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E
Hi charisenexcelcis,
oops I have lost your post which had the prompts to which I wanted to reply.
From memory. I have never denied that Jesus is called God by His Father who then immediately places Himself above Jesus by saying He is God to Jesus I have quoted this many times. . It seems to me to parallel the "God is the head of Christ who is the head of man who is the head of woman." I see Father God superior. I see Jesus , the Son of God, heir and we as co-heirs. Also I have quoted many times that Jesus refers to scripture which Jesus says cannot be broken where people who speak God's words are called gods. Then Jesus asks about himself as he only ever spoke God's word. I embrace this fully.
I am off to see if I can find your reply.
I have found your reply. Hopefully I can quote you faithfully. Quote,"Jesus, Son of God, laid aside His omniscience,omnipotence, and His omnipresence to become a man, but retained His absolute holiness, His unmeasurable love, His grace, His perfection of character etc. In this way He remained fully God. Those attributes that He laid aside, He did not lose, and therefore God was not diminished"
Then you use the term , Jesus Son of God from all eternity.
The last term "Jesus Son of God from all eternity" I just love it to the extreme.
Most of your quote I fully agree with. IE Jesus, Son of God laid aside etc etc. This I agree with 100%
The only part I disagree with it towards the end when you say, He remained fully God. I need the phrase, He remained fully the Son of God. This distinguishes him from Father God.
If you say with your mouth Son of God ( who is God and called God by God and why not as the whole of creation was made through him, The Word,) then we are in agreement because you believe that the Son of God came down and was made flesh. Then you have the Son.
I hope you can see my belief and how desperately I want you to see it too.
Those who claim God (Father God) became flesh have rejected the Son.
With our mouth we should speak it this way, The Son came down from heaven and became flesh.
Please don't think that I want to lessen Jesus Christ, the Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last, for in him is all creation contained.
love
edwin.
oops I have lost your post which had the prompts to which I wanted to reply.
From memory. I have never denied that Jesus is called God by His Father who then immediately places Himself above Jesus by saying He is God to Jesus I have quoted this many times. . It seems to me to parallel the "God is the head of Christ who is the head of man who is the head of woman." I see Father God superior. I see Jesus , the Son of God, heir and we as co-heirs. Also I have quoted many times that Jesus refers to scripture which Jesus says cannot be broken where people who speak God's words are called gods. Then Jesus asks about himself as he only ever spoke God's word. I embrace this fully.
I am off to see if I can find your reply.
I have found your reply. Hopefully I can quote you faithfully. Quote,"Jesus, Son of God, laid aside His omniscience,omnipotence, and His omnipresence to become a man, but retained His absolute holiness, His unmeasurable love, His grace, His perfection of character etc. In this way He remained fully God. Those attributes that He laid aside, He did not lose, and therefore God was not diminished"
Then you use the term , Jesus Son of God from all eternity.
The last term "Jesus Son of God from all eternity" I just love it to the extreme.
Most of your quote I fully agree with. IE Jesus, Son of God laid aside etc etc. This I agree with 100%
The only part I disagree with it towards the end when you say, He remained fully God. I need the phrase, He remained fully the Son of God. This distinguishes him from Father God.
If you say with your mouth Son of God ( who is God and called God by God and why not as the whole of creation was made through him, The Word,) then we are in agreement because you believe that the Son of God came down and was made flesh. Then you have the Son.
I hope you can see my belief and how desperately I want you to see it too.
Those who claim God (Father God) became flesh have rejected the Son.
With our mouth we should speak it this way, The Son came down from heaven and became flesh.
Please don't think that I want to lessen Jesus Christ, the Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last, for in him is all creation contained.
love
edwin.
E
Hi AgeofKnowledge,
Articulated yourself,man you are like a B double road train. I don't understand strawmen except when we were young we had a lot of fun in November celebrating Guy Fawkes night. Buy up crackers and fireworks over a few weeks and make a straw man and fill him with crackers and on the night set him alight. I guess they thought it too dangerous as it was stopped many years ago. Maybe the fire cracker fights had something to do with that too.
