Sorry, but I don't listen to preachers like MacArthur or Prince or whoever. I listen to GOD'S word. 
What's the point? Everything is selfish.
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Well, sis, you're missing out on MacArthur, but I'd avoid Joseph Prince like the plague. Maybe I'm a bad person, I listen to many preachers; R C Sproul, Erwin Lutzer, John MacArthur, Paul Washer, Dr. Steven Lawson, D. Martyn Lloyd-Jones, J D Hall & more. God gave these men to the church to equip us.
I'm good. Everything I need to know is in the bible.
http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/151264-give-us-these-kind-men.html#post3060975
I'm good. Everything I need to know is in the bible.
I'm not sure a very accurate Bible exists. And if it does, I'm not sure which one it is. Though most agree the NIV Bible is not brilliant and a few others as their are over 500 English Bibles apparently. So I'm trying to follow the best advice I can find. Continuously.
D
Here's the scoop on Bibles. (I'm not an expert, but I've learned this something like I learned how to type -- hunt-and-peck style -- as needed over the years. lol)
Two kinds -- translations and transliterations.
Translations -- when linguistic/biblical scholars find the earliest MSS (manuscripts) they can find, study them, and take the best guesses they can make with the knowledge of three dead or fairly dead languages. (Technically, none of the languages are dead, but language changes, so the language from 2000+ years ago might as well be dead.)
Transliterations -- taking an translation and updating it to current vernacular. (Not good, since current vernacular doesn't allow gender based pronouns much anymore.)
So, you want translations.
Now, here's the problem. There are thousands! Probably 10's of 1000s or 100's of 10000's when you start considering English isn't the only language. And each one was based on the knowledge already gained at the time of the scholar(s) writing it. Personally, I'm mighty impressed with Jerome. He did one of the first translation back when Latin was the language of the common people. (His version is called The Vulgate. One guy translated it all -- OT and NT. Very impressive when you consider it takes about 100 scholars years now to do a new translation.) BUT, he wasn't as good as he hoped to be and he was back in the times when a plane trip or Internet search didn't existed, so he could only use what was on hand. That's why the RCC still thinks repent means penance. Jerome boobooed on that word, and the RCC found it profitable to stick with it. (It was the excuse for paying for indulgences. Now they just can't admit they got it wrong this long.)
Fast forward to a king named James, and those scholars had two different problems translating. First, James was out to change the Bible. He wanted it to say The King is Law. I admire the scholars for fighting that one, but not so sure how much they accomplished with that fight. Add to that, they were Englishmen in the 1600's, so what did they know about The Sinai or Israel of 3000+ years earlier? The reason rabbit is in the Bible when there were no rabbits in the Middle East when the law was written. (BTW, your country fixed that. Now there are rabbits in six continents. Thank you! Delicious. lol) They translated from earlier MSS all right, but we hadn't even found the Dead Sea Scrolls yet. And, we've found earlier MSS (in pieces) since then.
Plus, every time there is a new archaeological discover in the Mediterranean region, we have a chance of seeing words rarely used and figuring out what they mean in context. (Also, consider we're talking writing that is 2000-6000 years old, so paper is unlikely to be found by now, but carving in stone last. It really cuts down on learning what words meant at an ancient time.)
An example of this -- Nephilim. As of the 1900's that word was only found four times in anything ever discovered from that area. Twice in the Bible, and twice outside the Bible. They have a choice of two possible meanings -- giants or fellers. It's been translated as "giant" in the Bible. Some day, they may find out it meant "feller" all along, and we're all going to have to learn what a feller is!
Forward to NIV. That was the last translation created by jet. Jet? Yeah! By then, all old parchments were owned by the country that found out what that old piece of parchment was, and none of those countries are mailing them out to be borrowed, so those scholars that translated the NIV went by jet to study the parchments.
Last time, because they were finished right around the time this new gizmo showed up -- the Internet. Now the parchments can be reached by Internet access. So, the scholars today are going with the latest technology and the latest discoveries to do their work.
Are the perfect? No! But, really? Does it matter is Nephilim means giant or feller? Does it matter if that word is rabbit or if it's a particular rodent that still lives in the Sinai? Not really! That's the level the maybes are at though.
What does matter -- God's word has managed to keep being clear despite the changes in language, the changes in technology and the upgrades in scholarship. 2000 years, and God's word has survived in tact!
