A call for unity and love
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I became a Christian because someone was not afraid to offend me. Was I offended yes but I was honest enough to admit I was wrong. I was not loved into becoming a Christian, just convinced.
Bless you for that word of encouragement, Ceph, and I encourage you to share the truth in love.
If anyone ever notices anything on our website <truthseekersfellowship.com > that is untrue
or something I say in these threads that is unloving, please let me let me know, but keep in mind
that Jesus and Paul provoked unrighteous people (Matt. 13:14-15, Acts 28:26-27).
Apparently, you were a truthseeker, obeying Matt. 7:7 without realizing it at the time, PTL!
I wonder just how many people realise exactly what God's sovereignty means entirely,
For me God sovereignty rules over mans free will, and no amount of anyone's will can determine what God decides, for most part when I read people's explanations of free will they really never include self determination with it.
Because honestly friend really that's all man's own free will equates to, self determination equates to the choices we make . If we then ask the question Can God be sovereign over self determination as in the choices a person makes then this goes one of two ways, either God has granted a person faith or he hasn't, and again for those he has granted faith he foreknew because of his foreknowledge, and for those he knows he also directs there steps, and for his people only his people are helped to rule over sin in advance, I don't think you would find a saved people committing or commuting a sin without checking in with God first. Those he chooses to ignore may feel there talking to God but truly there not.
But guess what he also knew in advance who would rule over sin and who wouldn't, which could only truly mean one thing that everyone gets a chance.
1. God’s omnipotence means that He can do everything except “disown Himself” or not be God (2Tim. 2:13). It does NOT mean that God can perform logical absurdities, such as creating a rock too large for Him to move. Omnipotence or sovereignty also means that human MFW has limits with regard to how it can contradict God’s will. God provides morally competent humans the ability to resist His intentional will and plan of salvation (POS) within limits, such as the time limit that will end with death, resurrection (the last miracle) and judgment (per Heb. 9:27)–called His permissive will.
2. God’s power is equivalent to His omniscience. Jeremiah wrote that “God made the earth by his power; he founded the world by his wisdom.” (Jer. 10:12) Many NT passages refer to God as the source of true wisdom (e.g., Acts 6:3, 1Cor. 1:25, Col. 2:2-3, Jam. 1:5). God’s infinitely superior knowledge is extolled in Romans 11:33-34 (echoing Isa. 40:13-14) and Daniel 2:20-23.
Omniscience includes knowledge of people’s thoughts (Psa. 94:11, Matt. 12:25) and the foreknowledge of events (Acts 2:23, Rom. 8:29, 11:2, 1Pet. 1:2). Some people think that God even knows what a person will be/do before that person exists (Jer. 1:5). If this view is correct, it must be maintained that God’s foreknowledge does not predetermine a person’s spiritual choice regarding the satisfaction of God’s requirement for salvation or else moral responsibility would be abrogated.
I find it simpler to think that God merely tweaks the river of history occasionally to keep if flowing in the direction He intends but allows the fish to swim as they wish. God allows eddies in the river of salvation.
The thing about free will is that is that God never does anything without a reason and he gave adam and eve specific directions to not eat the fruit he gave them a choice he did the same with cain saying that sin is crouching at the door but he must rule over it. These are perhaps the most prime examples of free will and with his sovernty he forknew the choices they would make right? But then what was the purpose of giving them that choice to begin with if he forekenew it? it wouldn't make sense to do that I mean if you think about it he doesn't do anything for no reason but lets say that his mind can be changed based on the choices we make lets also say that the mere fact we are able to decide things like say to believe in him or not really can change things
Then it would make sense that he gave them those choices otherwise if not then how do you explain him doing that?
Hi
, well I would say it's always wise to be open to interpretation, and to understand a person's point of view. Cain eve adam are people he foreknew, as I said earlier everyone gets a chance.Meaning at some point God visits everyone in some kind of one to one talking, you could reason the question how did God know sin was crouching at Cain's door or really why would God warn Adam not to eat from the tree,
This is where we must always puts Gods knowledge above ours, as with God all things are possible, me and you can be like his son that walked the earth in kindness and humility love compassion but we can never have abilities God has.
When I read these passages I see God giving people the chance to change there destiny, which as it probably stood that was not going to happen for Cain and Adam but never the less he warned them, but because he allows Freedom of choice he did not tell either Cain or Adam this is going to happen and here let me show you your future,
If we lean on the understanding why would he need to warn them, you then start to think if he knew he wouldn't have warned them, this is where God's sovereignty and his great knowledge start being looked upon with a man's own mind.
