Are women allowed to Preach?

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lightbearer

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Jun 17, 2017
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Jtenacious. :)

I don't remember who said this, but I woke thinking of the quote and it made me laugh, considering this thread - preach the gospel at all times. If necessary, use words.
No one is sure where that saying came from Stunnedbygrace.
 

Lucy-Pevensie

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Dec 20, 2017
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There is a demonic spammer attacking the forum. Needs to be stopped ASAP. Are there any mods around?
 

Lucy-Pevensie

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Actually, it's happening so fast it might be a bot.
 

blue_ladybug

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Feb 21, 2014
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Yes we know. It's been reported. No need to keep commenting on it.. :) And are you kidding, these are the forums, there's NEVER any mods around when we need them. :rolleyes:

There is a demonic spammer attacking the forum. Needs to be stopped ASAP. Are there any mods around?
 

Stunnedbygrace

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I have found the mods to be actually quite fast when there's a real problem. :) this one is more like a huge nuisance. No one will actually go into the threads. Its just a nuisance to scroll down to the thread you're searching for. But hey, the good news is, there's coffee!
 

Lucy-Pevensie

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There is a second one at it now. Coffee? I'd much prefer a nice cup of tea.
 

WineRose

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Jan 3, 2017
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Row A, Column 9
There is a second one at it now. Coffee? I'd much prefer a nice cup of tea.
Yeah, so do I. Has anyone got any green or chrysanthemum tea around here?

And yeah...I knew that the spammer would return, and now that he also created a side account, who knows how much spam the poor BDF has to choke on...
 
Mar 28, 2016
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double thread.
 
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Angela53510

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Jan 24, 2011
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Just as an aside, and a personal note to Angela, I have never entered the KJV only thread, except once or twice by accident. But I didn't know you participated in it.

I'm going to read it to see your posts. I would prefer to find what you have to say, not in a piecemeal way, like I have to do in here, dodging around long and unlearned posts that are ridiculous, but if that's the only way to hear you, I'll do it - I'm tenacious. :)

I don't remember who said this, but I woke thinking of the quote and it made me laugh, considering this thread - preach the gospel at all times. If necessary, use words.

You see here just one woman's (me) hunger for practical theology, but a lot of us only really read what is a practical help to us any more. Everything else, we just discard. And if you aren't practically helping people, its doubtful that you are doing anything of worth.

Okay, I'll stop my campaign for practical theology. For now. :)R then.

If you were to somehow find a way to arrange a bible study, it would be a practical help and a service to us. Maybe a topical study ahe and exegete it. or a series of topical studies? You know, like, in your spareroup time...:D
I have my German final on April 24, plus a sermon to preach 2 days earlier. So I wouldn’t do it before then. I do topical all the time, but the best way is to take a passage and exegete it. Maybe we could start a small group, or think
about this. It sounds like a good plan!

I wouldn’t mind doing it publically, but I don’t want to get bogged down with trolls and naysayers, it would be wonderful to live near each other, and have it our homes with coffee and a treat. Let’s put our heads together and figure out the how, when and what. And participatory! Not just me lecturing!
 

Stunnedbygrace

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Could we make a group, by invite only...? Like the veranda?
 

Angela53510

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Jan 24, 2011
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It is an interesting word actually.

From Thayers unabridged work. I highlighted in bold his section on 2:12 ...

G831
αὐθεντέω, ἀυθέντω; (a Biblical and ecclesiastical word; from αὐθέντης contracted from αὐτοέντης, and this from αὐτός and ἔντεα arms (others, ἑντης, cf. Hesychius συνεντης συνεργός; cf. Lobeck, Technol., p. 121); hence,
a. according to earlier usage, one who with his own hand kills either others or himself.


b. in later Greek writings one who does a thing himself the author" (τῆς πράξεως, Polybius 23, 14, 2, etc.); one who acts on his own authority, autocratic, equivalent to αὐτοκράτωρ an absolute master; cf. Lobeck ad Phryn., p. 120 (also as above; cf. Winers Grammar, § 2, 1 c.)); to govern one, exercise dominion over one: τινς, 1Ti_2:12.

