Our Lord gave us 2 Commandments. According to him there is no greater commandments than these 2 commandments. What is the 1st Commandment?

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Mem

Senior Member
Sep 23, 2014
7,283
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#41
My partial quote that you responded to pertained to what Jesus said, and not to what Paul said. Contextually, Jesus was definitely referring to the law of Moses.

Jhn 5:45
Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust.
Jhn 5:46
For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me.
Jhn 5:47
But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?

As far as Paul is concerned, he directly quoted Moses from Deuteronomy 30:11-14, and he did so in relation to the righteousness which is of faith.

Deu 30:11
For this commandment which I command thee this day, it is not hidden from thee, neither is it far off.
Deu 30:12
It is not in heaven, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go up for us to heaven, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it?
Deu 30:13
Neither is it beyond the sea, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go over the sea for us, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it?
Deu 30:14
But the word is very nigh unto thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart, that thou mayest do it.

Rom 10:6
But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above)
Rom 10:7
Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead)
Rom 10:8
But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
Rom 10:9
That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Rom 10:10
For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

The children of Israel had the gospel preached unto them, and they could have inherited eternal life through it. Unfortunately, the gospel was not mixed with faith in most who heard it.

Heb 4:2
For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.

In context, the them was the children of Israel.
Do you mean to equate the law with the gospel?
 

Aaron56

Well-known member
Jul 12, 2021
3,073
1,812
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#43
The children of Israel had the gospel preached unto them, and they could have inherited eternal life through it. Unfortunately, the gospel was not mixed with faith in most who heard it.

Heb 4:2
For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.

In context, the them was the children of Israel.
Certainly. But the gospel included the end to the curse of the Law. God's original intent was not derailed by Israel's refusal to obey God at Sinai.

"The law as added because of transgressions."

Having concluded that all were under sin and the curse of the law, the gospel then included salvation from that curse AND the promises given to Abraham 430 years prior to Sinai and to Christ from the foundation of the world before time.

BTW: it's not like the gospel obtained a new function because of the Law rather, its power was sufficient to even remove the curse at Sinai.
 
Nov 14, 2024
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#44
Certainly. But the gospel included the end to the curse of the Law. God's original intent was not derailed by Israel's refusal to obey God at Sinai.

"The law was added because of transgressions."

Having concluded that all were under sin and the curse of the law, the gospel then included salvation from that curse AND the promises given to Abraham 430 years prior to Sinai and to Christ from the foundation of the world before time.

BTW: it's not like the gospel obtained a new function because of the Law rather, its power was sufficient to even remove the curse at Sinai.
We are possibly/probably in total agreement, but I am not sure if I am understanding you correctly.

I definitely agree that Christ was foreordained to be the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world from before the foundation of the world (1 Pet. 1:18-20, John 1:29), and that definitely greatly preceded the giving of the law.

I also definitely agree that Abraham had the gospel preached unto him (Gal. 3:8) prior to the giving of the law, and that the covenant which was confirmed before of God in Christ was in no way disannulled when the law was added 430 afterwards (Gal. 3:17).

I also definitely agree that Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law while being made a curse for us (Gal. 3:13).

My only possible point of contention, and that is only IF I am reading you correctly (I might not be), is that I fully believe that Christ provided a means for the people of Moses' day to similarly be redeemed from the curse of the law through faith in him. If not, then nobody was saved for approximately 1500 years while the law was in effect, and I am hoping that you do not believe that. If you do not believe that people under the law could have been freed from the curse of the law through faith in Christ, then I definitely disagree with you on that point.
 
Oct 24, 2012
16,843
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#45
@Mem pinpointed it exactly.

The Law at Sinai was only designed to preserve the current life of the Jews. That was God's promise through the Law at Sinai which includes the 10 Commandments. God kept His side of the covenant but the Jews could not keep theirs. That is why they became slaves to the Law and to God: they continued to live the lives God preserved through the covenant but they defaulted on their end. When that occurs, one side keeps the covenant and the other defaults, the ones who did not meet the requirements are debtors to the one who did. The problem was they owed God their lives, which is what He promised to preserve.

