To Disagree with God!?
- Thread starter RaceRunner
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Disagreeing with God. Interesting topic.
It depends on your definition here but is David in the Psalms disagreeing with God?
The psalms which are my least favorite topic in the Bible say a lot about this “disagreement”
For example I say to God:
Where are you?
There are people dying!
There are people suffering!
There are children dying!
Where are you?
Why are you hiding?
When are you coming to resolve ALL of this?
Why don’t you show yourself to all these people suffering?
Why are you showing me things but you don’t show things to those who are suffering?
Is that disagreement?
No, I don’t think so because I am still addressing Him, maybe in anger but I know that I am insignificant to understand his plan and mind.
So, it depends what you mean by Disagreement.
It depends on your definition here but is David in the Psalms disagreeing with God?
The psalms which are my least favorite topic in the Bible say a lot about this “disagreement”
For example I say to God:
Where are you?
There are people dying!
There are people suffering!
There are children dying!
Where are you?
Why are you hiding?
When are you coming to resolve ALL of this?
Why don’t you show yourself to all these people suffering?
Why are you showing me things but you don’t show things to those who are suffering?
Is that disagreement?
No, I don’t think so because I am still addressing Him, maybe in anger but I know that I am insignificant to understand his plan and mind.
So, it depends what you mean by Disagreement.
Even if we're children of God we still have a sinful nature that always wars against God; we can't help that. But whether we serve the Spirit or the flesh is a choice. We choose to walk according to the Spirit or according to the flesh. We don't lose our free will when we're born again.
-
2
- Show all
I don't think so.
If we disagree with Him, we have not made Him our Lord. If we have not made Him our Lord, He is not our Savior.
We must repent of such things in timely fashion. We must ultimately come to the understanding that His ways are higher than our ways and that our Father knows best.
If we disagree with Him, we have not made Him our Lord. If we have not made Him our Lord, He is not our Savior.
We must repent of such things in timely fashion. We must ultimately come to the understanding that His ways are higher than our ways and that our Father knows best.
-
2
-
2
- Show all
It wasn't a choice for any of us to be born under the Curse of the Lord, the Curse that was implemented by the sins of Adam and Eve. That Curse applies the general mind of Satan to the life and existence of all.
Romans 8:7 NKJV - "Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be."
James 4:4 NKJV - "Adulterers and adulteresses! Do you not know that friendship with the world is enmity with God? Whoever therefore wants to be a friend of the world makes himself an enemy of God."
And this is the Purpose of Christ . . . to relinquish His Elect from the Curse of His Father. God the Father applied the Curse, and Jesus is the Redeemer of that Curse. Once a person has been released from the Curse, granted Repentence, given the Holy Spirit, and places full Trust and Faith in Christ and the Power that raised Him, they are no longer in disagreement with God.
Thank God, though, that this is Holy Work that He alone accomplishes through His Son.
Deuteronomy 30:6 NLT - "The LORD your God will change your heart and the hearts of all your descendants, so that you will love him with all your heart and soul and so you may live!"
Did you note the highlighted text, "so that"? This phrase tells us that there is an intended effect to Spiritual Circumcision, and it is by the releasing of the Curse that a person is then enabled to Love God with all their heart and soul so that they would Live forever.
Romans 8:7 NKJV - "Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be."
James 4:4 NKJV - "Adulterers and adulteresses! Do you not know that friendship with the world is enmity with God? Whoever therefore wants to be a friend of the world makes himself an enemy of God."
And this is the Purpose of Christ . . . to relinquish His Elect from the Curse of His Father. God the Father applied the Curse, and Jesus is the Redeemer of that Curse. Once a person has been released from the Curse, granted Repentence, given the Holy Spirit, and places full Trust and Faith in Christ and the Power that raised Him, they are no longer in disagreement with God.
Thank God, though, that this is Holy Work that He alone accomplishes through His Son.
Deuteronomy 30:6 NLT - "The LORD your God will change your heart and the hearts of all your descendants, so that you will love him with all your heart and soul and so you may live!"
Did you note the highlighted text, "so that"? This phrase tells us that there is an intended effect to Spiritual Circumcision, and it is by the releasing of the Curse that a person is then enabled to Love God with all their heart and soul so that they would Live forever.
-
2
- Show all
mans operation in creation requires us to Choose freely ,
“And the LORD God took the man, and put him into the garden of Eden to dress it and to keep it. And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat: but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. And they were both naked, the man and his wife, and were not ashamed.”
Genesis 2:15-17, 25 KJV
what God is doing is informing man of what’s true “ all things are yours but this fruit is poisonous don’t eat of it “
He placed the man in Eden and his wife also and I formed them of tbier dominion and freedom and also the warning of what is deadly.
this is then where the disagreement comes in
“And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die: for God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.”
