Could the tribulation start this year?

[GRACE_ambassador]

I do think we are already in Daniel's 70th week or "the tribulation." Some hold to the view that the start of "the tribulation" is the start of the Wrath of God and that the rapture has to occur before or at the start of "the tribulation."

+

only learn where in the season we are.

Precious friends, we are "still in" The Age Of GRACE, Which has NO signs for us,
Only God "Knows The Date {Imminently soon, Or another 2000 years?}" Of OUR
Great GRACE Departure, To Heaven! Amen? Please re-review #187.

Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15 KJB!) From “Things That DIFFER!”:

When {earthly} ISRAEL and the nations suffer GREAT tribulation, THEN THEY will
"know the SIGNS for the SEASONS that THEY Are in," Prior To The Second Coming!
Amen?

Please Be Richly Encouraged, Enlightened, Exhorted, and Edified!
God's Simple Will!

 

[randyk]

The age of grace has put a temporary stop to the time line ...more precise the( appointed times) in which jesus is to return. It is referred to as the time of the gentiles.

That's a poor argument. What time-line? If you're referring to the 70 Weeks prophecy, there is no stop to the timeline, except that you claim there is. Again, if you separate the timeline into 2 parts, it ceases to be a timeline at all.

Can you imagine my saying an earthquake will take place in precisely 70 Weeks, and then not seeing that earthquake for 170 Weeks? And when you complain that my timeline, as well as my prediction, are off, I just say that there is a temporary stop in the timeline, which resumes at some point?

No, God isn't like any run of the mill false prophet, who rationalizes away his false prophecies! And He doesn't speak in absurd riddles that can only be figured out after the fact.

 

[TheLordIsMyRedeemer]

Precious friend, we are "still in" The Age Of GRACE, Which has NO signs for us,
Only God "Knows The Date {Imminently soon, Or another 2000 years?}" Of OUR
Great GRACE Departure, To Heaven! Amen? Please re-review #187.

Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15 KJB!) From “Things That DIFFER!”:

When {earthly} ISRAEL and the nations suffer GREAT tribulation, THEN THEY will
"know the SIGNS for the SEASONS that THEY Are in," Prior To The Second Coming!
Amen?

Please Be Richly Encouraged, Enlightened, Exhorted, and Edified!
God's Simple Will!

Well, here is my take on the matter. I assume because this is an eschatological discussion we will likely agree to disagree. I think that we do have some signs to look for when it comes to the harpazo of the church. We can look at the signs the Lord told us to look for in Matthew 24. Also there was the Revelation 12:1-2 sign that occurred in September 2017. We are now nearing the Time of Jacob's Trouble.

I think we can be in "the "tribulation" period and not be experiencing God's wrath. The Bible defines 'tribulation' as persecution. The wrath of God is not the same thing as persecution (tribulation) and Revelation delineates between persecution (tribulation) and wrath. I think looking at what is occurring in Israel right now holds a clue for us interested in eschatology. The Time of Jacob's Trouble seems to be approaching quickly. It is my view that we are now approximately 1 to 2 years from the midpoint of the approximate 7 year timeframe.

The Israeli military leaders are stating they are preparing to strike Iran. Also, there has been so many exchanges between Israel and Iran's proxies in the last six months or so (wars and rumors of wars), including that prolonged rocket attack from Hamas that lasted about 10 days. An EU vaccine "passport" is being introduced across all 27 member nations - plus Switzerland, Iceland, Norway and Liechtenstein. China and Israel have introduced similar measures. What we are seeing is the development of a global system that will eventually lead to that final mark of the beast system being put into place.

When Israel experiences great tribulation at the time of the midpoint, I agree that they will know the season that they are in. Yes, the Word of God should be rightly divided, although I would not consider myself a strict dispensationalist.

 

[ZNP]

I can understand your desire to learn more about the end times and I wish you the best in your studies. I do think we are already in Daniel's 70th week or "the tribulation." Some hold to the view that the start of "the tribulation" is the start of the Wrath of God and that the rapture has to occur before or at the start of "the tribulation." Although I disagree with that view, I understand why some Christians hold to that view. I think we can be in the tribulation period and not be experiencing God's wrath. I think looking at what is occurring in Israel right now holds a clue for us interested in eschatology. The Time of Jacob's Trouble seems to be approaching quite quickly. It is my view that we are now approximately 1 to 2 years from the midpoint of the approximate 7 year timeframe.

