Sabbath

[Rainrider]

O-O...don't go there ! they love to hand out these labels to anyone who is obedient to Jesus. .stabbing insults is what they are good at...never speak to them, let it pass !

Sory it's not in me to let a thing like that go. Been told many times I need to find my reverse and use it from time to time. Just not built that way, HaShem didn't put any back up in me sorry. I can deal, and remain respectful at the same time. Having dealt with folks like that many times in my life, I see the bate, yet some how like a cat with mouse, I can't walk away.
When it comes to things like that, I really have a hard time with it. I also for some reason can't see Yeshua not fighting for the under dog, and setting the record strait. Besides, if they are just looking for a fight, and will not use reason, or be respectful, they really should not be here at all.

 

[Rainrider]

Jesus fulfilled the whole of the Law on our behalf because we are incapable of doing that ourselves.

Going back over the post on here, I found your. As I know I have not replied to it, I wish to do so now.

The Mosaic Law is not a spiritual Buffet. You are not supposed to pick the bits you like and ignore the rest its all or nothing.

Though I can say you are right o some extent, I must ask. If every one of HaShems Laws are ment for every person on earth, why did He take teh time to make it clear what Laws are intended for every walk of life. The Priest have one set, the High priest another, Women yet another, There are laws for farmers, as well as teachers. This can go on and on, until I named every line of work, every walk of life, and ever stage of life. So when a person says that law is not for me, are doing so to keep from having to follow it, or is it that the law really is for another walk of life?

Regarding the Sabbath do those who make such an issue of it actually keep it? It runs from Sunset on Friday to Sunset on Saturday. Do they really start at Sunset on Friday ? If they dont keep the Sabbath Law to the letter they are breaking it just as much as someone who ignores all of it.

I can speak for everyone, Though I do know many other than my self that do follow the Shabbot, as it is given in Torah. Some of us even go so fare as to keep, Shmita. even outside Eretz Yisrael.
One thing you miss understand, as do most Law experts, is that the Law was not, is not, and never will be, a physical act. It was, is, and will always be, a spiritual act for them that keep it. Though this can only become true in the hearts of people that truly understand it, and don't try to place the whole of the law on a people that do it was not meant for. It was never meat to be what many think of today, as most only get a look at it, and then hear about Rabbinic Law, then add the 2 together.
This is often seen in many teachings. I won't go naming doctrines, or running them down, that simply is not right. Yet if one walks in to a church or meeting place, and finds they are faced with ritual, and not true study, or a mix of both. They may wish to remove them self.

 

[Rainrider]

You would have to be well up on scripture to keep the conversation flowing...and even then there is absolutely no guarantee of a happy outcome and it could come to 'fisticuffs when insults start flying.
Jesus is not always the meek, mild and gentle pushover portrayed in christianity...what He said got Him killed.

Sorry I must have missed this post.

You are right in what you say, yet to find out if it can be done, I opened a dialog with a vary close friend to see. I picked him, as him and his wife know me well. Sometimes it is a bit scary, almost like they know me better than I do my self. We didn't pick a topic, ( that come back to cut off a head or 2) so all I can do wait and see what reply I get.
I only sent one passage in my email.
Isa 9:10 The bricks are fallen down, but we will build with hewn stones: the sycomores are cut down, but we will change them into cedars.

I may be wrong, though I think they will get the idea. After all, we have talked of Johnathon Coin a lot, Thats why I picked it.

 

[beta]

Sory it's not in me to let a thing like that go. Been told many times I need to find my reverse and use it from time to time. Just not built that way, HaShem didn't put any back up in me sorry. I can deal, and remain respectful at the same time. Having dealt with folks like that many times in my life, I see the bate, yet some how like a cat with mouse, I can't walk away.
When it comes to things like that, I really have a hard time with it. I also for some reason can't see Yeshua not fighting for the under dog, and setting the record strait. Besides, if they are just looking for a fight, and will not use reason, or be respectful, they really should not be here at all.

Thing is they see us as intruders and yes...somehow we are not 'in tune with christian traditions'...so I can see their point...does not make it right tho'. What should matter to ANY man/woman is what matters to God !!!

 

[Rainrider]

Thing is they see us as intruders and yes...somehow we are not 'in tune with christian traditions'...so I can see their point...does not make it right tho'. What should matter to ANY man/woman is what matters to God !!!