Genesis 3:4-5
God doesn’t disagree with himself the truth was the fruit was deadly he gave man all he needed to live and dwell in Eden just to believe his word would have done it and kept them safe but “ no no it won’t kill you it will make you wise it’s good for you “ came along to disagree with Gods word
the truth is what he said is going to be no matter what we think so if we are in disagreement it’s we that needs to change our thinking he’s not going to change his word.
It depends on if someone is disagreeing from being ignorant or is it’s from unbelief
“And the LORD God took the man, and put him into the garden of Eden to dress it and to keep it. And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat: but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. And they were both naked, the man and his wife, and were not ashamed.”
Genesis 2:15-17, 25 KJV
what God is doing is informing man of what’s true “ all things are yours but this fruit is poisonous don’t eat of it “
He placed the man in Eden and his wife also and I formed them of tbier dominion and freedom and also the warning of what is deadly.
this is then where the disagreement comes in
“And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die: for God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.”
Genesis 3:4-5
God doesn’t disagree with himself the truth was the fruit was deadly he gave man all he needed to live and dwell in Eden just to believe his word would have done it and kept them safe but “ no no it won’t kill you it will make you wise it’s good for you “ came along to disagree with Gods word
the truth is what he said is going to be no matter what we think so if we are in disagreement it’s we that needs to change our thinking he’s not going to change his word.
It depends on if someone is disagreeing from being ignorant or is it’s from unbelief
-
1
- Show all
Yes, because in the scriptures it's written in Deuteronomy 30: 15 See, I have set before thee this day life and good, and death and evil; 16in that I command thee this day to love the LORD thy God, to walk in his ways, and to keep his commandments and his statutes and his judgments, that thou mayest live and multiply: and the LORD thy God shall bless thee in the land whither thou goest to possess it. 17 But if thine heart turn away, so that thou wilt not hear, but shalt be drawn away, and worship other gods, and serve them; 18 I denounce unto you this day, that ye shall surely perish, and that ye shall not prolong your days upon the land, whither thou passest over Jordan to go to possess it. 19 I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live: 20 that thou mayest love the LORD thy God, and that thou mayest obey his voice, and that thou mayest cleave unto him: for he is thy life, and the length of thy days: that thou mayest dwell in the land which the LORD sware unto thy fathers, to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob, to give them.
So this started with the children of Israel but is for all nation of people who wants to serve the Lord in spirit and in truth. Every person have the right to reject God word or disagree. One law and one manner shall be for you, and for the stranger that sojourneth with you. (Numbers 15:16). Another example of a person in the Bible who disagree with God was Jonah. Now Jonah to preach to the city of Nineveh that great city and against it. But Jonah rose up to flee unto Tarshish from the presence of the LORD. For time sake let's see what the Lord did when Jonah did that. Now the LORD had prepared a great fish to swallow up Jonah. And Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights. Let’s continue in Jonah 2: 1 Then Jonah prayed unto the LORD his God out of the fish's belly, 10 And the LORD spake unto the fish, and it vomited out Jonah upon the dry land.
Let’s continue in Jonah 3: 1 And the word of the LORD came unto Jonah the second time, saying, 2 Arise, go unto Nineveh, that great city, and preach unto it the preaching that I bid thee. 3 So Jonah arose, and went unto Nineveh, according to the word of the LORD. Now Nineveh was an exceeding great city of three days' journey. 4 And Jonah began to enter into the city a day's journey, and he cried, and said, Yet forty days, and Nineveh shall be overthrown. 5 So the people of Nineveh believed God, and proclaimed a fast, and put on sackcloth, from the greatest of them even to the least of them. 10 And God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not.
So out of fear of the Lord, Jonah went to Nineveh to warn the people there, and out of faith (belief) in God’s word and fear, the people of Nineveh repented and God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not.
Sometimes the outcome could be different depending on the relationship one have with God, but yes you can disagree. But those who that fear God and have understanding, knowledge and wisdom, will probably agree.
So this started with the children of Israel but is for all nation of people who wants to serve the Lord in spirit and in truth. Every person have the right to reject God word or disagree. One law and one manner shall be for you, and for the stranger that sojourneth with you. (Numbers 15:16). Another example of a person in the Bible who disagree with God was Jonah. Now Jonah to preach to the city of Nineveh that great city and against it. But Jonah rose up to flee unto Tarshish from the presence of the LORD. For time sake let's see what the Lord did when Jonah did that. Now the LORD had prepared a great fish to swallow up Jonah. And Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights. Let’s continue in Jonah 2: 1 Then Jonah prayed unto the LORD his God out of the fish's belly, 10 And the LORD spake unto the fish, and it vomited out Jonah upon the dry land.
