when will the most evil doctrin in the world get banned on this site.

Phoneman-777 · Mar 11, 2022

John the Baptist says we must bring forth "fruits meet of repentance" or "works which demonstrate genuine repentance" - "repentance" meaning "changing our minds". Changing what? From a will surrendered to ourselves to a will surrendered to Christ. That happens by our choice to do so.

peldom10 · Mar 11, 2022

Runningman said:

If you speak of saved while on this earth...(correctly...born again).....Per God's word. NO WAY.

For those who follow such trashing of God's word please answer this for all of us...why has this belief only appeared since the 1960's? Did we get smarter or did..."tickle my ears and tell me what I want to hear".... become obsessive by many with new age religion bibles to support such nonsense. Latter is the case.
If you believe this foolishness then you have an obligation to answer questions about it or....give it up....if you consider yourself a Christian.

rogerg · Mar 11, 2022

Phoneman-777 said:

It can only happen by and through God.

We are told in Scripture that it is God who give repentance as a gift of, and from, salvation - God's work, not ours.

[Heb 10:14-16 KJV]
14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.
15 [Whereof] the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,
16 This [is] the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;

the law of v16 above:

[Rom 8:2 KJV] 2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

posthuman · Mar 11, 2022

Phoneman-777 said:

wow, it clearly does not say that, at all.

ἄρα ἀπολείπεται σαββατισμὸς τῷ λαῷ τοῦ Θεοῦ.

so then there remains a sabbath-resting for the people of God

ἄρα
- so then
ἀπολείπεται
- there remains
σαββατισμὸς
- a resting, as on sabbath, a cessation of work
τῷ
- for (the)
λαῷ
- people
τοῦ Θεοῦ
- of God

there is no word 'duty' in the text, and the context does not at all support you presumptuously adding it to scripture.
the only verb in the verse is "remains" -- sabbatismos is a word only used once in all of scripture, and it is a noun.
a resting, as the resting done on sabbath-days, remains for us.
"so then" - as a consequence of the argument preceding it - that because of unbelief, the people did not enter the rest promised them in Canaan.

the very next verse explains why the author chose to relate the 'rest' he has been talking about to the ritual of sabbath-keeping:

For he who has entered His rest has himself also ceased from his works as God from His.
(Hebrews 4:10)

the rest, that remains for us, God's rest, is like the symbol of the old covenant because likewise we cease from our own works, when we have entered it. the mention of sabbath is being used as an allegory, not as a command.

when are these false teachers going to stop patting themselves on the back for corrupting God's Word??

rogerg · Mar 11, 2022

peldom10 said:

It didn't just appear in the 1960's, its origin is from the Bible.

[Heb 10:14-16 KJV]
14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

[1Jo 5:13 KJV] 13 These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

Runningman · Mar 11, 2022

peldom10 said:

I make one comment and you come at me sideways like that? I haven’t even expounded upon why I think what I do or anything. You told me I’m not a Christian if I don’t give up what you seem to think I believe. Wow.

The way normal conversations work is that we take turns asking questions and giving answers. You have probably already debated this topic a lot and have firmly-held beliefs; if so then good for you.

What makes you think you’re going to change anyones mind on this message board? Do you just want to provoke people into arguments or actually talk things out? Talking it out is the only sensible conclusion.

And yes I would love to chat about salvation and verses that guarantee salvation.

rogerg · Mar 11, 2022

Phoneman-777 said:

Umm - did you actually read what I posted? I said that they were of the things that accompany salvation. In order to be in possession of the things that accompany salvation, one has to be saved.

peldom10 · Mar 11, 2022

rogerg said:

You are trying to re cast the narrative differently.
Here is the point I was reasponding to....;

Runningman said:
And yes there are a lot of verses that strongly imply that once you are saved you can’t be unsaved.

Runningman said:

It is not my beliefs...it is the Bible language. Forget trying to shoot me.
Respond to the Bible...it speaks for itself.

There are no such scriptures existing.

peldom10 · Mar 11, 2022

rogerg said:

I reiterate...show me one such teaching recorded before the 1960's...do that challenge which is before you.
The Bible...KJV 1611 edition has always been the same.

rogerg · Mar 12, 2022

peldom10 said:

External life, being eternal, means that it is never ending and can't be lost thereby being OSAS. To be even more precise,
anyone's name God had written into the book of life from the foundation of the world, will be saved (and cannot be unsaved) and given eternal life.

