Word of Faith - a Look at what the Bible says!

HisHolly · Nov 29, 2016

I get that. But it is possible that He has meaning beyond the layout as documented. Personal revealed words don't line up in others opinions so I quit saying them.. Revealed is just that.. Have to want it

nowyouseem033 said:

HisHolly · Nov 29, 2016

I do apologize. My English is sloppy.

nowyouseem033 · Nov 29, 2016

HisHolly said:

mine can be at times too. But its clear enough to understand.

HisHolly · Nov 29, 2016

I wasted my youth on my feelings and didn't care to educate myself. Now it's a process to learn all I never cared to. Sometimes to be proper while trying to be timely is aggravating.. I fear I'll lose my point while paying attention to grammar.. it is a task BC I don't know it well enough that it just comes to me like breathing. It's embarrassing but it is what it is for now

nowyouseem033 said:

followjesus · Nov 29, 2016

Angela53510 said:

If you wish to talk about opinions, please see the other thread which is going on right now. I want to keep this thread to discuss what the BIBLE says about the Word Faith teaching, and why the Bible says it is wrong.

Again, another copy and paste of something I already wrote, coming from a pamphlet called The Disease of the Health and Wealth Gospel by Gordon D. Fee. Gordon Fee is one of the top Bible and Greek scholars in the world. He is also Pentecostal, believes in healing and the gifts of the Spirit. But he does NOT believe in the distorted exegesis of the Bible, and how Health and Wealth teachers have twisted the Bible, as evident from so many posts in this thread.

As far as wealth, Gordon Fee doesn't have a kind word to say about it. It is totally a false doctrine. Having met numerous people who were fleeced by these evil men who preach unconditional wealth, it is not Biblical. I will not deal with it here, although if anyone wants to talk about it, in terms of what the Bible says, please feel free to post Bible verses on it. I do not believe in this false prosperity gospel and I would be willing to post the Scriptures that explain why. (I am NOT saying that God doesn't bless us, but again, it is not part of the atonement or the Bible!)

Regarding healing, Fee titles this chapter "The 'Gospel' of Perfect Health." First, he notes that physical and mental healing of human life is part of the redemptive activity of God. He believes in prayer for the sick, as I do! Christians are subject to decay and death in this present age, and healing is God's gracious activity in the body healed and is a sign of the future already at work in this present age.

If healing is supported by both the Bible and theology and praying in faith for the gracious healing of the sick, then where is the problem? What is the "disease" nature of the "gospel" of total health for Christians?

There are basically some biblical and theological distortions which insist:

1. that God wills perfect health and complete healing for every believer

2. that God has obligated Himself to heal every sickness for those who have faith (unless the sickness is a result of breaking God's "health" laws.)

Integral to this theology is the insistence that faith can "claim" such healing from God, and that any failure to be healed is not the fault of God, but of the one who has not had enough faith. Very often "claiming" healing means to "confess" it as done, even though the symptoms persists.

So the answer to why people are not healed, who have faith, has to lie not in the actual words of the Bible or God himself, but in the way the Bible is being interpreted. As with many half-truths, the "gospel" of perfect health sees to base itself on Scripture. However, the evangelists interpretation is faulty for the following reasons:

1. some poor, or flat-out wrong interpretations of key texts
2. some selective use of texts,
3. a failure to have a wholistic biblical view of things, and especially a failure to understand the essential theological framework of the New Testament writers.

As a result, they tend to repeat the Corinthian error and are unable to hear Paul's answers in 1 and 2 Corinthians as over and against themselves, although these evangelists are unwitting descendants of the false apostles of 2 Cor. 10-13!