Let’s continue in Jonah 3: 1 And the word of the LORD came unto Jonah the second time, saying, 2 Arise, go unto Nineveh, that great city, and preach unto it the preaching that I bid thee. 3 So Jonah arose, and went unto Nineveh, according to the word of the LORD. Now Nineveh was an exceeding great city of three days' journey. 4 And Jonah began to enter into the city a day's journey, and he cried, and said, Yet forty days, and Nineveh shall be overthrown. 5 So the people of Nineveh believed God, and proclaimed a fast, and put on sackcloth, from the greatest of them even to the least of them. 10 And God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not.
So out of fear of the Lord, Jonah went to Nineveh to warn the people there, and out of faith (belief) in God’s word and fear, the people of Nineveh repented and God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not.
Sometimes the outcome could be different depending on the relationship one have with God, but yes you can disagree. But those who that fear God and have understanding, knowledge and wisdom, will probably agree.
-
1
- Show all
P
As many times as I have read the book of Job I still don't get the full implications or teaching. Seems Job accepted the 'chastisement' he was subjected to. It was God allowed Satan to have control over Jobs condition. So the bad things in life we are to agree with too???!!!Seems more a matter of acceptance. Maybe nothing to do with choice. Play the hand God gave you? How about Paul,....'kicking against the pricks'....He didn't choose to follow Jesus.
-
1
- Show all
The Lord is not afraid of you questioning Him.
9:13 Then Ananias answered, Lord, I have heard by many of this man, how much evil he hath done to thy saints at Jerusalem: 14 And here he hath authority from the chief priests to bind all that call on thy name.
The Lord told Ananias to go and lay hand on Saul of Tarsus so he could receive his sight. Now Ananias is not so sure about this, this guy has done a lot of evil, he his here to find Christians and lock them up. You know Jesus was just recently ascended to the heavens, maybe things are really busy up there and he wasn't aware of this. It doesn't hurt to bring this up.
15 But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel: 16 For I will shew him how great things he must suffer for my name's sake.
The Lord is not offended, He simply explains to Ananias that He has planned some great sufferings for Paul.
We see the same thing with Peter
7 And I heard a voice saying unto me, Arise, Peter; slay and eat. 8 But I said, Not so, Lord: for nothing common or unclean hath at any time entered into my mouth. 9 But the voice answered me again from heaven, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.
The issue is with obeying. If Ananias had decided he knew best and was not going to obey the Lord or if Peter had done that, well that is where you would have a big problem.
9:13 Then Ananias answered, Lord, I have heard by many of this man, how much evil he hath done to thy saints at Jerusalem: 14 And here he hath authority from the chief priests to bind all that call on thy name.
The Lord told Ananias to go and lay hand on Saul of Tarsus so he could receive his sight. Now Ananias is not so sure about this, this guy has done a lot of evil, he his here to find Christians and lock them up. You know Jesus was just recently ascended to the heavens, maybe things are really busy up there and he wasn't aware of this. It doesn't hurt to bring this up.
15 But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel: 16 For I will shew him how great things he must suffer for my name's sake.
The Lord is not offended, He simply explains to Ananias that He has planned some great sufferings for Paul.
We see the same thing with Peter
7 And I heard a voice saying unto me, Arise, Peter; slay and eat. 8 But I said, Not so, Lord: for nothing common or unclean hath at any time entered into my mouth. 9 But the voice answered me again from heaven, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.
The issue is with obeying. If Ananias had decided he knew best and was not going to obey the Lord or if Peter had done that, well that is where you would have a big problem.
Yes, in Psa 13, we read that, when King David was going through some difficult circumstances, he said "How long, O Lord"? But in the end he made an act of faith and trust in the Lord God and submitted his will to Him in Love. So should we do also.
"How Long, O Lord?
To the choirmaster. A Psalm of David.
13 How long, O Lord? Will you forget me forever?
How long will you hide your face from me?
2 How long must I take counsel in my soul
and have sorrow in my heart all the day?
How long shall my enemy be exalted over me?
3 Consider and answer me, O Lord my God;
light up my eyes, lest I sleep the sleep of death,
4 lest my enemy say, “I have prevailed over him,”
lest my foes rejoice because I am shaken.
5 But I have trusted in your steadfast love;
my heart shall rejoice in your salvation.
6 I will sing to the Lord,
because he has dealt bountifully with me.
"How Long, O Lord?
To the choirmaster. A Psalm of David.
13 How long, O Lord? Will you forget me forever?
How long will you hide your face from me?
2 How long must I take counsel in my soul
and have sorrow in my heart all the day?
How long shall my enemy be exalted over me?
3 Consider and answer me, O Lord my God;
light up my eyes, lest I sleep the sleep of death,
4 lest my enemy say, “I have prevailed over him,”
lest my foes rejoice because I am shaken.
