sin unto death?

[NoNameMcgee]

1 John Chapter 5
►


1 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.

2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.

3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

5 Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?

6 This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth.

7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.

9 If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son.

10 He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son.

11 And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.

12 He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

13 These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

14 And this is the confidence that we have in him, that, if we ask any thing according to his will, he heareth us:

15 And if we know that he hear us, whatsoever we ask, we know that we have the petitions that we desired of him.

16 If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it.

17 All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death.

18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

19 And we know that we are of God, and the whole world lieth in wickedness.

20 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

21 Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen.

__________________________

Whole chapter for context and convenience



16 If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it.

17 All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death.



____________

what would you say a "sin not unto death" is?

and a "sin unto death"?


i dont want to influence the answers i get.... if anyone wishes to share their opinions....

understandings...

or what they think God has revealed to them regarding this verse

id like to hear it

 

[FlSnookman7]

I think that the only "sin unto death" is not accepting Jesus as one's Lord and Savior.

 

[NoNameMcgee]

I think that the only "sin unto death" is not accepting Jesus as one's Lord and Savior.

maybe....

but then why "I do not say that he shall pray for it."


is that not saying to not pray for life to someone in that sin?

it doesnt sound like its saying dont pray for that sin... who would?

shouldnt we want those who dont have faith in Jesus TO have faith in Jesus?

is it referring to reprobates?

 

[FlSnookman7]

I am going to give you the rarest answer by far here at CC......I do not know...lol.

 

[NoNameMcgee]

I am going to give you the rarest answer by far here at CC......I do not know...lol.

me either

x'D

 

[He_reigns]

Sin unto death is willful, unrepentant sin. Usually a hidden or "pet sin".

 

[seoulsearch]

I am going to give you the rarest answer by far here at CC......I do not know...lol.

I'm seriously thinking I need to screenshot this and frame it.

Kudos to you, FIS, for giving an honest answer instead of just talking in circles, posting walls of Scripture that have nothing to do with the topic, or just making something up!

 

[FlSnookman7]

Sin unto death is willful, unrepentant sin. Usually a hidden or "pet sin".

But we who are saved are dead to sin and free from condemnation.

 

[NoNameMcgee]

Sin unto death is willful, unrepentant sin. Usually a hidden or "pet sin".

that is what my brother thought

 

[FlSnookman7]

I'm seriously thinking I need to screenshot this and frame it.

Kudos to you, FIS, for giving an honest answer instead of just talking in circles, posting walls of Scripture that have nothing to do with the topic, or just making something up!

Thank you and you're welcome. As God shows me more and more I find that there are so many more questions that I haven't even thought of yet. There are things I am sure of...Jesus is Lord, I have been redeemed and made righteous by what Jesus did and not of my own works, I am saved. Other than that for me at least the rest is a process and I am slowly learning to enjoy the ride instead of trying to quickly reach the destination.

 

[He_reigns]

But we who are saved are dead to sin and free from condemnation.

Are you perfect in spirit, soul and flesh?

 

[MarcR]

1 John Chapter 5
►


1 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.

2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.

3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

5 Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?

6 This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth.

7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.

9 If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son.

10 He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son.

11 And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.

12 He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

13 These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

14 And this is the confidence that we have in him, that, if we ask any thing according to his will, he heareth us:

15 And if we know that he hear us, whatsoever we ask, we know that we have the petitions that we desired of him.

16 If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it.

17 All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death.

18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

19 And we know that we are of God, and the whole world lieth in wickedness.

20 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

21 Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen.

__________________________

Whole chapter for context and convenience



16 If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it.

17 All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death.



____________

what would you say a "sin not unto death" is?

and a "sin unto death"?


i dont want to influence the answers i get.... if anyone wishes to share their opinions....

understandings...

or what they think God has revealed to them regarding this verse

id like to hear it

Mt 12:31-32
31 Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.
32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.
KJV


Even rejecting Salvation is not irreversible.

 

[BillG]

me either

x'D

You post a toughie here.

A few views concerning this passage

sin that leads to death.

It seems thst John was writing to the church to encourage believers not to fall for the Gnostic teachings that had to infiltrate the church.

Gonstics denied the incarnation and no moral restraints amongst other things like his resurrection bodily.

So it is possible that the sin that leads to death is that of persistent denial of the truth of Jesus (Remember John makes a point of seeing Jesus and touching him, both before and after his resurrection) and as a result continuing to walk in their lack of morals. Therefore this unrepentant sin leads to spiritual spiritual death.

