caught my son watching xxxx
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Poor kid...
Discipline is instruction. Discipline is NOT and SHOULD NEVER BE punishment; or ROM 8:1 has NO MEANING.
Spanking is and will continue to be a valid disciplinary technique.
It should be employed to help a child remember to do right NOT to punish wrong doing.
ONLY after acceptable behavior has been clearly defined and explained.
If a child is able to read he/she should be instructed to read this passage; otherwise it should be read to him/her.
It should be explained that the wrongdoing is already forgiven and that the coming spanking is to help the child remember to do right.
The child should be reminded that Jesus was stripped naked in front of a hostile crowd and beaten beyond recognition to forgive your bad behavior.
The child should be told: You will be stripped naked and get a mild spanking in front of one person who loves you and wants the best for you.
The child should be told: "If you think about your embarrassment and your pain the spanking will be an unpleasant experience that will not help you; but if you think about Jesus' embarrassment and His pain, the spanking will truly help you remember to do right.
then regardless of the seriousness of the offense:
The child should then be totally disrobed and spanked 3 swats on each buttock hard enough to sting but not hard enough to injure.
The child should then be reminded of your love and forgiveness.
I'm not trying to critique other parents' disciplinary techniques! I'm trying to suggest a method that makes a child aware of what Jesus did for him/her and His forgiveness; while correcting bad behavior
Spanking is and will continue to be a valid disciplinary technique.
It should be employed to help a child remember to do right NOT to punish wrong doing.
ONLY after acceptable behavior has been clearly defined and explained.
If a child is able to read he/she should be instructed to read this passage; otherwise it should be read to him/her.
It should be explained that the wrongdoing is already forgiven and that the coming spanking is to help the child remember to do right.
The child should be reminded that Jesus was stripped naked in front of a hostile crowd and beaten beyond recognition to forgive your bad behavior.
The child should be told: You will be stripped naked and get a mild spanking in front of one person who loves you and wants the best for you.
The child should be told: "If you think about your embarrassment and your pain the spanking will be an unpleasant experience that will not help you; but if you think about Jesus' embarrassment and His pain, the spanking will truly help you remember to do right.
then regardless of the seriousness of the offense:
The child should then be totally disrobed and spanked 3 swats on each buttock hard enough to sting but not hard enough to injure.
The child should then be reminded of your love and forgiveness.
I'm not trying to critique other parents' disciplinary techniques! I'm trying to suggest a method that makes a child aware of what Jesus did for him/her and His forgiveness; while correcting bad behavior
P
Well MarcR, I have to completely disagree with your philosophy and your technique ... Punishment certainly is "discipline" ... And where in the Bible does God suggest that any child be stripped naked before he/she is disciplined ? ... I know you did not read that within the Bible ... Where do you get this idea from ? ... Or would you rather not tell ? ...
In scripture crimes or misdemenors not worthy of death were punished by 'STRIPES' 40 less1
The way Stripes were administered was as follows:
The person who was to receive stripes was stripped naked and made to lie in a prone position.
13 men with rods like broom handles each delivered 3 strikes between the shoulders and the ankles [historically verifyable fact]
When Pilate, hoping to have Jesus scourged and released, was following this practice.
Even if that were not the case; the point of disciplining that way is to remind the child what Jesus suffered to purchase his/her forgiveness.
The way Stripes were administered was as follows:
The person who was to receive stripes was stripped naked and made to lie in a prone position.
13 men with rods like broom handles each delivered 3 strikes between the shoulders and the ankles [historically verifyable fact]
When Pilate, hoping to have Jesus scourged and released, was following this practice.
Even if that were not the case; the point of disciplining that way is to remind the child what Jesus suffered to purchase his/her forgiveness.
P
Can you provide actual scripture from the Bible commanding that a "child" be stripped naked before being disciplined ? ... And if not, then where did you get that idea from ? ... Your response above did not provide any scripture nor adequately answer the question asked ... We are talking about children here ... We are not talking about any punishment of adults ...
I did indeed provide Scripture showing what happened to Jesus.
I did indeed say that the intent is to remind the child in a much milder way what it cost Jesus to pay for his/her misbehavior.
If you are not satisfied with my answer that is your right. You, IMO, are being argumentative to NO PURPOSE.
If you discipline to punish, How do you explain Jesus' forgiveness? or explain Rom 8:1?
