Believing on his name

[Everlasting-Grace]

View attachment 273403

Like that maze shows. its impossible

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

Does obedience earn salvation?

If your doing it to be saved. then yes. But it can't. it will be rejected

Does following Jesus earn salvation?

Again, if your doing it to be saved. then it is works based. but you can not be obedient enough. so you will fail

Does abiding in the doctrine of Christ earn salvation? Is looking to the author of eternal salvation cause one to be self-righteous or is it looking to His righteousness? To suggest one believes they earn salvation for doing so is to say that Jesus and all His apostles and the NT writers taught you can earn salvation, which you most definitely cannot. A lot of get so concerned with earning salvation (an impossibility) that they lose sight of what obedience actually is.

Anyone. who states they have to do anything to gain or keep salvation, or prevent them from losing salvation. Is trying to save themselves.

They can be like the jews and pump their chest all they want. they have failed to repent. and are lost.

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

Does any form of obedience earn what Jesus did on the cross for us to have salvation?

is the penalty of sin obedience?

If it is, then what form of obedience does one have to do to have that penalty removed

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

You are now saying an outright blatant lie about me. I emphatically said I do not believe we earn salvation, but now you accuse me of believing I do because I do not believe in OSAS? That’s absolute nonsense and an outright lie. You are also saying obedience earns what Jesus did on the cross in saying such. For the record, I never said I didn’t believe in the security of the believer, just not OSAS. There’s a big difference. I can just as easily say if you believe in OSAS then you believe you can live like the devil and still be saved. There’s no way around it. The only other option is for you to say they were never saved when faced with the truth. What’s funny is in order not to be considered “never truly saved”, you would be doing the same thing you accuse me of. Having faith in Jesus to obey, or else you were never saved. Thus, your own argument about trying to earn salvation actually applies to you, as you are making it conditional upon an obedient faith, which you classify as earning salvation, yet it is impossible to do such. And there is no way around that.

Thanks for your time.

Eternal security = the belief that the moment one is born again (john 3) according to John 3 by faith in Christ. their new birth is eternal and can never be lost

OSAS teaches that once a person is saved (ie, once they are born again by faith) they will remain saved forever (always saved)

so they both in fact state the same thing.

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

Just because I do not believe in OSAS does NOT mean I believe in earning salvation!!!! You are not approaching this discussion about salvation and differing beliefs with grace and respect!! Believing that one must continue in faith and obedience does NOT equate to earning salvation!!

How would you feel if I accused you believing something falsely because of what you believe?

I’m done!!

I would disagree.

if you believe salvation can be lost (or as we call NOSAS or not once saved always saved) then you feel some type of work myst be done in order to stay saved.

So personally I would question what you believed also

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

No contradiction. So, when will you BELIEVE?

amen

stop believing in self and believe in Jesus ie, repent

 

[GWH]

I would disagree.

if you believe salvation can be lost (or as we call NOSAS or not once saved always saved) then you feel some type of work myst be done in order to stay saved.

So personally I would question what you believed also

Until a couple of days ago I tended to separate work from faith as many do, but someone on CC prompted me to gain the following insight:

There is no qualitative difference between faith that accepts God’s saving grace at conversion (once saved) and faith that accepts God’s working grace while walking/living (continuing salvation or perseverance, EPH 2:8-10, 2CR 5:7), but only a quantitative difference as each additional moment passes–and of course faith-work remains non-meritorious during the saint’s entire lifetime.

 

[mailmandan]

If your doing it to be saved. then yes. But it can't. it will be rejected

Again, if your doing it to be saved. then it is works based. but you can not be obedient enough. so you will fail

Anyone. who states they have to do anything to gain or keep salvation, or prevent them from losing salvation. Is trying to save themselves.

They can be like the jews and pump their chest all they want. they have failed to repent. and are lost.

Such folks who believe salvation is works based, remind me of the Pharisee in the parable of the Pharisee and the tax collector. Luke 18:9 - And He also told this parable to some people who trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and viewed others with contempt/despised others/look down on everyone else. 10 “Two men went up into the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. 11 The Pharisee stood and was praying this to himself: ‘God, I thank You that I am not like other people: swindlers, unjust, adulterers, or even like this tax collector. 12 I fast twice a week; I pay tithes of all that I get.’ (notice all the I) 13 But the tax collector, standing some distance away, was even unwilling to lift up his eyes to heaven, but was beating his breast, saying, ‘God, be merciful to me, the sinner!’ 14 I tell you, this man went to his house justified rather than the other; for everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, but he who humbles himself will be exalted.”

