A forgotten point about the four gospels

[Dino246]

yes I’m aware there are a lot of reasons to disbelieve the gospels and many logics about their just historical records ect couldn’t the same logic be used to eliminate all scripture ? Non believers use that argument

"Disbelieve" is your word, not mine, and has nothing to do with my post.

did you know Luke was a partner in Paul’s ministry who wrote the gospel of Luke for gentile audiences ? Which begins like this to sort of demolish the logic you are using

Please DO NOT assume my ignorance. This tiny bit of knowledge does nothing whatsoever to "demolish" my logic.

your saying this is mere record of history and not doctrine ?

I suggest you read my post again.

That’s why we have four full accounts of what he preached in our homes across the globe still today it’s meant for us to accept and believe reconsider brother it’s never too late to take a step of faith

Don't be condescending and pedantic... unless, of course, that's how you want me to treat you.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

God calls whom he will to his grace.

Acts 16:31 And they said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.”

Romans 10:9
Because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Yes that’s explaining this

“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16:15-16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

we would agree the clnfession needs to be genuine from the heart and belief in sure so we need to accept the term “ Lord” in order to confess it

“And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭5:9‬ ‭KJV‬‬

when we say he’s our Lord it means we then are in submission to his will expressed in the gospel, paul was preaching to those who had believed the gospel of the kingdom

Lord sort of sounds like this biblically

“Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son: In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

And he is before all things, and by him all things consist. And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭1:13-18‬ ‭KJV‬‬

in a kingdom the king sets the laws and words for all to abide in who belong to his kingdom that’s where we should consider the term Lord . Because there’s always what he the lord said before Paul’s quotes can be considered

“And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?

Whosoever cometh to me, and heareth my sayings, and doeth them, I will shew you to whom he is like: He is like a man which built an house, and digged deep, and laid the foundation on a rock: and when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently upon that house, and could not shake it: for it was founded upon a rock.

But he that heareth, and doeth not, is like a man that without a foundation built an house upon the earth; against which the stream did beat vehemently, and immediately it fell; and the ruin of that house was great.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭6:46-49‬ ‭KJV‬‬

saying Jesus is lord of we don’t really mean it isn’t what Paul’s suggesting but accepting him as Lord is everything


“Afterward came also the other virgins, saying, Lord, Lord, open to us. But he answered and said, Verily I say unto you, I know you not.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭25:11-12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

any quote from Paul is meant for those believing the gospel so we don’t misconstrue it


Heaven never eliminates Gods word and Jesus word is Gods word forst and foremost in the kingdom the church belongs to.

“Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭7:21‬ ‭KJV‬‬

so we shouldn’t flrget Jesus words to accept Paul’s we should be founded in Christ word and then will understand oaul oerfectly otherwise we get the grave books of today that insist “ the words of Christ in red aren’t for you “

 

[Dino246]

Yes another point you make is solved here

they were all under the law until Jesus died to remit it at that point his word became the covenant here’s the point in scripture

"They" being Jews, not Gentiles. You haven't "solved" anything.

Romans 2:14 "For when Gentiles, who do not have the law..."

 

[Icedaisey]

Yes that’s explaining this

“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16:15-16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

we would agree the clnfession needs to be genuine from the heart and belief in sure so we need to accept the term “ Lord” in order to confess it

“And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭5:9‬ ‭KJV‬‬

when we say he’s our Lord it means we then are in submission to his will expressed in the gospel, paul was preaching to those who had believed the gospel of the kingdom

Lord sort of sounds like this biblically

“Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son: In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

And he is before all things, and by him all things consist. And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭1:13-18‬ ‭KJV‬‬

in a kingdom the king sets the laws and words for all to abide in who belong to his kingdom that’s where we should consider the term Lord . Because there’s always what he the lord said before Paul’s quotes can be considered

“And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?

Whosoever cometh to me, and heareth my sayings, and doeth them, I will shew you to whom he is like: He is like a man which built an house, and digged deep, and laid the foundation on a rock: and when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently upon that house, and could not shake it: for it was founded upon a rock.