I did indeed say that the intent is to remind the child in a much milder way what it cost Jesus to pay for his/her misbehavior.
If you are not satisfied with my answer that is your right. You, IMO, are being argumentative to NO PURPOSE.
If you discipline to punish, How do you explain Jesus' forgiveness? or explain Rom 8:1?
P
Again you provide no scripture ... Scripture is an actual quote from the Bible ... It is not your interpretation or your own wording ... I explain Jesus' forgiveness that He forgives those who ask for forgiveness ... That has nothing to do with how a parent is to discipline their children for wrongdoings ... For the third time, can you show me actual scripture in the Bible where it states a "child" should be made to completely disrobe before they receive discipline ? ... And if not, then where did you get that idea from ? ... I am not being argumentative ... What is happening here is that I have a simple question of you and you are refusing to answer it ... I am searching for proof within the Bible of your belief ... If you received your belief from actual scripture of the Bible regarding your philosophy of disciplining children in the nude, then why can you not simply provide that scripture ? ...
Matt 27:27-31
Then the soldiers of the governor took Jesus into the common hall, and gathered unto him the whole band of soldiers.
28 And they stripped him, and put on him a scarlet robe.
29 And when they had platted a crown of thorns, they put it upon his head, and a reed in his right hand: and they bowed the knee before him, and mocked him, saying, Hail, King of the Jews!
30 And they spit upon him, and took the reed, and smote him on the head.
31 And after that they had mocked him, they took the robe off from him, and put his own raiment on him, and led him away to crucify him.
KJV
Should have been pasted in where it now appears. This was a typo. My apology to Pontiac for not checking back
Then the soldiers of the governor took Jesus into the common hall, and gathered unto him the whole band of soldiers.
28 And they stripped him, and put on him a scarlet robe.
29 And when they had platted a crown of thorns, they put it upon his head, and a reed in his right hand: and they bowed the knee before him, and mocked him, saying, Hail, King of the Jews!
30 And they spit upon him, and took the reed, and smote him on the head.
31 And after that they had mocked him, they took the robe off from him, and put his own raiment on him, and led him away to crucify him.
KJV
Should have been pasted in where it now appears. This was a typo. My apology to Pontiac for not checking back
P
Marc, you still have not provided any scripture supporting your view that a "child" should be stripped naked before receiving any discipline ... It becomes more obvious all the time that you did not see that written in the Bible because you keep failing to provide any actual scripture making that command ... I full realize the terribleness done to Jesus ... I am not asking you about that ... I am asking where in the Bible do you see where a child is to be made to strip naked before they are given discipline ... Four times now you have responded and all four times you have failed to support your philosophy regarding child discipline by providing any example within the Bible ...
YOU WROTE: The child should be told: You will be stripped naked and get a mild spanking in front of one person who loves you and wants the best for you.
Where in the Bible does it say a child should be told this or treated in this manner ? ... If you cannot provide any scripture supporting this view then it is only of your own opinion and not a directive of God ...
YOU WROTE: The child should be told: You will be stripped naked and get a mild spanking in front of one person who loves you and wants the best for you.
Where in the Bible does it say a child should be told this or treated in this manner ? ... If you cannot provide any scripture supporting this view then it is only of your own opinion and not a directive of God ...
There is of course NO Scripture that directly says this. There is no scripture that directly speaks about internet access either!
IMO it is vitally important for a child to fully understand what their forgiveness cost Jesus.
It is equally important for a child understand:
that because of what Jesus did for him/her, his/her sins are indeed forgiven.
Because they are forgiven, they will NOT be PUNISHED by God.
IT is a parents job to help a child remember to do right
the child is loved
The technique I advocate teaches all these important lessons in the same lesson plan.
IMO it is vitally important for a child to fully understand what their forgiveness cost Jesus.
It is equally important for a child understand:
that because of what Jesus did for him/her, his/her sins are indeed forgiven.
Because they are forgiven, they will NOT be PUNISHED by God.
IT is a parents job to help a child remember to do right
the child is loved
The technique I advocate teaches all these important lessons in the same lesson plan.
P
Thank you for finally admitting that your philosophy is your own opinion and not any fact supported by the Bible ... In your earlier post you stated a child "should" be told this and that ... And stated this and that "should" be done ... In all you used the word "should" at least seven times regarding the discipline of children, while all the time this is only your opinion ... You never once stated "I believe this is the way it is to be done" or "this is my opinion" ... Instead you stated all of this to the entire forum as if it were fact when it is not factual at all ... That is my point here ... You should not be stating things as fact according to the Bible when those ideas are coming from your own mind ...
