Did Moses and Elijah rise from dead before Christ?

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Mar 28, 2016
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I literally just addressed this in my last comment.
I understand and re-addressed it. The first two speak of things men do. The reference in Job is to what God is. . not a man as us or a man like no creature . The idea that there is no daysman fleshly mediator between (Pope) cements it in stone.

God is not a man .He is the faithful Creator without nature (supernatural no beginning)
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
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I understand and re-addressed it. The first two speak of things men do. The reference in Job is to what God is. . not a man as us or a man like no creature . The idea that there is no daysman fleshly mediator between (Pope) cements it in stone.

God is not a man .He is the faithful Creator without nature (supernatural no beginning)
Garee...

NOBODY is claiming that God is merely a man. Get that wacky, heretical idea out of your head. You're arguing with the wind.

MOST are stating what the Bible clearly teaches: that God CAME in the form of a man, as Jesus the son of Mary; that Jesus is fully God and fully man. ANY view that diminishes Jesus to mere humanity is equally heretical.
 

Diakonos

Well-known member
Jan 19, 2019
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Everything the physical eye sees is corrupted, not corruptible. Dead is dead. In that way we let the dead bury the dead .We bring the gospel not seen our eternal living hope it goes beyond what the eyes discover.

God was not a man at any time. The 3 days three night demonstration of the temporal was used to give us the unseen gospel understanding.

We can use the tools he has designed to open our understanding hid in the parables.

2 Corinthians 4:18 While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

It would seem to help understand the wrath of God as a corrupted dying creation that began to be reveled in Genesis the garden . When mankind obeyed the voice of a creature seen. The wrath, in dying you will be dead. It is being revealed from heaven to the whole world not just the Christian or Jewish world. The wrath would seem to be founded on those not applying that interpreting principle. 2 Corinthians 4:18

They changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man.

Even the Son of man, Jesus in his flesh which he says profits for nothing (corruption has no power) would not stand in that holy place unseen place of the father as a abomination of desolation but rather when called a daysman (Pope) (Job 9:33 ) The Son of man said one is our Good Master, Our father not seen call no man on earth teacher as Good Master as Lord one is our father in heaven

For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, (2 Corinthians 4:18) even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and four footed beasts, and creeping things.Romans1:18-23
It sounds like you don't believe in the deity of Jesus :(
 
Mar 28, 2016
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It sounds like you don't believe in the deity of Jesus :(

Or perhaps in a different way.;)

Deity as gods are sons thereof born of God. In that way he calls believers, gods .

God is not a man He has no geanalolgy, beginning of days or end of spirit life. .

We according to 1 John are sons of God in bodies of death. What we will be is not revealed.

Those who had no faith refused to beleive the father in heaven not seen through prophecy the gospel .

They accused the Son of man the first born of the brethren of claiming to be the fleshly Jewish God that they falsely hoped it would be a man.(they had no faith or desire ) Many today are still waiting for the right Jesus to come along when he dwells in them protecting the faith by which he comforts us. The mark of the antichrists in 1st John. . . deny both the father and the son .

They cannot be separated. No man can serve two masters .The things of men seen, the flesh and the unseen eternal glorious things of God . . . . . . no faith

One demonstration is all that was promised then the last day comes.

They denied both the father not seen and the Son seen mutually . It was the one work of peace performed by two. Jesus as the Son of man refused to stand in the unseen place of the hidden glory of the father making the hidden glory desolate. .

I and my Father are one.Then the Jews took up stones again to stone him. Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me?The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God. Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods? If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken; Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God? If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not. John 10:30-37

Jesus the high apostle and prophet did not say they were his own works but that of the spirit not seen. It works in the flesh to both will and do the good pleasure of Him who wills a finished work.

deities = gods
antichrists = many gods
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
25,353
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Or perhaps in a different way.;)

Deity as gods are sons thereof born of God. In that way he calls believers, gods .

God is not a man He has no geanalolgy, beginning of days or end of spirit life. .

We according to 1 John are sons of God in bodies of death. What we will be is not revealed.

Those who had no faith refused to beleive the father in heaven not seen through prophecy the gospel .

