Not By Works

[PeterJens]

how many times have we asked? They never answer, they blame shift, and then start to stir the pot as someone said earlier To try to get the focus off them.

"They never answer"

Now this is a lie. Why do I know this?
Because if an answer is given, just once it is proven false.
And the answer has been provided thousands of times.

So why sin and lie? Why sin and think nothing of it? Because ones heart is cold and ones
relationship with God is distant and theoretical. Listen to their theology.

They are saved no matter what they do and now believe in the future. They could abuse who
they like and sin a little or a lot, because one sin is as bad as thousands, so if you fail on one
and are covered by Christ no matter what, why not go the whole hog, and get it all in.

Their hearts do not think of the harm they are doing to themselves and those they lie about.
The targets of their lies are scum bags, who are so evil, the worst evil in the world cannot compare.
And the slander and insults the enemy create make them far worse than us so lying about them is
the kindest thing we could do. They deserve to die, roasted in hell like a barbeque.

This is the emotional spirit I read and feel from them. It is staggering how dislocated from God they
are and any caring morality, or even simple politeness.

It gets so bad, when I think back to the trigger, it has always been like here a lie spoken.
They want conflict, they want trouble, they want uncontrolled anger, and rage, but praise the Lord
in Him and the cross we have the victory.

My friends, mockers will always come, thinking themselves angels of light, but their fruit shows
their heart. God bless them, because they do not know what they are doing or where they really
stand.

One member who I spent a year back and forth with, eventually came clean. They had got really
hurt and just wanted to do me harm. I was truly sorry they felt hurt, because all I was sharing is
the Lord and His truth and love. I had forgiven them a long time before that, but it was good to
see love break through. Some here as in the world will never come through, but thankfully some
will, and in love we must continue to walk, respecting God and His will above all else.

 

[PeterJens]

Do you love me? I love you, because you are a follower of Christ, because you are a sinner
who needs a saviour, because you are lost in hurt and pain and looking for victims on which
to vent.

And I would if the situation came to it, die for you. Why? Because I am just a flower in a
garden, I bloom and am gone. If I can bring eternal light to you life, amen, glory to God,
because death is just passing through the veil between us and Christ.

Life is a blessing and also a curse, because it is a fallen world and to be with Christ is so
much better. But it is He who calls and decides not me or us.

Love takes no prisoners. You know something is wrong when love leaves the room in your
heart. I know how this happens, and many times I have been caught here.

Our lives are bounded simply by how much love has broken in, and how much we can reach
out, one individual to another, and meet in that place of praise with the Living God.

 

[mj007]

I love you dude!

Do you love me? I love you, because you are a follower of Christ, because you are a sinner
who needs a saviour, because you are lost in hurt and pain and looking for victims on which
to vent.

And I would if the situation came to it, die for you. Why? Because I am just a flower in a
garden, I bloom and am gone. If I can bring eternal light to you life, amen, glory to God,
because death is just passing through the veil between us and Christ.

Life is a blessing and also a curse, because it is a fallen world and to be with Christ is so
much better. But it is He who calls and decides not me or us.

Love takes no prisoners. You know something is wrong when love leaves the room in your
heart. I know how this happens, and many times I have been caught here.

Our lives are bounded simply by how much love has broken in, and how much we can reach
out, one individual to another, and meet in that place of praise with the Living God.

 

[loveme1]

This came to mind to share:

Acts 8

14Now when the apostles which were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John: 15Who, when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Ghost: 16(For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.) 17Then laid they theirhands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost. 18And when Simon saw that through laying on of the apostles' hands the Holy Ghost was given, he offered them money, 19Saying, Give me also this power, that on whomsoever I lay hands, he may receive the Holy Ghost. 20But Peter said unto him, Thy money perish with thee, because thou hast thought that the gift of God may be purchased with money. 21Thou hast neither part nor lot in this matter: for thy heart is not right in the sight of God. 22Repent therefore of this thy wickedness, and pray God, if perhaps the thought of thine heart may be forgiven thee. 23For I perceive that thou art in the gall of bitterness, and in the bond of iniquity. 24Then answered Simon, and said, Pray ye to the Lord for me, that none of these things which ye have spoken come upon me.
25And they, when they had testified and preached the word of the Lord, returned to Jerusalem, and preached the gospel in many villages of the Samaritans.

 

[PeterJens]

I surrender, Amen
[video=youtube;HcnfT4arZtI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HcnfT4arZtI&list=RDGMEMMib4QpREwENw3_jAc0Y gNwVMHcnfT4arZtI[/video]

 

[AbigailZeke]

Key word here--struggles. That's how you tell the difference. The struggle with sin comes from the fact that we have a new mind in the very core of our being. Not our mind as in our thinking. But the very core of who we are.

Unbelievers struggle with sin. Which is why we have groups like AA.