U
Attitudes like this are what cause people to grow up and hate God. Your distorted, sadistic view of "discipline" borders on illegal. And is cruel. Shame is a tool of the devil and it often does more to reinforce bad behavior. It's disgusting that you call yourself a Christian then promote this garbage.
The Bible speaks very frankly and directly about sex and sexual behavior; and does not cater to Victorian sensibilities.
When God brings judgement on a nation or an individual humiliation is usually part of that judgement.
Isa 20:4
4 So shall the king of Assyria lead away the Egyptians prisoners, and the Ethiopians captives, young and old, naked and barefoot, even with their buttocks uncovered, to the shame of Egypt.
KJV
Job 26:6
6 Hell is naked before him, and destruction hath no covering.
KJV
Ezek 23:1-27
The word of the Lord came again unto me, saying,2 Son of man, there were two women, the daughters of one mother:3 And they committed whoredoms in Egypt; they committed whoredoms in their youth: there were their breasts pressed, and there they bruised the teats of their virginity.4 And the names of them were Aholah the elder, and Aholibah her sister: and they were mine, and they bare sons and daughters. Thus were their names; Samaria is Aholah, and Jerusalem Aholibah.5 And Aholah played the harlot when she was mine; and she doted on her lovers, on the Assyrians her neighbours,6 Which were clothed with blue, captains and rulers, all of them desirable young men, horsemen riding upon horses.7 Thus she committed her whoredoms with them, with all them that were the chosen men of Assyria, and with all on whom she doted: with all their idols she defiled herself.8 Neither left she her whoredoms brought from Egypt: for in her youth they lay with her, and they bruised the breasts of her virginity, and poured their whoredom upon her.9 Wherefore I have delivered her into the hand of her lovers, into the hand of the Assyrians, upon whom she doted.10 These discovered her nakedness: they took her sons and her daughters, and slew her with the sword: and she became famous among women; for they had executed judgment upon her.11 And when her sister Aholibah saw this, she was more corrupt in her inordinate love than she, and in her whoredoms more than her sister in her whoredoms.12 She doted upon the Assyrians her neighbours, captains and rulers clothed most gorgeously, horsemen riding upon horses, all of them desirable young men.13 Then I saw that she was defiled, that they took both one way,14 And that she increased her whoredoms: for when she saw men pourtrayed upon the wall, the images of the Chaldeans pourtrayed with vermilion,15 Girded with girdles upon their loins, exceeding in dyed attire upon their heads, all of them princes to look to, after the manner of the Babylonians of Chaldea, the land of their nativity:16 And as soon as she saw them with her eyes, she doted upon them, and sent messengers unto them into Chaldea.17 And the Babylonians came to her into the bed of love, and they defiled her with their whoredom, and she was polluted with them, and her mind was alienated from them.18 So she discovered her whoredoms, and discovered her nakedness: then my mind was alienated from her, like as my mind was alienated from her sister.19 Yet she multiplied her whoredoms, in calling to remembrance the days of her youth, wherein she had played the harlot in the land of Egypt.20 For she doted upon their paramours, whose flesh is as the flesh of asses, and whose issue is like the issue of horses.21 Thus thou calledst to remembrance the lewdness of thy youth, in bruising thy teats by the Egyptians for the paps of thy youth.22 There, O Aholibah, thus saith the Lord God; Behold, I will raise up thy lovers against thee, from whom thy mind is alienated, and I will bring them against thee on every side;23 The Babylonians, and all the Chaldeans, Pekod, and Shoa, and Koa, and all the Assyrians with them: all of them desirable young men, captains and rulers, great lords and renowned, all of them riding upon horses.24 And they shall come against thee with chariots, wagons, and wheels, and with an assembly of people, which shall set against thee buckler and shield and helmet round about: and I will set judgment before them, and they shall judge thee according to their judgments.25 And I will set my jealousy against thee, and they shall deal furiously with thee: they shall take away thy nose and thine ears; and thy remnant shall fall by the sword: they shall take thy sons and thy daughters; and thy residue shall be devoured by the fire.26 They shall also strip thee out of thy clothes, and take away thy fair jewels.27 Thus will I make thy lewdness to cease from thee, and thy whoredom brought from the land of Egypt: so that thou shalt not lift up thine eyes unto them, nor remember Egypt any more.