The other view is that the sin referred to is still a persistent sin that a believer and do so with no desire to repent.
Therfore God in will take their life. So they die physically.

1 Corinthians 11:30-32
30 For this reason many are weak and sick among you, and many sleep. 31 For if we would judge ourselves, we would not be judged. 32 But when we are judged, we are chastened by the Lord, that we may not be condemned with the world.

Also people quote and believe these verses amount to Apostasy.

 

[BillG]

1 John 5:14-17
Confidence and Compassion in Prayer
14 Now this is the confidence that we have in Him, that if we ask anything according to His will, He hears us. 15 And if we know that He hears us, whatever we ask, we know that we have the petitions that we have asked of Him.
16 If anyone sees his brother sinning a sin which does not lead to death, he will ask, and He will give him life for those who commit sin not leading to death. There is sin leading to death. I do not say that he should pray about that. 17 All unrighteousness is sin, and there is sin not leading to death.

It is intersting though.

Verse 14 we can ask anything according to his will and he will hear us.
Verse 15 God hears us as we pray because we pray according to your will.
Verse 16 we find the word brother (to me a fellow believer) if anyone sees a brother sinnning, pray for them.
Yet at the end of the verse he doesn’t say a brother is one who commits sin that leads to death.
Verse 17 all unrighteousness is sin.

We find in the Gospel of John

John 16:7-11
7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth. It is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send Him to you. 8 And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: 9 of sin, because they do not believe in Me; 10 of righteousness, because I go to My Father and you see Me no more; 11 of judgment, because the ruler of this world is judged.

We find John saying that he must go away to convict

Of sin in unbelief in Jesus
Of his righteousness because he is righteous.

So to me the sin here is unbelief in Jesus, who is righteous, if we continue in that sin then the righteousness of Jesus cannot be imparted to us because we don’t believe in him.

Yet If we do

Romans 3:21-24
God's Righteousness Through Faith
21 But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, 22 even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe. For there is no difference; 23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus,

2 Corinthians 5:21
21 For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.

Therefore is it possible that the unrighteousness that John talks about is the the refusal to repent of unbelief in Jesus as forgiveness of our sins and place our faith in him?

 

[Nehemiah6]

I think that the only "sin unto death" is not accepting Jesus as one's Lord and Savior.

The context makes it clear that this NOT what John is writing about. It is about people who sin after accepting Jesus as Lord and Savior.

 

[Nehemiah6]

The other view is that the sin referred to is still a persistent sin that a believer and do so with no desire to repent. Therefore God will take their life. So they die physically.

This is the proper understanding of the sin unto death (premature physical death) and the passage you quoted is in line with this.

 

[BillG]

This is the proper understanding of the sin unto death (premature physical death) and the passage you quoted is in line with this.

To be honest I would have to say that I agree with you.

 

[seed_time_harvest]

I am going to give you the rarest answer by far here at CC......I do not know...lol.

That’s so true,people rarely say they don’t know around here.

 

[Innerfire89]

I think lying to the Holy Spirit is a good example of a sin unto death. Acts 5:3.
All the times Paul says "deliver them to Satan for the destruction of the flesh" always refer to sexual immorality by those in the church.

 

[AbigailZeke]

A clear and detailed explanation! This was discussed in our church and yeah, its within the context that John was speaking to the gnostics unbelievers. So, sin unto death (physical) or the spiritual death of an unbeliever.

You post a toughie here.

A few views concerning this passage

sin that leads to death.

It seems thst John was writing to the church to encourage believers not to fall for the Gnostic teachings that had to infiltrate the church.

Gonstics denied the incarnation and no moral restraints amongst other things like his resurrection bodily.

So it is possible that the sin that leads to death is that of persistent denial of the truth of Jesus (Remember John makes a point of seeing Jesus and touching him, both before and after his resurrection) and as a result continuing to walk in their lack of morals. Therefore this unrepentant sin leads to spiritual spiritual death.

The other view is that the sin referred to is still a persistent sin that a believer and do so with no desire to repent.
Therfore God in will take their life. So they die physically.

1 Corinthians 11:30-32
30 For this reason many are weak and sick among you, and many sleep. 31 For if we would judge ourselves, we would not be judged. 32 But when we are judged, we are chastened by the Lord, that we may not be condemned with the world.

Also people quote and believe these verses amount to Apostasy.