But he that heareth, and doeth not, is like a man that without a foundation built an house upon the earth; against which the stream did beat vehemently, and immediately it fell; and the ruin of that house was great.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭6:46-49‬ ‭KJV‬‬

saying Jesus is lord of we don’t really mean it isn’t what Paul’s suggesting but accepting him as Lord is everything


“Afterward came also the other virgins, saying, Lord, Lord, open to us. But he answered and said, Verily I say unto you, I know you not.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭25:11-12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

any quote from Paul is meant for those believing the gospel so we don’t misconstrue it


Heaven never eliminates Gods word and Jesus word is Gods word forst and foremost in the kingdom the church belongs to.

“Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭7:21‬ ‭KJV‬‬

so we shouldn’t flrget Jesus words to accept Paul’s we should be founded in Christ word and then will understand oaul oerfectly otherwise we get the grave books of today that insist “ the words of Christ in red aren’t for you “

"any quote from Paul is meant for those believing the gospel so we don’t misconstrue it" Do you mean to say Paul didn't preach the gospel? But only addressed those who were already believers?

 

[Pilgrimshope]

"Disbelieve" is your word, not mine, and has nothing to do with my post.


Please DO NOT assume my ignorance. This tiny bit of knowledge does nothing whatsoever to "demolish" my logic.


I suggest you read my post again.


Don't be condescending and pedantic... unless, of course, that's how you want me to treat you.

Um yes anything I wrote are my words and not your words I agree .

The rest of it just shows your offense I don’t assume you are ignorant , was just sharing the scripture and some thoughts

but yea I read your post thoroughly and responded but sure I’ll read it again if you wish

if you perceive me that way it’s probably pointless to continue though

 

[Pilgrimshope]

"any quote from Paul is meant for those believing the gospel so we don’t misconstrue it" Do you mean to say Paul didn't preach the gospel? But only addressed those who were already believers?

I mean to say pauls letters don’t change the gospel they are preaching to those who believes the gospel me helping us understand it . Not changing or eliminating a single word that’s the whole point of the post here

Paul doesn’t offer anything parting from what Christ offered .

and his ministry was in person like this those epistles are only touching on Paul’s ministry there aren’t complete at all

“And when they were come to him, he said unto them, Ye know, from the first day that I came into Asia, after what manner I have been with you at all seasons, Serving the Lord with all humility of mind, and with many tears, and temptations, which befell me by the lying in wait of the Jews: And how I kept back nothing that was profitable unto you, but have shewed you, and have taught you publickly, and from house to house, Testifying both to the Jews, and also to the Greeks, repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ. And now, behold, I know that ye all, among whom I have gone preaching the kingdom of God, shall see my face no more.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭20:18-21, 25‬ ‭KJV‬‬

we don’t have anything he preached in person we have letters sent back to the chirches he helped establish in the gospel in person addressing situations he’s heard about to help them remain strong

We have a few epistles but he went around for years and years with men like Luke , mark , barnabus ect and we don’t have any record of those things

my point is we don’t throw away the kings word for the sake of one of his servants helping us understand things he taught

 

[Icedaisey]

I mean to say pauls letters don’t change the gospel they are preaching to those who believes the gospel me helping us understand it . Not changing or eliminating a single word that’s the whole point of the post here

Paul doesn’t offer anything parting from what Christ offered .

and his ministry was in person like this those epistles are only touching on Paul’s ministry there aren’t complete at all

“And when they were come to him, he said unto them, Ye know, from the first day that I came into Asia, after what manner I have been with you at all seasons, Serving the Lord with all humility of mind, and with many tears, and temptations, which befell me by the lying in wait of the Jews: And how I kept back nothing that was profitable unto you, but have shewed you, and have taught you publickly, and from house to house, Testifying both to the Jews, and also to the Greeks, repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ. And now, behold, I know that ye all, among whom I have gone preaching the kingdom of God, shall see my face no more.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭20:18-21, 25‬ ‭KJV‬‬

we don’t have anything he preached in person we have letters sent back to the chirches he helped establish in the gospel in person addressing situations he’s heard about to help them remain strong