KJV
Isa 47:1-3
Come down, and sit in the dust, O virgin daughter of Babylon, sit on the ground: there is no throne, O daughter of the Chaldeans: for thou shalt no more be called tender and delicate.
2 Take the millstones, and grind meal: uncover thy locks, make bare the leg, uncover the thigh, pass over the rivers.
3 Thy nakedness shall be uncovered, yea, thy shame shall be seen: I will take vengeance, and I will not meet thee as a man.
KJV
Deut 28:47-48
47 Because thou servedst not the Lord thy God with joyfulness, and with gladness of heart, for the abundance of all things;
48 Therefore shalt thou serve thine enemies which the Lord shall send against thee, in hunger, and in thirst, and in nakedness, and in want of all things: and he shall put a yoke of iron upon thy neck, until he have destroyed thee.
KJV
Ezek 16:27-37
thee, and have diminished thine ordinary food, and delivered thee unto the will of them that hate thee, the daughters of the Philistines, which are ashamed of thy lewd way.
28 Thou hast played the whore also with the Assyrians, because thou wast unsatiable; yea, thou hast played the harlot with them, and yet couldest not be satisfied.
29 Thou hast moreover multiplied thy fornication in the land of Canaan unto Chaldea; and yet thou wast not satisfied herewith.
30 How weak is thine heart, saith the Lord God, seeing thou doest all these things, the work of an imperious whorish woman;
31 In that thou buildest thine eminent place in the head of every way, and makest thine high place in every street; and hast not been as an harlot, in that thou scornest hire;
32 But as a wife that committeth adultery, which taketh strangers instead of her husband!
33 They give gifts to all whores: but thou givest thy gifts to all thy lovers, and hirest them, that they may come unto thee on every side for thy whoredom.
34 And the contrary is in thee from other women in thy whoredoms, whereas none followeth thee to commit whoredoms: and in that thou givest a reward, and no reward is given unto thee, therefore thou art contrary.
35 Wherefore, O harlot, hear the word of the Lord:
36 Thus saith the Lord God; Because thy filthiness was poured out, and thy nakedness discovered through thy whoredoms with thy lovers, and with all the idols of thy abominations, and by the blood of thy children, which thou didst give unto them;
37 Behold, therefore I will gather all thy lovers, with whom thou hast taken pleasure, and all them that thou hast loved, with all them that thou hast hated; I will even gather them round about against thee, and will discover thy nakedness unto them, that they may see all thy nakedness.
KJV
Nah 3:1-6
Woe to the bloody city! it is all full of lies and robbery; the prey departeth not;
2 The noise of a whip, and the noise of the rattling of the wheels, and of the pransing horses, and of the jumping chariots.
3 The horseman lifteth up both the bright sword and the glittering spear: and there is a multitude of slain, and a great number of carcases; and there is none end of their corpses; they stumble upon their corpses:
4 Because of the multitude of the whoredoms of the well-favoured harlot, the mistress of witchcrafts, that selleth nations through her whoredoms, and families through her witchcrafts.
5 Behold, I am against thee, saith the Lord of hosts; and I will discover thy skirts upon thy face, and I will shew the nations thy nakedness, and the kingdoms thy shame.
6 And I will cast abominable filth upon thee, and make thee vile, and will set thee as a gazingstock.
KJV
Isa 3:16-17
16 Moreover the Lord saith, Because the daughters of Zion are haughty, and walk with stretched forth necks and wanton eyes, walking and mincing as they go, and making a tinkling with their feet:
17 Therefore the Lord will smite with a scab the crown of the head of the daughters of Zion, and the Lord will discover their secret parts.
KJV
As you can see God uses humiliation to chastise nations including Israel whether or not that offends Victorian sensibilities.
If we do not want our children judged harshly as adults we do well to persuade them to do right as children.
P
Those examples are "God" stripping people naked ... There is zero scripture there indicating that God has instructed for man to strip his child naked prior to giving him/her any discipline ... Do you think you yourself are God, MarcR ? ... What God has done and what He instructs for man to do are two entirely different things ... You seem to be confused into thinking that if God did something then it is o.k. for you to do it ... That is in no way how it works my friend ...