 

[AbigailZeke]

dc - lol. Believe in Jesus, all His words, follow Him in obedience as Lord and Saviour,
Repent and turn from your sin, in worship and adoration of the King, serving others as Christ served
the church. Our faith is in the cross, through which we have the forgiveness of our sins.
The Kingdom which is communion with the King, following the way, Amen, halleluyah

It looks to me your faith is in:

- Jesus
- His words
- your following Him in obedience
- your repentance
- your turning away from sin
- your worship and adoration of the King
- your serving others as Christ served the church
- oh and the Cross

 

[AbigailZeke]

*goes back 10 pages*

I'll spare you the trouble.

From what I've seen, it seems PeterJens believes that our salvation is dependent on our walk with Christ (holy living) in addition to the Cross.

 

[AbigailZeke]

And?
I was talking about here and now,besides Jesus had "good reason" where as you don't,for your name calling,calling people "spoons" thereby being "pointless".
nice try though.

Please don't argue about this. It's too trivial and you're both good men.

 

[AbigailZeke]

Do you love me?

I don't think they'd go this far to make you see what you're missing, Jesus' unearned, undeserved, unmerited favour, if they didn't love you.

You don't think they're only doing this for their amusement, do you? I don't suppose you take them to be that lowlife.

 

[PeterJens]

I don't think they'd go this far to make you see what you're missing, Jesus' unearned, undeserved, unmerited favour, if they didn't love you.

You don't think they're only doing this for their amusement, do you? I don't suppose you take them to be that lowlife.

My friend, I am not God, I do not know what motivates people.
I do know a lot of people think loving someone is believing this will help them, so
you have to give it or share it. Loving someone is actually desiring the best for them
in all things, appreciating their contributions and desiring to bring a blessing to them.

I can testify some have only been intent on beating me into the ground or blasting
me out of the way, as if I am some scum not worthy of consideration.

Some said only yesterday I should be thrown out of their church if I was there.
So you assume too much without listening to the fruit of their words and the obvious
intention of their hearts.

But God bless you, that you believe we have a bunch to glorious rejoicing believers who
only intend the best for all contributors, Amen, may it be true one day.

My question about love is to ask where is ones heart, in the flesh or in the Spirit.

 

[PeterJens]

I don't think they'd go this far to make you see what you're missing, Jesus' unearned, undeserved, unmerited favour, if they didn't love you.

You don't think they're only doing this for their amusement, do you? I don't suppose you take them to be that lowlife.

On reactions to posts, some get so angry they have to actually leave the forums
because it winds them up so much.

I would worry to be in the same room as them, with this volatility.
Others have used the words disgusting.

Now if a preacher can link these emotions with a group, they can create a blame
culture, where scapegoating all problems and issues can be put on that group.

In the past some members have expressed the idea some should be expelled for
their expression, and intentionally try and provoke them. Could you imagine
spirit filled believers behaving like this? Well some have done this month in month out.

So I know love is the power of Christ and the question has to be asked, because some
do not know what love really means.

 

[PeterJens]

It looks to me your faith is in:

- Jesus
- His words
- your following Him in obedience
- your repentance
- your turning away from sin
- your worship and adoration of the King
- your serving others as Christ served the church
- oh and the Cross

Faith is involved in all these things.
Is there something here you think that is wrong?

I am saved through Christ.
The problem with people who analyse too much is the idea you can separate the
issues into distinct parts. They are all a whole, part of loving God with all our
hearts, minds, soul, strength.

When I praise God and know His presence, I am touched, deeply by that love,
our King coming to be with us. If you know the reality of Christ changing your
heart, we can earn nothing, we are just worshipers of the King with all we have.

[video=youtube;hNhqdKbTFp4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hNhqdKbTFp4&list=RDGMEMMib4QpREwENw3_jAc0Y gNwVMHcnfT4arZtI&index=27[/video]

 

[loveme1]

Titus 3

3 Put them in mind to be subject to principalities and powers, to obey magistrates, to be ready to every good work,
2 To speak evil of no man, to be no brawlers, but gentle, shewing all meekness unto all men.
3 For we ourselves also were sometimes foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving divers lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful, and hating one another.
4 But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared,
5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;
7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
8 This is a faithful saying, and these things I will that thou affirm constantly, that they which have believed in God might be careful to maintain good works. These things are good and profitable unto men.
9 But avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain.
10 A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject;
11 Knowing that he that is such is subverted, and sinneth, being condemned of himself.
12 When I shall send Artemas unto thee, or Tychicus, be diligent to come unto me to Nicopolis: for I have determined there to winter.
13 Bring Zenas the lawyer and Apollos on their journey diligently, that nothing be wanting unto them.
14 And let our's also learn to maintain good works for necessary uses, that they be not unfruitful.
15 All that are with me salute thee. Greet them that love us in the faith. Grace be with you all. Amen.






So those that believe GOD should be mindful to maintain good works?

I think we all agree that there was no good work that could save us. Dead in our trespasses needing saving.

It is only by GOD's Mercy and Grace by believing in Christ that we can be forgiven and born again of the Holy Spirit.

