How To Be Un-Saved

[mailmandan]

Amen, What part of ”His sheep” are given eternal life, and shall NEVER be plucked out. Do they not comprehend? But remember, they are trusting in self to begin with, so they have to think they have that power.

Amen! In John 10:27-28, Jesus said - My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me (not some of them do and some of them don't). 28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand (not some of them will receive eternal life/never perish or be snatched out of My hand and some of them will not receive eternal life/perish, and be snatched out of My hand).

We are kept by the power of God through faith for salvation, ready to be revealed in the last time. (1 Peter 1:5) We don't pull ourselves up by our own boot straps and keep ourselves saved by our power.

 

[Speak2Me]

What lies? I have been a member of 7 different Christian Forums over the years now and I've been in multiple discussions with people in the NOSAS camp about Judas Iscariot and the majority of those people argued that Judas Iscariot was saved then later lost his salvation. Me and my buddies? Spies in da camp? Why so bitter, cynical and angry?

It's easy to fall prey to the eternal security camp when multiple belief systems are in agreement.

Over 3/4 of the site now, including the fake NOSAS.

Everyone goes with the big majority nowadays.

But where's the big majority going?

Into the ditch.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

It's easy to fall prey to the eternal security camp when multiple belief systems are in agreement.

Over 3/4 of the site now, including the fake NOSAS.

Everyone goes with the big majority nowadays.

But where's the big majority going?

Into the ditch.

Your name is an oxymoron, It says speak2me, but when people try to speak 2 you. You never listen. You should really change your name. It is deceptive.

Look at the religions of the world. About 90 - 99 percent believe in a works based gospel which is performance based. Do this and you MAY be saved.

Faith based religion (grace alone through faith alone) makes up for about 1 - 10 % of all religions

Yet you want to say OSAS is the most popular.

NOSAS is larger by far. Than OSAS theology.

Again, You need to change you name.

 

[mailmandan]

It's easy to fall prey to the eternal security camp when multiple belief systems are in agreement.

Over 3/4 of the site now, including the fake NOSAS.

Everyone goes with the big majority nowadays.

But where's the big majority going?

Into the ditch.

When you add up ALL the Christian churches and "nominal" Christian churches, the majority would be in agreement with NOSAS. I find it interesting that "nominal" Christian churches which teach works salvation are all strong advocates of NOSAS. I grew up in the Roman Catholic church and they were very strong advocates of NOSAS!

 

[Speak2Me]

Your name is an oxymoron, It says speak2me, but when people try to speak 2 you. You never listen. You should really change your name. It is deceptive.

Look at the religions of the world. About 90 - 99 percent believe in a works based gospel which is performance based. Do this and you MAY be saved.

Faith based religion (grace alone through faith alone) makes up for about 1 - 10 % of all religions

Yet you want to say OSAS is the most popular.

NOSAS is larger by far. Than OSAS theology.

Again, You need to change you name.

I thought you had me on ignore like you kept saying?

Guess not.

 

[Speak2Me]

When you add up ALL the Christian churches and "nominal" Christian churches, the majority would be in agreement with NOSAS. I find it interesting that "nominal" Christian churches which teach works salvation are all strong advocates of NOSAS. I grew up in the Roman Catholic church and they were very strong advocates of NOSAS!

You know the RCC as a whole isn't going, so they don't really count, do they?

Besides, they're a part of the ecumenical movement. They'll eventually merge with you.

 

[mailmandan]

You know the RCC as a whole isn't going, so they don't really count, do they?

There are churches that teach false gospels, which will lead all of those to their doom, who strictly follow the teachings of those churches. But those who believe the true gospel and not just whatever those churches teach, are saved regardless of the group with which they are associated. Conversely, one's church may teach the true gospel and if one truly believes the gospel, then one has eternal salvation. But if one does not believe it, then one is lost even though the official teaching of one's church (whether denominational or non-denominational) is correct.

Besides, they're a part of the ecumenical movement. They'll eventually merge with you.

Is that what the Bible teaches?

 

[Ralph-]

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The Lord says He gives His Sheep Eternal Life and they will Never perish.

That's right.
Believers will NEVER perish.
Unbelievers and former believers will.

He doesn't say that Eternal Life will never perish.

That's right he doesn't say that.
He says you have eternal life as long as you continue to believe.

The question is Do you believe the Lord Jesus Christ and what He says?

John 10:27

And I give unto them eternal life; and ​

they shall never perish​

, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.

Those who are given Eternal Life never perish. I guess you missed that important part.

The Lord doesn't say 'based on your performance' or 'your faith in me' or 'maybe you won't make it'.
​

Yes, the Lord did say 'based on your faith in me you have eternal life'.


"you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you"-1 Corinthians 15:2


So, the question to you is, "Do you believe the Lord Jesus Christ and what He says (through Paul)?"

​

If Salvation were up to us this certainly could be a possibility.

But Salvation isn't up to us.

We don't cause our heart to be good.

The Lord Jesus Christ gives us a New Heart and that heart is the good ground that you are searching for.

We all know you can't save yourself. What you can do, and are required to do, is trust in the One who can. He gives the faith to believe. Now it's our responsibility to trust in what he said through the power of faith that he has given us. You have to do that, and continue to do that in order to be saved and have eternal life. If you fall away you lose the free gift of salvation that only those who presently believe can have.

 

[Ralph-]

You know the RCC as a whole isn't going, so they don't really count, do they?

Besides, they're a part of the ecumenical movement. They'll eventually merge with you.

I tried to make this point to him too. Catholics are not to even to be considered in a discussion about Protestant churches and their doctrines. That's like saying we have to consider what unbelievers think to determine the status of a doctrine in the church.

Catholics are in another world and that's where they belong. I don't even consider what they think or do when I speak of the church. I don't include them.

