We Have Forgotten That The Way Is Narrow

[phil36]

I can see your semantics here. The Holy Spirit is also called the Spirit of Jesus too. Perhaps there is more here then meets the natural mind of man?

Yes, that is correct, however, you seem to forget that The Father, Son and Holy Spirit are 3 persons (one being). The triunity of God has a special bearing when referring to the Spirit of Jesus in us...by way of the HolySpirit....

Are you Suggesting that 'grace' is a being? grace is not a being, grace is not a Spirit. You could say that grace is an attribute.

 

[Grace777x70]

Yes, that is correct, however, you seem to forget that The Father, Son and Holy Spirit are 3 persons (one being). The triunity of God has a special bearing when referring to the Spirit of Jesus in us...by way of the HolySpirit....

Are you Suggesting that 'grace' is a being? grace is not a being, grace is not a Spirit. You could say that grace is an attribute.

There are different ways of looking at it. You can't have Jesus without grace and there is no grace without Jesus. Trying to separate Jesus from grace is like trying to separate the wet from the water.

Here is an article that I found interesting and it rang true to me on one level but I don't make a doctrine out of it as I think it's a non-essemtial and just an opinion. For kicks - I'll put it up but as I say - I could care less one way or the other. My focus is - When I see Jesus - I see grace.

Quote:

Is grace a person?

People sometimes ask me, “Why do you say grace is another name for Jesus?” or “Why do you say grace is a Person?” They are referring to something I wrote in my book The Gospel in Twenty Questions:

Grace isn’t a bunch of rules for you to keep. And grace is not God’s lubricant for greasing the cogs of self effort. Grace is a Person living his life through you. Living under grace is like being married, only more so. It’s the adventure of life shared with Christ. (p.2)


Some say that the law is impersonal and was given (suggesting an arms-length transaction), while grace is personal and came when Jesus came (John 1:17). That sounds good to me, but some people find this weird.


“You make it sound like there’s a fourth member of the Trinity called Grace.”

We’re simply saying that God gives us his grace through his Son. Jesus came full of grace from the One who sits on the throne of grace. He is the personification of the Father’s grace. No Jesus, no grace. Know Jesus, know grace.

“But isn’t it weird to say grace has a personality?”

Maybe, but it’s not without Biblical basis. In Romans Paul describes sin as having a personality. He says sin is a noun (not a verb) characterized by desires and an agenda. In fact, everything the Bible says about sin is true of Satan. Both sin and Satan seek to devour us (Gen 4:7, 1 Pet 5:8) and kill us (Rom 7:11, John 8:44), and both have been defeated by Jesus (Heb 9:26, John 12:31).

Just as sin is synonymous with Satan, grace is synonymous with Jesus. Here are eighteen reasons why

Why is grace another name for Jesus?

1. The gospel of grace is the gospel of Jesus (Acts 20:24, 2 Th 1:8).

1. We are saved by grace (Eph 2:5); we are saved by Jesus (2 Tim 1:9).

1. We are justified by grace (Rom 3:24); we are justified by Jesus (Rom 4:25).

1. Grace helps us; Jesus helps us (Heb 4:16).

1. God’s grace offers salvation to all (Tit 2:11); Jesus is the Savior of all (1 Tim 4:10).

1. God is love and love that stoops (or comes down) is grace; Jesus is the Father’s love come down (John 16:28).

1. The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Christ (Rom 8:9) and the Spirit of Grace (Heb 10:29).

1. All the blessings of God come to us by grace alone and all of them are found in Jesus (Eph 1:3).

1. Grace is a teacher (Tit 2:12); Jesus is a teacher (Matt 8:19).

1. Grace reigns (Rom 5:21); Jesus reigns (1 Cor 15:25).

1. When the Galatians cut themselves off from Christ, they cut themselves off from grace (Gal 5:4)

1. In the same way that God is love, Jesus is grace (see 2 Cor 13:14).

1. The Bible speaks of “the love of God” and “the grace of Jesus” ( 1Cor 16:23, Rev 22:21).

1. God’s grace is given in Christ Jesus” (1 Cor 1:4, Eph 1:6, 2 Tim 1:9, 2:1). Jesus is the embodiment of God’s grace.

1. Here are two Biblical blessings that say the same thing: “The Lord be with you” and “grace be with you” (2 Tim 4:22, Phm 1:25).