You can trust it. (You can also eat rabbits because they don't chew the cud nor have split hooves. lol)
Two kinds -- translations and transliterations.
Translations -- when linguistic/biblical scholars find the earliest MSS (manuscripts) they can find, study them, and take the best guesses they can make with the knowledge of three dead or fairly dead languages. (Technically, none of the languages are dead, but language changes, so the language from 2000+ years ago might as well be dead.)
Transliterations -- taking an translation and updating it to current vernacular. (Not good, since current vernacular doesn't allow gender based pronouns much anymore.)
So, you want translations.
Now, here's the problem. There are thousands! Probably 10's of 1000s or 100's of 10000's when you start considering English isn't the only language. And each one was based on the knowledge already gained at the time of the scholar(s) writing it. Personally, I'm mighty impressed with Jerome. He did one of the first translation back when Latin was the language of the common people. (His version is called The Vulgate. One guy translated it all -- OT and NT. Very impressive when you consider it takes about 100 scholars years now to do a new translation.) BUT, he wasn't as good as he hoped to be and he was back in the times when a plane trip or Internet search didn't existed, so he could only use what was on hand. That's why the RCC still thinks repent means penance. Jerome boobooed on that word, and the RCC found it profitable to stick with it. (It was the excuse for paying for indulgences. Now they just can't admit they got it wrong this long.)
Fast forward to a king named James, and those scholars had two different problems translating. First, James was out to change the Bible. He wanted it to say The King is Law. I admire the scholars for fighting that one, but not so sure how much they accomplished with that fight. Add to that, they were Englishmen in the 1600's, so what did they know about The Sinai or Israel of 3000+ years earlier? The reason rabbit is in the Bible when there were no rabbits in the Middle East when the law was written. (BTW, your country fixed that. Now there are rabbits in six continents. Thank you! Delicious. lol) They translated from earlier MSS all right, but we hadn't even found the Dead Sea Scrolls yet. And, we've found earlier MSS (in pieces) since then.
Plus, every time there is a new archaeological discover in the Mediterranean region, we have a chance of seeing words rarely used and figuring out what they mean in context. (Also, consider we're talking writing that is 2000-6000 years old, so paper is unlikely to be found by now, but carving in stone last. It really cuts down on learning what words meant at an ancient time.)
An example of this -- Nephilim. As of the 1900's that word was only found four times in anything ever discovered from that area. Twice in the Bible, and twice outside the Bible. They have a choice of two possible meanings -- giants or fellers. It's been translated as "giant" in the Bible. Some day, they may find out it meant "feller" all along, and we're all going to have to learn what a feller is!
Forward to NIV. That was the last translation created by jet. Jet? Yeah! By then, all old parchments were owned by the country that found out what that old piece of parchment was, and none of those countries are mailing them out to be borrowed, so those scholars that translated the NIV went by jet to study the parchments.
Last time, because they were finished right around the time this new gizmo showed up -- the Internet. Now the parchments can be reached by Internet access. So, the scholars today are going with the latest technology and the latest discoveries to do their work.
Are the perfect? No! But, really? Does it matter is Nephilim means giant or feller? Does it matter if that word is rabbit or if it's a particular rodent that still lives in the Sinai? Not really! That's the level the maybes are at though.
What does matter -- God's word has managed to keep being clear despite the changes in language, the changes in technology and the upgrades in scholarship. 2000 years, and God's word has survived in tact!
You can trust it. (You can also eat rabbits because they don't chew the cud nor have split hooves. lol)
Hmm, the KJV bible mentions the word hell, ESV/NIV etc, as far as i know mention Hades and outer darkness (name?), The terms around the blood of Christ giving salvation are mostly removed outside of the KJV, eg NIV Bible etc. As far as i know. The understanding or wording about being saved for all sins and not by works is also confused in meaning compared to other Bible's in wording. This has been continuously debated on which Bible is best and there is the argument of king James onlyism. That says it's the only true word of God. So deciding on this is very difficult, depending on what YOU CHOOSE. There should probably just be one. One Bible mentions marshmallow slime? Not joking.
D
Do word studies for yourself then. True, concordances are specific to certain translations, and my choice is Strong's, but Angela (who actually does understand this stuff, versus my here-and-there over the years knowledge) prefers Thayer's.
Nothing says you can't go with more than one concordance just to find where the verses for "salvation," "saved," "Hell," "Hades," "darkness" are, so you can then read the context to see what that says about it.
