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I don't think it really matters if Jesus drank wine or not, He was no drunkard at all, today we use that verse as Christians to decieve ourselves, rather than pursuing alcohol we can pursue things of the Kingdom, and I've heard people claim well Jesus made wine so it's okay, and while they are in that drunken stupar they are full of curse words and everything about it is wrong, do we see Jesus ever acting that way off of wine....No I believe wine was a common drink back then to fill the thirst like your cola today.
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Over-eating is the number one cause of early deaths in North America. Should we now stop eating because of this? Whenever people try to force "their rules" on other people they have just created a religion of their own choosing.
This is the complete opposite of living from the the life of Christ that is in us. Everyone is free to follow their own heart in this matter and no one should be condemning others for their own personal decision on whether to have a drink or not.
Gluttony is destructive - so everyone stop eating so that you can "be holy" - like me!...
This is the complete opposite of living from the the life of Christ that is in us. Everyone is free to follow their own heart in this matter and no one should be condemning others for their own personal decision on whether to have a drink or not.
Gluttony is destructive - so everyone stop eating so that you can "be holy" - like me!...
We should stop eating as much
K
Over-eating is the number one cause of early deaths in North America. Should we now stop eating because of this? Whenever people try to force "their rules" on other people they have just created a religion of their own choosing.
This is the complete opposite of living from the the life of Christ that is in us. Everyone is free to follow their own heart in this matter and no one should be condemning others for their own personal decision on whether to have a drink or not.
Gluttony is destructive - so everyone stop eating so that you can "be holy" - like me!...
This is the complete opposite of living from the the life of Christ that is in us. Everyone is free to follow their own heart in this matter and no one should be condemning others for their own personal decision on whether to have a drink or not.
Gluttony is destructive - so everyone stop eating so that you can "be holy" - like me!...
Gluttony is also wrong but I know a whole lot more alcoholics than gluttons. Food will make you sick and overweight if you are,in fact,a glutton. But its not the same as being drunk. Drunkenness causes us to do and say things, the Bible says its a mocker. Being drunk does not compare to being addicted to food. Not at all. Apples and oranges.
Going through the comments, I think there's a majority agreement that there's nothing wrong with drinking it in moderation. Even folks that had bad experiences and don't drink themselves say it's okay for others to do so if they can handle it. What I'm seeing, though, is some people trying to justify drinking as much as they want. Don't tell me what to do, I'll do what I want type mindset. That mindset is similar to that of an alcoholic. There's a difference between wanting to have a beer to wind down after a long day. And then immediately going to said beer to wind down because you feel that's the only way you can take your mind off things. An alcoholic doesn't need to be stumbling over his words and his feet in the street. There are such things as functioning alcoholics. I don't understand why people are trying to justify more than moderation when the answer is right in front of us in the Bible.
It's interesting how some will say in their defense on questionable matters, "Jesus did it!".....
Then when someone talks about striving for perfection, the same mouth will say, "You can't do that, because only Jesus was perfect."
Therefore, I will say I won't drink, & I think others shouldn't either, because, after all, we're not Jesus are we?
I might consider it when I become more like Jesus, cause only then would I be able to handle it.
How is it christians say they can never get close to perfect, mature like Jesus, then say they can handle alcohol with their carnal ability? This world is spiraling out of control more each day, yet mankind still thinks they can "handle it".
Sounds like someone needs to reset their goals, jus' sayin'
Then when someone talks about striving for perfection, the same mouth will say, "You can't do that, because only Jesus was perfect."
Therefore, I will say I won't drink, & I think others shouldn't either, because, after all, we're not Jesus are we?
I might consider it when I become more like Jesus, cause only then would I be able to handle it.
How is it christians say they can never get close to perfect, mature like Jesus, then say they can handle alcohol with their carnal ability? This world is spiraling out of control more each day, yet mankind still thinks they can "handle it".
Sounds like someone needs to reset their goals, jus' sayin'
Another question.....
How is the modern church gonna drink in moderation, when they're too weak to keep other sins out of their life?
I don't say that judgmentally, but from hearing so many on here stating they can't keep from continuously sinning against God.
I guess some will say "grace covers it".
I guess it will give God something else to forgive us for in our future lives.
How is the modern church gonna drink in moderation, when they're too weak to keep other sins out of their life?