1. The Old Testament prophets foretold the coming of Jesus and the coming of grace (1 Pet 1:10). These weren’t two separate events. Grace came when Jesus came (John 1:17).

1. To the degree that we know Jesus, we enjoy God’s grace (2 Pet 1:2)

1. Jesus is the word of God and the word of his grace which can build you up (Act 20:32)

Why does it matter?

This matters a great deal because grace will not bear fruit in your life if you think it is merely a concept or a doctrine. As Judah Smith said recently:

We shudder at the term grace because it has been so maligned, so abused, so misrepresented. We see grace as the get out of jail free card. “Oh yeah, I love me some grace man. I get my jiggy on in the weekend then I come back on Sunday and get me my grace on.” No, that’s not grace. You’ve met a concept, not a Person.”

I regularly encounter people who don’t know what grace is so they misuse it or they attack it. Just the other day someone wrote to tell me that too much preaching on grace leads to wrongdoing. That’s simply not possible when you have a proper understanding of grace. Grace no more leads to wrongdoing than love for your spouse will lead you to Ashley Madison.

The other day I happened to catch a prominent TV evangelist tearing my stuff to shreds on his program. (Watched by millions!) It’s nice to be noticed but I was saddened that he was using his platform to disparage the only thing that can empower people to live well.

I occasionally get asked by pastors to come and preach a sermon or run a seminar on grace because they recognize it as a hot topic. It makes me wonder what they’re preaching when they’re not preaching grace. Jesus is not a “hot topic” or a buzzword to be slotted into your teaching schedule. He’s the Lover of our souls and the Center of Everything!

What grace is not

Grace is not a doctrine or a podcast or a tweet. Grace is not a season to walk through or a midweek seminar. Grace is not one aspect of God’s character to be balanced against his other, less gracious aspects.
Grace is a Person who loves you, died for you, and now lives for you. The gospel of grace is the gospel of Jesus – there is no difference.

The grace of the Lord Jesus be with you!

Here is the link for this article. I like that at the bottom people can ask questions. I often find nuggets in there too.


https://escapetoreality.org/2015/09/04/grace-is-a-person/

 

[phil36]

Your right in one respect you cannot separate grace from God, and that was never my intention in my post. I think you know that though.

By my pointing out that grace is not a being but a characteristic, or an attribute of the one true God, you seem to have the impression that I have a low view of grace, on the contrary, I have a high view of God's grace. That's why I get very concerned regarding some views on here regarding this issue, from legalists and those with antinomian leanings.

When we look at Jesus we see grace... that is grace in action in the activity of the triune God in redemptive history.

“Grace is love that cares and stoops and rescues.” J.Stott.

And I would agree with the Max Lucado pic you posted. As I said above, when we look to Jesus we see grace..... in action!

Anyhow, have a blessed weekend grace7.

 

[PeterJens]

I see a simple problem. Grace is a summary word for love, mercy and forgiveness.
It does not exist outside these concepts, so to make it into something greater than this
is because the motives of these people is to introduce a salvation without righteousness
attainable by the believer walking in the Spirit.

They hold with a duality of perfect spirit and fallen flesh, but are hazy how the whole
ever reaches redemption in a real sense or there is any value in it.

The ideas appear to be the spirit hopes between the old body and the new body, ie
the flesh so from imperfection to perfection at the point of transformation.

If there theory of separation is wrong and the lusts of the heart are implicit in our
existance, then they need to be resolved no matter what, and this perfect spirit
theology fails.

You will hear lots about no steps of sanctification or "evolution" as some would
say from sinner to saint, which has some merit, because we are holy, pure and redeemed
people but with behaviour problems that need resolving.

But most of this theological architecture is not talked about, because they are unsure of
its validity, other than they hate their old theology of redeemed but slowly transformed
with the potential for failure, which they regard as unbelief and equivalent to not being
part of the faith at all. Not a nice place to be, if you ask me.

 

[Grace777x70]

Your right in one respect you cannot separate grace from God, and that was never my intention in my post. I think you know that though.

By my pointing out that grace is not a being but a characteristic, or an attribute of the one true God, you seem to have the impression that I have a low view of grace, on the contrary, I have a high view of God's grace. That's why I get very concerned regarding some views on here regarding this issue, from legalists and those with antinomian leanings.

When we look at Jesus we see grace... that is grace in action in the activity of the triune God in redemptive history.

