Matthew 5. Regarding the Law and the Prophets
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Your post is on Christ's teachings to all. Paul is addressing the romans, and much can be learned from this epistle.
This is not arguing what you are saying in this post. What my post is saying is simple.
If christ, talking to the Jews, is there to save them first, and He is teaching them, He is teaching the gospel, and the gospel is the same for all peoples.....ergo, we must learn from Jesus just how it is to be approached under mercy and grace.. I did say, and have said a multitude of times, no man is saved by his own action, only by the Blood of the Lamb of God.
Be careful with this thread, or it will turn into a grace/law thread with no one understanding anyone, as has occurred so many times in the past.
This is not arguing what you are saying in this post. What my post is saying is simple.
If christ, talking to the Jews, is there to save them first, and He is teaching them, He is teaching the gospel, and the gospel is the same for all peoples.....ergo, we must learn from Jesus just how it is to be approached under mercy and grace.. I did say, and have said a multitude of times, no man is saved by his own action, only by the Blood of the Lamb of God.
Be careful with this thread, or it will turn into a grace/law thread with no one understanding anyone, as has occurred so many times in the past.
Be aware, all of the teaching you read in the New Testament gospels are teaching Jews first and then the nations. It was not until Peter was givne his vision of the sheet with the unclean animals that Jesus in that vision told Peter to go to the nations. The Jews were always taught so.
Also, read in the Old testament of the garce of God being given daily. Read there also of Jesus on the cross. Read there also of how the man is blessed to whom God does not impute sin.
If you need direct quotes, read teh word in prayer. If you believe I am stupid or lying just say so because this is what it sounds like to any reading what you have asked of me.
May you be blessed with guideance through the Wrd by the HOly Sprit, in Jesus Christ's name, amen.
Also, read in the Old testament of the garce of God being given daily. Read there also of Jesus on the cross. Read there also of how the man is blessed to whom God does not impute sin.
If you need direct quotes, read teh word in prayer. If you believe I am stupid or lying just say so because this is what it sounds like to any reading what you have asked of me.
May you be blessed with guideance through the Wrd by the HOly Sprit, in Jesus Christ's name, amen.
what happens if one is a Jew who is in Christ? which kingdom do they inherit?
Lets destroy this argument right off the bat before it even starts:
Matthew 19:23-24
23 And Jesus said to his disciples, “Truly, I say to you, only with difficulty will a rich person enter the kingdom of heaven.24 Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter the kingdom of God.”
Lets destroy this argument right off the bat before it even starts:
Matthew 19:23-24
23 And Jesus said to his disciples, “Truly, I say to you, only with difficulty will a rich person enter the kingdom of heaven.24 Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter the kingdom of God.”
Have I mentioned "keeping the law?" Pay attention because that term, keeping the law implies I am under the law.
I have asked what any would ask of the assembly, and that is to learn about the law today under mercy and grace from Jesus Christ, Himself, as He has invited all to learn directly from him, fro God.
You are referring to what is calle tzit-tzit, the fringe or tassels that were to be worn on the corners of the robes of the faith ful as a reminder to always be aware of and obey God's commandments.
We have the tassels on our hearts and on the robes fabricated by our good works given us each by god.
Jesus Christ has fulfilled all laws concering the priesthood being our High Prist. Concerning sacrifice being the Only Sacrifice for sin once and for all. He has made all foods received with thanksgiving clean, all foods for when they are received with thanksgiving they are blessed. Must I tgo on.
He teaches when understanding the law we must apply faith, hope and justice.......We do not stone anyone. We do not punish anyone. Mercy, and God's justice is forgiving.
IT BREAKS MY HEART to have people come to me teaching all that all laws are bad and they are all dead, obsolet. Jesus fulfills all law, not destroys. Laws about vengeance are merciless, He teaches this fulfilling them
Law about being good are all included in love, but so many say they love yet all the good laws are obsolet, because they love. HOw confused can a person be. So the Ten commandments are no longer because thhese people LOVE:!
If people loved as does god there would be a lot more folks giving and help others. There would be no accusations of obedient childre being under the law, yet there are accusations.
People who accuse such have resien above law and God making thmselves judges of the obedient, and this should not be so.
They are reigning without the King present.
I have asked what any would ask of the assembly, and that is to learn about the law today under mercy and grace from Jesus Christ, Himself, as He has invited all to learn directly from him, fro God.
You are referring to what is calle tzit-tzit, the fringe or tassels that were to be worn on the corners of the robes of the faith ful as a reminder to always be aware of and obey God's commandments.
We have the tassels on our hearts and on the robes fabricated by our good works given us each by god.
Jesus Christ has fulfilled all laws concering the priesthood being our High Prist. Concerning sacrifice being the Only Sacrifice for sin once and for all. He has made all foods received with thanksgiving clean, all foods for when they are received with thanksgiving they are blessed. Must I tgo on.
He teaches when understanding the law we must apply faith, hope and justice.......We do not stone anyone. We do not punish anyone. Mercy, and God's justice is forgiving.