The Israeli military leaders are stating they are preparing to strike Iran. Also, there has been so many exchanges between Israel and Iran's proxies in the last six months or so, including that prolonged rocket attack from Hamas that lasted about 10 days. An EU vaccine "passport" is being introduced across all 27 member nations - plus Switzerland, Iceland, Norway and Liechtenstein. China and Israel have introduced similar measures. What we are seeing is the development of a global system that will eventually lead to that final mark of the beast system being put into place.

It is my view that the remnant church will be glorified and then be used to help the Lord in the final harvest of souls. Those wise virgins who have plenty of oil will help bring healing and deliverance to those souls who are lukewarm or who have not been walking in His Spirit. As this is happening, the mark of the beast will likely be in place. These new converts will have to refuse the mark obviously. It is my view that the rapture or harpazo event will happen after the glorification when the main harvest crop is ready.

There are a lot of terms which adds to the confusion. I agree that we are in Jacob's trouble, but to me that is the last ten years, not seven. The tribulation begins with the year of affliction which starts October 8th of this year. Right now we are in the dung year, the year the fig tree needs to bear fruit lest it be cut down. I do believe there will be a rapture prior to this Oct 8th date.

 

[Omegatime]

Jacob's (Israel) Troubles does happen inside the the Tribulation and is associated with the the Day of the Lord.

Jer 30:
7 Alas! that day is so great
there is none like it;
it is a time of distress for Jacob;
yet he shall be saved out of it.

1 Thess. 5:1-3 But as to the times and the seasons, brethren, you have no need to have anything written to you. 2 For you yourselves know well that the Day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. 3 When people say, “There is peace and security,” then sudden destruction will come upon them as travail comes upon a woman with child, and there will be no escape

Time of Jacobs troubles happens during the Bowl Judgements

IMO--there is no pre-tribulation rapture

 

[ZNP]

Jacob's (Israel) Troubles does happen inside the the Tribulation and is associated with the the Day of the Lord.

Jer 30:
7 Alas! that day is so great
there is none like it;
it is a time of distress for Jacob;
yet he shall be saved out of it.

1 Thess. 5:1-3 But as to the times and the seasons, brethren, you have no need to have anything written to you. 2 For you yourselves know well that the Day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. 3 When people say, “There is peace and security,” then sudden destruction will come upon them as travail comes upon a woman with child, and there will be no escape

Time of Jacobs troubles happens during the Bowl Judgements

IMO--there is no pre-tribulation rapture

Well if we don't see the rapture this month I will have to reassess my position.

 

[Blain]

+

Precious friends, we are "still in" The Age Of GRACE, Which has NO signs for us,
Only God "Knows The Date {Imminently soon, Or another 2000 years?}" Of OUR
Great GRACE Departure, To Heaven! Amen? Please re-review #187.

Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15 KJB!) From “Things That DIFFER!”:

When {earthly} ISRAEL and the nations suffer GREAT tribulation, THEN THEY will
"know the SIGNS for the SEASONS that THEY Are in," Prior To The Second Coming!
Amen?

Please Be Richly Encouraged, Enlightened, Exhorted, and Edified!
God's Simple Will!

I agree we are still in the age of grace but that time is close to an end. Think of it this way Israel was promised a savior and a redeemer they all went about their daily lives ever watchful and hoping for him but only the wisemen knew of his coming because they knew the sign to be looking for and they weren't even Hebrews yet they were among the few who saw his coming and had the honor to worship at his feet everyone else was unaware aside from herald and his men

In the same way we are promised to be saved from this world we were promised he would come back for us we are ever watchful and hoping but many have not sought after his coming or sought after the signs to be watching for in the same manner if we do not remain vigalent his coming will happen just like he said as a theif in the night and like Israel we will have not had the wisdom to know the sign to look for

 

[Blain]

I can understand your desire to learn more about the end times and I wish you the best in your studies. I do think we are already in Daniel's 70th week or "the tribulation." Some hold to the view that the start of "the tribulation" is the start of the Wrath of God and that the rapture has to occur before or at the start of "the tribulation." Although I disagree with that view, I understand why some Christians hold to that view. I think we can be in the tribulation period and not be experiencing God's wrath. I think looking at what is occurring in Israel right now holds a clue for us interested in eschatology. The Time of Jacob's Trouble seems to be approaching quite quickly. It is my view that we are now approximately 1 to 2 years from the midpoint of the approximate 7 year timeframe.