“Grace is love that cares and stoops and rescues.” J.Stott.

And I would agree with the Max Lucado pic you posted. As I said above, when we look to Jesus we see grace..... in action!

Anyhow, have a blessed weekend grace7.

I know you love the Lord and have great respect for all things concerning Him. Have a great weekend too Phil.

 

[Spokenpassage]

Here is a question we should ask ourselves, if "indeed, all who desire to live a godly life in Christ Jesus will be persecuted, while evil people and impostors will go on from bad to worse, deceiving and being deceived (2 Tim. 3:12, 13)," why aren't we being persecuted? No one should search to be persecuted, but it is a risk of being in Christ.

Someone once said that if Christians started acting like Jesus they wouldn't be hated, but I am over here thinking that Jesus was crucified, so if we acted like him we would be hated too. Here is another question, are we hated in this day and age because we hold to Christ and uphold true integrity, or is it because of being a reproach to his name from our failures, or is it because some misrepresent us and dishonor his name? It may be a combination of all.

 

[beta]

Here is a question we should ask ourselves, if "indeed, all who desire to live a godly life in Christ Jesus will be persecuted, while evil people and impostors will go on from bad to worse, deceiving and being deceived (2 Tim. 3:12, 13)," why aren't we being persecuted? No one should search to be persecuted, but it is a risk of being in Christ.

Someone once said that if Christians started acting like Jesus they wouldn't be hated, but I am over here thinking that Jesus was crucified, so if we acted like him we would be hated too. Here is another question, are we hated in this day and age because we hold to Christ and uphold true integrity, or is it because of being a reproach to his name from our failures, or is it because some misrepresent us and dishonor his name? It may be a combination of all.

Just try walking with Jesus 24/7 and you will know you are persecuted and hated - starting with being called a JUDAIZER !

 

[MadebyHim]

It's walking the razors edge, just think about that. More narrow than most know. i think we are all getting better at it. Kinda like walking a tight rope. only more narrow.

 

[beta]

It's walking the razors edge, just think about that. More narrow than most know. i think we are all getting better at it. Kinda like walking a tight rope. only more narrow.

Yes, God always hated a 'false balance, that is why we must learn to walk by every word that procedes out of His mouth. Never rely on your own understanding or you will lose life and limb falling off the sharp edge.

 

[MadebyHim]

https://youtu.be/TPdTxSNcC5Y

 

[followjesus]

[video=youtube;1_hGBFVzYZ4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_hGBFVzYZ4&sns=em[/video]

The Way is so narrow that we walk, But His Love is So Broad that we depend upon. There is mercy enough when we fall and get off course, But there is a constant Light that draws us back upon His way. We struggle in our walks at times because so many seek to extinguish the importance of the LIGHT.

 

[danula]

Yes, the way is very very narrow

 

[beta]

Yes, the way is very very narrow

No disrespect intended, but maybe women who have given birth to children understand this better than men...lol

 

[preacher4truth]

What I also want to say is the reason people are not on the narrow path is because they are falsly taught they are 'already born again'.

I agree here. People are popishly and prematurely declared on their way to heaven as soon as they pray a prayer and make a confession of faith. There has not been time given to see if that person actually bears the fruit of salvation and repentance. We should note the parable of the soils; Matthew 13:1-23.

Why would they restrain themselves from wordly lusts if they have already achieved their goal and are saved ?

They won't, they've been told their ticket has been punched. The easy-believe-ism and Free Grace Theology (FGT) heretics will say that the above is preaching works (foolishly). Note Titus 2:11-15. FGT has done much damage within the church.

There is no incentive of rejecting sin seriously if already re-born. NOW we are BEGOTTEN and only FULLY BORN AGAIN in the resurrection from the dead Rom 1v4. when we put on the new body Phil 3v21; Rom 8v21.

I have to disagree as we are born again here in this life; 1 Peter 1:23. Glorification is the consummation of this truth.

 

[beta]

I agree here. People are popishly and prematurely declared on their way to heaven as soon as they pray a prayer and make a confession of faith. There has not been time given to see if that person actually bears the fruit of salvation and repentance. We should note the parable of the soils; Matthew 13:1-23.

They won't, they've been told their ticket has been punched. The easy-believe-ism and Free Grace Theology (FGT) heretics will say that the above is preaching works (foolishly). Note Titus 2:11-15. FGT has done much damage within the church.
I have to disagree as we are born again here in this life; 1 Peter 1:23. Glorification is theconsummation of this truth.