Life in Christ is not based on the covenant at Sinai. Because of Christ's sacrifice of His own life (which was required to end the curse of the Law) men who receive Christ as their Redeemer and Lord receive the same eternal life Jesus received upon His resurrection. This is the new life. Indeed it is new and not our old lives renovated; we died with Him when we receive Him. God the Father, then, gives new life to our mortal bodies.

Which bus the born again (new) life offered in the risen Christ, thanks Aaron

There is a gigantic difference, I think you explained it well to me anyways. I love Luke 21 where that woman gave little and the other rich person gave more than her. Jesus asked his disciples, who gave more? They supposed that rich man and Jesus corrected them.
The gigantic difference in first birth of flesh nature and the new birth in Father's Spirit and Truth that God seeks for us to see and be willing to be new
Wow is me
 

Aaron56

Well-known member
Jul 12, 2021
3,073
1,812
113
#46
My only possible point of contention, and that is only IF I am reading you correctly (I might not be), is that I fully believe that Christ provided a means for the people of Moses' day to similarly be redeemed from the curse of the law through faith in him. If not, then nobody was saved for approximately 1500 years while the law was in effect, and I am hoping that you do not believe that. If you do not believe that people under the law could have been freed from the curse of the law through faith in Christ, then I definitely disagree with you on that point.
I see.

Any who had faith beyond the confines of the Law would have been prisoners to Death until Christ appeared to them.

This is in the scriptures:

"And Jesus cried out again with a loud voice, and yielded up His spirit.

51 Then, behold, the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom; and the earth quaked, and the rocks were split, 52 and the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised; 53 and coming out of the graves after His resurrection, they went into the holy city and appeared to many."


So, although the Lamb was slain from the foundation of the world, the benefits of that could not be seen until, in the fullness of time, the Lamb was slain in time and space.

So, even though their hope was in something greater than what was promised in the Law, they were still held by the curse of the Law until it was broken. Once broken (by accepting the blood of Christ as the propitiation for their sins) they could be returned to the covenant between God and God, the promises of which were given to Abraham. In this covenant, the new life they receive is a life not vulnerable to the way of the world but a life from eternity, suitable for an everlasting condition with the Lord.
 
Nov 14, 2024
726
514
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#47
I see.

Any who had faith beyond the confines of the Law would have been prisoners to Death until Christ appeared to them.

This is in the scriptures:

"And Jesus cried out again with a loud voice, and yielded up His spirit.

51 Then, behold, the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom; and the earth quaked, and the rocks were split, 52 and the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised; 53 and coming out of the graves after His resurrection, they went into the holy city and appeared to many."

So, although the Lamb was slain from the foundation of the world, the benefits of that could not be seen until, in the fullness of time, the Lamb was slain in time and space.

So, even though their hope was in something greater than what was promised in the Law, they were still held by the curse of the Law until it was broken. Once broken (by accepting the blood of Christ as the propitiation for their sins) they could be returned to the covenant between God and God, the promises of which were given to Abraham. In this covenant, the new life they receive is a life not vulnerable to the way of the world but a life from eternity, suitable for an everlasting condition with the Lord.
Under the new covenant or new testament, our bodies are still subject to death.

Rom 8:10
And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
Rom 8:11
But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

We (those under the new covenant), like they (those under the old covenant), have a hope of receiving glorified bodies at Christ's return.
 

Aaron56

Well-known member
Jul 12, 2021
3,073
1,812
113
#48
Under the new covenant or new testament, our bodies are still subject to death.

Rom 8:10
And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
Rom 8:11
But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

We (those under the new covenant), like they (those under the old covenant), have a hope of receiving glorified bodies at Christ's return.
"Death" was capital "d". As in the authority of.

Jesus did not receive the keys of death and hell until after He appeared as the Christ.

"All authority has been given to Me".

As proof, the graves opened up at the moment of His sacrifice.

Furthermore, it is given unto men once to die. We may die with the Lord or we may die in our sins.