Can't the same be side of them? I mean if we open a discussion on the Law, and they enter into it, and become disruptive, are they not in the wrong? What they and others need to understand is that on an open forum like this, they are going to find that not everyone sees things the same way. So if you or I are looking for a place to talk with others that ONLY see the Word as we do, then we need to find a closed forum that is what we are looking for. I love the open exchange of ideas, and teachings. One dose not need to be forceful, or hateful. The idea behind this type of forum is to be respectful, have open and honest talks of things we may not know. Be open to others understanding, and really look at them. There is no need to say how wrong another person is. After all, not one person on here can say they know they are 100% right.
That is why, if you watch me, you will find I always ask question. In fact it is most likely about 85% of my post. Don't get me wrong, I also give my understanding. Most of the time it comes only after I know where the other person stands. You see, I found sometime back, that if you find out what they follow first, you have a better chance of finding out what they really think. Their are some that want you to put your thoughts out their first, so they can see the best way to attack you.
Yes I can be a bit forceful in my attempt to gt their ideas placed out their first. That may be wrong on my part. Yet a person with true understanding, is the one I want to talk with. How do we know them? A person with true understanding is not rude, they don't get angry, they are patient, and always show love. Sound like any we both know? No I am not talking about you or me, their is one other. Hint, His avatar is a night.

 

[Rainrider]

Now that I think about it, maybe we should open a thread on the Law. May be interesting to learn how some of the others see it.

 

[beta]

Going back over the post on here, I found your. As I know I have not replied to it, I wish to do so now.




Though I can say you are right o some extent, I must ask. If every one of HaShems Laws are ment for every person on earth, why did He take teh time to make it clear what Laws are intended for every walk of life. The Priest have one set, the High priest another, Women yet another, There are laws for farmers, as well as teachers. This can go on and on, until I named every line of work, every walk of life, and ever stage of life. So when a person says that law is not for me, are doing so to keep from having to follow it, or is it that the law really is for another walk of life?



I can speak for everyone, Though I do know many other than my self that do follow the Shabbot, as it is given in Torah. Some of us even go so fare as to keep, Shmita. even outside Eretz Yisrael.
One thing you miss understand, as do most Law experts, is that the Law was not, is not, and never will be, a physical act. It was, is, and will always be, a spiritual act for them that keep it. Though this can only become true in the hearts of people that truly understand it, and don't try to place the whole of the law on a people that do it was not meant for. It was never meat to be what many think of today, as most only get a look at it, and then hear about Rabbinic Law, then add the 2 together.
This is often seen in many teachings. I won't go naming doctrines, or running them down, that simply is not right. Yet if one walks in to a church or meeting place, and finds they are faced with ritual, and not true study, or a mix of both. They may wish to remove them self.

Yes there is a lot of confusion re the sabbath. Plain fact is God wants us to assemble (or at least spend time in His Word) especially on the sabbath HIS holy Day to be INSTRUCTED by Him Lev23....if we only want to worship that can be done any time. Christianity has put the two together on another day which is bound to estrange and confuse...scripture says 'put difference between holy and unholy and Jesus teaching us to DO the Fathers Will...not meddle with what we are given.
HE kept His Fathers Commandments including the sabbath and these 10 are a complete law by themselves...not to be broken !
Moses law contained in ordinances and works have been dealt with by Jesus on the cross Eph 2v15 and are no part of God's Com which are spiritual, eternal, holy, just and good Rom 7.
GOD gave the 10 to all the PEOPLE assembled (not Moses only) Ex 20; Deut 5. to which He added no more v22 - therefore other coms coming through Moses are separate...God showing the difference/separation between carnal works and spiritual observance.

 

[beta]

Now that I think about it, maybe we should open a thread on the Law. May be interesting to learn how some of the others see it.

You want to bring WW3 down on us again ? better look for my Armour ! may be better never to take it off lol. the way we are constantly under attack.

 

[Blik]

I still always find it amazing that people actually think God is so concerned about which day we get together as worshipers.

It amazes me that people feel it is important to them to choose their own day when God says "follow me".

I have been searching for information about the church as it was in the age of the apostles when it was called "The Way". From the little I have found it was a much different church from our church today. I have searched and found who made changes to the church and why. The changes were not scripture based but were from ideas derived from outside scripture.

