Happened From The Cross To the Throne and Identification: A Romance In Redemption. It is claimed that Kenneth E. Hagin taught JDS ideas but such citations are singletons taken out of context.[SUP][41][/SUP] Kenneth Hagin's mentioned Jesus Harrowing Hell in The Name of Jesus (1978 edition) which has caused many to believe that he supported JDS. Kenneth Copeland does claim that Jesus suffered in Hell and that Christ's resurrection parallels the believer's born again experience. D.R. McConnell considers the teaching to be heresy.[SUP][42]

What we see is since it's inception, WOF has contained ALL OF THIS, not adding here & there, but FROM THE BEGINNING was in the doctrine, written by it's true founder & originator, EW Kenyon. It's been damnable doctrine from the beginning, & is still damnable doctrine.[/SUP]

 

[HisHolly]

Billye Brim, Keith Moore are the first 2 that come to mind. They worked directly with and for KHagin.. Yet no one mentions them..

You got some names to help shed light on this? I would appreciate it.

 

[HisHolly]

Both are fantastic!!

 

[Whassup]

Haha my teacher is the LORD!! Sounds so pious doesnt it?

So, who is your teacher... satan???

Why would anyone make fun of a Christian saying the Lord is their teacher?

Thank you for this comment... it explains a lot about you.

Well its funny because i use to believe this bull (i was pentecostal) until the Lord delivered me from it.

Actually, since you no longer accept and recognize God's promises concerning healing... this simply mean satan choked the Word of God out of your life where healing is concerned by presenting opposing view points that contradict what God says. Jesus explains this in Mark 4:13-20

Good luck with that...

 

[Billyd]

I wonder, then, how people could think that God's will is sickness. And if it is, can't the same logic be applied on death?

And yet Jesus conquered death. HMMMM

I have epilepsy. There is no medical cure for mine. I have prayed for God to cure it. Hundreds of people have prayed for God to cure it. I have been anointed and prayed for by the elders of my church. Still I carry my thorn. When I am weakest, God always returns me to these verses.

2 Corinthians 12:8 Three times I pleaded with the Lord about this, that it should leave me. 9 But he said to me, "My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness." Therefore I will boast all the more gladly of my weaknesses, so that the power of Christ may rest upon me. 10 For the sake of Christ, then, I am content with weaknesses, insults, hardships, persecutions, and calamities. For when I am weak, then I am strong.

In my weakness, God provides a medication that allows me to live seizure free for a period of time. Then the seizures return, and God reminds me that when I am weakest, with Him, I am strongest. A new medication is found, and the seizures are gone. You see, God doesn't want to heal me. He just wants me to be faithful.

 

[LanceA]

I have epilepsy. There is no medical cure for mine. I have prayed for God to cure it. Hundreds of people have prayed for God to cure it. I have been anointed and prayed for by the elders of my church. Still I carry my thorn. When I am weakest, God always returns me to these verses.

2 Corinthians 12:8 Three times I pleaded with the Lord about this, that it should leave me. 9 But he said to me, "My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness." Therefore I will boast all the more gladly of my weaknesses, so that the power of Christ may rest upon me. 10 For the sake of Christ, then, I am content with weaknesses, insults, hardships, persecutions, and calamities. For when I am weak, then I am strong.

In my weakness, God provides a medication that allows me to live seizure free for a period of time. Then the seizures return, and God reminds me that when I am weakest, with Him, I am strongest. A new medication is found, and the seizures are gone. You see, God doesn't want to heal me. He just wants me to be faithful.

Not saying this is your case but have you ever tried deliverance? Have you ever fasted concerning your healing?