The Israeli military leaders are stating they are preparing to strike Iran. Also, there has been so many exchanges between Israel and Iran's proxies in the last six months or so, including that prolonged rocket attack from Hamas that lasted about 10 days. An EU vaccine "passport" is being introduced across all 27 member nations - plus Switzerland, Iceland, Norway and Liechtenstein. China and Israel have introduced similar measures. What we are seeing is the development of a global system that will eventually lead to that final mark of the beast system being put into place.

It is my view that the remnant church will be glorified and then be used to help the Lord in the final harvest of souls. Those wise virgins who have plenty of oil will help bring healing and deliverance to those souls who are lukewarm or who have not been walking in His Spirit. As this is happening, the mark of the beast will likely be in place. These new converts will have to refuse the mark obviously. It is my view that the rapture or harpazo event will happen after the glorification when the main harvest crop is ready.

Yes I have also considered this as well and have not ruled it out as a possibility as I like to look at things from more than one angle. I do see a lot of the things being in place that are spoken about in revelation I however did not know about Israel and Iran but the mark the beast system and the antichrist are all being set up there is no denying that but I do see a difference in the tribulation when it comes to enduring tribulation and God's wrath I don't think they are the same

And to be honest even if I was raptured or as you accurately called it harpazo I told God from the beginning I want to serve him in the tribulation maybe God placed that desire on my heart for a reason the thing is there is so much interpretation and thaat is what causes confusion on one if we are not vigalent and looking for the signs we could be unaware of it even though we were given all the keys to know but on the other hand some are so busy looking up they fail to see that their walk has strayed from the narrow path

I honestly don't care who is right I just want to find the truth and even I have to be careful because I see my mind trying to interpret with my belief in a pretrib rapture which is not how you find the truth. To many claim to have the truth yet in every debate not a single person is able to prove their view correct, scripture is concrete it is not something so fragile that one can just use another part to defeat another it is one as God is one it is light as God is light it is love and truth as God is truth

If the truth was truly known no one could disprove it no one could pick apart another part of the truth to stand against the truth itself that is like fighting a sword with a small knife it simply can't be done. This is of course how I see scripture to me it is far more than words and has far more power in it than people realize and honestly how I see everyone these days from all over so blantently misuse it so eagerly twist and cherry pick it to fit their agenda it is disgusting God's word doesn't fit our agenda we fit in his

 

[Omegatime]

Well if we don't see the rapture this month I will have to reassess my position.

LOL--Better chance to see the beginning of the Tribulation

 

[Omegatime]

I kinda messed up on the 5 minute rule I wanted to add:

Well if we don't see the rapture this month I will have to reassess my position.

LOL--Better chance to see the beginning of the Tribulation

I, like you see things for the month of October, this would be my timing for the beginning of the tribulation --deep subject

 

[ZNP]

You have no need that I should write you

5 But concerning the times and the seasons, brethren, you have no need that I should write to you. 2 For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night

I was struck by Paul saying that concerning the times and seasons, you have no need that I should write you. Paul wrote this book about the signs of the Lord's coming, they asked him about the times and seasons and yet he says you have no need for him to write. He didn't say "you don't need to know that" but rather "you know perfectly well". Paul's letters represent the Lord's heavenly ministry. If we don't need Paul to tell us because we already know, then doesn't that mean that we were told by the Lord in His earthly ministry? Not only so but Paul continues that we know the day of the Lord comes as a thief in the night. The Lord told us that. So then, instead of looking at the Old Testament, what do the gospels say about the rapture? The first rapture is likened to the mount of transfiguration. Not all the disciples went up, only a few. Not only so but they represented the sleeping church, the only ones who were wide awake were Moses and Elijah. This suggests to me that at the end of the age you will have those with the spirit of Moses and Elijah, they will be wide awake, they will be watching, they will be warning and sounding the alarm.

So what do we know about the time and season of the Mount of Transfiguration? We know it was six days after the Lord rebuked Peter saying "get thee behind me Satan", we are told this in Matthew and Mark. However, in Luke there is no mention of that rebuke and instead we are told it is "about eight days after the Lord said these things".

