THE THIRD COMING OF CHRIST

[Komentaja]

Wouldn't 'third coming' better describe the position of both partial preterists and pretribulational dispensationalists...a problem with both positions?

Exactly. I have been saying it for a long time, partial preterists who are usually amillennialists and dispensationalists both believe in three comings if they were honest with themselves. One explains away the rapture as a "coming but not a real coming as Jesus does not touch the ground" and the other explains away the coming as "its not a visible coming its a coming in judgment to destroy Jerusalem in AD70"

Same games being played. Only the true historic position of the early Church, which is one second coming, during which the dead are raised after which the people who are alive will be raptured to meet the Lord in the air. Very simple.

 

[soberxp]

If you don’t mind me asking, you have stirred my curiosity by saying the second coming has failed. So what do you mean?

People talk about the second coming every day. Is there anyone watching the scene in the sky every day?
I call it watchman.

In addition, everyone has a different understanding of the second coming, which is the biggest failure. Even if it comes, people will not believe it.

How do you make people all over the world see you at the same time?

 

[Runningman]

How do you make people all over the world see you at the same time?

Through live broadcasting on television, radio, Internet, etc. it’s entirely possible for the world to witness an event via technology.

Matthew 24:27
For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man.

Referring to electricity moving across the world in Matt. 24:27 such as is the case with the Internet for example. Not saying this is the true interpretation of what Jesus said, but it’s plausible and worth considering in my opinion. Unless someone has a better explanation.

 

[Runningman]

Revelation 1:7
7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.

 

[soberxp]

Through live broadcasting on television, radio, Internet, etc. it’s entirely possible for the world to witness an event via technology.

Matthew 24:27
For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man.

Referring to electricity moving across the world in Matt. 24:27 such as is the case with the Internet for example. Not saying this is the true interpretation of what Jesus said, but it’s plausible and worth considering in my opinion. Unless someone has a better explanation.

What if the government and the Internet block this information? For example, videos and photos.

What if people think that video and pictures are just Hollywood tools?

 

[soberxp]

Revelation 1:7
7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.

Every eye shall see him, not every eye must see him.

 

[Runningman]

What if the government and the Internet block this information? For example, videos and photos.

What if people think that video and pictures are just Hollywood tools?

Yes that’s possible, too. That’s why there will be signs accompanying the time prior to the arrival of Jesus.

Like birth pains, the begin mildly then increase in intensity.

Matthew 24:4-8
4Jesus answered, “See to it that no one deceives you. 5For many will come in My name, claiming, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will deceive many. 6You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. These things must happen, but the end is still to come. 7Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. 8All these are the beginning of birth pains.

There will be signs before it happens.

 

[MISSION-IMPOSSIBLE]

My question is, where do you find this third coming in the Bible then? Thats my primary question, my secondary question is why didn't any of the prophecies about the pagan nations attacking Israel being destroyed get fulfilled when Rome attack Jerusalem? Why wasnt there two witnesses there.

My question is where do you find this SECOND COMING in the Bible? I said "third" to differentiate the previous two comings. All you have to do is read the NT while putting aside the popular notion that wherever it says the coming of the Lord, it must be the second coming that will take place in our future, not the future of the bibli al recipients. Did Paul lie to the Thessalonians believers by writing to them about something that hasn't happened yet?

Think about it before you respond. Thank you. 😇

 

[MISSION-IMPOSSIBLE]

Again, the old covenant didn't depend on a temple standing. Jesus fulfilled the OC, and made a new one. Where in the bible does it say the old covenant would end with the destruction of the temple?

All you need is to understand that if the old covenant was finished, why were the people still offering sacrifices under the old covenant? So, do you mean to tell me that if the temple was still standing today, and the people were still offering animal sacrifices, the old covenant wouldn't matter to you even though everyone else said it did?

 

[MISSION-IMPOSSIBLE]

We never question the bible for then we would indeed be at least heterodox if not in fact heretic ... let us take our beliefs out of the bible and our minds will become the mind of Christ.

We never question the bible for then we would indeed be at least heterodox if not in fact heretic ... let us take our beliefs out of the bible and our minds will become the mind of Christ.

The only heresy here is the way you think, so if it doesn't say it in black and white, must be false, correct? So, where in the bible does it say, "the SECOND COMING"?

If it doesn't say, why do you believe it? 😇

 

[Komentaja]

My question is where do you find this SECOND COMING in the Bible? I said "third" to differentiate the previous two comings. All you have to do is read the NT while putting aside the popular notion that wherever it says the coming of the Lord, it must be the second coming that will take place in our future, not the future of the bibli al recipients. Did Paul lie to the Thessalonians believers by writing to them about something that hasn't happened yet?

Think about it before you respond. Thank you. 😇

IT would be exactly all those "coming" passages you refer to. REason I think those have not happened is because the resurrection has not taken place clearly, the prophecies in the book of Revelation have not taken place.

 

[SomeDisciple]

All you need is to understand that if the old covenant was finished, why were the people still offering sacrifices under the old covenant? So, do you mean to tell me that if the temple was still standing today, and the people were still offering animal sacrifices, the old covenant wouldn't matter to you even though everyone else said it did?

