Today’s church’s misunderstandings

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tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
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Tennessee
#61
I believe that unless you were meeting in church and worshipping on Saturday all throughout the Covid crisis, then you need to take the log out of your own eye before taking out the speck of people who observed it on a Sunday instead of a Saturday.

And that you also forfeit your right to log onto this forum and obviously pick a fight, if you yourself did not meet in church every Saturday since the covid crisis began.
It would be hard to meet together in church, the Sabbath or otherwise, if it were closed due to corona.
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
13,058
4,341
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#62
You are proving what I have said about it. They saw that Christ had risen but they did not see Him rise. What they saw were the material he was wrapped in.

Even if they had seen Christ rise, and it was the first day of the week that they saw this, how would that show that God changed what God had created?

I don't think this is a vital issue, what is vital is knowing Christ saves us from our sin. But it does show that you are not listening to the Lord as he is speaking to you in scripture.
To the room, this is why human reasoning can't comprehend the Lord Jesus Christ without help from the Holy Spirit.

What they saw was Jesus resurrected from the dead as Jesus Himself said GO and Tell my Disciples and Peter.
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
25,470
13,782
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#63
Groundless? Opinions not scripture? Can you prove your accusations?
You first. Step up and substantiate your accusation against me, and your accusations against the church. Then and only then will I respond as you ask.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
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#64
To the room, this is why human reasoning can't comprehend the Lord Jesus Christ without help from the Holy Spirit.

What they saw was Jesus resurrected from the dead as Jesus Himself said GO and Tell my Disciples and Peter.
The Holy Spirit agrees with scripture. It does not add or take away. Scripture does not tell us the hour that Christ arose, if it was important we would be told. Scripture tells us just when it was discovered that he rose. It has nothing at all to do with the marvelous fact that Christ rose and is alive today. It also has nothing to do with the seventh day that God created the Sabbath.
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
13,058
4,341
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#65
The Holy Spirit agrees with scripture. It does not add or take away. Scripture does not tell us the hour that Christ arose, if it was important we would be told. Scripture tells us just when it was discovered that he rose. It has nothing at all to do with the marvelous fact that Christ rose and is alive today. It also has nothing to do with the seventh day that God created the Sabbath.
The Holy Spirit also will speak of Jesus as Jesus said in John chapter 14. The Holy Spirit will lead you and guide into all Truth.

The Truth is Jesus literally has risen from the dead. IN three days as HE said HE would. It has everything to do with the Truth that we serve a Risen Lord and Savior. Everything hangs on that. I think Jesus is the authority on the topic.
 

Rondonmon

Senior Member
May 13, 2016
1,304
183
63
#66
Are you preaching to disregard the law because we have grace? Are you saying that if we go to Christ and give Him our sin for forgiveness, it does not lead us to want to obey Him? If accepting the grace Christ offers only leads to a disregard of anything else He tells us then the grace God gave separates us from Christ, not bring Christ into the heart.
You don't need the Law when you live by faith that God is perfect, our desires were CHANGED we want to be like God. That is unless you love the world more than God. Sin nature is different from willful sinning. During the 1000 year reign, when Satan is locked up, there will be no willful sin, but there will still be sin nature, or men whoo sin by omission, only God is perfect, so not thinking about another persons needs might be a selfish sin of omission, but those living at that time will not go around willfully lusting, hating, etc. etc.

In the Holy Spirit, we do the same now, but Satan still can tempt us, so there is a continual battle, but via the holy spirit we can overcome the liar. Resist the devil and he will flee from you. I wonder if people have ever thought that through to its logical end? If I sat around talking to you every day, bugging you, and it agitated you, I would keep doing it if that is how I git my jollies. But the moment you ignored me for 24 hours straight, then a week straight, I would get tired of running my mouth and leave you be. That is what that verse means, if our hearts are set towards Jesus/God, then Satan will flee us, e may come back periodically with a grand scheme to make us fall. But if our hearts are set towards God/Jesus, the Law means nothing, we are justified by the Blood, not the Law.

