Doctrine of Unconditional Election
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That is different from saying unbelief is the unpardonable sin. As we know all of who are christian were in fact in unbelief and yet pardoned.
I agree all men are commanded to repent and that Christ accomplished what He set out to do and save those whom the Father gave Him John (6:37; Romans 8:28ff; Eph 1:4) and that he will never let them go. They will persevere till the end. Those who are not given to the son are the opposite of Ephesians 1:4. cf, Rev 13:8.
Those passed over from before the foundation of the world:
And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. Rev 13:8
Those who will be saved from before the foundation of the world:
For he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight. - Ephesians 1:4
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You still have the issue. Non of the above happens apart from faith in christ
no one can have faith unless they repent
repent and believe is the gospel
It’s not earning salvation if you repent and believe because it is God who empowers this
we still have to make the choice though
unbelieve is a sin. And if we die in unbelief we have commented the sin which will never be forgiven
no one can have faith unless they repent
repent and believe is the gospel
It’s not earning salvation if you repent and believe because it is God who empowers this
we still have to make the choice though
unbelieve is a sin. And if we die in unbelief we have commented the sin which will never be forgiven
Hi Sir,
Just to but in with your comment "Men who are in unbelief actually do get saved! So it is not unpardonable!" But when? It is only when they turn their unbelief into belief or that they placed their faith in Christ so that this makes it conditional The faith of the woman who has an issue of blood has healed her. It was conditioned by her faith and so with us. Unbelief will not let the man go to heaven. It is one's belief in Christ that does it.
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Matthew 9:22
King James Version
22 But Jesus turned him about, and when he saw her, he said, Daughter, be of good comfort; thy faith hath made thee whole. And the woman was made whole from that hour.
Just to but in with your comment "Men who are in unbelief actually do get saved! So it is not unpardonable!" But when? It is only when they turn their unbelief into belief or that they placed their faith in Christ so that this makes it conditional The faith of the woman who has an issue of blood has healed her. It was conditioned by her faith and so with us. Unbelief will not let the man go to heaven. It is one's belief in Christ that does it.
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Matthew 9:22
King James Version
22 But Jesus turned him about, and when he saw her, he said, Daughter, be of good comfort; thy faith hath made thee whole. And the woman was made whole from that hour.
"Men who are in unbelief actually do get saved! So it is not unpardonable!"
This is an unbiblical statement. Simple cause and effect of faith. Faith produces an action called Belief. IF one has no faith given to them by God they can't believe. And unbelief is no faith which IS REQUIRED TO PLEASE GOD. IF you are an unbeliever you are not saved NOR can you be.
The Oxymoron: is "unconditional Election" and faith without Belief.
Those who scream "you're saying you can work for your salvation" but you say belief is not even needed to be saved which the word of God says differently.
This is an unbiblical statement. Simple cause and effect of faith. Faith produces an action called Belief. IF one has no faith given to them by God they can't believe. And unbelief is no faith which IS REQUIRED TO PLEASE GOD. IF you are an unbeliever you are not saved NOR can you be.
The Oxymoron: is "unconditional Election" and faith without Belief.
Those who scream "you're saying you can work for your salvation" but you say belief is not even needed to be saved which the word of God says differently.
"It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh is no help at all" -John 6:63
"no one can say 'Jesus is Lord' except by the Holy Spirit" - 1 Cor 12:3
"This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father." John 6:65, and All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out. - John 6:37
"no one comprehends the thoughts of God except the Spirit of God. Now we have received not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, THAT WE MIGHT UNDERSTAND the things freely given us by God...The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned."
Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. For the promise is for you and for your children and for all who are far off, everyone whom the Lord our God calls to himself.” Acts 2:38-39
He went on to say, “This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless the Father has enabled them.” -John 6:65.
The spiritually dead man does not understand spiritual matters. This plain from scripture so he will not come to faith unless He has spiritual life, a renewed heart, his eyes opened.. then he can receive this by faith. The father enables men to come.. Men don't enable themselves.
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5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.
6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.
The Election of Grace is the Predestinated Plan of God to save lost man from the Beginning. It was the foreknowing of God, that HE would have to come and die for US why? Because the Holy God demands blood for sin, and God is holy and the only one who can save us. IF you are not washed in the Blood that was shed 2000 years ago and place faith in Jesu today the Grace that is given unconditionally YOU can't earn but you can reject it, when you die you go to hell.
6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.
The Election of Grace is the Predestinated Plan of God to save lost man from the Beginning. It was the foreknowing of God, that HE would have to come and die for US why? Because the Holy God demands blood for sin, and God is holy and the only one who can save us. IF you are not washed in the Blood that was shed 2000 years ago and place faith in Jesu today the Grace that is given unconditionally YOU can't earn but you can reject it, when you die you go to hell.