5 But I have trusted in your steadfast love;
my heart shall rejoice in your salvation.
6 I will sing to the Lord,
because he has dealt bountifully with me.
-
1
- Show all
God will often allow extraordinary circumstances into our lives if there is a chance that they will draw us nearer to Him. These things will be revealed to have been infinitely profitable to us in the end. Just trust Him. Paul did choose to follow Jesus. He just needed to be "enlightened". He was a very confused man.
-
2
- Show all
P
Interesting that he was blinded upon 'conversion'. And then seems some time passed till he 'understood' clearly.
Acts 9:8 And Saul arose from the earth; and when his eyes were opened, he saw no man: but they led him by the hand, and brought him into Damascus. 9 And he was three days without sight, and neither did eat nor drink.
10 ¶ And there was a certain disciple at Damascus, named Ananias; and to him said the Lord in a vision, Ananias. And he said, Behold, I am here, Lord. 11 And the Lord said unto him, Arise, and go into the street which is called Straight, and enquire in the house of Judas for one called Saul, of Tarsus: for, behold, he prayeth, 12 And hath seen in a vision a man named Ananias coming in, and putting his hand on him, that he might receive his sight. 13 Then Ananias answered, Lord, I have heard by many of this man, how much evil he hath done to thy saints at Jerusalem: 14 And here he hath authority from the chief priests to bind all that call on thy name. 15 But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel: 16 For I will shew him how great things he must suffer for my name’s sake. 17 And Ananias went his way, and entered into the house; and putting his hands on him said, Brother Saul, the Lord, even Jesus, that appeared unto thee in the way as thou camest, hath sent me, that thou mightest receive thy sight, and be filled with the Holy Ghost. 18 And immediately there fell from his eyes as it had been scales: and he received sight forthwith, and arose, and was baptized. 19 And when he had received meat, he was strengthened. Then was Saul certain days with the disciples which were at Damascus. 20 And straightway he preached Christ in the synagogues, that he is the Son of God. 21 But all that heard him were amazed, and said; Is not this he that destroyed them which called on this name in Jerusalem, and came hither for that intent, that he might bring them bound unto the chief priests? 22 But Saul increased the more in strength, and confounded the Jews which dwelt at Damascus, proving that this is very Christ.
23 ¶ And after that many days were fulfilled, the Jews took counsel to kill him: 24 But their laying await was known of Saul. And they watched the gates day and night to kill him.
Acts 9:8 And Saul arose from the earth; and when his eyes were opened, he saw no man: but they led him by the hand, and brought him into Damascus. 9 And he was three days without sight, and neither did eat nor drink.
10 ¶ And there was a certain disciple at Damascus, named Ananias; and to him said the Lord in a vision, Ananias. And he said, Behold, I am here, Lord. 11 And the Lord said unto him, Arise, and go into the street which is called Straight, and enquire in the house of Judas for one called Saul, of Tarsus: for, behold, he prayeth, 12 And hath seen in a vision a man named Ananias coming in, and putting his hand on him, that he might receive his sight. 13 Then Ananias answered, Lord, I have heard by many of this man, how much evil he hath done to thy saints at Jerusalem: 14 And here he hath authority from the chief priests to bind all that call on thy name. 15 But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel: 16 For I will shew him how great things he must suffer for my name’s sake. 17 And Ananias went his way, and entered into the house; and putting his hands on him said, Brother Saul, the Lord, even Jesus, that appeared unto thee in the way as thou camest, hath sent me, that thou mightest receive thy sight, and be filled with the Holy Ghost. 18 And immediately there fell from his eyes as it had been scales: and he received sight forthwith, and arose, and was baptized. 19 And when he had received meat, he was strengthened. Then was Saul certain days with the disciples which were at Damascus. 20 And straightway he preached Christ in the synagogues, that he is the Son of God. 21 But all that heard him were amazed, and said; Is not this he that destroyed them which called on this name in Jerusalem, and came hither for that intent, that he might bring them bound unto the chief priests? 22 But Saul increased the more in strength, and confounded the Jews which dwelt at Damascus, proving that this is very Christ.
23 ¶ And after that many days were fulfilled, the Jews took counsel to kill him: 24 But their laying await was known of Saul. And they watched the gates day and night to kill him.
-
1
- Show all
I don't agree that God distinguishes the artificial from the beautiful, the ugly, the fat and the thin.
Why doesn't God make Jesus ugly and fat? I've seen the Shroud of Jesus. It's a beautiful man with a great figure. Then why do we.....
But I believe it will be different in the kingdom of heaven haha
Why doesn't God make Jesus ugly and fat? I've seen the Shroud of Jesus. It's a beautiful man with a great figure. Then why do we.....
But I believe it will be different in the kingdom of heaven haha