Doctrine of Unconditional Election

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brightfame52

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fredoheaven said:
And you won't consider clear scripture when it says grace through faith. Yes, grace is in opposition to works but true grace worketh well with faith. Anyway, the election is to service which requires faith. The below passage would tell us that it takes grace by faith or "whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed"

Romans 9:30-33

King James Version

30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.
31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;
33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
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No scripture says election of grace without works is conditioned on faith. Election took place before the foundation of the world my friend !
 
phil36

phil36

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CS1 said:
LOL it is funny that unconditional Election doesn't include the Jewish people to those who speak strongly about Unconditional Election LOL
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🤔

And they sang a new song, saying,

“Worthy are you to take the scroll

and to open its seals,

for you were slain, and by your blood you ransomed people for God

from every tribe and language and people and nation, - Rev 5:9.
 
phil36

phil36

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eternally-gratefull said:
Again our disagreement is in HOW and WHO the HS illuminates

I am told he convicts the world. Everyone Not just the elect.

Thats WHY we have no excuse.

again, in my view, If I am unable to even understand the gospel. I can not be held accountable for rejecting the gospel.

Again, at the great white throne, they are not judged for sin (it was paid for) they are judged for their works. (And found lacking) they are condemned because of unbelief.

To condemn a person because they did not believe, while at the same time not even giving them the ability to believe, This is not righteous judgment in my view brother.

Love ya Bro. We are brothers. Of that I have no doubt!..
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Again thanks for your thoughtful input into the discussion EG 👍

Love ya too.. Brothers in Christ. Amen.
 
Gardenias

Gardenias

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Mark 8:23-25

I see men as trees ......walking
I'm sorry but it seems as though many in here are worse than this blind man!

Before Jesus touched him again his vision wasn't perfect and the above was his proclamation.

Get Jesus to touch and keep touching your spiritual eyes until you see scripture more perfect than you do.

Doctrinal heresies are the BLIND leading the BLIND!
 
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John146

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brightfame52 said:
No scripture says election of grace without works is conditioned on faith. Election took place before the foundation of the world my friend !
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Could you post that scripture? Thanks.
 
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rayzor

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FreeGrace2 said:
Check the context. "the end" refers to the end of the 7 year Tribulation.
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all the sudden 4 that 1 moment there not save by grace but they must endure till the end? totlity the context of the whole bible not just 1 passage.
 
fredoheaven

fredoheaven

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brightfame52 said:
No scripture says election of grace without works is conditioned on faith. Election took place before the foundation of the world my friend !
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Umm, your OP cited Romans 9 which i did a continuation the passages you may perhaps missed and now you are saying the context were never a part of the 'electing grace' as to service.
 
fredoheaven

fredoheaven

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Additionally your cited verses in your OP does not have "electing grace is from the foundation of the world". Any verses for us to study? I have to agree John14:6 wanted you any verses to prove the claim. Thanks
 
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justpassinthrough

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brightfame52 said:
No scripture says election of grace without works is conditioned on faith. Election took place before the foundation of the world my friend !
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Yes, the Jews were elected to be the nation through which the Messiah came.



Therefore I endure all things for the sake of the elect, that they also may obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory. 2 Timothy 2:10



Salvation is given to those who obey Jesus Christ.



And having been perfected, He became the author of eternal salvation to all who obey Him, Hebrews 5:9






JPT
 
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justpassinthrough

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Gardenias said:
Mark 8:23-25

I see men as trees ......walking
I'm sorry but it seems as though many in here are worse than this blind man!

Before Jesus touched him again his vision wasn't perfect and the above was his proclamation.

Get Jesus to touch and keep touching your spiritual eyes until you see scripture more perfect than you do.

Doctrinal heresies are the BLIND leading the BLIND!
Click to expand...


Yes, and amen.


We all desperately need to ask Him continually, for eye salve, that we may see as He sees.



I counsel you to buy from Me gold refined in the fire, that you may be rich; and white garments, that you may be clothed, that the shame of your nakedness may not be revealed; and anoint your eyes with eye salve, that you may see.
Revelation 3:18
 
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brightfame52

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fredoheaven said:
Umm, your OP cited Romans 9 which i did a continuation the passages you may perhaps missed and now you are saying the context were never a part of the 'electing grace' as to service.
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Yeah Election of Grace is seen in Rom 9. Thats unconditional election.
 
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brightfame52

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justpassinthrough said:
Yes, the Jews were elected to be the nation through which the Messiah came.



Therefore I endure all things for the sake of the elect, that they also may obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory. 2 Timothy 2:10



Salvation is given to those who obey Jesus Christ.



And having been perfected, He became the author of eternal salvation to all who obey Him, Hebrews 5:9






JPT
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Election of Grace has nothing to do with ethnicity, that would make it conditional. The election of Grace is comprised of people out of all ethnicities. Also it was before men did good or evil, before they were born. Explain how a person obeyed God before they existed !
 
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FreeGrace2

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FreeGrace2 said:
Check the context. "the end" refers to the end of the 7 year Tribulation.
rayzor said:
all the sudden 4 that 1 moment there not save by grace but they must endure till the end? totlity the context of the whole bible not just 1 passage.
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Sorry, but I have no idea what you are trying to convey. Could you please rephrase so your thoughts can be understood?

Thanks.
 
CS1

CS1

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justpassinthrough said:
Yes, the Jews were elected to be the nation through which the Messiah came.



Therefore I endure all things for the sake of the elect, that they also may obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory. 2 Timothy 2:10



Salvation is given to those who obey Jesus Christ.



And having been perfected, He became the author of eternal salvation to all who obey Him, Hebrews 5:9






JPT
Click to expand...
Therefore I endure all things for the sake of the elect, that they also may obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory. 2 Timothy 2:10


SO the elect May obtain salvation? So the election is not unconditional?
 
fredoheaven

fredoheaven

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brightfame52 said:
Yeah Election of Grace is seen in Rom 9. Thats unconditional election.
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Umm, I failed to see your counterpoint at all, just a rehash and good for an opinion. You actually missed the whole context of Romans 9. Thanks
 
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rayzor

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ignorance is bliss and stupidity of virtue.You see god knows every thing! who's going to do rightly & everyone who will make the wrong decisions.For Jesus to marvel he has to give himself a mortal quality.All that's beings said is that he designed some to be of the flesh & not of the spirit.That's what elections means. Those that r design to serve god will.
 
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rayzor

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FreeGrace2 said:
FreeGrace2 said:
Check the context. "the end" refers to the end of the 7 year Tribulation.

Sorry, but I have no idea what you are trying to convey. Could you please rephrase so your thoughts can be understood?

Thanks.
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completion of the puzzle is totality.A couple of pieces is "context of a passage"People that have a few pieces can only see part the picture.
 
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brightfame52

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fredoheaven said:
Umm, I failed to see your counterpoint at all, just a rehash and good for an opinion. You actually missed the whole context of Romans 9. Thanks
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I cant help what you cant see. And what I pointed out is within the context of Rom 9, unconditional election.
 
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