 

[Dino246]

I think it is important to use the language of the King James Version of the Holy Bible (the standard $8-$12 variety, ie. the actual Holy Bible) when believing on his name, or it might NOT happen, because you are believing something else.

You have obviously drunk the KJV-only Kool-Aid. Your claim is COMPLETELY ridiculous. Do your homework and stop promoting cultic lies.

 

[HeIsHere]

Until a couple of days ago I tended to separate work from faith as many do, but someone on CC prompted me to gain the following insight:

There is no qualitative difference between faith that accepts God’s saving grace at conversion (once saved) and faith that accepts God’s working grace while walking/living (continuing salvation or perseverance, EPH 2:8-10, 2CR 5:7), but only a quantitative difference as each additional moment passes–and of course faith-work remains non-meritorious during the saint’s entire lifetime.

There is actually a qualitative difference, one is called justification and the other is called sanctification.

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

Until a couple of days ago I tended to separate work from faith as many do, but someone on CC prompted me to gain the following insight:

There is no qualitative difference between faith that accepts God’s saving grace at conversion (once saved) and faith that accepts God’s working grace while walking/living (continuing salvation or perseverance, EPH 2:8-10, 2CR 5:7), but only a quantitative difference as each additional moment passes–and of course faith-work remains non-meritorious during the saint’s entire lifetime.

I think we just need to see why we are doing any type of work.

are we doing it because we want to make sure we are saved.

Are we doing it so we can make sure we do not lose salvation.

are we doing it for anything to do with salvation.

if we are. God calls those self righteous works.

We work to serve and love others. not self.

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

There is actually a qualitative difference, one is called justification and the other is called sanctification.

spot on

 

[Kroogz]

There is actually a qualitative difference, one is called justification and the other is called sanctification.

Exactly.

Romans 8:16
The Spirit himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God,

2 Corinthians 1:22
And who has also put his seal on us and given us his Spirit in our hearts as a guarantee.

We are commanded to not grieve or quench the Spirit. Be filled with the Spirit and walk in the Spirit.

He is our guarantee. We are not our own. We have the same seal as the Son.......The Holy Spirit is not the spirit who says," I might leave you or you might kick me out."


1 John 4:1
Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world.

And IMO, One cannot continue on to sanctification with loss of salvation mentality. That is grieving and quenching His Spirit.

 

[GWH]

There is actually a qualitative difference, one is called justification and the other is called sanctification.

That is what I thought too until I realized that sanctification is merely a moment by moment extension of justification requiring the same faith from first to last (RM 1:17).

 

[HeIsHere]

And IMO, One cannot continue on to sanctification with loss of salvation mentality. That is grieving and quenching His Spirit.

I would say your IMO is exactly what the scripture repeats over and over again and is the very reason and focus of the epistles written to the churches of the time.

 

[HeIsHere]

That is what I thought too until I realized that sanctification is merely a moment by moment extension of justification requiring the same faith from first to last (RM 1:17).

It is stated "through" faith as to how one receives the complete gift, faith is not what keeps us saved, it is the object of our faith who saves.

Jesus saves.

 

[Kroogz]

It is stated "through" faith as to how one receives the complete gift, faith is not what keeps us saved, it is the object of our faith who saves.

Jesus saves.

This gets lost in "loss of salvation" faith. It is no longer The Lord Jesus Christ saving....It's MY obedience.

The First order of business(doctrine) is salvation. If salvation is not locked and loaded and 110% finished in our minds......We go nowhere in the christian way of life.

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

That is what I thought too until I realized that sanctification is merely a moment by moment extension of justification requiring the same faith from first to last (RM 1:17).

Actually it is different

Justification is a one time event.

sanctification is a lifetime event. which will not be completed until we are ressurected (called glorification)

 

[HeIsHere]

This gets lost in "loss of salvation" faith. It is no longer The Lord Jesus Christ saving....It's MY obedience.

The First order of business(doctrine) is salvation. If salvation is not locked and loaded and 110% finished in our minds......We go nowhere in the christian way of life.

I so agree!

We either trust in exactly what Christ Jesus offers (the completed gift of salvation) or we have not trusted at all.

 

[Kroogz]

I so agree!

We either trust in exactly what Christ Jesus offers (the completed gift of salvation) or we have not trusted at all.

And that gift is FULL of blessings and tools and logistical grace for us to utilize to advance in His plan for us.

Salvation/justification~~equal privilege equal opportunity.

Sanctification ~~equal privilege equal opportunity.

Glorification~~ ALL believers will be glorified. But rank and reign is based upon how we utilized all He gave us in time.....

2 Tim 2:12
If we endure, we will also reign with Him; If we deny Him, He will also deny us;