"So to keep me from becoming conceited because of the surpassing greatness of the revelations, a thorn was given me in the flesh, a messenger of Satan to harass me, to keep me from becoming conceited. 8 Three times I pleaded with the Lord about this, that it should leave me. 9 But he said to me, “My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness.”Therefore I will boast all the more gladly of my weaknesses, so that the power of Christ may rest upon me. 10 For the sake of Christ, then, I am content with weaknesses, insults, hardships, persecutions, and calamities. For when I am weak, then I am strong." 2 Cor. 12:7-10

Basic hermeneutics demands the following things:

The aim of all biblical interpretation is the "plain meaning" of the text. This is the "original meaning", that the author plainly intended and that the original readers plainly understood. The Bible is indeed a book for all seasons, because it speaks directly out of our past to our present situation, it does so because it first spoke to them in their situation.

Therefore, the first task of interpretation is NOT to find out what it says to us, but what it originally said to them. God's Word to us is not a new word, never before discovered; rather it must be the very same word he originally spoke back there and then. This is the only legitimate Word to be heard in Scripture.

All this must be insisted upon, because the basic Biblical failure of the "perfect health" evangelists is the interpretation of their primary texts. They simply fail to do adequate exegesis which has to do with determining the meaning of the text in original context.

The arguments for perfect health as God's will for all believers are based on three sets of texts

a. Paul's statement that "Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law" Gal 3:14, coupled with Deuteronomy 28:21-22 where disease is one of the curses for disobedience of the law.

"The Lord will make the pestilence stick to you until he has consumed you off the land that you are entering to take possession of it. 22 The Lord will strike you with wasting disease and with fever, inflammation and fiery heat, and with drought and with blight and with mildew. They shall pursue you until you perish." Debt. 28:21-22

It is argued from these texts that sickness is a part of the curse of the law, from which Christ redeemed us from.

b. Isa. 53 and the citation of Isa. 53:4 in Matt 8:17 and Isa. 53:5 in 1 Peter 2:24. It is argued from these texts, especially from the change to the past tense in 1 Peter that healing is in the atonement in the same way as forgiveness. (Something that Undergrace has been ably defending!)

c. A whole host of texts that remind us that God honours faith eg. Matt 9:29, Mark 11:23-24, John 14:12; Hebrews 11:6; James 1:6-8

The first set of texts, (a above) can be quickly set aside. This is a typical example of a totally faulty "concordance" interpretation, which finds English "catch" words in various texts and then tries to make them all refer to the same thing. There is not even the remotest possibility that Paul was referring to the curses of Deuteronomy 28 when he spoke of "curse of the law." And "redemption" in Galatians has to do with one thing only - how does one have right standing with God - through faith (= trust in God's gracious acceptance and forgiveness for sinners), or by works of the law (=acceptance by obedience to prescribed rules)? Thus the Holy Spirit could scarcely have inspired a meaning of the text that is totally foreign to the point Paul is making in the context in Galatians.

It is also questionable whether one can rightly argue that the Bible teaches that healing is provided for in the atonement. Historic Pentecostalism does not see healing provided for in the atonement the same way as salvation. Healing is "provided for" because the "atonement brought release from the consequences of sin;" nevertheless, since "we have not yet received the redemption of our bodies" suffering and death are still our lot until the resurrection.

"Surely he has borne our griefs
and carried our sorrows;
yet we esteemed him stricken,
smitten by God, and afflicted.
5 But he was pierced for our transgressions;
he was crushed for our iniquities;
upon him was the chastisement that brought us peace,
and with his wounds we are healed.
All we like sheep have gone astray;
we have turned—every one—to his own way;
and the Lord has laid on him
the iniquity of us all." Isa. 53:4-6

While there are many texts that show that our sin has been overcome by Christ's death and resurrection, there is in fact no text that that explicitly says the same thing about healing, not even Isaiah 53 and its NT citations.

Matthew's use of Isa. 53:4 does not even refer to the cross, rather the clearly sees the text being fulfilled in Jesus earthly ministry. This is made certain by both the context and by his choice of Greek verbs in his own unique translation of the Hebrew (ἔλαβεν or elaben = he took; ἐβάστασεν or ebastasen = he removed.)