And should grow in Grace and Knowledge of Christ who is the author of eternal salvation to them that obey Him.. Which is to Love Him and do what He teaches us to do.

 

[AbigailZeke]

Faith is involved in all these things.
Is there something here you think that is wrong?

Yes, when you say you need to have all of the following for redemption, then that's like saying it was never by grace through faith in Christ alone.

- Jesus
- His words
- your following Him in obedience
- your repentance
- your turning away from sin
- your worship and adoration of the King
- your serving others as Christ served the church
- oh and the Cross

 

[eternally-gratefull]

It looks to me your faith is in:

- Jesus
- His words
- your following Him in obedience
- your repentance
- your turning away from sin
- your worship and adoration of the King
- your serving others as Christ served the church
- oh and the Cross

Thats prety sad, you put the cross in as an afterthought. And including a lot of self righteous things (His this HIS that) and he liked it, which means he agreed.. I do not think anything else needs to be said,

 

[PHart]

From what I've seen, it seems PeterJens believes that our salvation is dependent on our walk with Christ (holy living) in addition to the Cross.

I don't believe that Peter has ever said we are justified through anything other than faith in Christ. What he's saying is being justified by faith apart from our works invokes an obligation to not walk according to the flesh.

This obligation is what the church at large resists. They say if they are obligated to walk by the Spirit then that can ONLY mean we earn our own salvation. But I doubt they would argue with Paul that when he says we have an obligation to walk by the Spirit it can only mean one thing, that we are to try and earn our own salvation:

"12So then, brethren, we are under obligation, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh—13for if you are living according to the flesh, you must die; but if by the Spirit you are putting to death the deeds of the body, you will live. 14For all who are being led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God." (Romans 8:12-14 NASB)
​

By virtue of what it means to be a born again son of God you must walk not according to the flesh. But so many think that's a works gospel. And so off they go into their lawless 'Christian' lives thinking all will be well on the Day of Judgment because their works have nothing to do with salvation whatsoever.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Abraham never went backward in his faith in the promise. He sinned in daily living just like the rest of us but he never wavered back and forth in his faith in the promise but grew strong in his faith:

"19Without becoming weak in faith he contemplated his own body, now as good as dead since he was about a hundred years old, and the deadness of Sarah’s womb; 20yet, with respect to the promise of God, he did not waver in unbelief but grew strong in faith, giving glory to God, 21and being fully assured that what God had promised, He was able also to perform.22Therefore IT WAS ALSO CREDITED TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS." (Romans 4:19-22 NASB)
​

I've noticed that many Christians don't make the distinction between their faith in God's promise for salvation itself and faith in God's promise for daily provision. Wavering in faith in regard to the promise of salvation itself is what will get you in trouble regarding your salvation, not wavering in faith regarding God's promise to care for you in daily living.

Yep, he had so great faith he lied about his wife, who was promised to have the promised child, so she would not be taken away, and abraham killed, Meaning God could not keep his promise.

If Abraham had Full assurance God would keep his promise, he would never have had to lie. He would have confidently went about his way knowing God would protect them.

 

[PHart]

...he liked it, which means he agreed..

No, that's not what it has to mean.

I 'like' posts of my opponents when it has even just some merit to it, AND when they post with respect and calmness and politeness despite the fact that there is nothing in the post I agree with.

 

[PeterJens]

I don't believe that Peter has ever said we are justified through anything other than faith in Christ. What he's saying is being justified by faith apart from our works invokes an obligation to not walk according to the flesh.

This obligation is what the church at large resists. They say if they are obligated to walk by the Spirit then that can ONLY mean we earn our own salvation. But I doubt they would argue with Paul that when he says we have an obligation to walk by the Spirit it can only mean one thing, that we are to try and earn our own salvation:

"12So then, brethren, we are under obligation, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh—13for if you are living according to the flesh, you must die; but if by the Spirit you are putting to death the deeds of the body, you will live. 14For all who are being led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God." (Romans 8:12-14 NASB)
​

By virtue of what it means to be a born again son of God you must walk not according to the flesh. But so many think that's a works gospel. And so off they go into their lawless 'Christian' lives thinking all will be well on the Day of Judgment because their works have nothing to do with salvation whatsoever.

I am going a little further than an obligation, it is our hearts desire.
It can be hard to see often inside ourselves the burden of doing stuff, but when love
bursts through it is something we want to do.

There are people who everyday kill themselves because they think no one love them
and there is no hope in life and their contribution to existance is best rubbed out.
To rescue ones such as this, a privilege.

A mother who does not know how to care for their child and how their child loves them
with unconditional love, but just because they are their child.

You are talking real life changes, not just some minor tweak, but going from death to
life. A man of violence turned to a way of peace, means literally people are not killed
widows made, lives destroyed.

We discount what we can offer, just a listening ear, a little help, a safe place from abuse
and hatred.

I stand at the end of a long life, blessed and anointed in His grace. I know what love poured
into peoples lives looks like, and my friends, we all want and need this. And this is what Jesus
brings, if we listen to Him and just follow.