We have a few epistles but he went around for years and years with men like Luke , mark , barnabus ect and we don’t have any record of those things

my point is we don’t throw away the kings word for the sake of one of his servants helping us understand things he taught

Thanks for your explanation.
I wasn't taking Paul's words over that of Jesus. If that is how my remarks came across, it was not my intention. I intend to show that Paul concurs with Jesus.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

"They" being Jews, not Gentiles. You haven't "solved" anything.

Romans 2:14 "For when Gentiles, who do not have the law..."

ok I perceive an argument that has no end. What does the law of Moses have to do with the gospel preached by Jesus Christ ?

the law is not the gospel , this is

“The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God;

Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God, And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭1:1, 14-15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

nothing no wuote you can find in any epistle can change what the gospel is or who preached it , Paul believes it and so carried it on to Gentiles.

the law of Moses isn’t part of it the apostles all agreed in chapter 15 of acts on that

“For the law was given by Moses,

but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.”
‭‭John‬ ‭1:17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

saying we aren’t under the law doesn’t mean we are lawless we have the law of the spirit

“It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭6:63‬ ‭KJV‬‬

So when you read Paul come from that and then see this

“There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭8:1-2‬ ‭KJV‬‬

we aren’t without law and all we’re under the law even if they didn’t receive it ot is witnesses in every nation of earth when God judges mans sin there’s no excuse

That’s why no One can be saved apart from Christ of we reject the Lords word we’re rejecting life

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:24‬ ‭KJV‬‬

what would happen if someone believes that ? Without arguing or being offended ? What would happen if we start believing Jesus word ?

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Thanks for your explanation.
I wasn't taking Paul's words over that of Jesus. If that is how my remarks came across, it was not my intention. I intend to show that Paul concurs with Jesus.

not at all I was just trying to clarify what I meant , like everyone when we are texting it’s sometimes hard to perceive how something is said there’s no emotion or expression it’s just text

it’s easy to perceive what o here haven’t meant so I was just trying to explain further what I was saying I sort of never thought you meant to say that at all was just responding to your request of what I was meaning

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Thanks for your explanation.
I wasn't taking Paul's words over that of Jesus. If that is how my remarks came across, it was not my intention. I intend to show that Paul concurs with Jesus.

I find Paul and the apostles ministry to be useful here

“Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: Of sin, because they believe not on me; Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more; Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged. I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now. Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you. All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.”
‭‭John‬ ‭16:7-15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

they were meant to help us further understand the hidden things in Jesus sometimes mysterious language and parables Paul especially speaks to
People who haven’t heard a lot of prophecy Gentiles , not because it’s dofferent but because he was given that appointment more so than the others he was the forerunner tonthe Gentiles showing them how to understand the gospel better

o would have loved to sit and listen to Paul’s sermons and his companions like Barnabus and mark , Luke and Apollos and also Priscilla and aquilla I think the message would sound so much more like Jesus words but with more clarity and more human communications because even the apostles were not perfect

I adore Paul’s writings but I’ve come to realize his writings are a sample of his doctrine and sources and centered in the gospel

 

[John146]

Sometimes we forget that the gospels were written not before the church began , but when the church was in full swing and the Holy Ghost was still exalted among believers .