I don't say that judgmentally, but from hearing so many on here stating they can't keep from continuously sinning against God.
I guess some will say "grace covers it".
I guess it will give God something else to forgive us for in our future lives.
Are 34% of the people you know alcoholics? ( come to think of it..in the Maritimes - that could be true...
)In the US 34% of the people are obese. The principle remains the same. We just like to single out some things as being especially bad at the expense of the others being ok. All things that destroy us and others are dangerous and falling short of the goodness and love of God.
I agree that drunkenness is more destructive than gluttony on the surface of things and for sure in it's immediate effects on us and those we love.
I know drunkenness is destructive in a lot of ways and it needs to be stopped before any more damage occurs - but so are many other things as well. I agree that if people have a problem - stay away from it until we learn to walk by the spirit and then we will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh to do "it's" desires.
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K
Are 34% of the people you know alcoholics? ( come to think of it..in the Maritimes - that could be true... )
In the US 34% of the people are obese. The principle remains the same. We just like to single out some things as being especially bad at the expense of the others being ok. All things that destroy us and others are dangerous and falling short of the goodness and love of God.
I agree that drunkenness is more destructive than gluttony on the surface of things and for sure in it's immediate effects on us and those we love.
I know drunkenness is destructive in a lot of ways and it needs to be stopped before any more damage occurs - but so are many other things as well. I agree that if people have a problem - stay away from it until we learn to walk by the spirit and then we will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh to do "it's" desires.
)In the US 34% of the people are obese. The principle remains the same. We just like to single out some things as being especially bad at the expense of the others being ok. All things that destroy us and others are dangerous and falling short of the goodness and love of God.
I agree that drunkenness is more destructive than gluttony on the surface of things and for sure in it's immediate effects on us and those we love.
I know drunkenness is destructive in a lot of ways and it needs to be stopped before any more damage occurs - but so are many other things as well. I agree that if people have a problem - stay away from it until we learn to walk by the spirit and then we will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh to do "it's" desires.
Quote "come to think of it..in the Maritimes - that could be true...
"Oh ho!! Quite a swipe! Actually Newfies are bigger drinkers. And I be half Newfie my son!
Quote "I know drunkenness is destructive in a lot of ways and it needs to be stopped before any more damage occurs - but so are many other things as well. I agree that if people have a problem - stay away from it until we learn to walk by the spirit and then we will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh to do "it's" desires."
I'd say we pretty much agree on the subject.
Quote "come to think of it..in the Maritimes - that could be true..."
Oh ho!! Quite a swipe! Actually Newfies are bigger drinkers. And I be half Newfie my son!
Quote "I know drunkenness is destructive in a lot of ways and it needs to be stopped before any more damage occurs - but so are many other things as well. I agree that if people have a problem - stay away from it until we learn to walk by the spirit and then we will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh to do "it's" desires."
I'd say we pretty much agree on the subject.
"Oh ho!! Quite a swipe! Actually Newfies are bigger drinkers. And I be half Newfie my son!
Quote "I know drunkenness is destructive in a lot of ways and it needs to be stopped before any more damage occurs - but so are many other things as well. I agree that if people have a problem - stay away from it until we learn to walk by the spirit and then we will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh to do "it's" desires."
I'd say we pretty much agree on the subject.
Half Newfie? God love ya' Tell me where you are to and I'll come where you are at. Just keeping it all real by keeping it between the jigs and the reels.
(Psst...don't be tellin' no one but me grandfodder was full Newf eh )
LOL..yes out east here...we have a lovely name for those that drink a lot - liquor pigs.
Exhibit A
K
Half Newfie? God love ya' Tell me where you are to and I'll come where you are at. Just keeping it all real by keeping it between the jigs and the reels.
(Psst...don't be tellin' no one but me grandfodder was full Newf eh )
LOL..yes out east here...we have a lovely name for those that drink a lot - liquor pigs.
Exhibit A
Now that looks like a bunch of characters!! Which begs the question "have ye tried screech me son?"
Over-eating is the number one cause of early deaths in North America. Should we now stop eating because of this? Whenever people try to force "their rules" on other people they have just created a religion of their own choosing.
This is the complete opposite of living from the the life of Christ that is in us. Everyone is free to follow their own heart in this matter and no one should be condemning others for their own personal decision on whether to have a drink or not.