"ὅπως πληρωθῇ τὸ ῥηθὲν διὰ Ἠσαΐου τοῦ προφήτου λέγοντος· Αὐτὸς τὰς ἀσθενείας ἡμῶν ἔλαβεν καὶ τὰς νόσους ἐβάστασεν." Matt 8:17 Greek

"This was to fulfill what was spoken by the prophet Isaiah: “He took our illnesses and bore our diseases.” Matt 8:17 ESV

The citation of Isa. 53:5 in 1 Peter 2:24 on the other hand, does not refer to physical healing. The usage here is metaphorical, pure and simple! In context, in which slaves are urged to submit to their evil masters - even if it means suffering for it - Peter appeals to the example of Christ, which Christians slaves are to follow.

"He himself bore our sins in his body on the tree, that we might die to sin and live to righteousness. By his wounds you have been healed." 1 Peter 2:24 ESV

This appeal to Christ, beginning at verse 21, is filling with allusions and to citations of Isa. 53 all of which refers to Christ's having suffered unjustly as the source of the slave's redemption from sin. Thus Peter says:

"He himself bore our wounds" (Isa. 53:12) "that we might die to sin."

"By his wounds you have been healed" (Isa. 53:5) FOR you were as sheep going astray. (Isa. 53:6)

The allusions to both verses 5 and 6, joined by FOR (coordinate Conjunction) and referring to "sheep going astray" plus the change to the past tense, all make it abundantly clear that "healing" here is a metaphor for being restored to health from "the sickness of their sins!"

Such a metaphorical use would be natural for Peter, since sin as "wound" "injury" or "sickness" and the "healing" or such "sickness" are thorough going images in the Old Testament. See 2 Chron. 7:14; Psalm 6:2; Isaiah 1:5-6; Jerem. 30:12-13, 52:8-9; Nahum 3:19)

Furthermore , the Old Testament citations in 1 Peter rather closely follow the Septuagint (LXX or Greek translation of the OT) even when this translation differed from the Hebrew; and the Septuagint had ALREADY translated Isa. 53:4 metaphorically!

"He himself bore our sins" rather than "our sicknesses." I am sure Peter knew both versions and chose the LXX because he knew it was a better version for NT believers and their understanding of Isa. 53:4.

So my point!

Matt clearly saw Isa. 53:4 as referring to physical healing, but as a part of the Messiah's ministry, not the atonement. Peter, conversely, saw the "healing" in Isa. 53 as being metaphorical and thus referring to the healing of our sin sickness. Neither NT reference to healing sees the "healing" in Isa. 53 as referring to physical healing in the atonement.

But what did Isaiah himself intend??

The first reference is certainly metaphorical as the Septuagint, the Targums and Peter recognize. Israel was diseased! She was grievously wounded for her sins (Isa 1:6-7) Yet God would restore his people. There would come one who himself would suffer so as to deliver. Isaiah says of the Messiah "The punishment that brought us peace was upon him and by his wounds we are healed." Since physical disease was clearly recognized as a consequence of the Fall, such a metaphor could also pick up the literal sense and that is what Matthew picked up on.

The Bible therefore does, not explicitly teach that healing is provided for in the atonement. However, the NT does see the cross as the focus of God's redemptive activity.

As far as part c above, ultimately, these rely on a wrong interpretation that healing is part of the atonement. The argument for perfect health, or healing on demand, lies in the joining of healing to the atonement as the basis for demand, and therefore if God has provided for it, he must therefore heal on demand.

Since in fact, there is no connection of the atonement to healing, God is not obligated to provide healing on demand, although I do believe he heals when people pray and it is His will to heal, that he might be glorified.

