Lost Gospel of Evangelicalism

[Grandpa]

What sin does the Holy Spirit convict of according to the verse?

He shall teach you all things...

The Law was our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ. It was sin that the Law revealed to us or rather the Holy Spirit used to reveal to us.

The Law doesn't bring everyone to Christ (Judaism, etc) so something else must be the cause of the Law bringing us to Christ. (Holy Spirit)

 

[Grandpa]

No preaching the Gospel no salvation.

No Holy Spirit no understanding of Gospel or Salvation.

 

[kaylagrl]

You need to practice what you prescribe for others. Following women preachers so called will never get you to Spiritual maturity.

You've got to be kidding. I know women with more spiritual maturity than the vast majority of men. See, I can make blanket statements too. I traveled in ministry for 20yrs in over a thousand churches of all denominations. Wanna take a guess at the percentage of women vs men in attendance. Shoot they had to put a big screen tv in one of the churches I attended so the spiritually mature men would come during football season. rofl When I met my husband he told me the teams he liked and that he wasn't a sports nut,but liked to watch important games. I told him "fine, two things, it doesn't come before church or a family event."

We went to minister in a church years ago, they told us the pastor would not be there. We assumed he was on vacation, nope, he was attending a hockey game. Yeah, clearly it's the women that are spiritually immature. Most of the local churches would be closed if it weren't for the women attending and running, the church. But don't dare let them step in the pulpit. Noooo, shut that sucker down before you let a woman preach. smh

 

[Blain]

Has anyone else noticed this-- there are a number of pastors of churches and preachers on TV who do not preach about the cross, the atonement, or the resurrection of Christ, then tag a little schpeel on the end of their sermon that religion is a bad thing and we need a relationship, and declare people saved for repeating a prayer.

The prayer may involve people 'asking Jesus into your heart' without any explanation of Who Jesus is or what He did prior.

There is also this idea that 'receiving Christ' means to repeat a prayer after a preacher?

From what I have studied, the practice of confessing faith by means of a prayer either goes back to Billy Graham or wasn't widely practiced before his crusades. I have heard the assertion that if someone has not done this, he is not saved.

I recall decades ago, prayers based on Romans 10:9-10 where people would confess Jesus is Lord and their faith that God raised Him from the dead. Now a lot of these sinner's prayer rituals and the sermons that precede them often seem to be missing the
Sometimes the preacher tells the audience those that repeat the prayer that they are saved without telling them that Christ died for their sins or that He rose from the dead.

Has anyone else noticed this?

I have noticed this as well How can one recieve him without knwoing who he is or what he did for us? The reason he suffered the reason he did all he did in his ministry? I mean would you welcome a stranger into your house? I heard a very interesting thing from a dedicated house lover and house turner a house is just like the human body it has a moputh being the front door a backside the back door it has the heart of the house which is usually the living room and it breaths as most houses are made of material that requires room to breath and like the human luings if it is soaked it cannot breath well leaving water damage
our bodies became the house of the Lord his temple but how can one accept a stranger into their house? another thing is that many preachers not only do not preach on salvation or saving grace but many times they speak of what not to do they make a point to speak about sin weakness and a constant battle against it many times I would try new churches and see no life in people there sure the preacher had instructive teachings well organized with scripture but there was no life in the audience some looked like they would nod off others looked anxious to leave or just bored.

I took a cool personality test as I find things like that fun one of them was the calling or ministry as a Christian surprisingly I got teacher and or preacher and I wondered what I would be like as one I mean I know the power of words being a writer I am not afraid to speak in front of a large group of people in fact God used me several times in this area two specifically I remember well is when I was visiting my sister and it was sunday morning I wanted to try this small church I saw nearby the people here were so kind and welcoming but I sensed deep emotional wounds in them I learned many there had lost loved ones or had loved ones and friends who were gravely ill I listened to the sermon and about half way through I felt this urgent need to get in front of everyone and speak I had no idea what I was going to say I just knew I had to get up there and speak *I waited until the sermon was done to be polite and asked the pastor if I could speak like I normally do I just spoke what was placed on my heart and by the time I was done to my surprise the entire church was appluading in tears and I saw life in these people a spark was made and inner healing was being done they all wanted to talk to me after the service. asking me how I learned to speak in that way

