Do protestants have a reasonable non-Roman-Catholic explanation for John 20:22-23?

[Aaron56]

In Rome, there were many Pontifex Maxmimi (link) before Peter. When the Romans chose Christianity to be the state religion, to make the church serve the empire, they simply began a new line of leaders called "Popes". But they also kept with their tradition and gave the title "Pontifex Maximus" to each new pope.

In tradition, the PM was the ultimate governor of religious matters. In polytheistic Rome, the office of PM arranged celebrations, alms giving events, and ceremonies of all the temples.

For example, the Vestal Virgins (link) were women who took a vow of chastity and attended the hearth fires: sacred fires that must always burn. Because of their vow they were given high status within Roman culture.

Here's a picture of some in action:

Look familiar? Of course. They are Rome's modern day "nuns". Rome simply repurposed that sect of religious virgins (that began ~ 500 B.C.) into their own brand of religious virgins.

Popes = Pontifex Maximus
Cardinals = Roman Senate
Bishops = Governors
Nuns = Vestal Virgins
Queen of Heaven = Roman Goddess worship

This was all done to appease the poly-theistic citizens of the Roman Empire

 

[beechan]

1 Timothy 2:5-6: "For there is one God and one mediator between God and mankind, the man Christ Jesus…”

Well, I am speaking of intercessor, not mediator.
Go and check how two terms are different.

 

[Aaron56]

Updated list of saints (“Roman deities”) and their super powers: https://focus.org/posts/a-guide-to-patron-saints-for-every-situation/

this appeased the Roman population that was used to praying to different deities for different needs. The Roman church just substituted new names for the same needs. https://greekgodsandgoddesses.net/roman/

 

[Me_Clay]

Hi Aaron56

How are you?

Kind regards
Clay

 

[beechan]

In Rome, there were many Pontifex Maxmimi (link) before Peter. When the Romans chose Christianity to be the state religion, to make the church serve the empire, they simply began a new line of leaders called "Popes". But they also kept with their tradition and gave the title "Pontifex Maximus" to each new pope.

In tradition, the PM was the ultimate governor of religious matters. In polytheistic Rome, the office of PM arranged celebrations, alms giving events, and ceremonies of all the temples.

For example, the Vestal Virgins (link) were women who took a vow of chastity and attended the hearth fires: sacred fires that must always burn. Because of their vow they were given high status within Roman culture.

Here's a picture of some in action:

Look familiar? Of course. They are Rome's modern day "nuns". Rome simply repurposed that sect of religious virgins (that began ~ 500 B.C.) into their own brand of religious virgins.

Popes = Pontifex Maximus
Cardinals = Roman Senate
Bishops = Governors
Nuns = Vestal Virgins
Queen of Heaven = Roman Goddess worship

This was all done to appease the poly-theistic citizens of the Roman Empire

You are trying to put similarities of Catholic nuns with Roman Vestal Virgins but hiding much of their differences.

First, Vestal Virgins were chosen by Pontifex Maxmimi from girls.
The girls were not always voluntary to do the service.
Catholic nuns are all voluntary, answering vocation.

Vestal Virgins served only 30 years and after that they could marry, if some men wished to take such over-aged woman as wife.
Catholic nuns are for life unless they asked for returning to live as laywomen.

 

[DeanM]

The word 'trinity' is not found in scripture, but the theology is inferred from bible verses.

In the same manner, Mary's Assumption is not proven by a single verse, but inferred from biblical patterns and theological reasoning.

Show me. After pentecost Mary is never mentioned again.

 

[DeanM]

May be when Martin Luther left the church , his church was so poor and cannot afford making statues good for worshiping GOD.
So is the same to many Protestant doniminations today.

Or maybe he left because of corruption? Such as worshipping the wafer, indulgences being sold to pay for the church called St. Peters. The crusades to kill jews and take their treasures.

 

[beechan]

Or maybe he left because of corruption? Such as worshipping the wafer.

Don't you know that the Lutheran Church does believe the Real Presence in Euchrist??

Look like your church has no wafer to offer. Your sunday church is just a social gathering: sing, dance and gossip a little.

