How can you really really really know you are saved?

[notuptome]

You offer a question that is clearly a false dichotomy and offer advice like "better felt than telt".

And I am the one being evasive?

I too have heard of "better felt than telt". Its used by those who have nothing left to offer but feelings.

Great then prove your sincerity. Tell me why you know you are saved and offer encouragement for others who may have doubts. All I have seen here is you endeavoring to create more doubt and uncertainty. There are some things that are so intensely personal in salvation that they cannot be spoken.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[heartofdavid]

There is a certain dimension of walking with Him through trials,fire,and valleys.

(not saying I am there yet)

But I have tasted a bit if this awesome walk of trials and such.

It is different when we personally are touched by adversity.

We just went through the hurricane. Seems almost surreal,and so many have "hurricane fatigue". It flat wears you down,but thinking of those in Houston COMPLETELY wiped out.

We are so blessed. So fortunate.

I think once Jesus OWNS us for real,our focus will not stay selfish for very long. The needs of others will always be first.

How selfish we are is kinda a ruler to see how far we are from Jesus

 

[wolfwint]

I would like to hear from someone who "knows" for sure that they are not part of the "Away from me I never knew you" group.

I realize this may sound like a strange request but we all cannot be saved since many of us are calling the others blind.

In other words, how can we know we are truly sheep and not confused goats?

I am convinced that the Holy Spirit in me tell it to my Spirit. And I am trustIng the word of God more then my feelings.
Yes we should do God works, yes we should put on the New life. But to do this is not the condition to be saved!
It's grace! Not possible to deserve! Its because of Love from God! I can only speak for myself. The Lord is the one who can looks in our heart and knows who really believes in Him.

 

[DJ2]

Great then prove your sincerity. Tell me why you know you are saved and offer encouragement for others who may have doubts. All I have seen here is you endeavoring to create more doubt and uncertainty. There are some things that are so intensely personal in salvation that they cannot be spoken.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

You question my motives, offer a false dichotomy and present feelings as a defense. Now I am supposed to prove my sincerity, have you no bounds.

"There are some things that are so intensely personal in salvation that they cannot be spoken."? How about, there are times when we don't have an answer we should just admit it.

Let me be the first.

I do not understand how people with opposing gospels that clearly negate the other be both assured as well as correct. One must be right and the other wrong or possibly both are wrong. Either way at least one person's assurance is false.

Again, my question is how do we know we are not among the sincerely wrong? If this question cannot be answered I suggest the assurance that many here speak of is but wishful thinking.

Warm fuzzy feelings, you just know, personal experience, etc are not cogent answers. They may help you sleep at night but they are not biblical answers.

The God of the Bible is not a god of confusion.

If there is no 100% way to know we are saved before we die, it is better to be honest and not offer a false hope.

I trust God to always do the right thing, that thing may not be what we want.

 

[ps106]

" If you openly declare that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved."- Romans 10:9

Also comes with it, a person who truly accepted Jesus as his Lord should bear fruit of the Spirit; love, joy, peace , patience, goodness, peace, self- control (Galatians 5:22)

 

[Depleted]

You question my motives, offer a false dichotomy and present feelings as a defense. Now I am supposed to prove my sincerity, have you no bounds.

"There are some things that are so intensely personal in salvation that they cannot be spoken."? How about, there are times when we don't have an answer we should just admit it.

Let me be the first.

I do not understand how people with opposing gospels that clearly negate the other be both assured as well as correct. One must be right and the other wrong or possibly both are wrong. Either way at least one person's assurance is false.

Again, my question is how do we know we are not among the sincerely wrong? If this question cannot be answered I suggest the assurance that many here speak of is but wishful thinking.

Warm fuzzy feelings, you just know, personal experience, etc are not cogent answers. They may help you sleep at night but they are not biblical answers.

The God of the Bible is not a god of confusion.

If there is no 100% way to know we are saved before we die, it is better to be honest and not offer a false hope.

I trust God to always do the right thing, that thing may not be what we want.

23 years to study the Word, and you have yet to find the proof in it? God answers this question multiple times. You not finding it is YOU not trusting God, babe. You not finding it already? Really, really, really all you. And nope, you won't find your answer because you don't want to and have no intention of listening to God's answer. You are the confused. Not God. Not anyone who tried to give you an answer. And honestly, I don't think you're confused at all. You got the answer you wanted all along -- none.