The rebuke of Peter is the biggest rebuke in the gospels, stunning really, and if I had to place it on the Jewish Calendar it would be the 9th of AV. Apparently I miscalculated (I said this was the 16th but that is a mistake, it is the evening of the 17th and the day of the 18th of August). Six days later is the evening of Monday, and morning of Tuesday.

Why is it "about the eighth day". The eighth day is when you start a new beginning and it is also when you offer up the firstborn of your herd and when you circumcise a firstborn male. When the Lord said He was going to go to the cross that is the circumcision, the cutting off of the flesh. The rapture is about the same thing. If you think about it the 9th of AV is not the beginning of the story, the witnesses went into the land, they came back, they gave the evil report, then Israel cried out that if they followed the Lord into the good land their children would die. The Lord said because you said that you will die in the wilderness but your children will go in instead of you. So that means on the 9th of AV those children were already there, they had to have been born prior to that day. So the rapture is all about "the eighth day" the day you present the first fruit of the church to God as an offering. These ones were born prior to the 9th of AV.

Everyone is examining the types and shadows, that is fine, the feasts are a shadow of things to come, but Paul told us clearly that we had already been told about the time and season from the Lord Jesus.

Second, the other thing that has always bothered me is that in the gospels the Lord always says "no one knows the day or the hour" and yet it seems clear from a couple of verses that not knowing the day or the hour is what happens to those who do not watch.

Revelation 3:3 Therefore if you will not watch, I will come upon you as a thief, and you will not know what hour I will come upon you.

I think I have finally solved this puzzle too.

9 Now as they came down from the mountain, Jesus commanded them, saying, “Tell the vision to no one until the Son of Man is risen from the dead.”

When the Lord told the disciples no one knew the day or the hour this was true because they had not yet been told about the mount of transfiguration.

 

[ZNP]

You have no need that I should write you

5 But concerning the times and the seasons, brethren, you have no need that I should write to you. 2 For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night

Everything in the last post leads back to this question, why would Paul say that we knew perfectly well about the times and seasons since we knew that the Lord comes as a thief in the night? Well, let's think about those ones that the Lord rebuked in Revelation 3:3, if you do not watch I will come to you as a thief. In other words the people who are sleeping, who are not watching, who are saying no one knows the day or the hour as some kind of excuse not to watch, they do not realize the day of the Lord comes as a thief. They are clueless that this word was a warning to them and they are the ones who will be robbed. The fact that you know this means you are watching. If you are watching when the time comes the Lord will speak the word you need to hear.

 

[randyk]

Everything in the last post leads back to this question, why would Paul say that we knew perfectly well about the times and seasons since we knew that the Lord comes as a thief in the night? Well, let's think about those ones that the Lord rebuked in Revelation 3:3, if you do not watch I will come to you as a thief. In other words the people who are sleeping, who are not watching, who are saying no one knows the day or the hour as some kind of excuse not to watch, they do not realize the day of the Lord comes as a thief. They are clueless that this word was a warning to them and they are the ones who will be robbed. The fact that you know this means you are watching. If you are watching when the time comes the Lord will speak the word you need to hear.

I really don't think you get it. The things we are to watch for is the Kingdom of God. Keeping our eyes on Jesus we know what we're supposed to do, how we're supposed to live. It really has nothing to do with calculating how long this or that will happen, or with determining dates.

We know what season we're in. We can see what God's doing in present history. We can see the Gospel going on, and we can see the response of people to it, both positive and negative.

Being "watchful" has more to do with avoiding misdirections, distractions, false teachings, and false prophecies. You have a view of "watching" that is associated with alertness, except it isn't just being alert that makes us ready, but rather, being righteous. And it isn't being alert for an "any-moment" Rapture. Rather, it is being alert to how we're to live every hour of every day, so that we keep our clothing clean and white.

 

[Absolutely]

pretrib rapture
This is the result of people's forced interpretation of the Bible. If this never happens, it will only destroy the faith of believers.
It is appropriate to focus on spiritual life.
Job 5:7

Amen
I also defend the pretrib rapture.
Solid bible and easy to defend.

 

[Absolutely]

I really don't think you get it. The things we are to watch for is the Kingdom of God. Keeping our eyes on Jesus we know what we're supposed to do, how we're supposed to live. It really has nothing to do with calculating how long this or that will happen, or with determining dates.