Another time I entered a new church and this pastor was so obsessed with sin his entire sermon was about sin about how we attack God in every sin we do how our weakness is to be shamed of it was like throwing daggers into the large group of people there I wasn't having any of that and stood up to confront this preacher in the middle of his sermon he wanted nothing to do with me and kept trying to silence me but I kept going telling him how he as a leader of the church and the shepherd appointed to guide help and teach his sheep will be held all the more accountable for the words he speaks I in my fury told him how his job more than anything is to build the church to encourage strengthen and bring the bonds of the sheep and God more intimately closer not attack them about their failings bringing them down lower than they already felt from his preaching he commanded I leave his church and I rejected him saying this is the house of God not him and if he couldn't handle what I had to say maybe he shouldn't be a pastor of course I was kicked out anyways.

there is a reason the church is dead or lukewarm we need real teachers real shepherds real pastors

 

[Blain]

You've got to be kidding. I know women with more spiritual maturity than the vast majority of men. See, I can make blanket statements too. I traveled in ministry for 20yrs in over a thousand churches of all denominations. Wanna take a guess at the percentage of women vs men in attendance. Shoot they had to put a big screen tv in one of the churches I attended so the spiritually mature men would come during football season. rofl When I met my husband he told me the teams he liked and that he wasn't a sports nut,but liked to watch important games. I told him "fine, two things, it doesn't come before church or a family event."

We went to minister in a church years ago, they told us the pastor would not be there. We assumed he was on vacation, nope, he was attending a hockey game. Yeah, clearly it's the women that are spiritually immature. Most of the local churches would be closed if it weren't for the women attending and running, the church. But don't dare let them step in the pulpit. Noooo, shut that sucker down before you let a woman preach. smh

Don't worry I know all to well how women preachers can bring forth spiritual growth a user on here called Angela is one she is my unofficial mentor she helped teach and guide me in my walk even when she gave correction or rebuke not to mention women tend to be more empathetic they tend to be more encouraging and are very good at lifting others up encouraging and building them up as well they have tender hands for those who need it and so God uses them far more than other men who would think otherwise would assume.

 

[calibob]

You've got to be kidding. I know women with more spiritual maturity than the vast majority of men. See, I can make blanket statements too. I traveled in ministry for 20yrs in over a thousand churches of all denominations. Wanna take a guess at the percentage of women vs men in attendance. Shoot they had to put a big screen tv in one of the churches I attended so the spiritually mature men would come during football season. rofl When I met my husband he told me the teams he liked and that he wasn't a sports nut,but liked to watch important games. I told him "fine, two things, it doesn't come before church or a family event."

We went to minister in a church years ago, they told us the pastor would not be there. We assumed he was on vacation, nope, he was attending a hockey game. Yeah, clearly it's the women that are spiritually immature. Most of the local churches would be closed if it weren't for the women attending and running, the church. But don't dare let them step in the pulpit. Noooo, shut that sucker down before you let a woman preach. smh

You better watch it. they'll be calling you a liberal next. Don't worry I'll back you up.

BTW; since when did liberal and progressive become dirty words? I thought they meant generous and and advancing.

 

[notuptome]

You've got to be kidding. I know women with more spiritual maturity than the vast majority of men. See, I can make blanket statements too. I traveled in ministry for 20yrs in over a thousand churches of all denominations. Wanna take a guess at the percentage of women vs men in attendance. Shoot they had to put a big screen tv in one of the churches I attended so the spiritually mature men would come during football season. rofl When I met my husband he told me the teams he liked and that he wasn't a sports nut,but liked to watch important games. I told him "fine, two things, it doesn't come before church or a family event."