Jesus has come to save you from your sins. That you can be sure of. God is real. But televangelist, Word Faith prophets, not at all! If you start reading the Bible from cover to cover, over and over yearly or more, you will get a very different theology than these sharks and false prophets paint. I urge everyone to get out a modern translation like ESV or HCSB and read it over and over again. That was part of what helped me heal - just reading the Word of God - in context, and fully! I've read the Bible over 40 times straight through, and most of the NT in Greek and much of the OT in Hebrew. (And the entire bible in French!) I assure you, there is nothing more glorious than feeding on the Word of God. God will minister to you daily as you seek his revealed Word in the Bible, rather than with internet preachers and false prophets.

Here is the verse God gave me that healed my soul in more than one way. It appears in Paul's chapter on justification, and that we all suffer - we live in a fallen world. It has comforted me more times than you can imagine!

"Not only that, but we rejoice in our sufferings, knowing that suffering produces endurance, 4 and endurance produces character, and character produces hope,5 and hope does not put us to shame, because God's love has been poured into our hearts through the Holy Spirit who has been given to us." Romans 5:3-5

amen really good post. I remember years back creflo dollar a disciple of kenneth copeland. teaching just absurd ideas like " Jesus taught more about money than He did the kingdom of God" and " people think Jesus was a poor vagabond, but he wasnt, Jesus rode a donkey thats was never ridden before" just complete distortions designed to support the health and wealth doctrine. I look now at rod parsley and see just where that doctrine has went, all the way to a place of Just clear heresy and unadulterated Greed, even now i cannot understand how any christian could fall for this doctrine. i suspect its because it appeals to self as do all false doctrines focus on self. this world we Live in is not our Home and we are promised many trials, struggles and thornes our place is to pray continually and submit to Gods will no matter our circumstance. God is well able to heal any disease, But He does not always do that and does not ever promise perfect Health or financial prosperity in the new covenant. in fact the new tells us that if we are blessed financially, then we are responsible for being generous to those in need. which strangely, the health and wealth doctrines are always void of, the directive to give all we are able to the poor. the more we have, the more we are to give. whether a poor man on the corner begging for a dollar or the rich man in the high rise penthouse, the heart is what the Kingdom of God is about, righteousness, peace and Joy in the spirit. the world worships money, christians are told " you cannot serve both moiney and God, you will love one and Hate the other, or serve one and despise the other.

Pauls thorn in my belief was an eye disease.

I plead with you, brothers and sisters, become like me, for I became like you. You did me no wrong.13As you know, it was because of an illness that I first preached the gospel to you, 14and even though my illness was a trial to you, you did not treat me with contempt or scorn. Instead, you welcomed me as if I were an angel of God, as if I were Christ Jesus himself. 15Where, then, is your blessing of me now? I can testify that, if you could have done so, you would have torn out your eyes and given them to me. "

also paul wrote with extra ordinarily large letters, which indicates a possible eye issue. and Pauls thorn was a hindrance to His ministry. im thinking when He was blinded, God left a remnant of that that possibly reoccured at times to keep paul humble and dependant on Gods provision. this is only my opinion though, not really a concrete scriptural teaching. Perfect Health will be a part of our new home, and is not at all guaranteed here and now.......

AbigailZeke · Nov 29, 2016

Oncefallen said:

Grace777x70 said:

I am torn. I can't talk about hyper grace (which is closely related to word of faith) in a way that 'supports' them even if I use the same bible as proof.

However, the opposing side (anti WoF, anti HG) can talk about the doctrine they believe in (and I, repeat, they believe in) using the same bible as proof simply because the admin believes in the same interpretation as them.

While I understand G7's post completely, I wanted to express my opinion (which I know, no one cares about), the website name is clearly misleading. Christianity covers a much wider subject than just most of orthodox Christianity.

In my almost 10 years here in CC, never have I felt out of place. Something tells me, however, that the exit is probably already waiting for me. xD

Cee · Nov 29, 2016

You weren't healed from the wounds of sin.
You died in sin. And were reborn in Christ.
Notice it says the "stripes of His Body".
This is called discerning His body.
And Paul links this to why people get sick and even die.
And this is the only place in NT Scripture that explains why people get sick and die.

