Former President Trump Indicted By DOJ

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Roughsoul1991

Roughsoul1991

Senior Member
#101
Sep 17, 2016
8,863
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#101
ZNP said:
So then, when he left office did he fill out all the paperwork correctly? Seems reasonable, let's put a former president in prison for the rest of his life because he failed to fill out some document from National Archives correctly. No different from any other person retiring from a job, if you don't fill out the paperwork correctly they can put you in prison for the rest of your life. I guess that is what they mean by no one is above the law. I think it would help if they gave us a precedent where a teacher or policeman also was put in prison for doing that.
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It should be thrown out due to the post above in violation to the 14th amendment.
 
ZNP

ZNP

Well-known member
#102
Sep 14, 2020
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#102
Roughsoul1991 said:
I would assume his defense could argue a violation of the 14th amendment due process clause.

Procedural Due Process Civil
SECTION 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
ANNOTATIONS
Generally
Due process requires that the procedures by which laws are applied must be evenhanded, so that individuals are not subjected to the arbitrary exercise of government power.737 Exactly what procedures are needed to satisfy due process, however, will vary depending on the circumstances and subject matter involved.738 A basic threshold issue respecting whether due process is satisfied is whether the government conduct being examined is a part of a criminal or civil proceeding.739 The appropriate framework for assessing procedural rules in the field of criminal law is determining whether the procedure is offensive to the concept of fundamental fairness.


(It is plainly obvious that fairness and evenhanded use of the law has not been evenly applied to political candidates. )
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Why? Just because judges were required to get witnesses to flip on Trump before they would get federal appointments? That is "evenhanded" look at the Mueller investigation, the impeachments, and all the other things they have done, this is par for the course for what they do to Trump.
 
T

ThereRoseaLamb

Well-known member
#104
Jan 17, 2023
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#104
seed_time_harvest said:
Did you read what I wrote,He H I M S E L F made It a crime what do you mean by B A L O N E Y?

Side-note: NO ONE IS ABOVE THE LAW even If they are the President of the United States
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He didn't mishandle anything! He's not above the law but neither is he beneath it! He was president and that comes with privileges Clinton, Biden and even Pence did not have. It's in the Constitution. In fact both Clintons did it. Bill had things in his sock drawer and they said they couldn't make a case to hold him accountable because... he was president. Same goes for Trump.
 
LightOfMyLife

LightOfMyLife

Well-known member
#105
May 6, 2023
389
429
63
Independence, Mo
#105
ThereRoseaLamb said:
He didn't mishandle anything! He's not above the law but neither is he beneath it! He was president and that comes with privileges Clinton, Biden and even Pence did not have. It's in the Constitution. In fact both Clintons did it. Bill had things in his sock drawer and they said they couldn't make a case to hold him accountable because... he was president. Same goes for Trump.
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There should not be a double standard, but in this case there is because they are out to get him. They don't want him back in office. Pray all goes well for him.
 
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seed_time_harvest

Senior Member
#106
Dec 9, 2011
14,132
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#106
ThereRoseaLamb said:
He didn't mishandle anything! He's not above the law but neither is he beneath it! He was president and that comes with privileges Clinton, Biden and even Pence did not have. It's in the Constitution. In fact both Clintons did it. Bill had things in his sock drawer and they said they couldn't make a case to hold him accountable because... he was president. Same goes for Trump.
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Deflection to someone else doesn't make Trump, Clinton,Biden,Pence,Or uncle Joe Innocent.If you feel that Trump didn't mishandle documents regardless of whether he Is found guilty or not then congratulations, but If a jury finds him guilty then that means that he DID mishandle documents and If he DID mishandle documents then he can only blame HIMSELF for the consequences of possibly being jailed.

Personally I wouldn't vote for A N Y O N E to lead the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA that has been found guilty of mishandling top secret documents.

Side-note:Why DID Donald Trump want to hold on to those documents anyway? Was It because he thought that they were like memorabilia and they belonged to him?

Maybe I'll vote for Chris Christie.🙂
 
S

seed_time_harvest

Senior Member
#107
Dec 9, 2011
14,132
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#107
LightOfMyLife said:
There should not be a double standard, but in this case there is because they are out to get him. They don't want him back in office. Pray all goes well for him.
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If he Is found guilty by a jury of mishandling top secret documents ,will you vote for him to be the leader of America?
 
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ThereRoseaLamb

Well-known member
#109
Jan 17, 2023
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#109
seed_time_harvest said:
Deflection to someone else doesn't make Trump, Clinton,Biden,Pence,Or uncle Joe Innocent.
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Deflection is your opinion. The fact is Trump and Bill were presidents and only they were allowed to do what they did. Clinton was cleared, so must Trump.


seed_time_harvest said:
If you feel that Trump didn't mishandle documents regardless of whether he Is found guilty or not then congratulations, but If a jury finds him guilty then that means that he DID mishandle documents
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No, it means they don't know the law and the situation wasn't clearly described to them.


seed_time_harvest said:
Personally I wouldn't vote for A N Y O N E to lead the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA that has been found guilty of mishandling top secret documents.
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He didn't. If Bill can hide documents in his sock drawer and not be held accountable, then Trump can't. But Trump as president did what he was allowed to do.


seed_time_harvest said:
Maybe I'll vote for Chris Christie.🙂
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I don't vote for Rinos.
 