They accused the Son of man the first born of the brethren of claiming to be the fleshly Jewish God that they falsely hoped it would be a man.(they had no faith or desire ) Many today are still waiting for the right Jesus to come along when he dwells in them protecting the faith by which he comforts us. The mark of the antichrists in 1st John. . . deny both the father and the son .

They cannot be separated. No man can serve two masters .The things of men seen, the flesh and the unseen eternal glorious things of God . . . . . . no faith

One demonstration is all that was promised then the last day comes.

They denied both the father not seen and the Son seen mutually . It was the one work of peace performed by two. Jesus as the Son of man refused to stand in the unseen place of the hidden glory of the father making the hidden glory desolate. .

I and my Father are one.Then the Jews took up stones again to stone him. Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me?The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God. Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods? If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken; Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God? If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not. John 10:30-37

Jesus the high apostle and prophet did not say they were his own works but that of the spirit not seen. It works in the flesh to both will and do the good pleasure of Him who wills a finished work.

deities = gods
antichrists = many gods
Garee, do you believe that Jesus is divine, was divine before His birth, continued to be divine throught His earthly life, and is now divine since His ascension? A simple "Yes" or "No" will do, on each point if necessary. No other commentary is needed... or wanted.
 

Diakonos

Well-known member
Jan 19, 2019
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beginning of days or end of spirit life. .
Where are you getting this from? If you're quoting Hebrews 7, your adding things.
We according to 1 John are sons of God in bodies of death. What we will be is not revealed.
It has been revealed in 1 Cor 15. Paul literally answered the question "How are the dead raised? And with what kind of body do they come?"
He shows us in Rom 5 that she “second man” from heaven refers to Jesus in his glorified humanity.
Judaism taught the resurrection of the body, not just the immortality of the soul; Paul agrees but defines the nature of the new body differently from many of his contemporaries.
15:35–38. Ancient writers often raised rhetorical objections from imaginary opponents; Jewish teachers presented questions like the one Paul raises here as the standard objections nonbelievers raised against the doctrine of the resurrection. For instance, what happened if someone died at sea, or the body was completely destroyed by fire? The rabbis decided that the body would be resurrected from a particular bone in the neck which they held to be indestructible. Paul more reasonably argues that, regardless of what physical material remains, at least the pattern of the old body will always remain as the seed for the new body. His argument from analogy, a standard argument, is effective, and later rabbis also used the “seed” analogy. “Fool!” (15:36) was a standard rhetorical insult, Jewish as well as Greek, for someone who raised an ignorant or immoral objection.

Jesus is "The first born from the dead"....meaning there will be more born from the dead . I.e. us. The resurrection of Jesus was the example, prototype and model for the resurrected state of all who will be resurrected after Him. So when we read verses like Romans 6:5, we can know exactly what our resurrection will be like because Jesus has already shown us. And Paul has explained it in 1 Cor 15. That's the theme of that chapter: Resurrection.
They cannot be separated. No man can serve two masters .The things of men seen, the flesh and the unseen eternal glorious things of God . . . . . . no faith
This has been dealt with in post #117 and #119. You're just repeating yourself instead of responding to the Scriptures that have been provided against this
Jesus as the Son of man refused to stand in the unseen place of the hidden glory of the father making the hidden glory desolate. .
The incarnation is described by the N.T. writers in the perfect tense; the Greek is conjugated in such a way that it indicates a completed action, never to be undone or re-done.
Jesus' incarnation was a permanent addition to His being. This inarguable. The Greek is clear
 
Mar 28, 2016
15,954
1,528
113
Where are you getting this from? If you're quoting Hebrews 7, your adding things.
That self description of eternal God who is not a man was not added by me. Those who look to make God into a man make it without effect.

It has been revealed in 1 Cor 15. Paul literally answered the question "How are the dead raised? And with what kind of body do they come?"
He shows us in Rom 5 that she “second man” from heaven refers to Jesus in his glorified humanity.
Judaism taught the resurrection of the body, not just the immortality of the soul; Paul agrees but defines the nature of the new body differently from many of his contemporaries.
We do not know what kind of body it will be. It could be one that glows like the Sun . Whether we will be male or female is not know. Just as in the same neither Jew nor gentile . No one has received a new incorruptible body . There will be no ressurection of this body of sin that the worms have had there fill.