Ron, you accept Christ as your savior so we are children of the Lord together, but you do need to study to clear up some of these things. I like so much "God didn't make any mistakes". I think if you could separate the eternal law from the laws given to the Jews to train them in the lord's ways you could see these scriptures clearly.

Paul didn't specify in his letters what law he was speaking of. History that we have of those times tell us and the people living in those days knew. But we lump all law together, and Paul didn't. There are so many statements Paul made about the need to keep the law best we can that it should be clear to any bible student that Paul was not against obeying the Lord, only against some of the Law of Moses like circumcision.
I have been preaching this word might near 35 years brother. The Law is null and void, as a matter of fact it was never the Covenant, Abrahams Covenant was always THE PROMISE.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
#67
You don't need the Law when you live by faith that God is perfect, our desires were CHANGED we want to be like God. That is unless you love the world more than God. Sin nature is different from willful sinning. During the 1000 year reign, when Satan is locked up, there will be no willful sin, but there will still be sin nature, or men whoo sin by omission, only God is perfect, so not thinking about another persons needs might be a selfish sin of omission, but those living at that time will not go around willfully lusting, hating, etc. etc.

In the Holy Spirit, we do the same now, but Satan still can tempt us, so there is a continual battle, but via the holy spirit we can overcome the liar. Resist the devil and he will flee from you. I wonder if people have ever thought that through to its logical end? If I sat around talking to you every day, bugging you, and it agitated you, I would keep doing it if that is how I git my jollies. But the moment you ignored me for 24 hours straight, then a week straight, I would get tired of running my mouth and leave you be. That is what that verse means, if our hearts are set towards Jesus/God, then Satan will flee us, e may come back periodically with a grand scheme to make us fall. But if our hearts are set towards God/Jesus, the Law means nothing, we are justified by the Blood, not the Law.



I have been preaching this word might near 35 years brother. The Law is null and void, as a matter of fact it was never the Covenant, Abrahams Covenant was always THE PROMISE.
You keep preaching to live without law or any guidance from the Lord. I hope that works for you, although it certainly is not what scripture says. As for me, I follow Christ and listen to Him. He is my savior.
 
R

Reformyourself

Guest
#68
You keep preaching to live without law or any guidance from the Lord. I hope that works for you, although it certainly is not what scripture says. As for me, I follow Christ and listen to Him. He is my savior.
In the Holy Spirit, we do the same now, but Satan still can tempt us, so there is a continual battle, but via the holy spirit we can overcome the liar. Resist the devil and he will flee from you. AMEN Blik !
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
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#69
Have you noticed that these who insist the Sabbath be kept fail to do so themselves.
They are on the internet posting.
By doing so they are forcing people to work on the Sabbath.
Is that not breaking the Sabbath?
I am trying to talk people into believing scripture just as it is, not adding to it or taking anything away. You are telling people how to live their life when it is none of your business.

I am 96, completely blind in one eye and the other is mostly gone. I only hear when people shout. I cannot walk but am in a wheel chair. I have no family at all and I have outlived my friends so I am in a care home. And you are criticizing and judging me for being housebound?
 
Mar 28, 2016
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#70
You keep preaching to live without law or any guidance from the Lord. I hope that works for you, although it certainly is not what scripture says. As for me, I follow Christ and listen to Him. He is my savior.
One thing I have noticed personally. Like other words meaning have been changed. The word sabbath is a non time sensitive. if we assign time to it it destroys the meaning. The 7th day was the day he decided . He does not tire. He could of created the world in one minute . Seven is set aside for another function .(complete. )

Rest was replaced by a time sensitive word (week) . Its seems the paraphrasers had no idea of what to do being stuck on the 7 th. day. So they changes the word Sabbath (sávvato) to Week . The word week ( evdomáda ) It was not part of the Greek in the original autograph. It came much later.