Exactly. The OC didnt depend on the temple standing, or sacrifices happening. The OC began without a temple, and went long periods of time without a temple standing- and then it became obsolete while the temple was still standing. The temple is not what makes the OC the OC.

 

[tourist]

Revelation is all about the destruction of Jerusalem when the Romans invaded Jerusalem back in the first century. You are a bit over 2,000 years too late. 😂

So, John wrote a history book instead of a book of prophesy?

 

[MISSION-IMPOSSIBLE]

So, John wrote a history book instead of a book of prophesy?

So, John wrote a history book instead of a book of prophesy?

John wrote a book of prophecy about to be fulfilled (Rev. 1:1, 3, 3:11, 22:7, 10 & 12). Remember that John died 2,000 years ago, not last week. 😂

 

[tourist]

John wrote a book of prophecy about to be fulfilled (Rev. 1:1, 3, 3:11, 22:7, 10 & 12). Remember that John died 2,000 years ago, not last week. 😂

If the second coming of Jesus was during the trouble of Jerusalem at 70 AD then that account is not prophesy but recorded history. John wrote Revelation around 90 AD 20 years later. No way the events of 70 AD were prophetic in regard to the book of Revelation.

 

[MISSION-IMPOSSIBLE]

Exactly. The OC didnt depend on the temple standing, or sacrifices happening. The OC began without a temple, and went long periods of time without a temple standing- and then it became obsolete while the temple was still standing. The temple is not what makes the OC the OC.

So, what physical proof do we have that the old covenant ended? Don't you know that if God didn't give us physical proof of what Jesus did, the church of today would be extremely legalistic and divided in two?

 

[MISSION-IMPOSSIBLE]

IT would be exactly all those "coming" passages you refer to. REason I think those have not happened is because the resurrection has not taken place clearly, the prophecies in the book of Revelation have not taken place.

Come on. Did Paul lie to them by giving them false hopes that it never happened? Remember what Martha said to the Lord about her dead brother? She said, "I know that he will rise on the last day", as if saying, big deal, I need my brother alive now, not when it won't matter anymore. What did Jesus say to her? "Remove the stone."

Your opinion about the book of Revelation is based on the people who taught you wrong because they don't know how to read in context, nor do they know how to look back at history, and find out what took place in A.D. 70.

If you don't see what I'm talking about, I can't help you.

 

[49]

All you need is to understand that if the old covenant was finished, why were the people still offering sacrifices under the old covenant? So, do you mean to tell me that if the temple was still standing today, and the people were still offering animal sacrifices, the old covenant wouldn't matter to you even though everyone else said it did?

"All you need is to understand that if the old covenant was finished, why were the people still offering sacrifices under the old covenant?"

Because they did not believe Jesus was Christ. They were still "waiting" for Him...

 

[SomeDisciple]

So, what physical proof do we have that the old covenant ended? Don't you know that if God didn't give us physical proof of what Jesus did, the church of today would be extremely legalistic and divided in two?

No, I don't think it would. Because the temple being destroyed isn't physical evidence of the end of the OC. It happened decades later, and was unrelated to the OC ending. The scriptures and the Holy Ghost and the testimony of the saints is our evidence. If someone wanted to believe in the OC without the new, there is plenty of "physical evidence", they could use (but no spiritual proof.) Israel survived the destruction and Rabbinical Judaism has flourished, hollow as it is, carrying on the Pharisees legacy.

I don't know why preterists always seem so afraid of Jews and temples. Christianity began just fine with Herods temple up. Everyone knows by now that Jews and Christians are not the same. And if you have concerns about the church being "divided"... we don't need a temple up for that.

Jerusalem was destroyed as a judgement for the rejection of Jesus- and a fulfillment of prophecy. It was a sign to Israel that they were wrong with God as a nation. (And yet they would not recognize it)

After the 70AD destruction, and the Jewish revolts that happened continued later- surely you're aware that Jerusalem became a "christian" city, where they vehemently opposed the rebuilding of the temple- yet they were conquered and the city taken by muslims- SURELY you DO NOT consider that to be "physical evidence" of the end of the new covenant and the beginning of a Muslim age...

While the 1st century Jews rejected the truth, ensuring the destruction of their city- it doesn't change the fact that JESUS- an ISRAELITE- fulfilled the OC.

So, while preterists will say that the jews from generations past ensured that their nation can never be redeemed, others might say that Jesus' fulfillment of the OC guarantees that Israel as a nation will eventually be redeemed.

I've not seen any convincing theology or understanding of prophecy from a preterist point of view... only a sick celebration and veneration of the slaughter of Jews.

 

[SomeDisciple]

... and I'll say what's more: how can anyone take a look around themself and deny that the spirit of Anti-Christ remains in the world?

You have all these supposedly un-related entities all pushing toward the same end: the nations all fall under one power.

-Islamic Caliphates
-Jewish Zionists
-"christian" zionists
- secular humanists

Apostate religion and worldliness all mysteriously press for the cause of their iniquities and one house for mankind: but "ReVeLaTiOn HaPpEnEd AlReAdY!!!"