We went to minister in a church years ago, they told us the pastor would not be there. We assumed he was on vacation, nope, he was attending a hockey game. Yeah, clearly it's the women that are spiritually immature. Most of the local churches would be closed if it weren't for the women attending and running, the church. But don't dare let them step in the pulpit. Noooo, shut that sucker down before you let a woman preach. smh

Rebellion against the word of God can not prosper. This is exactly how false professors are created. A form of God likeness but apart from the power of God. No presence of the Holy Spirit so a false one is created.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[kaylagrl]

Rebellion against the word of God can not prosper. This is exactly how false professors are created. A form of God likeness but apart from the power of God. No presence of the Holy Spirit so a false one is created.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

And there is no possible way you could be wrong. The dogma with some of the people here is unreal. It tells me they attend an "us four and no more" church and never fellowship with anyone outside their circle. Not even God himself could change their mind. Believe what you believe, I'll leave you to it. But when you make comments like

"This is exactly how false professors are created. A form of God likeness but apart from the power of God. No presence of the Holy Spirit so a false one is created."

That's utterly arrogant. As someone who was in ministry, I find that offensive. And it has nothing to do with the Word, it's simply your dogmatic POV that you could never be wrong. You never use to bother me but lately, your arrogance is really showing through. You're not the only one here "for the cause of Christ" but you seem to think you are. smh

 

[kaylagrl]

You better watch it. they'll be calling you a liberal next. Don't worry I'll back you up.

BTW; since when did liberal and progressive become dirty words? I thought they meant generous and and advancing.

Oh they've called me a lot of things. I'm sure ol' Rog will have a few things to call me. Already told me I was demon possessed for speaking in tongues and that being in ministry was a waste because I don't believe the same as his "us four an no more" church. Shhh don't tell him there are going to be people in heaven that he didn't pre-approve to go there.

 

[kaylagrl]

Don't worry I know all to well how women preachers can bring forth spiritual growth a user on here called Angela is one she is my unofficial mentor she helped teach and guide me in my walk even when she gave correction or rebuke not to mention women tend to be more empathetic they tend to be more encouraging and are very good at lifting others up encouraging and building them up as well they have tender hands for those who need it and so God uses them far more than other men who would think otherwise would assume.

Yes, sister Angela is wonderful, I don't see her often anymore. She certainly is a testament to how female preachers can reach others with the Gospel and that you don't have to be a man to do so.

 

[calibob]

Oh they've called me a lot of things. I'm sure ol' Rog will have a few things to call me. Already told me I was demon possessed for speaking in tongues and that being in ministry was a waste because I don't believe the same as his "us four an no more" church. Shhh don't tell him there are going to be people in heaven that he didn't pre-approve to go there.

... Then Saint Peter answered, "Shhh, they think they're the only ones here".

 

[throughfaith]

But it affected his hearer who trembled.

Yes the information was key .

 

[throughfaith]

He shall teach you all things...

The Law was our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ. It was sin that the Law revealed to us or rather the Holy Spirit used to reveal to us.

The Law doesn't bring everyone to Christ (Judaism, etc) so something else must be the cause of the Law bringing us to Christ. (Holy Spirit)

which verse ? your inferring.

 

[presidente]

Yes the information was key .

Have you considered that it might have been the power of the Holy Spirit, and that Paul's preaching was cooperating with the types of things that the Spirit does? Have you considered the similarity to what Paul preached on with the sin, righteousness, and judgment that Spirit convicts of?

Acts 24:25 And as he reasoned of righteousness, temperance, and judgment to come, Felix trembled, and answered, Go thy way for this time; when I have a convenient season, I will call for thee.

 

[Blain]

Yes, sister Angela is wonderful, I don't see her often anymore. She certainly is a testament to how female preachers can reach others with the Gospel and that you don't have to be a man to do so.

Sasly she doesn't come online much anymore she is very busy I am guessing but I agree if there was anyone as a testament of the work female preachers can do it would be her, people can post all the scriptures that seemingly say otherwise but the evidence is obvious besides we all know how often scripture is misused or taken out of context

 

[JaumeJ]

She is busy with her doctorate work.

 

[throughfaith]

Have you considered that it might have been the power of the Holy Spirit, and that Paul's preaching was cooperating with the types of things that the Spirit does? Have you considered the similarity to what Paul preached on with the sin, righteousness, and judgment that Spirit convicts of?

Acts 24:25 And as he reasoned of righteousness, temperance, and judgment to come, Felix trembled, and answered, Go thy way for this time; when I have a convenient season, I will call for thee.