Let's see what the BDAG cites.

αὐθεντέω (s. αὐθέντης; Philod., Rhet. II p. 133, 14 Sudh.; Jo. Lydus, Mag. 3, 42; Moeris p. 54; cp. Phryn. 120 Lob.; Hesychius; Thom. Mag. p. 18, 8; schol. in Aeschyl., Eum. 42; BGU 1208, 38 [27 B.C.]; s. Lampe s.v.) to assume a stance of independent authority, give orders to, dictate to w. gen. of pers. (Ptolem., Apotel. 3, 14, 10 Boll-B.; Cat. Cod. Astr. VIII/1 p. 177, 7; B-D-F §177) ἀνδρός, w. διδάσκειν, 1 Ti 2:12 (practically = ‘tell a man what to do’ [Jerusalem Bible]; Mich. Glykas [XII A.D.] 270, 10 αἱ γυναῖκες αὐθεντοῦσι τ. ἀνδρῶν. According to Diod. S. 1, 27, 2 there was a well-documented law in Egypt: κυριεύειν τὴν γυναῖκα τἀνδρός, cp. Soph., OC 337–41; GKnight III, NTS 30, ’84, 143–57; LWilshire, ibid. 34, ’88, 120–34).—DELG s.v. αὐθέντης. M-M.


From what I see from what is shared above "to usurp authority" definitely falls within the grammar and how the word was used in Antiquity considering usurp is a verb. Maybe "to be usurping authority" would bring out the present tense more clearly.

Thinking on what you shared in regards to domineer. That definitely falls in line figuratively with what Thayer shared: in that he said, " according to earlier usage, one who with his own hand kills either others or himself." But then so would usurp.

But I don't see them falling in line with later usage. When I think of the word domineer or usurping I think of abusive authority or dictatorship. I am not seeing that emphatically being stated above in the citations.

What do you think?



What is that all about?

. Where are these examples? I am not aware of them that is why I ask.

Amen!


Not sure where you are coming from, but from either side of the argument, Subjectivity is an ugly beast that quips it's tongue way to often in regards to Spiritual things.

Speaking of context I love the fact the Paul through the Spirit gave a reason for what he emphatically stated in that he said,
"but I am not allowing woman to be teaching, nor to be dictating authority over man, but to be (in) quietness."

He reasoned through the Spirit, "For Adam was first formed, then Eve. And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression."
(1Ti 2:13-14 KJV)

E
I had not read through this thread. So I am not aware of how everyone thinks on this issue. But Please note if we continue this dialog that I probably do not see as others or how you might think I do in regards to woman and ministry.
I appreciate this post and the way you looked at the Greek. It’s still dark and very early here. My phone has a cracked screen, so I will answer you probably after church, on my computer, if you can wait.

In the meantime, I am going back to sleep!
 

Mem

Senior Member
Sep 23, 2014
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No one is sure where that saying came from Stunnedbygrace.
using a boolean search of "sometimes use words", I found it to be a paraphrase of Francis of Assisi.
 

SovereignGrace

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Dec 28, 2016
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I appreciate this post and the way you looked at the Greek. It’s still dark and very early here. My phone has a cracked screen, so I will answer you probably after church, on my computer, if you can wait.

In the meantime, I am going back to sleep!
Looks like someone’s gonna sleep all day.

#LazyBum
#CockaDoodleDoo
#Getupyoulazybum
 

lightbearer

Senior Member
Jun 17, 2017
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using a boolean search of "sometimes use words", I found it to be a paraphrase of Francis of Assisi.
Paraphrase? That would be a stretch from what I understand. Care to post your findings?
 