1 John 3:1Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

15:35–38. Ancient writers often raised rhetorical objections from imaginary opponents; Jewish teachers presented questions like the one Paul raises here as the standard objections nonbelievers raised against the doctrine of the resurrection. For instance, what happened if someone died at sea, or the body was completely destroyed by fire? The rabbis decided that the body would be resurrected from a particular bone in the neck which they held to be indestructible. Paul more reasonably argues that, regardless of what physical material remains, at least the pattern of the old body will always remain as the seed for the new body. His argument from analogy, a standard argument, is effective, and later rabbis also used the “seed” analogy. “Fool!” (15:36) was a standard rhetorical insult, Jewish as well as Greek, for someone who raised an ignorant or immoral objection.
The fool has said there is not God in their heart .They walk after the things seen the pagan formation. Out of sight out of mind.

Jesus is "The first born from the dead"....meaning there will be more born from the dead . I.e. us. The resurrection of Jesus was the example, prototype and model for the resurrected state of all who will be resurrected after Him. So when we read verses like Romans 6:5, we can know exactly what our resurrection will be like because Jesus has already shown us. And Paul has explained it in 1 Cor 15. That's the theme of that chapter: Resurrection.
yes believers are born again brothers and sister from the dead. Not fathers. One is in heaven not seen. Same one that worked in the Son of man Jesus to provide the one time demonstration.

We know him not after the flesh what the eyes see . Some did that he called faithless. and commands us we know him that way no more forever more. God is not a man .

We know exactly what the demonstration provided .The father not seen pouring His spirit on the corrupted flesh of the Son of man signified as sinfully for the purpose of the demonstration . it was needed to do what the letter of the law "death" could not do . Reveal the work of the father and son working as one God. The law of faith (the unseen eternal) the law that brings new spirit life

He is the lamb slain from before the foundation. The flesh, the temporal seen profited for nothing. God is not a man


This has been dealt with in post #117 and #119. You're just repeating yourself instead of responding to the Scriptures that have been provided against this
I have responded. The example in Job makes the first two examples clear. God is not a man and neither is there any fleshly mediator as a infallible master teacher standing between God not seen and mankind seen .

You keep forgetting God has no beginning.

Father and son are immutable attributes . God is one. God has no mother or father. In the same way God is not a lamb .

Three things make up God not seen. He is eternal spirit .God is also love and light. Not that he able to create love and light But those three are the very essence of eternal God .

No need to turn him into a man any more that a lamb . Both are metaphors describing his pone person God

The time promised demonstration spoken of in the old testament is finished. No more demonstrations are scheduled.

The incarnation is described by the N.T. writers in the perfect tense; the Greek is conjugated in such a way that it indicates a completed action, never to be undone or re-done.
Jesus' incarnation was a permanent addition to His being. This inarguable. The Greek is clear[
Yes salvation is one action not seen with our eyes . but rather new heart and spirit. . The incarnation was a sign of Jonas three days of sufferings a living hell strengthened by the father who worked with Jesus together finishing all the work required for the two .

God is not a man .No such thing as holiness of the corrupted flesh of mankind . His blood was not changed as if flesh and blood could enter the new order. Jesus said his flesh profits for Zero .

Seed of David dead in tresspapases and sin.

The Son of God .(not the Son of man ) has the power attributed to him the anointing Holy Spirit not seen . The spiritual seed not seen the eternal

Romans 1:3-5 King James Version (KJV) Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh; And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead: By whom we have received grace and apostleship, for obedience to the faith among all nations, for his name:

Grace is not reckoned after the flesh the things seen the temporal.

Its easy to see no power is attributed to the flesh of the Son of man. It is why the Father would give the prophet Jesus words that could rebuke the father of lies like in Mathew 16. The lord not seen has the power to rebuke. The disciples like Jesus the high apostle had no power of themselves coming from the things seen .