Gluttony is destructive - so everyone stop eating so that you can "be holy" - like me!...
This is the complete opposite of living from the the life of Christ that is in us. Everyone is free to follow their own heart in this matter and no one should be condemning others for their own personal decision on whether to have a drink or not.
Gluttony is destructive - so everyone stop eating so that you can "be holy" - like me!...
We're able to follow our own hearts in this matter? Is there a new God sitting on the throne now?
That statement remind me of some OT scriptures.....
Proverbs 16:2
New American Standard Bible
All the ways of a man are clean in his own sight, But the LORD weighs the motives.
Proverbs 12:15
The way of a fool is right in his own eyes, But a wise man is he who listens to counsel.
Deuteronomy 12:8
"You shall not do at all what we are doing here today, every man doing whatever is right in his own eyes;
So, are we really free to do what is right in our hearts?
Beloved, mark those that sows lies among the brethren.
If doing anything while a brother is with you causes him to stumble - then that is not walking in love. We need to be conscious of this fact when we are around others that have a different belief and are weak in faith.
Romans 14:13-23 (NASB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] Therefore let us not judge one another anymore, but rather determine this—not to put an obstacle or a stumbling block in a brother's way.
[SUP]14 [/SUP] I know and am convinced in the Lord Jesus that nothing is unclean in itself; but to him who thinks anything to be unclean, to him it is unclean.
[SUP]15 [/SUP] For if because of food your brother is hurt, you are no longer walking according to love. Do not destroy with your food him for whom Christ died.
[SUP]16 [/SUP] Therefore do not let what is for you a good thing be spoken of as evil;
[SUP]17 [/SUP] for the kingdom of God is not eating and drinking, but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] For he who in this way serves Christ is acceptable to God and approved by men.
[SUP]19 [/SUP] So then we pursue the things which make for peace and the building up of one another.
[SUP]20 [/SUP] Do not tear down the work of God for the sake of food. All things indeed are clean, but they are evil for the man who eats and gives offense.
[SUP]21 [/SUP] It is good not to eat meat or to drink wine, or to do anything by which your brother stumbles.
[SUP]22 [/SUP] The faith which you have, have as your own conviction before God. Happy is he who does not condemn himself in what he approves.
[SUP]23 [/SUP] But he who doubts is condemned if he eats, because his eating is not from faith; and whatever is not from faith is sin.
Romans 14:13-23 (NASB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] Therefore let us not judge one another anymore, but rather determine this—not to put an obstacle or a stumbling block in a brother's way.
[SUP]14 [/SUP] I know and am convinced in the Lord Jesus that nothing is unclean in itself; but to him who thinks anything to be unclean, to him it is unclean.
[SUP]15 [/SUP] For if because of food your brother is hurt, you are no longer walking according to love. Do not destroy with your food him for whom Christ died.
[SUP]16 [/SUP] Therefore do not let what is for you a good thing be spoken of as evil;
[SUP]17 [/SUP] for the kingdom of God is not eating and drinking, but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] For he who in this way serves Christ is acceptable to God and approved by men.
[SUP]19 [/SUP] So then we pursue the things which make for peace and the building up of one another.
[SUP]20 [/SUP] Do not tear down the work of God for the sake of food. All things indeed are clean, but they are evil for the man who eats and gives offense.
[SUP]21 [/SUP] It is good not to eat meat or to drink wine, or to do anything by which your brother stumbles.
[SUP]22 [/SUP] The faith which you have, have as your own conviction before God. Happy is he who does not condemn himself in what he approves.
[SUP]23 [/SUP] But he who doubts is condemned if he eats, because his eating is not from faith; and whatever is not from faith is sin.
G
Are 34% of the people you know alcoholics? ( come to think of it..in the Maritimes - that could be true... )
In the US 34% of the people are obese. The principle remains the same. We just like to single out some things as being especially bad at the expense of the others being ok. All things that destroy us and others are dangerous and falling short of the goodness and love of God.
I agree that drunkenness is more destructive than gluttony on the surface of things and for sure in it's immediate effects on us and those we love.
I know drunkenness is destructive in a lot of ways and it needs to be stopped before any more damage occurs - but so are many other things as well. I agree that if people have a problem - stay away from it until we learn to walk by the spirit and then we will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh to do "it's" desires.
