is the bible always the authority (heresy alert, dont click!)

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Grace777x70

Grace777x70

Banned
#41
Nov 22, 2015
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#41
resurrection33 said:
The purpose of the Bible is to bring us into a personal relationship with the Lord. Some people read their Bibles and adhere to much of it, without ever developing a personal relationship with the Lord.
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Well said!

We don't have a "relationship" with a "book". Jesus Himself is the true word of God. The scriptures reveal Christ Himself when illuminated by the Holy Spirit.

Jesus is the Word within the word.

We are just as dependent on the Holy Spirit to reveal Christ and His finished work on the cross and resurrection as Mary was dependent on the Holy Spirit to conceive Jesus in her womb.

Without this - we can create a religion and there is a religion of Christianity too - we just use terms like God, Jesus, word of God, Spirit of God....etc.

Jesus said it perfectly -

John 5:39-40 (NASB)
[SUP]39 [/SUP] "You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; it is these that testify about Me;

[SUP]40 [/SUP] and you are unwilling to come to Me so that you may have life.

Luke 24:44-45 (NASB)
[SUP]44 [/SUP] Now He said to them, "These are My words which I spoke to you while I was still with you, that all things which are written about Me in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and the Psalms must be fulfilled."
[SUP]45 [/SUP] Then He opened their minds to understand the Scriptures,
 
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sevenseas

Guest
#42
#42
Willie-T said:
I think it depends on what a person may be reading to find.

As one man puts it concerning the Book of Revelation (though this could apply to the entire Bible):
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this can very well be true

nonetheless the Bible is not just any book and I know you are not saying that

the Bible is not bits and pieces of incoherence but a revealing and if we allow, a tearing of the temple curtain from top to bottom

I am sure you have had the experience of reading what you have read before and find yourself caught by words that did not have that import

the word of God is alive...does another book claim that?


For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
Hebrews 4:12

it is not just a book or quotes from God

do we believe that this word is active or not?

with all the false prophets and koo koo hyper charasmatic nonsense, there is no other safe place to land

I am saying far less then I think or believe, but the Bible itself tells us what it is
 
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sevenseas

Guest
#43
#43
SovereignGrace said:
Huh? The bible is our authority, seeing the Christ does not speak to us verbally. It is His words written to us. Without the scriptures, none of can know 'what sayeth the Lord'.
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and we see what happens when people add to it, subtract from it or are so rigid in it (words without relationship)

people have died so we have it, continue to die to have it, it is smuggled into countries where it is against the law to have it and some characters want to tear out parts of the new testament and scramble the rest
 
resurrection33

resurrection33

Banned
#44
Dec 19, 2009
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#44
SovereignGrace said:
Huh? The bible is our authority, seeing the Christ does not speak to us verbally. It is His words written to us. Without the scriptures, none of can know 'what sayeth the Lord'.
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No, the Bible isn't the authority. God is the authority.
 
resurrection33

resurrection33

Banned
#45
Dec 19, 2009
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#45
J7 said:
God's Word is God's Promise and God is faithful to his promises.

Even when he wanted to destroy every Israelite, he still planned to start a new lineage through Moses.

Really God's Word is indistinguishable from God himself
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But you have to understand what God's word is.
 
Grace777x70

Grace777x70

Banned
#46
Nov 22, 2015
20,436
1,431
0
#46
resurrection33 said:
No, the Bible isn't the authority. God is the authority.
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Sometimes what can happen in all of us is this:

If you don't agree with my and my group's "interpretation" of the scriptures - then you are not believing "the bible". It's the way of the flesh. Only the Holy Spirit can reveal Christ to us and what the scriptures are saying to us all.

We only know "in part" and we all see through a glass darkly because of this flesh we are in because all things must pass through our brains. The proper renewing of the mind to the things of the Spirit are vital to walking out in this life the life of Christ in all of us that believe.

The people before Jesus came had no idea what Christ was actually doing. Even His own disciples who were with Him for 3 years - still after the Lord telling them in some form or other 17 times that He was going to die to bring in the kingdom - they still didn't understand it.

We thank God for the written scriptures as they point us to Christ Himself and has been pointed out - many have died to bring them to us.
 
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NoNameMcgee

Guest
#47
#47
sevenseas said:
I am sure you have had the experience of reading what you have read before and find yourself caught by words that did not have that import


it is not just a book or quotes from God
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i agree with this
 
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NoNameMcgee

Guest
#48
#48
Grace777x70 said:
Sometimes what can happen in all of us is this:

If you don't agree with my and my group's "interpretation" of the scriptures - then you are not believing "the bible". It's the way of the flesh. Only the Holy Spirit can reveal Christ to us and what the scriptures are saying to us all.