God bless
love
edwin.
Ps it is a shame you won't answer the questions.
If someone else can help please feel free.
Articulated yourself,man you are like a B double road train. I don't understand strawmen except when we were young we had a lot of fun in November celebrating Guy Fawkes night. Buy up crackers and fireworks over a few weeks and make a straw man and fill him with crackers and on the night set him alight. I guess they thought it too dangerous as it was stopped many years ago. Maybe the fire cracker fights had something to do with that too.
God bless
love
edwin.
Ps it is a shame you won't answer the questions.
If someone else can help please feel free.
Hey SuperDave. I need to add you as a friend. Peace and God bless you. I hope your week is working itself out. 
I believe that you said that you have a seminary degree? I am currently studying online but I am auditing my classes because I can't afford to take the graded classes. I just finished a study of the book of Acts, and I am currently studying 1 Corinthians. God has really opened my eyes in this last year, and I have learned so much. But it is so little compared with what there is to know.
That is one of the great things about God. He is so awesome, that even if we study Him for eternity, we will never know everything there is to know about Him.
C
We must part company on this. I will not deny the fullness of Christ's deity. Godhood is not fueled by power, but by ontological character. Jesus was fully man and fully God. He said it Himself, "Before Abraham was, I am." That "I am" is a timeless statement. Jesus is the same, yesterday, today, and forever.
I wanted to share something about this. Jesus is not the Father, and yet He is God. The Holy Spirit is not the Father , nor is He the Son, but He is also God. And these three are in each other to such an extent that they are one in essence, such that if you see the Son, you have seen the Father. In this same fashion the Spirit is called the Spirit of Christ, whom the Father sends, who comes from the Father at the behest of the Son. If we have the Spirit in us, we actually have the Father and the Son in us also. We have the mind of Christ, the Spirit of Christ, the love of the Father, the voice of God, all in the Holy Spirit.
Now we might wonder at these things, how they can be, but we must remember that these are spiritual thoughts and words, which do not lend themselves to our natural understanding and must be apprehended spiritually. It is like another dimension which we are gaining access to through the Holy Spirit, by God's wonderful working of making us His children. The thing about children is that they don't always understand the why or how, and they have to trust their parents that they will not lie to them, and that as they mature they will understand. I am always reminded of the fact that little children have their sins forgiven for His name's sake. And that the young men have the Word in them strongly, and have overcome the wicked one. And that fathers k ow Him who is from the beginning, the Father.
Each comes to their place in their own time, as the Lord allows.
What we must guard against is letting these things get in the way of our unity with each other, and with Christ. Does our testimony say that Christ has come in the flesh? Then we are of God. Does our testimony say that He has risen? Then we are of God. If we o
Are of God, then we should be of each other, because God is not divided.
In His love,
Vic
Now we might wonder at these things, how they can be, but we must remember that these are spiritual thoughts and words, which do not lend themselves to our natural understanding and must be apprehended spiritually. It is like another dimension which we are gaining access to through the Holy Spirit, by God's wonderful working of making us His children. The thing about children is that they don't always understand the why or how, and they have to trust their parents that they will not lie to them, and that as they mature they will understand. I am always reminded of the fact that little children have their sins forgiven for His name's sake. And that the young men have the Word in them strongly, and have overcome the wicked one. And that fathers k ow Him who is from the beginning, the Father.
Each comes to their place in their own time, as the Lord allows.
What we must guard against is letting these things get in the way of our unity with each other, and with Christ. Does our testimony say that Christ has come in the flesh? Then we are of God. Does our testimony say that He has risen? Then we are of God. If we o
Are of God, then we should be of each other, because God is not divided.
In His love,
Vic
E
Hi Vic,
I want to thank you for this post. I would like to point out some words in the last paragraph.