Okay, below is my reply using only verses from the Bible (KJV) to satisfy your challenge (as I understand it). Observe the "for ever" and "eternal life" in those verses.

[Heb 10:14-16 KJV]
14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

[1Jo 5:13 KJV] 13 These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

[Jhn 10:28 KJV]
28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any [man] pluck them out of my hand.

[Act 13:48 KJV]
48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

[1Jo 5:13 KJV]
13 These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

REPLY
REPORT

rogerg · Mar 12, 2022

peldom10 said:

You've lost me. If you're saying that OSAS isn't in the Bible, see my prior post. If your point is something else, please clarify

peldom10 · Mar 12, 2022

rogerg said:

For the purpose of OSAS while here on earth those do not apply and are being taken out of context of their intended and true meaning. We are born again while on this earth.
Those apply after God says we are...... saved....... which is after physical death and God's judgement. Those can not be applied to our sanctified status while alive here on this earth.
Let it be heard loud and clear.....the Bible says...; it is appointed unto man once to die and then the judgment. Upon judgement when one is declared ...saved....by God..........no one can interfere with that status....forever.

Amen ( verly let it be)

peldom10 · Mar 12, 2022

rogerg said:

Please, all I am doing is pointing out the pertinent references for understanding. Yes once one is declared saved by God during His judgement of us after physical death but, new age religionist are taking the OSAS out of context and are presenting OSAS in a manner that is miss leading.

Runningman · Mar 12, 2022

peldom10 said:

At this point I'm more interested why you require there be a possibility of losing salvation. I could start showing you verses that show you otherwise, but I am fully convinced in my heart and mind that nothing will change your mind, not even God Himself.

So let's just interview. What is your denomination?

Oblio · Mar 12, 2022

Many insist that they can lost their salvation. I, however, have done almost everything possible to lose mine, but it just hasn't happened. I believe that this is so because He who began a good work in me is being faithful to carry it to completion. He is faithful!
"And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that I shall lose none of those He has given Me, but raise them up at the last day." - John 6:39

rogerg · Mar 12, 2022

peldom10 said:

No. Look again at the verses that I provided regarding eternal life -- their tenses are not future-- meaning they were saved spiritually and given eternal life while still in the flesh (as a gift of God). In its eternal form this eternal life is manifested to all (of those who are to receive it) when they are redeemed at the last trump, at the end of time. Nevertheless, spiritual life (being saved) must be, and is, given, while still in this physical body.

[Eph 2:5 KJV]
5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved

I think your misunderstanding comes from the fact the Bible uses the term "saved" in two different ways: 1) as I said above, the term "saved" is used by the Bible (as something received during physical life) in order for someone to be made alive spiritually and, 2) saved is also used in the Bible to denote not suffering the wrath of God at the end of time in the day of the Lord; however, "1" must happen before "2", but both must happen. So sometimes it is difficult to differentiate which one is being referred to. When the Bible refers to being "saved" occurring after the receiving of faith, then the saved being referred to is of "2", not "1(hope that is understandable)".

[1Co 5:5 KJV]
5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

[2Pe 3:10 KJV]
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

rogerg · Mar 12, 2022

peldom10 said:

Please, all I am doing is pointing out the pertinent references for understanding. Yes once one is declared saved by God during His judgement of us after physical death but, new age religionist are taking the OSAS out of context and are presenting OSAS in a manner that is miss leading.

See my prior reply to you.

rogerg · Mar 12, 2022

rogerg said:

In thinking about my post(#696), to expound upon it further, I should have also stated in it that (generally speaking) when "saved" is used in the Bible as occurring in the future (future tense), that it also pertains to "2" and not "1". While this may not always the case, it often is. For example:

[Act 2:21 KJV] 21 And it shall come to pass, [that] whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.

At first glance the above verse seems to imply that, if by our choice, we call upon the name of the Lord, that we shall be saved - meaning
it is by our choice of calling upon His name that causes/ed the saving. However, I believe it actually means that only those who already have become saved (#1) through/by Christ alone- His work, not ours - and because of His work, after the fact, we call upon His name, shall be those who will be saved from His wrath (#2), in the day of the Lord.