 

[DeanM]

You are trying to put similarities of Catholic nuns with Roman Vestal Virgins but hiding much of their differences.

First, Vestal Virgins were chosen by Pontifex Maxmimi from girls.
The girls were not always voluntary to do the service.
Catholic nuns are all voluntary, answering vocation.

Vestal Virgins served only 30 years and after that they could marry, if some men wished to take such over-aged woman as wife.
Catholic nuns are for life unless they asked for returning to live as laywomen.

Martin Luther married a nun. Guess she saw the light too.

 

[DeanM]

You don't know that the Lutheran Church does believe the Real Presence in Euchrist??

Look like your church has no wafer to offer. Your church is just a social gathering: sing, dance and gossip a little.

You know nothing about what goes on in a legitimate church.

 

[DeanM]

Don't you know that the Lutheran Church does believe the Real Presence in Euchrist??

Look like your church has no wafer to offer. Your sunday church is just a social gathering: sing, dance and gossip a little.

I notice yku cherry pick what you choose to answer. What about murdering jews and calling it a holy crusade?

 

[DeanM]

Don't you know that the Lutheran Church does believe the Real Presence in Euchrist??

Look like your church has no wafer to offer. Your sunday church is just a social gathering: sing, dance and gossip a little.

All protstant churches take communion. They just dont sacrifice Christ all over again when they do. And they dont say hocus pocus and claim it turns into flesh. And im not Lutheran

 

[beechan]

I notice yku cherry pick what you choose to answer. What about murdering jews and calling it a holy crusade?

I also notice that you failed to focus on discussion on a specific issue. You tried hard to paint the Catholic Church black.
When one issue: Assumption of Mary failed, you put up Vestal Virgins of Rome. It failed again and you put up 'worshipping wafer'. It failed and you now turning to 'killing Jews' and 'Crusades'.
What's next in your list? Sex scandals of church? Priest celibacy? using candles and incense..may be

 

[DeanM]

I also notice that you failed to focus on discussion on a specific issue. You tried hard to paint the Catholic Church black.
When one issue: Assumption of Mary failed, you put up Vestal Virgins of Rome. It failed again and you put up 'worshipping wafer'. It failed and you now turning to 'killing Jews' and 'Crusades'.
What's next in your list? Sex scandals of church?

No bubby. The vestal virgin comments were from someone else who knows what they're talking about. As for murdering jews for treasure yes, i did mention that but you wanted to ignore that. Try and keep up.

 

[beechan]

All protstant churches take communion. They just dont sacrifice Christ all over again when they do. And they dont say hocus pocus and claim it turns into flesh. And im not Lutheran

That's why I said Protestants have numerious denominations teaching different things.

 

[beechan]

No bubby. The vestal virgin comments were from someone else who knows what they're talking about. As for murdering jews for treasure yes, i did mention that but you wanted to ignore that. Try and keep up.

show me a historical event where Catholics murdered, massacred Jews for their treasure.

 

[beechan]

No bubby. The vestal virgin comments were from someone else who knows what they're talking about. .

So you knowledge just come from hearsay!
This is well demonstrated on how you disprove the Catholic Church.

 

[Dino246]

Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee;
Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus.
Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen.

The two verses are actually from the Bible. God inspired Luke to write verses to praise Mary.

No, He did not. Luke didn't "write verses to praise Mary"; he wrote verses stating that Mary was blessed among women because she was chosen to bear the Saviour. That's it, that's all.

The last part is a petition for intercession: Mary, please help me to bring my message and prayer to Christ.

Which is idolatry. There is one mediator between God and man, not two. Jesus is not deaf, and He is not too busy to hear us. In contrast Scripture records Jesus telling us to pray to the Father.

 

[Dino246]

show me a historical event where Catholics murdered, massacred Jews for their treasure.

The first crusade, and the inquisition.

 

[DeanM]

show me a historical event where Catholics murdered, massacred Jews for their treasure.

Its history. Called the crusades. The pope needed money for St. Peters to be built. I guess the indulgences werent enough. Put away your cachechism and read some history. Rhineland Massacre would be a starting point for you.