The disciples did not have the Holy Spirit yet. They didn't even have the knowledge of the death, burial, and resurrection. Isn't that the gospel unto salvation? Christ stated that he would build his church...future tense.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

The disciples did not have the Holy Spirit yet. They didn't even have the knowledge of the death, burial, and resurrection. Isn't that the gospel unto salvation? Christ stated that he would build his church...future tense.

yeah he taught them to wait for the spirit before they started doing this

“And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth. Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭28:18-20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

he never told them to invent new teachings and doctrines but to tomoresch the gospel he taught them tonthe world

then not having the spirit at the time he told them that doesn’t mean it doesn’t apply his words are never going to change what he preached to them then is written down formoir sakes so we too can hear it and be saved we also have their eoistles to help guide us into all truth but we have to never try to remove the foundation which is witnesses four times ( the only doctrine witnesses four times repetitively the only time period witnesses four times repetitively begins with Jesus and ends with Jesus

all the apostles believed the gospel well
Before they preached it by the spirit any Christian doesn’t have the spirit until they hear the doctrine about receiving it

 

[Blade]

The gospels.. seems your going by when they were written. No matter when the were they were under the law there was no Christians or Church. The great revelation Paul got was after Christ rose and was caught up. After the 120 baptisted with the holy spirit.

So when we read the gospels what you read happened way before Paul. No Christians no Church no holy spirit in every one. Christ had to leave or the Holy Spirit will not come.. was not there yet.

 

[John146]

yeah he taught them to wait for the spirit before they started doing this

“And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth. Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭28:18-20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

he never told them to invent new teachings and doctrines but to tomoresch the gospel he taught them tonthe world

then not having the spirit at the time he told them that doesn’t mean it doesn’t apply his words are never going to change what he preached to them then is written down formoir sakes so we too can hear it and be saved we also have their eoistles to help guide us into all truth but we have to never try to remove the foundation which is witnesses four times ( the only doctrine witnesses four times repetitively the only time period witnesses four times repetitively begins with Jesus and ends with Jesus

all the apostles believed the gospel well
Before they preached it by the spirit any Christian doesn’t have the spirit until they hear the doctrine about receiving it

Therefore, the foundation of the church, Jesus and the cross, had not been laid yet during Christ’s earthly ministry.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

The disciples did not have the Holy Spirit yet. They didn't even have the knowledge of the death, burial, and resurrection. Isn't that the gospel unto salvation? Christ stated that he would build his church...future tense.

Jesus has already preached about his death and resurrection

“Saying, The Son of man must be delivered into the hands of sinful men, and be crucified, and the third day rise again.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭24:7‬ ‭KJV‬‬

even Isaiah had preached it it wasn’t new knowledge the gospel ofn the kingdom is new however

the blood doesn’t erase the need for believing the word of life it allows us to come near and hear it unlike they could in the last because they had no remission of sins

Christs death and resurrection is certainly of the gospel and for us after it’s where we start , but the idea that there’s not a word of God calling us to repentance and obedience is erroneous and a concoction of the new age grace alone preachers who actually though they tout Paul’s name reject his doctrine also

“This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh. For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.

But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.

Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like:

of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭5:16-21‬ ‭KJV‬‬

or

“For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.”
‭‭2 Corinthians‬ ‭5:10-11‬ ‭KJV‬‬

that’s from the same guy they twist into a grace alone nothing else applies but the cross doctrine he never taught that but they do by twisting and cherry picking his epistles and rejecting the rest

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Therefore, the foundation of the church, Jesus and the cross, had not been laid yet during Christ’s earthly ministry.

see my last post to you

 

[Blik]

Sometimes we forget that the gospels were written not before the church began , but when the church was in full swing and the Holy Ghost was still exalted among believers .


The point is when we try to make the four gospels something that isn’t the church doctrine were eliminating the foundations of church doctrine. The gospels were written as the apostles and early church began to age and in order to carry out the commission they simply recorded in scripture the things Jesus had taught them , to go teach the world about him and of him.

there seems to always be a reason we don’t want to accept the four gospels and instead we want to try to learn from the epistles which is a great thing but the epistles are only companions to help us understand the gospel

Paul for instance what did he teach the Ephesians ? Is it his Ephesians letter that was thier doctrine ? Or did Paul spend two years in person preaching and teaching them the gospel and later wrote a single epistle correcting and exhorting and comforting them ?