The Youngs literal has it as it seems correct , But in the other place where the word sabbath (rest with no other meaning added . He also reverts to weeks . .Therefore destroying the foundation of the word. Again not a time sensitive word in any way shape or form.

Matthew 28 Young's Literal Translation (YLT) And on the eve of the sabbaths, at the dawn, toward the first of the sabbaths, came Mary the Magdalene, and the other Mary, to see the sepulchre,

Matthew 28 King James Version (KJV) In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre.

The first of new era of sabbaths would be the proper Changing it to weeks causes many problems

The fast, three meals on the sabbath were Kosher. The man bragging he ate only two and paid the tithe on the same day . Not week . Sabbath

Not eating twice a week is not the one fast

Luke 18:12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all things -- as many as I possess.

.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
#71
One thing I have noticed personally. Like other words meaning have been changed. The word sabbath is a non time sensitive. if we assign time to it it destroys the meaning. The 7th day was the day he decided . He does not tire. He could of created the world in one minute . Seven is set aside for another function .(complete. )

Rest was replaced by a time sensitive word (week) . Its seems the paraphrasers had no idea of what to do being stuck on the 7 th. day. So they changes the word Sabbath (sávvato) to Week . The word week ( evdomáda ) It was not part of the Greek in the original autograph. It came much later.

The Youngs literal has it as it seems correct , But in the other place where the word sabbath (rest with no other meaning added . He also reverts to weeks . .Therefore destroying the foundation of the word. Again not a time sensitive word in any way shape or form.

Matthew 28 Young's Literal Translation (YLT) And on the eve of the sabbaths, at the dawn, toward the first of the sabbaths, came Mary the Magdalene, and the other Mary, to see the sepulchre,

Matthew 28 King James Version (KJV) In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre.

The first of new era of sabbaths would be the proper Changing it to weeks causes many problems

The fast, three meals on the sabbath were Kosher. The man bragging he ate only two and paid the tithe on the same day . Not week . Sabbath

Not eating twice a week is not the one fast

Luke 18:12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all things -- as many as I possess.

.
God used the things of this world that we are born to understand to explain the eternal world of the spirit. He meant for us to see the eternal through the temporary things of this world. The sacrificial system was a symbol of Christ, the cutting of foreskin was a symbol of belonging to God, eating foods from animals that don't eat garage was a symbol of keeping our minds pure.

God's time is eternal time, God lives in a different world than we do. Keeping one day in a 7 day week is to be used as a symbol of recognizing the truth of the Lord. We are to pass by many of the symbols he gave to the reality of what they symbolized, but some symbols we are told to keep, and through them we are to recognize the truth of the Lord.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,685
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#72
The church today says that the Sabbath was cancelled. As proof they tell of Mary’s discovery of the risen Christ on Sunday. It doesn’t make sense that the time of a discovery should change what God tells us He created on the seventh day, or that a time of discovering something establishes when it happened, but that is the way they think.

The Lord gave us a new covenant, one we are told makes the old covenant obsolete. The church tells us that God knew he make a mistake so he cancelled the old covenant. I guess they think that God is like them and they know they make mistakes so they say so does the Lord. As if the Lord was just another human.

The church goes on and on about the mistakes the Lord has made. They say the sacrificial system didn’t work at all for atonement of sin even though scripture tells us it did. When the blood of cattle was used to feed the Lord, like pagans fed idols and not as a symbol of Christ, God hated it so the church tells us it was a mistake of the Lord to establish it.

The church tells us OT scripture can be in error. OT scripture tells us that God guides us to praise and celebrate His plan of salvation for us with feasts for all generations. The church tells us that is an error, that the feasts are to be treated the same way cutting the foreskin is treated.

Scripture tells us to celebrate Christ with Passover, the church says God cancelled that. They made up a new way to do it and named it using pagan gods to inspire them to make up a name for this replacement.

Demons are attracted to the church, undermining it is undermining the Lord. They have done a mighty work, they will still fail in the end.
I fully agree, the 7th day Sabbath has "Never" been abolished.

