KING JAMES VERSION BIBLE VS. MODERN ENGLISH BIBLES

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trofimus

trofimus

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KJV1611 said:
If a person looks at the bible as history book instead of a book to know Jesus Christ then I would agree but the bible isn't a history book to record a pagan Babylonian kings words.
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So is it right to change also other KJV verses? For a better clarity?

Or, they must stay in their "unclear" state just because... you know... the KJV is perfect? (Double standard).

O Belteshazzar, master of the magicians, because I know that the spirit of the holy gods is in thee, and no secret troubleth thee, tell me the visions of my dream that I have seen, and the interpretation thereof.
Dan 4:9
 
Lucy-Pevensie

Lucy-Pevensie

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KJV1611 said:
This has nothing to do with the words of a babylonian king, it has to do with taking something that was clear in the KJV and obscuring.
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The KJ is not the starting point. The whole thing would still have been translated faithfully if the KJV had never existed.

No one changed the KJV to make it obscure. It isn't in the equation at all.
 
Dino246

Dino246

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KJV1611 said:
If a person looks at the bible as history book instead of a book to know Jesus Christ then I would agree but the bible isn't a history book to record a pagan Babylonian kings words.
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This is a dangerous view! If the Bible is not historically accurate, it's not truthful. Perhaps you should rethink this. :)
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

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Dino246 said:
Correlation does not indicate intentional design. In the Hebrew Bible, Samuel, Kings and Chronicles are one book each. The minor prophets are grouped together in one book.
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I don't know anything about the Hebrew bible, does it contain the New Testament?
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

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trofimus said:
So is it right to change also other KJV verses? For a better clarity?

Or, they must stay in their "unclear" state just because... you know... the KJV is perfect? (Double standard).

O Belteshazzar, master of the magicians, because I know that the spirit of the holy gods is in thee, and no secret troubleth thee, tell me the visions of my dream that I have seen, and the interpretation thereof.
Dan 4:9
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Are you kidding me, the KJV made all kinds of changes for better clarity.
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

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Lucy-Pevensie said:
The KJ is not the starting point. The whole thing would still have been translated faithfully if the KJV had never existed.

No one changed the KJV to make it obscure. It isn't in the equation at all.
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Who was in the furnace?
 
trofimus

trofimus

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KJV1611 said:
Are you kidding me, the KJV made all kinds of changes for better clarity.
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So "the spirit of gods" was in Daniel? This is theologically clear?

"Are you kidding me"? :) If the KJV intentionally changed one place, they forgot 4 more.
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

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Dino246 said:
This is a dangerous view! If the Bible is not historically accurate, it's not truthful. Perhaps you should rethink this. :)
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Do you think God is trying to preserve the words of a pagan king or preaching the gospel in the old testament in that verse?
 
trofimus

trofimus

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KJV1611 said:
Do you think God is trying to preserve the words of a pagan king or preaching the gospel in the old testament in that verse?
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You forgot that it was the KJV in the 17th century that changed it. So the gospel was not preached in the Old testament in this verse, but from 17th century.
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

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trofimus said:
So "the spirit of gods" was in Daniel? This is theologically clear?

"Are you kidding me"? :) If the KJV intentionally changed one place, they forgot 4 more.
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Or maybe they were inspired to change it in only one place.
 
trofimus

trofimus

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KJV1611 said:
Do you think God is trying to preserve the words of a pagan king or preaching the gospel in the old testament in that verse?
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With such a view, what else is not historically true in the Bible? Words of Moses? Words of Jesus? Words of Paul? What can be changed for "better gospel preaching"?
 
Dino246

Dino246

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KJV1611 said:
So who do you think it was, a son of the gods or the Son of God?
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You're clouding the issue. What I or any reader thinks about who it was doesn't change what Nebuchadnezzar said. Obviously I don't think it was anything of "the gods". I'm perfectly comfortable with it having been either an angel or Jesus Himself, and what the king said doesn't define who it actually was.

Look at it this way: do you take the words of a child as accurate and definitive? Would you demand that a child's words be recorded accurately, or that they be redacted to represent objective truth? In my view the accurate record of the statement is more important in this case than the accuracy of the statement. The point is that the king recognized something very special had happened, and that a fourth personage appeared in the furnace.
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

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trofimus said:
You forgot that it was the KJV in the 17th century that changed it. So the gospel was not preached in the Old testament in this verse, but from 17th century.
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How would I know, I don't study original languages or pre KJV texts.
 
Dino246

Dino246

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KJV1611 said:
Do you think God is trying to preserve the words of a pagan king or preaching the gospel in the old testament in that verse?
Click to expand...
KJV1611 said:
Or maybe they were inspired to change it in only one place.
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What I think is that you're grasping at straws to make this consistent with your exalted view of the KJV.
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

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Dino246 said:
You're clouding the issue. What I or any reader thinks about who it was doesn't change what Nebuchadnezzar said. Obviously I don't think it was anything of "the gods". I'm perfectly comfortable with it having been either an angel or Jesus Himself, and what the king said doesn't define who it actually was.

Look at it this way: do you take the words of a child as accurate and definitive? Would you demand that a child's words be recorded accurately, or that they be redacted to represent objective truth? In my view the accurate record of the statement is more important in this case than the accuracy of the statement. The point is that the king recognized something very special had happened, and that a fourth personage appeared in the furnace.
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We can agree to disagree. :)
 
trofimus

trofimus

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KJV1611 said:
How would I know, I don't study original languages or pre KJV texts.
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I know. I am not talking about what is actually more authentic. Septuagint has also "son of God."

I am talking about your position that we can change what the Bible says to make it better.
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

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Dino246 said:
What I think is that you're grasping at straws to make this consistent with your exalted view of the KJV.
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What's the straw grasping? Can God inspire translators to write whatever he wants written - of course he can. I don't understand how I'm grasping at straws.
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

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trofimus said:
I know. I am not talking about what is actually more authentic. Septuagint has also "son of God."

I am talking about your position that we can change what the Bible says to make it better.
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God can change whatever he wants to change. Hopefully you realize the whole new testament is contained in the old testament through types and foreshadows. All God did in the New Testament was bring those same thoughts and ideas into more clarity.
 
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