the epistles are just a glimpse into what Paul was teaching most of his writings are to churches he helped establish in person with men like Luke and barnabus , Apollos and Priscilla and aquilla, Timothy and mark

Paul sent letters from far away places he was establishing other cities in the gospel and hearing thkngs and sending letters to help keep them following the gospel. His epistles were never the source of doctrine for anyone they were companions and additions to the gospels. To help us remain and be comforted and edified further

if we could hear Paul’s in Morrison message it would fully include the gospels as the foundation and irrevocable word of Christ.

it’s not a good idea to remove Jesus words and replace them with Paul’s epistles we don’t even have a clear image in those few short and specifically designed letters sent to correct , rebuke and encourage the church they are wonderful but are companions to the gospel not the replacements

consider when people are insisting on Paul’s letters being everything , what they really are saying about Jesus

As we read scripture we need to keep in mind that it is a God who is spirit speaking to man who is mortal. It is only through the holy spirit that we can comprehend the life in the spirit that scripture is trying to make clear to us. We and our world is made in he image of God, so God can use history and the earth to illustrate the spirit. God does this especially in the old testament, as God brings out the singularities to marking skin to marking spirits as belonging to God as in circumcision.

Scripture is beautiful poetry. Scripture explains the spirit of the Lord. Scripture tells us how to live. Scripture is history. Scripture is God's messages to us.

The bottom line is that all and every scripture is to be read with many ways of understanding, and if we limit any of it to just one way we miss out of the message of scripture.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

The gospels.. seems your going by when they were written. No matter when the were they were under the law there was no Christians or Church. The great revelation Paul got was after Christ rose and was caught up. After the 120 baptisted with the holy spirit.

So when we read the gospels what you read happened way before Paul. No Christians no Church no holy spirit in every one. Christ had to leave or the Holy Spirit will not come.. was not there yet.

Lol the holy soirit PREACHED the gospel to them first and they wrote them as doctrine well after they received the holt spirit

this is the gospel source

“Now when all the people were baptized, it came to pass, that Jesus also being baptized, and praying, the heaven was opened, And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭3:21-22‬ ‭KJV‬‬

it’s not coincidence that he then began doing this and not before he was baltized and received the spirit

“Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God, And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭1:14-15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

nor is it coincidence that he immediately did this quoting Isaiah who prophecies of this time

“And there was delivered unto him the book of the prophet Isaiah. And when he had opened the book, he found the place where it was written, The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor;

he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised, To preach the acceptable year of the Lord. And he began to say unto them, This day is this scripture fulfilled in your ears.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭4:17-19, 21‬ ‭KJV‬‬

the law was given by Moses and lasted until Jesus died. His word became the eternal covenant word when he shed his blood remitting sin .

there’s no argument that a man can conceive to remove the gospel from the gospel. Who actually preached the gospel of not the spirit from heaven ?

“And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world.

I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

I have many things to say and to judge of you: but he that sent me is true; and I speak to the world those things which I have heard of him.

Then said Jesus unto them, When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things.

Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:23-24, 26, 28, 31-32‬ ‭KJV‬‬

no matter the argument of we are working to get anyone away from this

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:

we’re rejecting the words of the Holy Spirit spoken by the lord himself And trying to hide this from them

“It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.”
‭‭John‬ ‭6:45‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“He that cometh from above is above all: he that is of the earth is earthly, and speaketh of the earth: he that cometh from heaven is above all. And what he hath seen and heard, that he testifieth; and no man receiveth his testimony. He that hath received his testimony hath set to his seal that God is true.

For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him.

The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand. He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.”
‭‭John‬ ‭3:31-36‬ ‭KJV‬‬

All we have to do is hear and believe e true gospel preached by the Lord God himself he will take care of the rest and surely we shouldn’t deny that he does formoir sins and rose from the dead and now sits as our advocate who believe him

 

[Dino246]

ok I perceive an argument that has no end.