IT BREAKS MY HEART to have people come to me teaching all that all laws are bad and they are all dead, obsolet. Jesus fulfills all law, not destroys. Laws about vengeance are merciless, He teaches this fulfilling them
Law about being good are all included in love, but so many say they love yet all the good laws are obsolet, because they love. HOw confused can a person be. So the Ten commandments are no longer because thhese people LOVE:!
If people loved as does god there would be a lot more folks giving and help others. There would be no accusations of obedient childre being under the law, yet there are accusations.
People who accuse such have resien above law and God making thmselves judges of the obedient, and this should not be so.
They are reigning without the King present.
It used to be that the levitical house alone had an inheritance in THE LORD. They were in service to the whole tribe but they did not work for perishable things though those he served gave to him perishable things to sustain them in this world though their brothers provided for them these perishable comforts
now look at the 12 tribes of Israel mentioned in revelation and understand that along with the tribes of Levi, all in CHRIST are a royal priesthood and have an inheritance in the TRUE ISRAEL of GOD
HIS SON who is over the WHOLE HOUSE for God
Who did you think
JESUS was addressing in John8 but the Jews
id THE SON sets you free you are free
its just that they didn't want to see themselves as slaves to just a man
now look at the 12 tribes of Israel mentioned in revelation and understand that along with the tribes of Levi, all in CHRIST are a royal priesthood and have an inheritance in the TRUE ISRAEL of GOD
HIS SON who is over the WHOLE HOUSE for God
Who did you think
JESUS was addressing in John8 but the Jews
id THE SON sets you free you are free
its just that they didn't want to see themselves as slaves to just a man
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Mat 11:11 Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 18:3 And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Luk 7:28 For I say unto you, Among those that are born of women there is not a greater prophet than John the Baptist: but he that is least in the kingdom of God is greater than he.
Joh 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Mar 10:17 And when he was gone forth into the way, there came one running, and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life?
Mar 10:21 Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me.
Mar 10:22 And he was sad at that saying, and went away grieved: for he had great possessions.
Mar 10:23 And Jesus looked round about, and saith unto his disciples, How hardly shall they that have riches enter into the kingdom of God!
I would say that the kingdom of God,and the kingdom of heaven,are the same kingdom,and pertain to the believers who are in Christ.
Act 1:6 When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?
Act 1:7 And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.
Act 1:8 But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.
Act 1:9 And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.
Act 1:10 And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel;
Act 1:11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.
Although the kingdom on earth will be restored to the Jews in the millennial reign of Christ,and is the kingdom of God on earth,for Jesus and the saints rule over one sixth of the people that fought against Israel.
Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 18:3 And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Luk 7:28 For I say unto you, Among those that are born of women there is not a greater prophet than John the Baptist: but he that is least in the kingdom of God is greater than he.
Joh 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Mar 10:17 And when he was gone forth into the way, there came one running, and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life?
Mar 10:21 Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me.
Mar 10:22 And he was sad at that saying, and went away grieved: for he had great possessions.
Mar 10:23 And Jesus looked round about, and saith unto his disciples, How hardly shall they that have riches enter into the kingdom of God!
I would say that the kingdom of God,and the kingdom of heaven,are the same kingdom,and pertain to the believers who are in Christ.
Act 1:6 When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?
Act 1:7 And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.
Act 1:8 But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.
Act 1:9 And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.
Act 1:10 And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel;
Act 1:11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.
Although the kingdom on earth will be restored to the Jews in the millennial reign of Christ,and is the kingdom of God on earth,for Jesus and the saints rule over one sixth of the people that fought against Israel.
When a person says """Yup, we gotta keep the old testament law still, clearly"" They are proclaiming the basic Works salvation doctrine... They then Must keep the old Testament laws and if they fall down and fail in keeping just one of those laws then they are damned to the eternal lake of fire...
Now i can say:: The Moral laws of the OT are good and we should strive to do our best to do them.. In saying that i am proclaiming the laws to be good and right but i am NOT proclaiming that we Must keep the old testament laws..
So i can preach to others that stealing is wrong and against the law of God and that we should resist as best we can the temptation to steal and i am not preaching works salvation because i am not injecting that 4 letter word Must ( or equivalent word like gotta) into the equation but the world should.. So my preaching is declaring the Law to be good and right but it is also taking into account the faultiness of all people who because of their carnal flesh state of being will fail from time to time and may steal either physically or in thought by coveting their neighbors goods..
Now we know that it is by the Atonement of the LORD Jesus Christ that we are saved and not through Law doing.. Because if we Must keep the law then successful law keeping becomes part of the Mix that is required to keep us saved.. And all who believe and preach that works salvation doctrine are damned because no one can keep the law without fail..
Romans 7:KJV
14 "For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin. {15} For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I. {16} If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good. {17} Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me. {18} For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not. {19} For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do. {20} Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me. {21} I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me. {22} For I delight in the law of God after the inward man: {23} But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. {24} O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death? {25} I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin."