You say things like, God doesn't promise healing. But He does. Continually. And then you point to experiences to disprove the continual promises of the Lord. I simply believe them and agree with them. Even if they don't make sense always to my natural mind.

C.

nowyouseem033 said:

Cee · Nov 29, 2016

If you're trying to disprove something, you're not being a Berean.
Bereans searched Scripture with great eagerness to prove things were true not false.
This might surprise you but several OT Scriptures were taken out context when the NT was written.
I've seen you explain away promise after promise under the "context" argument.
And then go on and on about how God doesn't promise healing because it doesn't fit your "simple hermaneutics".

Jesus: those who believe in me will do the works I did and greater.
- He doesn't say apostles.
- He points to healing miracles before saying this.

Now please explain that away for me using your context arguments.

Then please explain why Paul says people are sick for not discerning the Body.
Then please explain why James says: IF YOU ARE SICK... it doesn't say when, but if... get prayed over in faith... and YOU will be healed...

These are all promises. How many more do you want?

I am the Lord who heals you.
Whatever God is He is relentlessly.
He is also peace and provider and savior.
Does He only do those when He wants as well?

If so, why does He tell us that He wants us to have faith, and it's the only thing that pleases Him? How can you have faith if you can't even believe He will keep your promises?

Why does Jesus say He is a good Father who will give good gifts to those who ask...? And then points to the Holy Spirit as being given... Yet, you say things like the "gifts of healing" are not for today. On who's authority? If you're so interested in context where do you get that from?

There are plenty of promises. You either choose to see them and believe them or you don't.
And you've chosen to not believe them.
Which is fine, that's your choice.
But to sit in here and argue with people because they do have faith?
And then to poke fun at their Bible methods because you don't agree with them?
And then to ridicule someone because He points to Holy Spirit as his teacher?
Hmm.

C.

nowyouseem033 said:

Cee · Nov 29, 2016

No worries, Abigail.

I have seen plenty of posts about WoF and Hypergrace doctrine on these forums. Just because the admin team doesn't believe in it, I haven't seen any censorship besides threads that turn slanderous and attacking. I think they are doing an incredible job. In my opinion, I think your doctrinal freedoms are safe. So that exit might not be as close as you think.

AbigailZeke said:

Grace777x70 · Nov 29, 2016

I remember when I had no money for food. God said that He would provide for me. I didn't receive the food in a way that I thought it would come to me. This means because of my "experience" God does not provide for my needs.

I could go all through the bible and show scriptures where God's people had no food for a time to "prove" that God does not provide for us like He said He would.

Does this nullify the promises of God because "I" didn't get in my time frame what I thought I should?

Does my use of scripture in an attempt to "validate" my belief that God does not provide for me invalidate the truth of God's promise to provide for me? I say no. A thousand times NO! Let every man be found a liar and God be found to be true.

Personally I have seen abuses of each other from both sides of this issue of healing. We should be allowed to have the faith that we have without the name-calling and de-meaning attitudes of some towards those that believe differently.

Some try to "lord it over your faith" and they incorporate different methods but the attempted outcome is the same - spiritual manipulation and control.

Sometimes this behavior will not change and interacting with them only exacerbates the behavior and there is a good chance that we can get defiled in our minds from this as well.

If people are not being respectful of your viewpoint on this issue - just ignore them and give out the scriptures that you believe addresses issues and leave it in the Holy Spirit's hands.

Sometimes we just have to take the reviling as the Lord can always use every situation to show His goodness to us all. It is His goodness that leads us to repentance.

It's time for all of us to have respect for other's view's on some subjects and this does not mean we have to agree as we can agree to disagree and still remain respectful because we are the same body of Christ and this will stop the biting and devouring of one another.

In many cases the below scripture can apply to all of us.

Romans 14:22 (NASB)
[SUP]22 [/SUP] The faith which you have, have as your own conviction before God. Happy is he who does not condemn himself in what he approves.

garee · Nov 29, 2016

Not healing as a outward sign. Healing was never performed by the apostles in respect to men. God is not served and therefore does not heal with human hands.