)In the US 34% of the people are obese. The principle remains the same. We just like to single out some things as being especially bad at the expense of the others being ok. All things that destroy us and others are dangerous and falling short of the goodness and love of God.
I agree that drunkenness is more destructive than gluttony on the surface of things and for sure in it's immediate effects on us and those we love.
I know drunkenness is destructive in a lot of ways and it needs to be stopped before any more damage occurs - but so are many other things as well. I agree that if people have a problem - stay away from it until we learn to walk by the spirit and then we will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh to do "it's" desires.
Its always wanting more, bigger and better, and never feeling satisfied with the "things" you have.
Although there is a focus on materialism in other parts of this world, I certainly notice it more when I am in North America. However, we all get caught up in this from time to time, no matter where we are from.
Also its important to take into account that the term "gluttony" can be a reference to over-indulgence in material items, wealth, and extravagance. This is how I've understood the term, not just related to eating the entire yummy pizza.
Its always wanting more, bigger and better, and never feeling satisfied with the "things" you have.
Although there is a focus on materialism in other parts of this world, I certainly notice it more when I am in North America. However, we all get caught up in this from time to time, no matter where we are from.
Its always wanting more, bigger and better, and never feeling satisfied with the "things" you have.
Although there is a focus on materialism in other parts of this world, I certainly notice it more when I am in North America. However, we all get caught up in this from time to time, no matter where we are from.
I agree on the materialism and the desiring of it and not being content with what we have.
But it must be deeper than that because in heaven there will be an abundance of things that will make our heads swim so it is not the "things themselves" as God made many in the OT rich beyond belief.
I also believe that the Greek word "licentiousness or lasciviousness " which is a work of the flesh in Gal. 5:19 - covers all aspects of over indulgence in all it's forms - as it means "without restraint".
Sometimes it is used in relation to sexual things but it has a deeper more widening meaning then to do with just sex.
ἀσέλγεια, aselgeia
Usage Notes: denotes "excess, licentiousness, absence of restraint, indecency, wantonness;" "lasciviousness"
Vine's Expository Dictionary of Old Testament and New Testament Words.
You may enjoy this guys teaching on why Christians always seem to want "more" not only in relation to materialism but in relation to our view of God too.
[video=youtube;nwrAHPwftvs]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwrAHPwftvs[/video]
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G
What yummy pizza? Where is this pizza?...
I agree on the materialism and the desiring of it and not being content with what we have.
But it must be deeper than that because in heaven there will be an abundance of things that will make our heads swim so it is not the "things themselves" as God made many in the OT rich beyond belief.
I also believe that the Greek word "licentiousness or lasciviousness " which is a work of the flesh in Gal. 5:19 - covers all aspects of over indulgence in all it's forms - as it means "without restraint".
Sometimes it is used in relation to sexual things but it has a deeper more widening meaning then to do with just sex.
ἀσέλγεια, aselgeia
Usage Notes: denotes "excess, licentiousness, absence of restraint, indecency, wantonness;" "lasciviousness"
Vine's Expository Dictionary of Old Testament and New Testament Words.
You may enjoy this guys teaching on why Christians always seem to want "more" not only in relation to materialism but in relation to our view of God too.
[video=youtube;nwrAHPwftvs]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwrAHPwftvs[/video]
I agree on the materialism and the desiring of it and not being content with what we have.
But it must be deeper than that because in heaven there will be an abundance of things that will make our heads swim so it is not the "things themselves" as God made many in the OT rich beyond belief.
I also believe that the Greek word "licentiousness or lasciviousness " which is a work of the flesh in Gal. 5:19 - covers all aspects of over indulgence in all it's forms - as it means "without restraint".
Sometimes it is used in relation to sexual things but it has a deeper more widening meaning then to do with just sex.
ἀσέλγεια, aselgeia
Usage Notes: denotes "excess, licentiousness, absence of restraint, indecency, wantonness;" "lasciviousness"
Vine's Expository Dictionary of Old Testament and New Testament Words.
You may enjoy this guys teaching on why Christians always seem to want "more" not only in relation to materialism but in relation to our view of God too.
[video=youtube;nwrAHPwftvs]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwrAHPwftvs[/video]
We can all talk about it, but where it really matters is how this is shows up in our individual lives. Does the way we live represent what we preach? That's for each individual to work on, with God's help. And, of course, we aren't perfect and stumble often.