And mailmandan surely isn't the first ex-Catholic I've encountered who has such a knee-jerk, fringe, emotional doctrinal response to the abuses of the Catholic Church. Truth should never be discerned from that point of view. It should be rational and unbiased.

 

[valiant]

That's right.
Believers will NEVER perish.
Unbelievers and former believers will.

So you believe that saving faith is a work that somehow you have to keep up?

That's right he doesn't say that.
He says you have eternal life as long as you continue to believe.

No He says you have eternal life, life that is everlasting. He doesn't make conditions like you do.He knows He will keep His own because they are of His sheep.

Yes, the Lord did say 'based on your faith in me you have eternal life'.

Where did He say that? He would be contradicting Himself.

"you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you"-1 Corinthians 15:2

And if they do not they never were saved.

So, the question to you is, "Do you believe the Lord Jesus Christ and what He says (through Paul)?"

Yes but not your twisting of it,​

 

[mailmandan]

I tried to make this point to him too. Catholics are not to even to be considered in a discussion about Protestant churches and their doctrines. That's like saying we have to consider what unbelievers think to determine the status of a doctrine in the church.

Catholics are in another world and that's where they belong. I don't even consider what they think or do when I speak of the church. I don't include them.

And mailmandan surely isn't the first ex-Catholic I've encountered who has such a knee-jerk, fringe, emotional doctrinal response to the abuses of the Catholic Church. Truth should never be discerned from that point of view. It should be rational and unbiased.

Yet the RCC is still labeled as "Christian" to the rest of the world and isn't it interesting that they are strong advocates of NOSAS, along with other "nominal" Christian churches that teach works salvation. Red flag! Apparently what I explained in post #484 and #487 just went right over your head.

 

[Speak2Me]

Is that what the Bible teaches?

Deluded people doesn't follow the Bible

 

[joefizz]

It's easy to fall prey to the eternal security camp when multiple belief systems are in agreement.

Over 3/4 of the site now, including the fake NOSAS.

Everyone goes with the big majority nowadays.

But where's the big majority going?

Into the ditch.

hilarious,majority rules,rightttttt,and oh yeah the majority rules,for there are the "deluded","liars""unbelieving" and "blasphemous teachers" but not those who "believe Jesus wholly" I don't know how anyone can "be against Jesus" yet claim to "be serving him" but oh well that's not my problem,I like many have explained "Truth" only to be called a liar and a lazy person,just as Jesus,never knew that Jesus was so lazy but apparently a fare few believe he was and that we have to do great works because of this,good luck looking Jesus "in the eye".

 

[Chester]

Amen! In John 10:27-28, Jesus said - My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me (not some of them do and some of them don't). 28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand (not some of them will receive eternal life/never perish or be snatched out of My hand and some of them will not receive eternal life/perish, and be snatched out of My hand).

We are kept by the power of God through faith for salvation, ready to be revealed in the last time. (1 Peter 1:5) We don't pull ourselves up by our own boot straps and keep ourselves saved by our power.

Amen and amen and amen and hallelujah!

All those sheep who are hearing his voice and He is knowing them, and they are following him (verse 27): these are "kept by the power of God"

 

[blue_ladybug]

It is impossible to get unsaved once you have been saved. Otherwise Jesus died for nothing..

 

[joefizz]

It is impossible to get unsaved once you have been saved. Otherwise Jesus died for nothing..

No Blue lady bug Jesus apparently isn't "the perfect sacrifice" and his works apparently weren't "great" and they "don't save" because we have to apparently do his works for him,because we should trust ourselves for salvation not Jesus,and we have to wait for his return to be saved we can't be saved according to the bible as Jesus intended,after all "we know best" rightttttttt????

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Amen and amen and amen and hallelujah!

All those sheep who are hearing his voice and He is knowing them, and they are following him (verse 27): these are "kept by the power of God"

You keep taking the focus of his sheep. And trying to put it on Verne’s, The subject is the sheep. Not the verbs,

HIS SHEEP hears

HIS SHEEP follows

HIS SHEEP are kept. (The word kept is present tense also. It would fit the same mold the context is WE, who are we? Those who are kept? No. We are his children, his sheep, the “begotten”ones, his reward etc..)

the passage is telling you what is happening to the people (sheep begottenones) not what makes them those things.

The passage says His sheep hears

The passages say his sheep follows

The passages say his begotten ones are kept.

Your trying to make them say things the do not say (in context)

 

[Chester]

It is impossible to get unsaved once you have been saved. Otherwise Jesus died for nothing..

Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, . . .

(See the thread where you can post whatever you want for the rest of the story . . . )

 

[blue_ladybug]

LOL.. If I posted what I REALLY want to say, I'd get banned...

Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, . . .

(See the thread where you can post whatever you want for the rest of the story . . . )

 

[Chester]

You keep taking the focus of his sheep. And trying to put it on Verne’s, The subject is the sheep. Not the verbs,

HIS SHEEP hears

HIS SHEEP follows

HIS SHEEP are kept. (The word kept is present tense also. It would fit the same mold the context is WE, who are we? Those who are kept? No. We are his children, his sheep, the “begotten”ones, his reward etc..)

the passage is telling you what is happening to the people (sheep begottenones) not what makes them those things.

The passage says His sheep hears

The passages say his sheep follows

The passages say his begotten ones are kept.

Your trying to make them say things the do not say (in context)

I said, "

All those sheep who are hearing his voice and He is knowing them, and they are following him (verse 27): these are "​

kept by the power of God" - Do you agree with what I wrote there?

I have no trouble agreeing with everything you wrote in your post: if you want to put the focus on the subject rather than the verbs (as you say I was doing), that is fine. The verses still give the same promises to the sheep.

I am not sure what you meant by "Verne's"? LOL!