 

[stonesoffire]

I am quite shocked to see the amount of circular reasoning being used on this thread. Post #147 is classic but not unique.

If this is the reasoning behind the notion of "assurance of salvation" then I suggest the idea is false.

Does anyone have another reason on how we can have assurance?

I was instantly changed on the inside when I was converted. All I did was to say yes to the Lord at the question which way will you go. The minute I did that, it was like something broke and I felt free.

All I knew was that I loved Jesus and I knew He loved me and that I was saved.

 

[TruthTalk]

I do not understand how people with opposing gospels that clearly negate the other be both assured as well as correct. One must be right and the other wrong or possibly both are wrong. Either way at least one person's assurance is false.

Again, my question is how do we know we are not among the sincerely wrong? If this question cannot be answered I suggest the assurance that many here speak of is but wishful thinking.

Warm fuzzy feelings, you just know, personal experience, etc are not cogent answers. They may help you sleep at night but they are not biblical answers.

The God of the Bible is not a god of confusion.

If there is no 100% way to know we are saved before we die, it is better to be honest and not offer a false hope.

I trust God to always do the right thing, that thing may not be what we want.

Hi DJ2, there is only one True Gospel; guard your faith and keep asking questions, the answers you seek are not far away. In my life I would ask the questions and pray God help me to understand. The answers did not come all at once but God is one who will truly reveal Himself to you, and the Holy Spirit will lead you into all truth.

"There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to one hope when you were called; one Lord, one faith, one baptism;one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.
"Ephesians4:4-6

 

[DJ2]

I think many have answered how.

John's epistles are filled with hows.

1 John 4:15 "Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God."

1 John 3:23-24 "And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment. And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us."

John 14:17 "Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you."

John 6:40 "And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day."

There are honestly too many to even post. It is everywhere.

I would be terrified right now if I did not have any assurance of salvation.

On the basis of your four verses, would you proclaim all Mormons as assured of salvation since they sincerely accept the truth of these scriptures?

If you doubt that they would confess these verses as true call 1-888-537-6600 and ask them yourself. If that's not enough go to www.mormon.org and schedule a visit at your home and you can ask them face to face.

The verses you present are not meant to convey a binding assurance of salvation but a symbol of hope to those who remain faithful to Jesus.

Your last sentence exposes your motives, fear. You want 100% assurance to be real so you can sleep and are willing to use any argument to make it true.

This is the difference between assurance and hope.

One who is 100% assured will no longer search for the truth because he already has it.

He who is hopeful is humble to the possibly of his own error and never closes his mind to that which might be.

So have a good nights sleep because you really, really, really better be right.

 

[Magenta]

On the basis of your four verses, would you proclaim all Mormons as assured of salvation since they sincerely accept the truth of these scriptures?

If you doubt that they would confess these verses as true call 1-888-537-6600 and ask them yourself. If that's not enough go to www.mormon.org and schedule a visit at your home and you can ask them face to face.

Mormons do not accept the truth of Scripture because they deny the Deity of Jesus Christ, saying He is a spirit brother of Satan as opposed to being the agent through which all of creation took place (including the creation of Satan). They also deny that God is eternally self existent, claiming He was a man like we are now (not meaning Jesus) and worked His way up some imaginary ladder to attain Godhood, and they will further tell you that you can do that too, and be your own God with your own universe to rule over. They claim God lives on a planet near the star of KOLOB. They also claim that God had physical relations with Mary in order for Jesus to be conceived.

 

[DJ2]

Mormons do not accept the truth of Scripture because they deny the Deity of Jesus Christ, saying He is a spirit brother of Satan as opposed to being the agent through which all of creation took place (including the creation of Satan). They also deny that God is eternally self existent, claiming He was a man like we are now (not meaning Jesus) and worked His way up some imaginary ladder to attain Godhood, and they will further tell you that you can do that too, and be your own God with your own universe to rule over. They claim God lives on a planet near the star of KOLOB. They also claim that God had physical relations with Mary in order for Jesus to be conceived.

Regardless of what other things the Mormons may believe, they accept the four verses that were presented as proof of assurance. By this theory they are assured of salvation.

I understand this may not be your view of what constitutes assurance but it is the view of many on this thread.

 

[DJ2]

I was instantly changed on the inside when I was converted. All I did was to say yes to the Lord at the question which way will you go. The minute I did that, it was like something broke and I felt free.

All I knew was that I loved Jesus and I knew He loved me and that I was saved.