 

[beta]

Can't the same be side of them? I mean if we open a discussion on the Law, and they enter into it, and become disruptive, are they not in the wrong? What they and others need to understand is that on an open forum like this, they are going to find that not everyone sees things the same way. So if you or I are looking for a place to talk with others that ONLY see the Word as we do, then we need to find a closed forum that is what we are looking for. I love the open exchange of ideas, and teachings. One dose not need to be forceful, or hateful. The idea behind this type of forum is to be respectful, have open and honest talks of things we may not know. Be open to others understanding, and really look at them. There is no need to say how wrong another person is. After all, not one person on here can say they know they are 100% right.
That is why, if you watch me, you will find I always ask question. In fact it is most likely about 85% of my post. Don't get me wrong, I also give my understanding. Most of the time it comes only after I know where the other person stands. You see, I found sometime back, that if you find out what they follow first, you have a better chance of finding out what they really think. Their are some that want you to put your thoughts out their first, so they can see the best way to attack you.
Yes I can be a bit forceful in my attempt to gt their ideas placed out their first. That may be wrong on my part. Yet a person with true understanding, is the one I want to talk with. How do we know them? A person with true understanding is not rude, they don't get angry, they are patient, and always show love. Sound like any we both know? No I am not talking about you or me, their is one other. Hint, His avatar is a night.

love your post and agree with it...hope this Knight we know comes to our aid...would not want you slaughtered on your own. I am an old woman and not much up to fighting....
thought about changing my name to BOADECEA but I am really more of a 'mother Hen ! and you had better sharpen your sword my boy (no offence but I have a son older than you)!

 

[beta]

It amazes me that people feel it is important to them to choose their own day when God says "follow me".

I have been searching for information about the church as it was in the age of the apostles when it was called "The Way". From the little I have found it was a much different church from our church today. I have searched and found who made changes to the church and why. The changes were not scripture based but were from ideas derived from outside scripture.

Agree with you. Some people don't know yet to 'put difference between holy and unholy Lev 10v10. not
doing so causes impurity and pollution, blurring the issue, etc etc...as seen from the arguments that ensue !

 

[beta]

Yes New Mexico. Only 18 miles from Tx going east, and 80 or so going south.

Hay you can't blame a man for trying can you? After brakeing my back in 2001, it is had to do much walking. Tell you what, I am willing to walk with you, and then if one of us falls down, we will have some help getting back up. LOL

Well,well,well you breaking your back and me my hip and leg makes us a right pair of warriers hahaha, can't stop laughing . easy to see WHY we need JESUS ! Let's just keep our HEADS intact then.
(won't be around this afternoon, visiting my son who foolishly also broke his hip a few months back)

 

[beta]

Going back over the post on here, I found your. As I know I have not replied to it, I wish to do so now.




Though I can say you are right o some extent, I must ask. If every one of HaShems Laws are ment for every person on earth, why did He take teh time to make it clear what Laws are intended for every walk of life. The Priest have one set, the High priest another, Women yet another, There are laws for farmers, as well as teachers. This can go on and on, until I named every line of work, every walk of life, and ever stage of life. So when a person says that law is not for me, are doing so to keep from having to follow it, or is it that the law really is for another walk of life?



I can speak for everyone, Though I do know many other than my self that do follow the Shabbot, as it is given in Torah. Some of us even go so fare as to keep, Shmita. even outside Eretz Yisrael.
One thing you miss understand, as do most Law experts, is that the Law was not, is not, and never will be, a physical act. It was, is, and will always be, a spiritual act for them that keep it. Though this can only become true in the hearts of people that truly understand it, and don't try to place the whole of the law on a people that do it was not meant for. It was never meat to be what many think of today, as most only get a look at it, and then hear about Rabbinic Law, then add the 2 together.
This is often seen in many teachings. I won't go naming doctrines, or running them down, that simply is not right. Yet if one walks in to a church or meeting place, and finds they are faced with ritual, and not true study, or a mix of both. They may wish to remove them self.

You will have to explain this more fully in Baby-english when we have more time. I may be old physically but not out of the Baby-stage spiritually. bless

 

[JohnTalmid]

That is really either dishonest or just dumb.

Hebrews 7:11 [FONT=&quot]If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, [/FONT][FONT=&quot](for under it the people received the law,)[/FONT][FONT=&quot] what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?[/FONT]

For under it the people received the law. The People didn't receive the law that governed the Levites... They received all the law. Starting with the 10 commandments.

Again either dishonest or just dumb.

Its circular reasoning to say that the law that governed the Levites changed because the Lord wasn't from that tribe. So the only thing that needed to be changed was this exception...??? No, no, no... Gross Conceptual Error.

There HAD to be a reason that the Priesthood was changed. And the reason for it was a NEW Way. A change in the Way that Gods People come to Him and Worship Him.


As mostly is the case, your focus is on the wrong thing....