God moves in mysterious ways, and for some messages seen more mysterious than others, but here's the thing if we lean on our own understandings and favour one interpretation over the other this again is down to our own self determination, unless we seek God for answers we just end up putting ourselves first, for me if I lean on your question, to which i doubt it's something you truly believe, and more a question that could be blocking you. I would then start to take away God's sovereignty.
But I'm sure God has dealt with a lot of people including myself thinking this is how I would do it if was God lol
Some people will believe all sorts of things because they heard one bad thing said about something.
If you can't believe Gof doesn't know what a person can do before he exists then I have to ask are you God ?
Maybe you should look to the bibke where God showed someone the future bye for now
Also if you can't believe un what your quoting then you have to disbelieve what I'm asking.
I'll give you a clue it was something shown to John in revelation. Bye for now
Blessings
bye for nowAlso if you can't believe un what your quoting then you have to disbelieve what I'm asking.
I'll give you a clue it was something shown to John in revelation. Bye for now
Blessings
How do you explain the choices given to adam and eve and to cain? why did he give them a choice?
“Yes there are times when you cannot take what Jesus says literally but for a lot of scripture it is not in patables or story telling”
yes agree. The parables and stories Jesus uses are lessons that conclude with a point he’s making usually they begin with a question like this
“Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times? Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven.”
Matthew 18:21-22 KJV
Now he’s going to teach Peter a lesson regarding God and his kingdom and forgiveness, but he’s going to use an “ example story “ in a setting that we can grasp like this
“Therefore is the kingdom of heaven likened unto a certain king, which would take account of his servants. And when he had begun to reckon, one was brought unto him, which owed him ten thousand talents. But forasmuch as he had not to pay, his Lord commanded him to be sold, and his wife, and children, and all that he had, and payment to be made. The servant therefore fell down, and worshipped him, saying, Lord, have patience with me, and I will pay thee all. Then the Lord of that servant was moved with compassion, and loosed him, and forgave him the debt. But the same servant went out, and found one of his fellowservants, which owed him an hundred pence: and he laid hands on him, and took him by the throat, saying, Pay me that thou owest. And his fellowservant fell down at his feet, and besought him, saying, Have patience with me, and I will pay thee all. And he would not: but went and cast him into prison, till he should pay the debt. So when his fellowservants saw what was done, they were very sorry, and came and told unto their Lord all that was done. Then his Lord, after that he had called him, said unto him, O thou wicked servant, I forgave thee all that debt, because thou desiredst me: shouldest not thou also have had compassion on thy fellowservant, even as I had pity on thee? And his Lord was wroth, and delivered him to the tormentors, till he should pay all that was due unto him.”
Matthew 18:23-34 KJV
He’s saying “ forgiveness in the kingdom of God is like this story “
Then he puts the punctuation on the lesson he’s taught. In answering peters inquiry
“So likewise shall my heavenly Father do also unto you, if ye from your hearts forgive not every one his brother their trespasses.”
Matthew 18:35 KJV
see what I was saying is Jesus is using a story that we humans can relate to a situation to teach us about forgivness and how even though like the man in the story were forgiven by the Lord through Christs sacrifice ….we need to reciprocate with the mercy he gave us and not be like the man in the story who wouldn’t forgive the person who owed him a little amount when he was forgiven for the great debt
We forget that just as Jesus died for my sins and I didn’t earn that……he also died for the persons sin , who sinned against me.
and so we need to not hold things against others because we have to still be brought before the judge
“For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy;
and mercy rejoiceth against judgment.”
James 2:13 KJV
when we each do this
“For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or evil.”
2 Corinthians 5:10 KJV
Jesus who’s the one that will judge us taught this
“Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful. Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven: give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall be given into your bosom.
For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.”
Luke 6:36-38 KJV
That story Jesus uses is where the apostles lessons came from . I just wanted to be clear everything he said was important I was only saying we should carefully and prayerfully read and consider because some of it can be easily misunderstood to mean something it doesn’t like “pluck out your eyes “ cut off your hands “ ect
tbose parables will teach us more than anything honestly with prayer and seeking
maybe you missed something in my post I believe I given you an answer for this, well one that's supported by more understanding of the bible.
May I ask why this important is you
Oh I must have missed your answer to that that is my bad my eyes are bad so sometimes I miss things when reading
The reason it is important to me is because the mere fact that they were given a choice regardless if he knew the outcome says something
oh sorry I've just realised I quoted the wrong person in post 191, i was meant to be quoting mr GHW ,post 191 192 193 was meant for him sorry not you my friend,
Bye for now, blessings
oh sorry I've just realised I quoted the wrong person in post 191, i was meant to be quoting mr GHW ,post 191 192 193 was meant for him sorry my friend,
Bye for now, blessings
well this is what foreknew means friend, he gave them a choice because he knew