We only know "in part" and we all see through a glass darkly because of this flesh we are in because all things must pass through our brains. The proper renewing of the mind to the things of the Spirit are vital to walking out in this life the life of Christ in all of us that believe.

The people before Jesus came had no idea what Christ was actually doing. Even His own disciples who were with Him for 3 years - still after the Lord telling them in some form or other 17 times that He was going to die to bring in the kingdom - they still didn't understand it.

We thank God for the written scriptures as they point us to Christ Himself and has been pointed out - many have died to bring them to us.
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also agree with this


well said sir
 
S

sevenseas

Guest
#49
#49
resurrection33 said:
No, the Bible isn't the authority. God is the authority.
Click to expand...

where does the Bible originate?

is it men's ideas or is it inspired as the Bible itself says it is

the Bible IS God's authority and what He has revealed of Himself to mankind

this is actually what the Bible says

stating that God is the authority you are actually in agreement with what I and others said here, because God inspired it through His Spirit



For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
Hebrews 4:12
 
Willie-T

Willie-T

Banned
#50
Feb 7, 2015
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#50
sevenseas said:
this can very well be true

nonetheless the Bible is not just any book and I know you are not saying that

the Bible is not bits and pieces of incoherence but a revealing and if we allow, a tearing of the temple curtain from top to bottom

I am sure you have had the experience of reading what you have read before and find yourself caught by words that did not have that import

the word of God is alive...does another book claim that?


For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
Hebrews 4:12

it is not just a book or quotes from God

do we believe that this word is active or not?

with all the false prophets and koo koo hyper charasmatic nonsense, there is no other safe place to land

I am saying far less then I think or believe, but the Bible itself tells us what it is
Click to expand...
Yet, as we see, time and time, and time again... right here on this forum... many of us often will NOT allow that to ever happen. They are convinced the Tabernacle Tent still stands as it was built in the desert, wholly untouched by the sacrifice of Jesus.
 
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sevenseas

Guest
#51
#51
Willie-T said:
Yet, as we see, time and time, and time again... right here on this forum... many of us often will NOT allow that to ever happen. They are convinced the Tabernacle Tent still stands as it was built in the desert, wholly untouched by the sacrifice of Jesus.
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can't do nuttin 'bout dat...:p

it is actually allow as you say

I have always been and remain to this day, a seeker

but not the seeker church kind of seeker

one time I was studying about the tabernacle (was putting together something for church Sunday am) and found myself thinking of the tabernacle in heaven

I'm like...what?...so I looked it up and there it was

3Every high priest is appointed to offer both gifts and sacrifices, and so it was necessary for this one also to have something to offer. 4If he were on earth, he would not be a priest, for there are already priests who offer the gifts prescribed by the law.

5They serve at a sanctuary that is a copy and shadow of what is in heaven. This is why Moses was warned when he was about to build the tabernacle: “See to it that you make everything according to the pattern shown you on the mountain.”[SUP]a[/SUP]

6But in fact the ministry Jesus has received is as superior to theirs as the covenant of which he is mediator is superior to the old one, since the new covenant is established on better promises. Hebrews 8

that was news to me. God speaks to us through His word and speaks His word INTO us

I get goosebumps thinking about it sometimes and some of the ways He has spoken to me

I have no problem accepting God speaks to us..hey I've heard audible singing but I guess that makes me off a bit haha

I've had my fair share of what God allows for me but I don't talk about things like that much for obvious reasons

but I stick to the word and don't partake of the bizarre goings on that seem to pass in some circles for the Holy Spirit

my take is that God has revealed His will to us. It's called the Bible. before someone goes looking for more, they better understand what He has already said because He says the same things to all of us

and that does not discount how He reveals Himself to us personally in ways we know it is Him
 
resurrection33

resurrection33

Banned
#52
Dec 19, 2009
27,513
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#52
sevenseas said:
where does the Bible originate?

is it men's ideas or is it inspired as the Bible itself says it is

the Bible IS God's authority and what He has revealed of Himself to mankind

this is actually what the Bible says

stating that God is the authority you are actually in agreement with what I and others said here, because God inspired it through His Spirit



For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
Hebrews 4:12
Click to expand...
Where does the Bible originate? Well, I've heard the history was passed down orally in the beginning. The epistles were written by the people the epistles were named after, I assume, though I think there is debate about that. Same with the gospels. Some of the Psalms were written by David. Read the Bible yourself and find out where the books came from.
 
SovereignGrace

SovereignGrace

Senior Member
#53
Dec 28, 2016
5,455
236
63
#53
Grace777x70 said:
Well said!

We don't have a "relationship" with a "book". Jesus Himself is the true word of God. The scriptures reveal Christ Himself when illuminated by the Holy Spirit.