Okay, add post # 227 to the circular reasoning list. I am getting rather dizzy.

 

[Magenta]

Regardless of what other things the Mormons may believe, they accept the four verses that were presented as proof of assurance. By this theory they are assured of salvation.

I understand this may not be your view of what constitutes assurance but it is the view of many on this thread.

You seem to have disagreed with everyone so far, so why are you citing them now as if they were experts? Since you have completely ignored what I said so far, so it is difficult for me to assess what you really understand of what constitutes my view, and I think you are bluffing, and don't understand at all. Since Mormons deny the Deity of Jesus Christ, they do not know Who He is. Since they deny Who He is, they will die in their sins. Jesus said so. Now you know my view.

 

[Locutus]

Question for the OP - how do you know Christ was resurrected?

 

[oldethennew]

yes,
all will die in their sins who are not called in their life-time, hence, the SECOND RESURRECTION...
read-up on it...it's truly a magnificient part, of the 'Greatest Story Ever Told That is True'...

 

[CherieR]

You question my motives, offer a false dichotomy and present feelings as a defense. Now I am supposed to prove my sincerity, have you no bounds.

"There are some things that are so intensely personal in salvation that they cannot be spoken."? How about, there are times when we don't have an answer we should just admit it.

Let me be the first.

I do not understand how people with opposing gospels that clearly negate the other be both assured as well as correct. One must be right and the other wrong or possibly both are wrong. Either way at least one person's assurance is false.

Again, my question is how do we know we are not among the sincerely wrong? If this question cannot be answered I suggest the assurance that many here speak of is but wishful thinking.

Warm fuzzy feelings, you just know, personal experience, etc are not cogent answers. They may help you sleep at night but they are not biblical answers.

The God of the Bible is not a god of confusion.

If there is no 100% way to know we are saved before we die, it is better to be honest and not offer a false hope.

I trust God to always do the right thing, that thing may not be what we want.

If you really want to look into it then you can read the evidence for Christianity and the evidence against it and decide for yourself. Whatever someone's religion, it all comes down to faith. There are wrong religions because there is only one way and his name is Jesus(see John 14:6). How can we know we are in the right as Christians and all the other religions are false? Examine the evidence. Consider the testimony of the apostles. Why would they die for Jesus claiming they saw him after he rose from the grave if there was no resurrection? Why would Peter who denied Jesus three times that he did not know him all of a sudden make up a story that Jesus rose from the grave and die for a dead man if in fact Jesus did not rise from the grave? Christianity is unique in the fact that God died for us so we may know him and it is not about earning your salvation. If we have to earn salvation as many religions say we do, we will never know if what we are doing is good enough.

 

[DJ2]

Question for the OP - how do you know Christ was resurrected?

I know Jesus was raised from the dead because the Word of God clearly states it.

I await your follow up question.

 

[DJ2]

23 years to study the Word, and you have yet to find the proof in it? God answers this question multiple times. You not finding it is YOU not trusting God, babe. You not finding it already? Really, really, really all you. And nope, you won't find your answer because you don't want to and have no intention of listening to God's answer. You are the confused. Not God. Not anyone who tried to give you an answer. And honestly, I don't think you're confused at all. You got the answer you wanted all along -- none.

Where do you get 23 years from?

 

[DJ2]

You seem to have disagreed with everyone so far, so why are you citing them now as if they were experts? Since you have completely ignored what I said so far, so it is difficult for me to assess what you really understand of what constitutes my view, and I think you are bluffing, and don't understand at all. Since Mormons deny the Deity of Jesus Christ, they do not know Who He is. Since they deny Who He is, they will die in their sins. Jesus said so. Now you know my view.

I was not trying to prove or disprove mormonism, just the weakness of using the belief in those four verses as proof of assurance. Did you not see this?

I believe everything you wrote about Mormons not being Christians. I have presented your arguments to Mormons myself.

 

[DJ2]

You seem to have disagreed with everyone so far, so why are you citing them now as if they were experts? Since you have completely ignored what I said so far, so it is difficult for me to assess what you really understand of what constitutes my view, and I think you are bluffing, and don't understand at all. Since Mormons deny the Deity of Jesus Christ, they do not know Who He is. Since they deny Who He is, they will die in their sins. Jesus said so. Now you know my view.

When you wrote, "so why are you citing them now as if they were experts?".

Who are the "them" and "they"?