What is far more evident? Not that the Lord arises after the similitude of Melchisidec. What is far more evident TO CHRISTIANS is that The Lord Has made a Way that is not after a Carnal Commandment but after the Power of an endless life.


Matthew 11:28 [FONT=&quot]Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

The Lord is relieving us of our work at a carnal commandment. How can He do that? Because the Priesthood being changed there is of necessity a change also of the law.

2 Corinthians 3:6-9
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]9 For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.

This is the Rest that the Lord Jesus Christ gives us. His Holy Spirit. The NEW Testament. The Ministration of Righteousness and Eternal Life.

So now, for Christians, we don't follow after a Carnal Commandment, we don't follow after the Ministration of Death or the Ministration of Condemnation. We follow after what the Lord Jesus Has Changed and that is the Ministration of Righteousness and Eternal Life. The Ministration of the Spirit.

Galatians 3:3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

2 Corinthians 3:14 But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.

If your mind is blinded and you haven't been to Christ then you have no other choice, no other understanding, but to work at the law in the OT.

If you have been to Christ and you continue at working at the carnal commandment are you just foolish? Can you not work it out? Are you better off with your work and your understanding or the Lords Work and His Understanding?[/FONT]

Malkizadik or King of righteousness is Messiah. Levitical priests where for the assembly of Israel. The renewed priesthood is of the order of the God of Heaven still however it no longer rests with the tribe of levite but with those who believe the Messiah. As such if you disagree with God and keeping Sabbath day you still haven't entered into the promise of rest, peace, and yes even salvation because your works could not confirm the covenant or promise. Repent means not only to change your mind, it also means to agree with God.

 

[beta]

Now that I think about it, maybe we should open a thread on the Law. May be interesting to learn how some of the others see it.

Friend...we already know...they have either nailed it to the cross or they have died to it !!! either way...it/the commandments have no effect in their lives - ALL are considered the law of Moses and abolished. They make no distinction between the temporary works law of Moses and the eternal spiritual law to love God and neighbour.

 

[Grandpa]

Malkizadik or King of righteousness is Messiah. Levitical priests where for the assembly of Israel. The renewed priesthood is of the order of the God of Heaven still however it no longer rests with the tribe of levite but with those who believe the Messiah. As such if you disagree with God and keeping Sabbath day you still haven't entered into the promise of rest, peace, and yes even salvation because your works could not confirm the covenant or promise. Repent means not only to change your mind, it also means to agree with God.

Galatians 3:10-12
[FONT=&quot]10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.

Its ok that you don't understand these verses.

Romans 8:1-4
[/FONT]
1[FONT=Helvetica Neue, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

Do you read the New Testament at all? Its pretty good.


[/FONT]

 

[Rainrider]

Well,well,well you breaking your back and me my hip and leg makes us a right pair of warriers hahaha, can't stop laughing . easy to see WHY we need JESUS ! Let's just keep our HEADS intact then.
(won't be around this afternoon, visiting my son who foolishly also broke his hip a few months back)

Well add him to my prayers. I do pray he heals up better than we seen to have. LOL

I keep my head down in my shell like a turtle. Just need me a good hard hat to cover what sticks up.

 

[gotime]

As long as they keep quoting the NT with no proof or backing of their position from the OT they are simply speaking private interpretations. Until they can prove their point from the OT they have nothing. The reason they ignore your points and mine is because we use both the NT and the OT.

 

[Rainrider]

Friend...we already know...they have either nailed it to the cross or they have died to it !!! either way...it/the commandments have no effect in their lives - ALL are considered the law of Moses and abolished. They make no distinction between the temporary works law of Moses and the eternal spiritual law to love God and neighbour.

I am willing to bet you that they follow a lot more of the Law they wish to think, or let on anyway. If they would be 100% honest in their answer I could show you. Just think out side the box for a second. do they see any form of perverted sex as being with out sin? Right there covers around,20 laws that come from out side the 10 C. I haven't even started on the ones that if asked about in their context, thery would first say no that one is gone, then when explained they would say it was not the same thing. LOL
See I keep my sward sharp at all times. NO point trying to cut down a tree with a dull blade of any kind.

 

[Rainrider]

As long as they keep quoting the NT with no proof or backing of their position from the OT they are simply speaking private interpretations. Until they can prove their point from the OT they have nothing. The reason they ignore your points and mine is because we use both the NT and the OT.

Amen. If you will also notice, they only use Paul, and a little,(vary little ) of what Yeshua said.
So if we rove any partds of the NT that, quote, future to, or hints at the OT, how much do you think would be left?