Seems we understand 1Pet 1v23 differently - I do not read it as 'born again here in this life - but simply making a reference to being born again, does not say when. I get that answer from Rom 1v4, when resurrected from the dead with power in a new body.

 

[PeterJens]

It comes down to the definition of good works. There are Divine good works and human good works(evil.)

And the majority describe "good works" as some type of human good. And that is wood,hay and stubble or ASHES in the end.

If an unbeliever can do it.................it isn't considered a Divine good work.

This idea of good works being evil is typical of faulty theology.

 

[sevenseas]

Here is a question we should ask ourselves, if "indeed, all who desire to live a godly life in Christ Jesus will be persecuted, while evil people and impostors will go on from bad to worse, deceiving and being deceived (2 Tim. 3:12, 13)," why aren't we being persecuted? No one should search to be persecuted, but it is a risk of being in Christ.

Someone once said that if Christians started acting like Jesus they wouldn't be hated, but I am over here thinking that Jesus was crucified, so if we acted like him we would be hated too. Here is another question, are we hated in this day and age because we hold to Christ and uphold true integrity, or is it because of being a reproach to his name from our failures, or is it because some misrepresent us and dishonor his name? It may be a combination of all.

For what credit is there if, when you sin and are harshly treated, you endure it with patience? But if when you do what is right and suffer for it you patiently endure it, this finds favor with God.
IPeter 2:20


13Who is going to harm you if you are eager to do good? 14But even if you should suffer for what is right, you are blessed. “Do not fear their threats[SUP]b[/SUP] ; do not be frightened.”[SUP]c[/SUP] 15But in your hearts revere Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect, 16keeping a clear conscience, so that those who speak maliciously against your good behavior in Christ may be ashamed of their slander. 17For it is better, if it is God’s will, to suffer for doing good than for doing evil. 18For Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring you to God. He was put to death in the body but made alive in the Spirit. I Peter 3

 

[sevenseas]

Originally Posted by wsblind

It comes down to the definition of good works. There are Divine good works and human good works(evil.)

And the majority describe "good works" as some type of human good. And that is wood,hay and stubble or ASHES in the end.

If an unbeliever can do it.................it isn't considered a Divine good work.

PeterJens;3051065]This idea of good works being evil is typical of faulty theology.

actually, the Bible absolutely does define the difference between human good works, which a person does NOT have to be a Christian to enact, and those ordained by God that we should do

there is a difference and I think it would be wise to see that, accept that and inquire of God what it is He would have us, PERSONALLY, doing

this certainly does not discount getting out and helping at church or soup kitchens or whatever because we are also told that godly religion is taking care of widows, orphans and so on

 

[eternally-gratefull]

actually, the Bible absolutely does define the difference between human good works, which a person does NOT have to be a Christian to enact, and those ordained by God that we should do

there is a difference and I think it would be wise to see that, accept that and inquire of God what it is He would have us, PERSONALLY, doing

this certainly does not discount getting out and helping at church or soup kitchens or whatever because we are also told that godly religion is taking care of widows, orphans and so on

I think what he was trying to say, and I agree with, Is there can be a difference.

A non believer can serve the poor.. A believer can serve the poor..

Both of these works can be considered works of self righteousness.. (depending on the believers reason for doing it) but only one of them is capable of doing this work as a work of righteousness of God.

 

[Grace777x70]

actually, the Bible absolutely does define the difference between human good works, which a person does NOT have to be a Christian to enact, and those ordained by God that we should do

there is a difference and I think it would be wise to see that, accept that and inquire of God what it is He would have us, PERSONALLY, doing

this certainly does not discount getting out and helping at church or soup kitchens or whatever because we are also told that godly religion is taking care of widows, orphans and so on

I agree 100%.

The deceitfulness of sin tells us that if we do good works - we will be righteous. Sin is so deceitful in it's desire to trick us into not believing in what Christ has done in the area of righteousness - that He alone is our righteousness because of what He has done.

The trick of sin deceitfully says "do good works and it will establish your righteous".

Good works do benefit the one receiving them but they do not make one righteous.

Get this backwards and we end up creating a religion of self-righteousness/holiness that actually denies the very grace of God in Christ needed for His life and fruit to be manifested by His good works in and through us to a hurt world that needs to see and know the love and grace our Father really has for them.