I had no faith, then God saved me. I was an unbeliever (unbelief) and now I believe. Thats all I need to say to refute your claim.
Your posts are becoming less coherent and with no scriptural backing.
As scripture says it is God who enables any man to come to him. Please read post #327.
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Again, as with your others posts I will have to say I haven't a clue what you are talking about, or to what you are even referencing. It's certainly not what I have said. Becoming less coherent.
Yes, the verse gives the purpose for the choosing.
I don't believe that God election always results in fulfilling the actions. For example, all believers have been chosen to be holy and blameless (Eph 1:4), yet simple observation and the Barna surveys reveals how many believers aren't "holy and blameless".
Even Simon the sorcerer wasn't.
I get a bit nervous when "decreed" gets mentioned. Almost like He causes things.
I use the word service because of how often it is found in Scripture in the context of election.
We know that Jesus is The Chosen One from Isa 42:1 and 28:16. And Mark 10:45 says: For even the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.”
If believers aren't convinced by this verse that election is about service, they just aren't willing to accept the truth.
And going through Acts and reading what Paul said about himself is more evidence. He frequently called himself a "servant of Christ". We know that his experience on the Damascus road was an election by what the Lord told Ananias in Acts 9:15.
I don't believe that God election always results in fulfilling the actions. For example, all believers have been chosen to be holy and blameless (Eph 1:4), yet simple observation and the Barna surveys reveals how many believers aren't "holy and blameless".
Even Simon the sorcerer wasn't.
I get a bit nervous when "decreed" gets mentioned. Almost like He causes things.
I use the word service because of how often it is found in Scripture in the context of election.
We know that Jesus is The Chosen One from Isa 42:1 and 28:16. And Mark 10:45 says: For even the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.”
If believers aren't convinced by this verse that election is about service, they just aren't willing to accept the truth.
And going through Acts and reading what Paul said about himself is more evidence. He frequently called himself a "servant of Christ". We know that his experience on the Damascus road was an election by what the Lord told Ananias in Acts 9:15.
Hi freegrace,
Thanks for addressing the issues at hand and using scripture
, if you don't mind I'll answer just the two above because it relates to all Christians.
Once we are saved, Christs righteousness is imputed to us, therefore we are declared righteous. Our position in Christ is always the same and will never change. Yet we live in this body of flesh and we will have the struggle with the flesh, but we will grow more and more Holy as time goes by. But this anticipates a future time when we are glorified - A time when there will be no sin and not just that and unlike Eden, there will be no more possibility of sin.
So although we are saved we will still sin, but we will strive to grow in Holiness in anticipation of the hope that is to come. When Christ returns and we will be fully without spot or blemish.
When we look at what God decrees we can start at the very start.
In the begining God said.. and he caused this whole universe to come into existence. Something from nothing.
I agree with you about service we all should serve each other, aren't we called to do that, i agree with you on that point. service is one aspect of being called, as is being called in Christ.
Anyhow, we have to bear in mind, that no matter what it is By grace alone, through faith alone, in Christ alone.
Thanks for addressing the issues at hand and using scripture
, if you don't mind I'll answer just the two above because it relates to all Christians.Once we are saved, Christs righteousness is imputed to us, therefore we are declared righteous. Our position in Christ is always the same and will never change. Yet we live in this body of flesh and we will have the struggle with the flesh, but we will grow more and more Holy as time goes by. But this anticipates a future time when we are glorified - A time when there will be no sin and not just that and unlike Eden, there will be no more possibility of sin.
So although we are saved we will still sin, but we will strive to grow in Holiness in anticipation of the hope that is to come. When Christ returns and we will be fully without spot or blemish.
When we look at what God decrees we can start at the very start.
In the begining God said.. and he caused this whole universe to come into existence. Something from nothing.
I agree with you about service we all should serve each other, aren't we called to do that, i agree with you on that point. service is one aspect of being called, as is being called in Christ.
Anyhow, we have to bear in mind, that no matter what it is By grace alone, through faith alone, in Christ alone.
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the error in this is you do not consider the holiness of God or HIS ability to change HIS mind
was Saul the elect? yet God chose another did he not? IS obedience a requirement as Jesus said you will do IF you LOVE ME.
Disobedience, willful sin, and unrighteousness don't matter IF you are the Elect? God just was kidding that those who are not Holy will NOT SEE HIM?
was Saul the elect? yet God chose another did he not? IS obedience a requirement as Jesus said you will do IF you LOVE ME.
Disobedience, willful sin, and unrighteousness don't matter IF you are the Elect? God just was kidding that those who are not Holy will NOT SEE HIM?