Constantine the Pagan in 321AD named Sunday (The Venerable Day Of The Sun) as the day of worship for the apostate church.

Same would apply to (Easter) and (Christmas) just more Pagan days added to the apostate calendar.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
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#73
I fully agree, the 7th day Sabbath has "Never" been abolished.

Constantine the Pagan in 321AD named Sunday (The Venerable Day Of The Sun) as the day of worship for the apostate church.

Same would apply to (Easter) and (Christmas) just more Pagan days added to the apostate calendar.
You have studied and know the truth. It is such a wonder that people put the church doctrines ahead of the truth that is there for people to see.

But the basic most powerful truth is what Christ did for us. That truth is accepted.
 
Mar 28, 2016
15,954
1,528
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#74
I fully agree, the 7th day Sabbath has "Never" been abolished.

Constantine the Pagan in 321AD named Sunday (The Venerable Day Of The Sun) as the day of worship for the apostate church.

Same would apply to (Easter) and (Christmas) just more Pagan days added to the apostate calendar.
Why do you think the translators used the word Week 9 times to replace the word Sabbath"? When ever we hear his word and do not harden our hearts we have entered his rest.

WE do not seek the approval of Constantine.

Did Constantine change the word Rest to Week and destroy the meaning? Sabbath does not mean the last day of the week. Neither does mean 1st day.

In that sense any day a person does not have to do their normal work can be set aside to do the work of bringing the gospel, the true fast.
 

Relic

Active member
Apr 29, 2020
249
104
28
#75
The true church with it's members who know the Lord is Holy and praise and believe Him, who only listen to the Holy Spirit and search for truth is not the church I am speaking of. It is the doctrines that are accepted as truth but are not truth that I am speaking of, and yes. I am very concerned. I am hoping that posts will prove me wrong about false doctrines.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,685
2,495
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#76
Why do you think the translators used the word Week 9 times to replace the word Sabbath"? When ever we hear his word and do not harden our hearts we have entered his rest.

WE do not seek the approval of Constantine.

Did Constantine change the word Rest to Week and destroy the meaning? Sabbath does not mean the last day of the week. Neither does mean 1st day.

In that sense any day a person does not have to do their normal work can be set aside to do the work of bringing the gospel, the true fast.
Your babbling, post scripture with your claims :)
 

Relic

Active member
Apr 29, 2020
249
104
28
#77
You have studied and know the truth. It is such a wonder that people put the church doctrines ahead of the truth that is there for people to see.

But the basic most powerful truth is what Christ did for us. That truth is accepted.
Long ago I gave up the traditional churches. Those with pews and songs and preachers with
doctors in their title as though that gives them credibility as they walk out to their Cadillacs
with air conditioners haven spoken the book that everyone is capable of reading themselves
I have gone to a group church with twenty people at most. I feel Jesus there and not someone
yelping at the crowd threatening they are going to hell. You're going to hell they utter. You
sinned, you are wrong, God is going to kill you. I have heard that many, many times believe
it or not.
 

Relic

Active member
Apr 29, 2020
249
104
28
#78

I hate, i despise your religious festivals;
your assemblies are a stench to me.
Even though you bring me burnt offerings and grain offerings,
I will not accept them...
Away with the noise of your songs!
I will not listen to the music of your harps.
But let justice roll on like a river,
righteousness like a never-failing stream!

(Amos 5:21-24)
 
Mar 28, 2016
15,954
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#79
Your babbling, post scripture with your claims :)


I have posted scripture. Babbling is offering the private interpretation of Constantine . If he even said those things.

It should be easy for you to prove. Why did the the paraphrasers change the word rest (sabbath) nine times for week ( evdomáda )?
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,685
2,495
113
#80
I have posted scripture. Babbling is offering the private interpretation of Constantine . If he even said those things.

It should be easy for you to prove. Why did the the paraphrasers change the word rest (sabbath) nine times for week ( evdomáda )?
Once again no Scripture is posted, babbling.