Also, Vine's Expository helps. As do a number of other Bible aids. (eSword.net gives away downloads to all the books I've mentioned, so no need to spend your life savings.) If I want to study a concept in the Bible, I can't do it with just one version, for the same reason you can't. Nephilim is easy. Twice in the whole Bible. Salvation? All over the place and different scholars used different words. (And I don't really feel like spending the next 20 years of my life learning Greek or Hebrew. I'm just not good with languages. lol)
Now! I expect a complete report from you on Salvation by this time next week. lol
Just kidding. I suspect that will take you a couple of years, at least. BUT, those years will come and go if you decide to learn what salvation is or not. So, you want to learn it? Go for it. You seem just like the kind of guy who could do justice to it.
Added bonus: You keep saying you're not in the position to help anyone. Do you think MacArthur winged that sermon? Consider how much time he took to gather that information and then how to present it. Didn't it help you? Nothing says you can't do the same thing and help someone else!
You really do have an inquisitive mind. Let God use that. I can so see you coming back in a few years and having a presentation that even I can understand on what is salvation! We need people who can bring it to "even I can understand" levels. There's a lot of even-I's out here hoping to understand these kinds of things.
Nothing says you can't go with more than one concordance just to find where the verses for "salvation," "saved," "Hell," "Hades," "darkness" are, so you can then read the context to see what that says about it.
Also, Vine's Expository helps. As do a number of other Bible aids. (eSword.net gives away downloads to all the books I've mentioned, so no need to spend your life savings.) If I want to study a concept in the Bible, I can't do it with just one version, for the same reason you can't. Nephilim is easy. Twice in the whole Bible. Salvation? All over the place and different scholars used different words. (And I don't really feel like spending the next 20 years of my life learning Greek or Hebrew. I'm just not good with languages. lol)
Now! I expect a complete report from you on Salvation by this time next week. lol
Just kidding. I suspect that will take you a couple of years, at least. BUT, those years will come and go if you decide to learn what salvation is or not. So, you want to learn it? Go for it. You seem just like the kind of guy who could do justice to it.
Added bonus: You keep saying you're not in the position to help anyone. Do you think MacArthur winged that sermon? Consider how much time he took to gather that information and then how to present it. Didn't it help you? Nothing says you can't do the same thing and help someone else!
You really do have an inquisitive mind. Let God use that. I can so see you coming back in a few years and having a presentation that even I can understand on what is salvation! We need people who can bring it to "even I can understand" levels. There's a lot of even-I's out here hoping to understand these kinds of things.
D
Nope. Apparently your preference, which is fine. But, you are getting your understanding of the Bible somewhere besides "only the Bible." We all do! It's okay to listen to preachers, just as long as we understand if they're worth listening to.
You were going after a guy for being a preacher and attacking him, as if you would never stoop so low. It's not low anymore than the guy out of Florida. MacArthur is wordy. (So am I. lol) He uses words above my vocabulary skills, but he's good. He's good. And he got good by studying. Don't put down a guy just because you don't listen to him. Especially when you said you only get your info from the Bible.
That's all.
You were going after a guy for being a preacher and attacking him, as if you would never stoop so low. It's not low anymore than the guy out of Florida. MacArthur is wordy. (So am I. lol) He uses words above my vocabulary skills, but he's good. He's good. And he got good by studying. Don't put down a guy just because you don't listen to him. Especially when you said you only get your info from the Bible.
That's all.
D
Got to ask -- if God miraculously healed you and you could and did go to church, would you give up guy out of Ft. Lauderdale?
I'm guessing not, because you really like him. Once we like someone, we stick with them.
So no ONLY. You really like the guy.
I really like MacArthur. (Don't worry. Not expecting you to like him, just because I do. lol)
I'm guessing not, because you really like him. Once we like someone, we stick with them.
So no ONLY. You really like the guy.
I really like MacArthur. (Don't worry. Not expecting you to like him, just because I do. lol)
LEV. 11:27.
And whatsoever goeth upon his paws, among all manner of beasts that go on all four,
those are unclean unto you: whoso toucheth their carcase shall be unclean until the even.
we have a choice, Thank God, and we, hub and i are definitely 'believing-HIM' for
knowing/telling us what we need in order to live a good and healthy life while in
His Army...as opposed when we were not...