The greater works were not attributed to outward men to begin with. We walk by faith not by sight. Men perform the works of God as He works in them to both will and do His good pleasure.

To attribute any healing to men is to make them into gods in the likeness of men.This blasphemes the Holy name by which we are called.

The healing that was shown was uses as a parable to represent the gospel .it’s an evil generation that looks for a sign. No sign gifts.
It’s simply a money making or pride seeking scam. God does not heal according to human hands.

The body of Christ is invisible .He was referring to a spiritual body made I up of many lively stones. Those bodies can be literal sick because of sin. (living in a body of death.)

He is of one mind and always does whatsoever His soul pleases. He performs healing constantly. He is just not bring any new revelation to verify one used to bring the gospel.

No he heals all of the creation and creature with the breath of life.. It’s when some call a a specific healing today, a miracle. All healing are miracles.

Miracles are simply miracles nothing more and nothing less. God is no longer bringing any new revelation to be used as a parable

garee · Nov 29, 2016

Good point. He can send a famine for hearing the word of God. And restore it by bringing manna. He is not served by human hands as if the kingdom of God was of this world and rather then walking by faith (the unseen) some look outwardly walking by sight after their experiences, using their experience to prove God obeyed their request.

Amen.

Grace777x70 · Nov 29, 2016

I believe God works through the "hands" of men in this New Covenant. I agree that we cannot "do them at will" that is operate in the gifts of the Holy Spirit. I believe in being led by the Holy Spirit because the gifts of the Spirit are given out as "he wills" - not us.

I also we believe we can pray in faith too as we walk in the knowledge that we do have. James talks about the "prayer of faith" when one calls for the elders of the church to pray for healing.

Sometimes we can have our own personal faith for ourselves but we only have limited authority in other people's lives - such as in a baby Christian's life - we can help them until they are old enough to stand on their own feet.

God uses "people and their hands" to show forth His good works and love and grace towards others.

Acts 19:11 (KJV)
[SUP]11 [/SUP] And God wrought special miracles by the hands of Paul:

Acts 28:8-9 (KJV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] And it came to pass, that the father of Publius lay sick of a fever and of a bloody flux: to whom Paul entered in, and prayed, and laid his hands on him, and healed him.

[SUP]9 [/SUP] So when this was done, others also, which had diseases in the island, came, and were healed:

Mark 16:20 (NASB)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] And they went out and preached everywhere, while the Lord worked with them, and confirmed the word by the signs that followed.

PeterJens · Nov 29, 2016

Genetic illness, born defects which occur from conception.

Where is Gods perfect form. If Gods will was always to deliver perfection with no difficulties
or when people come to faith, healing with no illness, there would be no walking problems, no
deformities, no need for glasses or hearing aids, no scars or marks from the past.

So this is not Gods will. It has never happened. No Gods will is gifts of grace to show his
abundant love despite our sin and rebellion, to show authority and power, and who can be trusted.

So healing in evangelism is powerful. Healing in time of great need and pain, where this will relieve
a situation and His people come asking the Lord for help.

But mostly the answer is no, things are as they should be, come to terms with it.

Now I would love to be told differently.

AbigailZeke · Nov 29, 2016

PeterJens said:

But you are being told differently! Oh how Jesus would have gathered us all like a hen gathers her chicks, but...

Anyway, isn't what you mention because this is a fallen world? Aren't deformities and born defects part of the curse?

LanceA · Nov 29, 2016

AbigailZeke said:

Exactly. This world wasn't meant to be as it is. Before the fall of man there wasn't sickness or disease.

AbigailZeke · Nov 29, 2016

LanceA said:

I wonder, then, how people could think that God's will is sickness. And if it is, can't the same logic be applied on death?