I just try to stick with what the text actually says .

 

[Funkus]

Indeed, those who condemned Christ were males exclusively so before bringing forward any argument against women that fact should be considered, for it is incumbent on a Christian to make certain that had they lived in those days they would have been one of those supporting Jesus and not condemning him. If one is not sure, then that is the area in you that needs work. For most that have this view of women it is really something else that motivates them and not women at all that is the problem. If men are so great at being the discerners of truth then why did men kill Jesus? Maybe it is because he chose the least things of this world to shame the wise in their estimation.

 

[Dino246]

Indeed, those who condemned Christ were males exclusively so before bringing forward any argument against women that fact should be considered, for it is incumbent on a Christian to make certain that had they lived in those days they would have been one of those supporting Jesus and not condemning him. If one is not sure, then that is the area in you that needs work. For most that have this view of women it is really something else that motivates them and not women at all that is the problem. If men are so great at being the discerners of truth then why did men kill Jesus? Maybe it is because he chose the least things of this world to shame the wise in their estimation.

Those who reject women in ministry are typically quick to trot out bad examples of female leaders, or examples of ministries that went sideways allegedly because of the influence of female ministers. Never yet have I seen any recognition of the countless ministries that have gone sideways because of bad male leadership. The closed-minded bias is amazing to behold.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

According to the scriptures, a person's conversion needs three steps.

1. The Holy Spirit must work inside them to convince them of "sin and judgment" (Jn.16:8)
2. When the realization of their sins and impending judgment have worked, somebody has to tell of the way out (Rom.10:13-14)
3. When they believe, they must also confess what is in their heart (Rom.10:10-13)

The Holy Spirit convicts, and gives faith. The way out is told by a Christian. The person themself must believe and confess. If just ONE of these three are missing, there is no conversion (this time). Blik's table-mate seems to me not to be convicted. Whether you told or not, I judge that you would not have made a difference. This does not excuse a Christian from preaching the gospel, but an obviously aggressive, dismissive and/or abusive person is unlikely to have been convicted, and less likely to confess.

You are making the natural man, as described in 1 Cor 2:14, able to believe in the things of the Spirit, which plainly states that he "cannot".

Romans 10 like most all of the scriptures is written to and about God's regenerated children instructing them on how he wants them to live their lives here in earth.

John 16:8, Jesus is telling regenerated children of God, that he will sent them the comforter, which John 14:26 says is a function of the Holy Ghost.

The Holy Spirit functions as a quickening Spirit, and the Holy Ghost, which is the Holy Spirit, but functioning as a revelator.

The Holy Spirit as a quickening Spirit that indwells a person in the new spiritual birth, the same in the old testament as in the new testament, Isaiah 63:11, Then he remembered the days of old, Moses, and his people, saying, Where is he that brought them up out of the sea with the shepherd of his flock? Where is he that put his Holy Spirit within him.

Rom 10, The Israel in verse 1 is not the nation of Israel, because all Israel is not of Israel, Rom 9:6, but is the Israel that Jacob's name was changed to by god, and Jacob/Israel is representative of God's elect, Rom 9:11.

Verse 2-3, The fact that they had a zeal of God indicates that they are regenerate children of God, but needed to be saved=delivered from their ignorance of God's righteousness so that they would not go about trying to establish their own righteousness, by their good works, and submit themselves unto the righteousness of God.

Confessing and believing are products of already having been born with the indwelling of the quickening Holy Spirit.

When the unregenerate natural man has been quickened, God exchanges his heart from a heart of stone and gives him a fleshy heart whose conscience can be pricked to feel guilt. This is confirmed in Acts 2, when Peter is accusing some regenerated children God of being responsible for having crucified Christ, and when they heard this they were "pricked" in their heart. saying what shall we do. in contrast, the people that stoned Stephen to death for preaching the same sermon, were "cut" to their heart of stone. Notice the difference of the response of the two hearts.

Peter's reply to their question was to repent and be baptized "for" (because off) the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the "gift" (revelation) of the Holy Ghost (a function of the Holy Spirit).