Stunnedbygrace

Senior Member
Nov 12, 2015
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Sometimes use words...would be a paraphrase of what I said and remembered the quote to be...so...whassup...??
 

lightbearer

Senior Member
Jun 17, 2017
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I appreciate this post and the way you looked at the Greek. It’s still dark and very early here. My phone has a cracked screen, so I will answer you probably after church, on my computer, if you can wait.

In the meantime, I am going back to sleep!
Thank you for your kind response. I can wait. I look forward to your response! Pleasant dreams!
 
Mar 28, 2016
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The quoting of acts 2, 17 original is from Joel 2. The context from Joel 2 is clear meant for the nation of Israel. And must be in future because the context till yet is not realized for Israel. When Peter qoutet this in Acts 2 then it is clear that it only could be a partwise fullfilling.
The pentecostal movememt claims Joel 2 for themselves.
But I cant see that Joel 2 is fullfilled till today.
Why you are mentioning prophecie? The thread is talking about preaching/teaching
.

I would think we would first have to define teaching and preaching in respect to one not seen. We walk by Christ's faith the unseen eternal

God is no respecter of persons . Can't seperate the Jews from the Gentiles in that way He does not speak privately to an outward Jew . He speaks to the multitude. Jew and Gentile

Prophecy is the context of 1 Corinthian 14. As far as woman being silent it had to do with counseling with the opposite sex.

In 1 Corinthians 14 the context of womam being silent. Women like Deborah were already prophesying in the church according to the prophecy of Joel

We have to remember the new setting of the new ceremonial laws.

Woman were no longer separated from the men that period of time used as a parable for the time present had come to a end at

From my experience most simply gloss over the idea of a reformation until the fifteenth. The first century reformation that re-established all things written in the law and prophets (sola scriptura) It is the same principle that worked in the fifteenth century reformation

The Holy Ghost this signifying, that the way into the holiest of all was not yet made manifest, while as the first tabernacle was yet standing:Which was a figure(parable) for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until "the time of reformation". Heb 9:9

That was the setting, which again seems to be ignored by many .It was the time of Jabobs trouble as things were being restored to another time period, before Kings were used in Isreal. When woman were seperated from men in a seperate court.

The Spirit as our one teacher does the preaching. We preach Christ when we declare his will .Not our selves We declare his will (prophecy). He does all the work of preaching aplying the gospel to one's new heart.

God is no respecter of person what he spoke to the multitude to in clued at outward Jew he spoke to everyone. Its not a Jewish religion. It has never been in respect to the flesh of a Jew. Even Christ said His flesh profits for nothing No private conversations. Joesl was in effect when the Son of man Jesus said it is finished the time of reformation had come

The context is 1 Corinthians 14 women were already being used to prophecy (declare the will of God). The teaching as to woman being silent is not in respect to prophecy . But personal matters .Women were not to council with men in personal matters and vice versa .That was something they were to do at home giving the husband the honor as the represetitive head for working to keep the marriage intact.

It is why he assigned Deacons as husband of one wife..The Deacon and their wife as a joint ministry working with relationship difficulties.

They acted as the phycologist.Something the church has given over to the world.
 

Mem

Senior Member
Sep 23, 2014
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I have my German final on April 24, plus a sermon to preach 2 days earlier. So I wouldn’t do it before then. I do topical all the time, but the best way is to take a passage and exegete it. Maybe we could start a small group, or think
about this. It sounds like a good plan!

I wouldn’t mind doing it publically, but I don’t want to get bogged down with trolls and naysayers, it would be wonderful to live near each other, and have it our homes with coffee and a treat. Let’s put our heads together and figure out the how, when and what. And participatory! Not just me lecturing!
I've considered hosting a chatroom titled "Jael's Tent," just for the occasions when such topics as often comes up that it would deem it necessary to direct the wayward eisegetes to "Go directly to Jael's. Do not pass go. Do not collect 200 collars." Something like that, but I'm afraid my motive might prove to be obstinate, and I just may too much like the privilege to bounce the thicker skulls.