Jesus is the Word within the word.

We are just as dependent on the Holy Spirit to reveal Christ and His finished work on the cross and resurrection as Mary was dependent on the Holy Spirit to conceive Jesus in her womb.

Without this - we can create a religion and there is a religion of Christianity too - we just use terms like God, Jesus, word of God, Spirit of God....etc.

Jesus said it perfectly -

John 5:39-40 (NASB)
[SUP]39 [/SUP] "You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; it is these that testify about Me;

[SUP]40 [/SUP] and you are unwilling to come to Me so that you may have life.

Luke 24:44-45 (NASB)
[SUP]44 [/SUP] Now He said to them, "These are My words which I spoke to you while I was still with you, that all things which are written about Me in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and the Psalms must be fulfilled."
[SUP]45 [/SUP] Then He opened their minds to understand the Scriptures,
Click to expand...
I agree we have no relationship with a 'book'. But without this 'book', we have no relationship with Whom the 'book' is about.

This is just repackaged 'AndyStanleyism'.
 
SovereignGrace

SovereignGrace

Senior Member
#54
Dec 28, 2016
5,455
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#54
resurrection33 said:
No, the Bible isn't the authority. God is the authority.
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You ever heard His voice verbally? If not, you need the bible to have Him speak to you. The bible is the final authority, as God speaks to us through it.

'AndyStanleyism' is alive and unwell on here it seems.
 
resurrection33

resurrection33

Banned
#55
Dec 19, 2009
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#55
SovereignGrace said:
You ever heard His voice verbally? If not, you need the bible to have Him speak to you. The bible is the final authority, as God speaks to us through it.

'AndyStanleyism' is alive and unwell on here it seems.
Click to expand...
God and Jesus are quoted many times in the Bible. We must obey.
 
JIMBO43

JIMBO43

Banned
#56
Mar 7, 2016
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#56
SovereignGrace said:
You ever heard His voice verbally? If not, you need the bible to have Him speak to you. The bible is the final authority, as God speaks to us through it.

'AndyStanleyism' is alive and unwell on here it seems.
Click to expand...
you know what he means .. and besides most forget God is the authority after reading the bible they become the authority,,, a bit like your character here .. blessings to you
 
Denadii

Denadii

Banned
#57
May 13, 2017
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#57
Muzungu256 said:
hahaaaaaa i know all heresy hunters will click on this........

but see i had a dream about this and im thinking does the bible always remain the final authority??????? its said today in many creeds and such..... but if u look at the bible, there are times when people are commanded to do something that the church would condemn today u see..... i mean the story where that mon is asked to marry a harlot and has to 'buy' her own wife back u see....... if u married a prost/harlot today ud be scolded for sure and bombed with bible quotes but this mon did it anyway...........
another situation is where rahab was commended for lying to the king's messengers which is in violation of the bible's commandments too (lies)............ and then we have the big patriach that big boi big man jacob who also lied to his own father and no consequences came......... there are probably more examples u see.

so what im saying is how does this fit with the bible final authority thing we read in all of the creeds these people disobeyed bible and it was fine and dandy sometimes even God ordained??????? the church would condemn all these people 100% if they did those things today........

and dont worry im not fikkle i got my helmet on its gonna be a bumpy ride for me hahahaha for this thread...... :D
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LOL Yes!! The bible is always the authority. Its pretty cool to have the Word, the whole Word, and nothing but the Word isn't it? And its right in our grubby little grabbers too!
 
Denadii

Denadii

Banned
#58
May 13, 2017
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#58
resurrection33 said:
The Bible is not the authority. The Lord is the authority. The Bible is a faithful testimony of what happened and who said what.
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A challlenge for resurrection33. The Lord is the Word, The bible is what we call the written Word. Look at it. In the beginning was the Word, the Word was made flesh, the written Word is the Word that has been around from the beginning and before. The word is what we see when we open our bible. ON and on and on....Jesus is the Word. You see and read the Word you are looking at Jesus who IS the final authority in everything.
 
Denadii

Denadii

Banned
#59
May 13, 2017
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#59
sevenseas said:
I find that more confusing than your last post

the Bible, is not confusing and God said he places His word above His name

now find that in scripture and please tell me, did God say that or not?

now if He did, you need to change what you are saying about him
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[h=1]Psalm 138:2[/h]
 
Blain

Blain

The Word Weaver
#60
Aug 28, 2012
19,212
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#60
If the bible is not the final authority then what do we test our beliefs and our views on? The Catholics mock Christians for believing in sola scripture but if you notice many of their beliefs and views are man made and contradict the bible and that is the same thing as contradicting God. True the bible is not god but it is his words and I would rather have his words to have a foundation on than anything else
 
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