Perhaps because you're trying to refute my comments instead of trying to understand them.

the law is not the gospel

I'm well aware of that, and have debated the point with legalists many times.

this is

“The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God;

Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God, And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭1:1, 14-15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Let's not confuse distinct uses of the term, "gospel"; there are the gospels (records) of Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John; this is the term as you use it above. Then there is THE gospel (message) which is the core truth about God, humanity, sin, Jesus, faith, and eternal life.

nothing no wuote you can find in any epistle can change what the gospel is or who preached it , Paul believes it and so carried it on to Gentiles.

You seem to think that I'm trying to change something; I'm not. I'm responding to your words from the opening post:

"The point is when we try to make the four gospels something that isn’t the church doctrine were eliminating the foundations of church doctrine. "

The four gospels, as records, are "foundational" though are themselves built on the Old Testament. They are historical records as I stated before. There is indeed doctrine for the Church recorded in them, but to treat the entirety of the gospels as doctrinal is likely to lead people back to the Law, because the events they record occurred in the context of the OT Law. Jesus Himself stated in reference to the Pharisees, "Do what they tell you." Are we as Christians to do what the Pharisees tell us? No. As I said before, we need to determine what is doctrinal and what isn't. Narrative passages usually aren't.

More from your opening post: "there seems to always be a reason we don’t want to accept the four gospels and instead we want to try to learn from the epistles which is a great thing but the epistles are only companions to help us understand the gospel "
Here you are employing the logical fallacy of equivocation again, using the term "gospel" in two distinct senses while implying that it is the same sense. You are also assuming ignorance or lack of understanding on the part of others.

By the way, who (Christians, that is) doesn't want to accept the gospels? I have met no such person.

what would happen if someone believes that ? Without arguing or being offended ? What would happen if we start believing Jesus word ?

Again, the tone of your questions implies wrongdoing on my part. Do you get that you come across as rather self-righteous?

In what way(s) do these "we" people not believe Jesus' word?

 

[Pilgrimshope]

As we read scripture we need to keep in mind that it is a God who is spirit speaking to man who is mortal. It is only through the holy spirit that we can comprehend the life in the spirit that scripture is trying to make clear to us. We and our world is made in he image of God, so God can use history and the earth to illustrate the spirit. God does this especially in the old testament, as God brings out the singularities to marking skin to marking spirits as belonging to God as in circumcision.

Scripture is beautiful poetry. Scripture explains the spirit of the Lord. Scripture tells us how to live. Scripture is history. Scripture is God's messages to us.

The bottom line is that all and every scripture is to be read with many ways of understanding, and if we limit any of it to just one way we miss out of the message of scripture.

I see it differently I believe the scripture only exists because God wants us to
Know what he said

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:24‬ ‭

that’s not a one off it fills scripture from beginning to end I think that of we go to Jesus and here his life giving promise there were actually doing this

“It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.”
‭‭John‬ ‭6:45‬ ‭KJV‬‬

And truthfully we are going to believe what we choose to believe but I have chosen long ago to believe what e Lord has said , and has caused to be available in every city on earth usually foind on a shelf gathering dust because we always want to make our own way to God without having to conform to Christs way

The scripture is there so we don’t have to listen to
Men and thoer ideas about God we should have learned about that path from the ot

that’s actually why he came tomoresch the truth of eternal Life and give us the right understanding of him

“And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.”
‭‭1 John‬ ‭5:20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I know a lot of folks don’t agree but to me we need to let the gospel be written on our belief in order to walk forth. Now of others have just received the gospel from some instantaneous miracle and already know it all , then I’m pretty dofferent I fought it along time and now am
In the “pitiful” position of needing to hear what Jesus actually taught to know what he was actually teaching and o believe scriptire os where that is best found

to each thier own because that’s eventually the thing it’s on each of us to determine where faith is camping from and what word to believe I’m going to have to always stick to the scripture meet that correct me because I had a lot of my own ideas about him but they never held up when I let the gospel in