And whatsoever goeth upon his paws, among all manner of beasts that go on all four,
those are unclean unto you: whoso toucheth their carcase shall be unclean until the even.
we have a choice, Thank God, and we, hub and i are definitely 'believing-HIM' for
knowing/telling us what we need in order to live a good and healthy life while in
His Army...as opposed when we were not...
[SUP]14 [/SUP]“For it will be like a man going on a journey, who called his servants[SUP][a][/SUP] and entrusted to them his property. [SUP]15 [/SUP]To one he gave five talents,[SUP][b][/SUP] to another two, to another one, to each according to his ability. Then he went away. [SUP]16 [/SUP]He who had received the five talents went at once and traded with them, and he made five talents more. [SUP]17 [/SUP]So also he who had the two talents made two talents more. [SUP]18 [/SUP]But he who had received the one talent went and dug in the ground and hid his master's money. [SUP]19 [/SUP]Now after a long time the master of those servants came and settled accounts with them. [SUP]20 [/SUP]And he who had received the five talents came forward, bringing five talents more, saying, ‘Master, you delivered to me five talents; here, I have made five talents more.’ [SUP]21 [/SUP]His master said to him, ‘Well done, good and faithful servant.[SUP][c][/SUP] You have been faithful over a little; I will set you over much. Enter into the joy of your master.’ [SUP]22 [/SUP]And he also who had the two talents came forward, saying, ‘Master, you delivered to me two talents; here, I have made two talents more.’ [SUP]23 [/SUP]His master said to him, ‘Well done, good and faithful servant. You have been faithful over a little; I will set you over much. Enter into the joy of your master.’ [SUP]24 [/SUP]He also who had received the one talent came forward, saying, ‘Master, I knew you to be a hard man, reaping where you did not sow, and gathering where you scattered no seed, [SUP]25 [/SUP]so I was afraid, and I went and hid your talent in the ground. Here, you have what is yours.’ [SUP]26 [/SUP]But his master answered him, ‘You wicked and slothful servant! You knew that I reap where I have not sown and gather where I scattered no seed? [SUP]27 [/SUP]Then you ought to have invested my money with the bankers, and at my coming I should have received what was my own with interest. [SUP]28 [/SUP]So take the talent from him and give it to him who has the ten talents. [SUP]29 [/SUP]For to everyone who has will more be given, and he will have an abundance. But from the one who has not, even what he has will be taken away. [SUP]30 [/SUP]And cast the worthless servant into the outer darkness. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’
One of my favorite parables. I, too, have witnessed to a classmate on his deathbed. I went after a friend told me he was dying. When I asked if he knew Jesus, the reply was, "It's too late for that!". No, I determined, it was not. So I went to hear AC/DC Hell's Bells playing at his side. No way! I brought Christian CD's the next day. One more visit on a Saturday. I considered not going but the Holy Spirit nearly pushed me out of the house. Here's why...as I returned after witnessing to him, it started to snow. Before Sunday morning, it was a blizzard. I had opted to go Sunday because he was in the same town as my church thereby saving gas. No church on Sunday. Crews cleaned up Monday making travel impossible. My classmate died on Tuesday morning. Had I not been obedient, it may have cost him his soul. My talent. My one gift. I have more now. I was a new Christian then. The Holy Spirit confirmed he went home to heaven. If you don't know how that feels, to have the Holy Spirit confirm something, that's what's missing in your life, perhaps. Soon enough you'll have testimonies aplenty to share. God bless and prayers for the journey. -student
One of my favorite parables. I, too, have witnessed to a classmate on his deathbed. I went after a friend told me he was dying. When I asked if he knew Jesus, the reply was, "It's too late for that!". No, I determined, it was not. So I went to hear AC/DC Hell's Bells playing at his side. No way! I brought Christian CD's the next day. One more visit on a Saturday. I considered not going but the Holy Spirit nearly pushed me out of the house. Here's why...as I returned after witnessing to him, it started to snow. Before Sunday morning, it was a blizzard. I had opted to go Sunday because he was in the same town as my church thereby saving gas. No church on Sunday. Crews cleaned up Monday making travel impossible. My classmate died on Tuesday morning. Had I not been obedient, it may have cost him his soul. My talent. My one gift. I have more now. I was a new Christian then. The Holy Spirit confirmed he went home to heaven. If you don't know how that feels, to have the Holy Spirit confirm something, that's what's missing in your life, perhaps. Soon enough you'll have testimonies aplenty to share. God bless and prayers for the journey. -student