Again, I realize this is more confusing than it probably needs to be because I'm not the best writer, but the distinction of how the Bible uses "saved", is critical to our understanding of it and of salvation.

GRACE_ambassador · Mar 12, 2022

rogerg said:

Precious friend, thanks for your honesty and input - please be Encouraged in:

God's THREE Tenses of His ETERNAL Salvation - God's Simple Will!:

"But we had the sentence of death in ourselves, that we should not
trust in ourselves, but in God Which raiseth the dead: Who delivered
us from so great a death, and doth deliver: in Whom we trust that He
will yet deliver us;" (2 Corinthians 1:9-10 KJB!) =

Precious friend(s), Is not the Solution to Confusion recog-
nizing These THREE, And, Also, God's Differences Between
"HIS Relationship With us," And "our fellowship with HIM!"?

God's Will, Today, Under HIS PURE GRACE? Very Simply:

1) Past Tense = "...God delivered us from so great a death...":

God Establishes HIS Eternal Relationship With
those who humbly repent and:

believe, 100% trust, place Total faith, In The LORD JESUS CHRIST,
HIS Death (Precious BLOOD), Burial, And HIS Resurrection,
According To The Scriptures!
(1 Corinthians 15:3-4; cp Ephesians 2:8-9; Romans 3-5 KJB!)

"GRACE Through faith" In The Merits
Of HIS All-Sufficient BLOOD Results:

All sins Forgiven, His Eternal Life, And, Peace With God!
(Ephesians 1:7; Colossians 2:13; Romans 6:23; Romans 5:1)

This Is Eternal Deliverance From the Penalty of sin,
The So Great A [Second ] Death! (Revelation 21:8) =
Justification and Spiritual Sanctification
(2 Corinthians 1:10a cp Romans 3:24)

(More Biblical Confirmation is here: God's ETERNAL Assurance!
And here:
God's OPERATION On All HIS New-born babes In CHRIST!)

God's ETERNAL Justification/Relationship Is First, And, Then:

(2) Present Tense = "...God doth deliver us...":

All believers Should do "good works" {Which will Never
Equal CHRIST's Payment For the above Penalty of sin!},
for Which we Are Created In CHRIST JESUS, to perform
for Him, having "been Called into fellowship With Him!"
(Ephesians 2:10; 1 Corinthians 1:9) Amen?:

We "work out our own salvation" (Philippians 2:12). This
Should Be a lifetime of Daily submission, and renewing,
being "not conformed to this world" (Romans 12:1-2),
for Grace Deliverance From the Power of sin!}
(2 Corinthians 1:10b) = personal sanctification:

(2a) Christ Living In us, To Fulfil:

All Of His Law, In "One Word: Love thy neighbor
as thyself!" (Galatians 5:14; Romans 13:8-10)

(2b) His Spirit Guiding and Teaching us, How To:

"Study to shew thyself Approved Unto God, work-
man that needeth not to be ashamed, Rightly
Dividing The Word Of Truth!" (2 Timothy 2:15 KJB)

Eternal Results: reward {or loss} (1 Corinthians 3:8-15),
ruling and reigning With CHRIST, Which Will Finally Be
At The Judgment Day:

(3) Future Tense = "...God Will Yet Deliver us":

CHRIST's Glorification of All "members" Of HIS Body!!
{This Is Eternal Deliverance From the Presence of sin!}
(1 Thessalonians 4:13-18; 1 Corinthians 15:51-57;
2 Corinthians 1:10c). Hallelujah! Praise HIS Excellent Name!!
----------------------------------
Conclusion:

BIG Differences Between the THREE tenses Of God's Eternal Salvation,
And Between God's Relationship And our fellowship! Correct?

Please Be Very Richly Encouraged, Enlightened, Exhorted, and Edified!

(2 Timothy 2:15; Romans 16:25; Ephesians 3:9 GRACE/ Mystery fellowship
{Romans – Philemon}, For All “To See,” today?)

Seeking-Christ · Apr 8, 2022

We are on page 35! I'm late to the party. But I want to say this, eternal security is not apart of my Christian background. And it's probably the reason why I constantly doubt my salvation. I've been trying to studying eternal security, to see if it could be true. I would love it, if it were true, then I wouldn't always be scared of going hell every time I struggled with a sin issue.

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