We know what season we're in. We can see what God's doing in present history. We can see the Gospel going on, and we can see the response of people to it, both positive and negative.

Being "watchful" has more to do with avoiding misdirections, distractions, false teachings, and false prophecies. You have a view of "watching" that is associated with alertness, except it isn't just being alert that makes us ready, but rather, being righteous. And it isn't being alert for an "any-moment" Rapture. Rather, it is being alert to how we're to live every hour of every day, so that we keep our clothing clean and white.

Nowhere are we to watch and wait for the false Christ.

The 5 foolish virgins had enough knowledge to wait and watch for the groom....Jesus. Their mistake was in the "readiness" dimension....THEIR ONLY MISTAKE.....YIKES!

Being wrong about watching and waiting is not in the bible

Nowhere is anyone corrected or rebuked for watching and waiting/ being ready. Yet postribs tirelessly bat the air in that false narrative.

Pretrib rapture is the only watching/waiting/being ready position.

Thank you Jesus!!!!!!!

 

[Absolutely]

Yes I have also considered this as well and have not ruled it out as a possibility as I like to look at things from more than one angle. I do see a lot of the things being in place that are spoken about in revelation I however did not know about Israel and Iran but the mark the beast system and the antichrist are all being set up there is no denying that but I do see a difference in the tribulation when it comes to enduring tribulation and God's wrath I don't think they are the same

And to be honest even if I was raptured or as you accurately called it harpazo I told God from the beginning I want to serve him in the tribulation maybe God placed that desire on my heart for a reason the thing is there is so much interpretation and thaat is what causes confusion on one if we are not vigalent and looking for the signs we could be unaware of it even though we were given all the keys to know but on the other hand some are so busy looking up they fail to see that their walk has strayed from the narrow path

I honestly don't care who is right I just want to find the truth and even I have to be careful because I see my mind trying to interpret with my belief in a pretrib rapture which is not how you find the truth. To many claim to have the truth yet in every debate not a single person is able to prove their view correct, scripture is concrete it is not something so fragile that one can just use another part to defeat another it is one as God is one it is light as God is light it is love and truth as God is truth

If the truth was truly known no one could disprove it no one could pick apart another part of the truth to stand against the truth itself that is like fighting a sword with a small knife it simply can't be done. This is of course how I see scripture to me it is far more than words and has far more power in it than people realize and honestly how I see everyone these days from all over so blantently misuse it so eagerly twist and cherry pick it to fit their agenda it is disgusting God's word doesn't fit our agenda we fit in his

There is no " serving him during the trib"

It CLEARLY says "all take the mark. Every man,woman,and child"

You take it, or they take your head.

All believers are killed in the trib.
They are the ones left behind VIVIDLY portrayed in the virgin parable

 

[tourist]

LOL--Better chance to see the beginning of the Tribulation

Better chance of hitting the Lotto.

 

[ZNP]

Better chance of hitting the Lotto.

 

[ZNP]

We have been warned.

6 He also spoke this parable: “A certain man had a fig tree planted in his vineyard, and he came seeking fruit on it and found none. 7 Then he said to the keeper of his vineyard, ‘Look, for three years I have come seeking fruit on this fig tree and find none. Cut it down; why does it use up the ground?’ 8 But he answered and said to him, ‘Sir, let it alone this year also, until I dig around it and fertilize it. 9 And if it bears fruit, well. But if not, after that you can cut it down.’ ”

This is a 4 year warning before God cuts down a nation. The USA was warned during the full moon of August, 2017 that resulted in a solar eclipse over Washington DC. As a result this warning will be over this coming full moon and the destruction should begin shortly after that.

 

[randyk]

Nowhere are we to watch and wait for the false Christ.

The 5 foolish virgins had enough knowledge to wait and watch for the groom....Jesus. Their mistake was in the "readiness" dimension....THEIR ONLY MISTAKE.....YIKES!

Being wrong about watching and waiting is not in the bible

Nowhere is anyone corrected or rebuked for watching and waiting/ being ready. Yet postribs tirelessly bat the air in that false narrative.

Pretrib rapture is the only watching/waiting/being ready position.

Thank you Jesus!!!!!!!

That in itself is false teaching! You make it sound good--look for Jesus, and not the Antichrist. But Jesus said to beware of false teachers and false Christs. You better go back to school!