And yet Jesus conquered death. HMMMM

LaurenTM · Nov 29, 2016

AbigailZeke said:

see, no one said they think sickness is God's will

that is part of the WOF disinformation package they learn in WOF ed 101

and it is said so often, that people like you believe it

yet no one has said that!

yes Jesus conquered death........hmmmmmmmmm

what does that mean to you?

do you expect you will not experience death?

I don't believe you understand the conversation

are you able to even acknowledge that NO ONE has stated we think God wants to make or makes people sick?

on the other hand, do you acknowledge that the very same God destroyed nations for the sake of His name because they were so demonic He wiped them out?

does the flood not ring a wake up call?

it's not really a complicated subject...however when folks reach conclusions based on really bad exegetical renderings, doctrine gleaned by taking verses out of context and slamming them together to create an amalgam of erroneous teaching and display hostility when questioned and twist words to make it sound like we hate God, then you will always end up NOT listening and falling for an unsubstantiated argument to the tune of 'we think God strikes people with cancer'

I believe God heals...I have seen it for myself...and I believe in the gifts...what I don't believe in, is the hyper religiosity that condemns everyone but those it agrees with

the worst sort of errors occur in church because that is where the devil attacks the hardest

LanceA · Nov 29, 2016

AbigailZeke said:

I don't believe sickness was ever God's will. Because of the fall there is sickness and we just have to live with that fact. Sin entered the world when Man fell. This brought disease, death, sickness etc...So when Jesus sacrificed Himself for us it wasn't just for our Sin it was for everything else as well.

We can't go back to the world as it was before the Fall, only when Jesus returns will this happen. But, Salvation is so much more than allowing us into Heaven. It is doing the work of God on the earth. This means exactly what Scripture tells us to do.

Mark 16:15-18 (NLT)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] And then he told them, “Go into all the world and preach the Good News to everyone.
[SUP]16 [/SUP] Anyone who believes and is baptized will be saved. But anyone who refuses to believe will be condemned.
[SUP]17 [/SUP] These miraculous signs will accompany those who believe: They will cast out demons in my name, and they will speak in new languages.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] They will be able to handle snakes with safety, and if they drink anything poisonous, it won’t hurt them. They will be able to place their hands on the sick, and they will be healed.”

Even before this Jesus tells His disciples to do the same but only with the Jews. Clearly this is part of our walk with the Lord and hasn't changed. The only way this message can change if the HS leaves us entirely. So I guess the next question is, has the HS left or is the HS still active in a Christians life today?

AbigailZeke · Nov 29, 2016

LaurenTM said:

see, no one said they think sickness is God's will

that is part of the WOF disinformation package they learn in WOF ed 101

and it is said so often, that people like you believe it

yet no one has said that!

yes Jesus conquered death........hmmmmmmmmm

what does that mean to you?

do you expect you will not experience death?

I don't believe you understand the conversation

are you able to even acknowledge that NO ONE has stated we think God wants to make or makes people sick?

on the other hand, do you acknowledge that the very same God destroyed nations for the sake of His name because they were so demonic He wiped them out?

does the flood not ring a wake up call?

it's not really a complicated subject...however when folks reach conclusions based on really bad exegetical renderings, doctrine gleaned by taking verses out of context and slamming them together to create an amalgam of erroneous teaching and display hostility when questioned and twist words to make it sound like we hate God, then you will always end up NOT listening and falling for an unsubstantiated argument to the tune of 'we think God strikes people with cancer'

I believe God heals...I have seen it for myself...and I believe in the gifts...what I don't believe in, is the hyper religiosity that condemns everyone but those it agrees with

the worst sort of errors occur in church because that is where the devil attacks the hardest

So, what is it about WoF that people are so irked by?

I mean, I understand what you're saying. So you and I agree that sickness is not God's will. Does that mean, you and I believe that it is God's will to heal?

What is this hyper religiosity?! Sincere question, because I 'think' I'm classified WoF agreeing to the teachings of JP and I have no idea what is so wrong with it.

Word of Faith - a Look at what the Bible says!

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