Quote, " Does our testimony say that Christ has come in the flesh? Then we are of God."
This is the crux of my belief. That it was Christ who came in the flesh, not God. Christ who is the Alpha and Omega, the Beginning and the end, the first and the last, through whom the whole creation was made, YES Christ.
Yes we need to say what is in our hearts and confess it with our mouths, that the Son of God has come to do the will of God.
IF we believe the Son has come in the flesh, then we are not rejecting him. IF we believe that it was not the Son then we are rejecting him.
love
edwin
I want to thank you for this post. I would like to point out some words in the last paragraph.
Quote, " Does our testimony say that Christ has come in the flesh? Then we are of God."
This is the crux of my belief. That it was Christ who came in the flesh, not God. Christ who is the Alpha and Omega, the Beginning and the end, the first and the last, through whom the whole creation was made, YES Christ.
Yes we need to say what is in our hearts and confess it with our mouths, that the Son of God has come to do the will of God.
IF we believe the Son has come in the flesh, then we are not rejecting him. IF we believe that it was not the Son then we are rejecting him.
love
edwin
Edwin,
You are great up until you say, "Christ, not God." Because you see, it should be, "Christ, not the Father." Because the Son is just as much God as is the Father.
It is like this; when God made a covenant with Abraham, and laid out the sacrificed animals divided for them to walk between, God is the one who made the walk, because He swore by Himself. When it came that we needed someone to stand for us, to take upon Himself the burden of our sins and the death that we deserved, God was the only One able to take this upon Himself, as no one else was found who was worthy.
So I do understand what you are saying, just that you seem to want to say that Jesus is not God. Jesus is not the Father, but then neither is the Spirit. But it is true that they are God, and He is one.
Blessings in His love,
vic
You are great up until you say, "Christ, not God." Because you see, it should be, "Christ, not the Father." Because the Son is just as much God as is the Father.
It is like this; when God made a covenant with Abraham, and laid out the sacrificed animals divided for them to walk between, God is the one who made the walk, because He swore by Himself. When it came that we needed someone to stand for us, to take upon Himself the burden of our sins and the death that we deserved, God was the only One able to take this upon Himself, as no one else was found who was worthy.
So I do understand what you are saying, just that you seem to want to say that Jesus is not God. Jesus is not the Father, but then neither is the Spirit. But it is true that they are God, and He is one.
Blessings in His love,
vic
E
Hi Vic
Thank you for responding. All responses help me to understand.
I think if you look at my multiply posts you will see that I have never denied that God The Father refers to His Son as God and that all people who speak God's words are gods but the one who came down from heaven only ever spoke God's words.
It appears the difference in our thinking is in equality. I see God the Father as the Father to the Son, and I see God the Father being God to God the Son. As scripture says, 1 Cor 11:3 "the head of Christ is God."
Of course I am talking of the Son through whom the world was made then manifested by the Holy Spirit through Mary.
love,
edwin
Thank you for responding. All responses help me to understand.
I think if you look at my multiply posts you will see that I have never denied that God The Father refers to His Son as God and that all people who speak God's words are gods but the one who came down from heaven only ever spoke God's words.
It appears the difference in our thinking is in equality. I see God the Father as the Father to the Son, and I see God the Father being God to God the Son. As scripture says, 1 Cor 11:3 "the head of Christ is God."
Of course I am talking of the Son through whom the world was made then manifested by the Holy Spirit through Mary.
love,
edwin
Edwin, a subtle distinction, for sure. I don't think any should confuse the Father with the Son, but it is written of the Son, of Jesus, that He could consider Himself as equal to the Godhood, but became a littleower than the angels. That is, He took on flesh, and became like us.
The real question is, do we worship Jesus? If so, then He is fully God, and inseparable from the Father or the Spirit. They are one.
In His love,
Vic
The real question is, do we worship Jesus? If so, then He is fully God, and inseparable from the Father or the Spirit. They are one.
In His love,
Vic