Now i can say:: The Moral laws of the OT are good and we should strive to do our best to do them.. In saying that i am proclaiming the laws to be good and right but i am NOT proclaiming that we Must keep the old testament laws..
So i can preach to others that stealing is wrong and against the law of God and that we should resist as best we can the temptation to steal and i am not preaching works salvation because i am not injecting that 4 letter word Must ( or equivalent word like gotta) into the equation but the world should.. So my preaching is declaring the Law to be good and right but it is also taking into account the faultiness of all people who because of their carnal flesh state of being will fail from time to time and may steal either physically or in thought by coveting their neighbors goods..
Now we know that it is by the Atonement of the LORD Jesus Christ that we are saved and not through Law doing.. Because if we Must keep the law then successful law keeping becomes part of the Mix that is required to keep us saved.. And all who believe and preach that works salvation doctrine are damned because no one can keep the law without fail..
Romans 7:KJV
14 "For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin. {15} For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I. {16} If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good. {17} Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me. {18} For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not. {19} For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do. {20} Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me. {21} I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me. {22} For I delight in the law of God after the inward man: {23} But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. {24} O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death? {25} I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin."
Well i wasnt "preaching" anything, i just laid out my opinion of that particular verse when i first became a believer.
Also this "no one can keep the law" thing has been refuted by the bible itself so many times its amazing you keep talking about it:
Luke 1:6 And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless
So there we go. either they walked in all commandments blameless or luke 1:6 is a lie.
Paul's letters are the most wrested ones as Peter warned us, lets not fall into a trap of fatalism where we are unable to do good or repent or obey God, we CAN, God has given us the ability, and He COMMANDS us over and over again to repent and do this and do that, but why? because God commands us, isnt that enough of a reason?
Why would God ask for impossible things of us? Jesus said His yoke is not burdensome and heavy.
Also to the falsehood of you cant use the word must, well Peter used it in acts 5 where he said we MUST Obey God rather than men. The commandments of Jesus are a MUST they are not a "well it would be better if you stopped, but if you dont, its okay too", thats not biblical language at all.
I dunno why you decided to get your knickers in a twist over a simple opinion
If you believe you have the laaws written in your inward parts and on your heart, then you must be obeying something taught by Jesus Christ by means of the Holy Spirit He imparted to us.
As it says in Ephesians we were once far away but we are now children of obedience separted for those of disobedicnece....
Never chide a family member for obeying Jesus Christ......that is just not to be done.
God bless all who hear Jesus christ and understand Him. No argument here, thus I go.
As it says in Ephesians we were once far away but we are now children of obedience separted for those of disobedicnece....
Never chide a family member for obeying Jesus Christ......that is just not to be done.
God bless all who hear Jesus christ and understand Him. No argument here, thus I go.
miknik5....
rem up until the last supper and the Crucifixtion of Jesus on Passover, He was still under the Laws of the Torah.
Notice. He came NOT TO Destroy but to FUlFill (What???)....Prophecy (of What?)..The OT.
Here TILL heaven and earth PASS...(After The Great Throne Judgement)...."not .ONE JOT or ONE TITTLE" (same meaning as "dotting all the 'i's and crossing all the 't's).The law will be followed to the letter until all (Prophecies) are fulfilled.
Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: (Here anyone breaking the commandments and then teaching others to NOT do so, will still be in heaven but will have less standing than others there. [/COLOR]
but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. ( the person who walks the talk talks the walk, will have a higher standing in heaven.)
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GOD gave dominion of the earth to man and he told man what would happen If man were disobedient to HIS WORD.Man was disobedient and sin entered the world followed by death.
GOD Is righteous and would not associate with sin.
After man fell,the only way that man could relate to GOD would be to fulfill GOD's perfect standard of righteousness(the law)perfectly,and since all men were coming short of GOD's glory,GOD sent HIS WORD to earth In the flesh,fully man and fully GOD.
JESUS fulfilled GOD's perfect standard of righteousness perfectly and took back the power the devil had over man because of man's weakness of the flesh,the devil used the law against man.
The children of Israel were only able to purify the outward man under law,but GOD magnified the law from just outward purification to Inward TRUTH.
JESUS said that the words HE spoke were Spirit and they were life.
Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the WORD of GOD.
We have access to this Grace through Faith.
GOD Is righteous and would not associate with sin.
After man fell,the only way that man could relate to GOD would be to fulfill GOD's perfect standard of righteousness(the law)perfectly,and since all men were coming short of GOD's glory,GOD sent HIS WORD to earth In the flesh,fully man and fully GOD.
JESUS fulfilled GOD's perfect standard of righteousness perfectly and took back the power the devil had over man because of man's weakness of the flesh,the devil used the law against man.
The children of Israel were only able to purify the outward man under law,but GOD magnified the law from just outward purification to Inward TRUTH.
JESUS said that the words HE spoke were Spirit and they were life.
Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the WORD of GOD.
We have access to this Grace through Faith.