ZNP

ZNP

Well-known member
#110
Sep 14, 2020
36,784
6,747
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#110
ThereRoseaLamb said:
He didn't. If Bill can hide documents in his sock drawer and not be held accountable, then Trump can't. But Trump as president did what he was allowed to do.
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The problem with this logic is that the documents Trump had were not hidden safely in his sock drawer. If he had put some socks on the boxes we probably wouldn't even be having this conversation.
 
ZNP

ZNP

Well-known member
#111
Sep 14, 2020
36,784
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#111

Finally, an honest response from the FBI.
 
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ThereRoseaLamb

Well-known member
#112
Jan 17, 2023
4,787
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#112
ZNP said:
The problem with this logic is that the documents Trump had were not hidden safely in his sock drawer. If he had put some socks on the boxes we probably wouldn't even be having this conversation.
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Thanks, I needed a laugh tonight!
 
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Locoponydirtman

Guest
#113
#113
ThereRoseaLamb said:
Deflection is your opinion. The fact is Trump and Bill were presidents and only they were allowed to do what they did. Clinton was cleared, so must Trump.




No, it means they don't know the law and the situation wasn't clearly described to them.




He didn't. If Bill can hide documents in his sock drawer and not be held accountable, then Trump can't. But Trump as president did what he was allowed to do.




I don't vote for Rinos.
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Agree.
There are many reasons a jury could falsely convict. How many people have been in prison for years before being released because of a false conviction due to a jury?
 
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Locoponydirtman

Guest
#114
#114
seed_time_harvest said:
If a jury finds him guilty then that means that he DID mishandle documents
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Not true.
There are literally endless reasons a jury can falsely convict, and there has been numerous cases where people have been released from prison after years because they were falsely convicted.
 
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Locoponydirtman

Guest
#115
#115
We dont know what the documents are related to. They could be literally anything, including documents necessary to prove himself not guilty in the Russian colussion allegation. The fact is we just dont know, our govco is so corrupt that it wouldnt surprise me. Those document could be literally anything, from meaningless nothings to national security to things we may wish were public, and we will never know because they are classified.
 
ZNP

ZNP

Well-known member
#116
Sep 14, 2020
36,784
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#116
Locoponydirtman said:
Not true.
There are literally endless reasons a jury can falsely convict, and there has been numerous cases where people have been released from prison after years because they were falsely convicted.
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Almost all the reasons stem from poor legal representation or a lack of resources to properly make a case. I highly doubt Trump will have poor legal representation or a lack of resources.

150 years ago it would not be implausible that a third of the inmates at a prison were innocent of the crime they were convicted of. That number has steadily decreased with the advent of modern forensic tools. Today the number is estimated to be less than 3% and again, in almost every case that is due to poor legal representation.

If the trial were held in Washington DC you might be able to find a "jury of his peers" that would convict but in Florida? Yes, jurors can be intimidated and bought, but don't you think the White hats in the deep state are going to be watching for this?
 
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Locoponydirtman

Guest
#117
#117
ZNP said:
Almost all the reasons stem from poor legal representation or a lack of resources to properly make a case. I highly doubt Trump will have poor legal representation or a lack of resources.

150 years ago it would not be implausible that a third of the inmates at a prison were innocent of the crime they were convicted of. That number has steadily decreased with the advent of modern forensic tools. Today the number is estimated to be less than 3% and again, in almost every case that is due to poor legal representation.

If the trial were held in Washington DC you might be able to find a "jury of his peers" that would convict but in Florida? Yes, jurors can be intimidated and bought, but don't you think the White hats in the deep state are going to be watching for this?
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You don't think the Deep state is stacked against Donald Trump?
This is nothing less than the justice system being weaponized against political opposition
 
ZNP

ZNP

Well-known member
#118
Sep 14, 2020
36,784
6,747
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#118
Locoponydirtman said:
You don't think the Deep state is stacked against Donald Trump?
This is nothing less than the justice system being weaponized against political opposition
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I think it is more like 35/35 and that a third of those in the bureaucracy are useful idiots. I also think that half of those who are on the dark side are there because they are threatened, bribed, coerced or blackmailed. So then if people were to wake up to what is going on it would be much closer to 65/35 for the white hats with many people willing to snitch or betray the black hats, especially to save their own skin. In Washington DC it would be stacked, but this trial is in Florida. You go to 2/3 of the country and it would clearly be stacked for Trump. Look at yesterday when he walks into that Cafe, it is clearly stacked for Trump.
 
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Locoponydirtman

Guest
#119
#119
ZNP said:
I think it is more like 35/35 and that a third of those in the bureaucracy are useful idiots. I also think that half of those who are on the dark side are there because they are threatened, bribed, coerced or blackmailed. So then if people were to wake up to what is going on it would be much closer to 65/35 for the white hats with many people willing to snitch or betray the black hats, especially to save their own skin. In Washington DC it would be stacked, but this trial is in Florida. You go to 2/3 of the country and it would clearly be stacked for Trump. Look at yesterday when he walks into that Cafe, it is clearly stacked for Trump.
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We are in a cultural War and facing a socialist coup d'etat. Im not even a Trumpite, but I can see the wind blowing.
 
iamsoandso

iamsoandso

Senior Member
#120
Oct 6, 2011
8,048
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#120
It's curious that he's still looking for lawyers for his legal team. You would think that in Florida, a Red state there would be lawyers with Republican ambition's everywhere willing to help him. It makes me wonder if from a lawyers point of view their seeing something in the indictment they don't think they can defend and so their thinking they better not take this case? Anyway you would think there would be loyal Republican lawyers everywhere in Florida.
 
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