Once Saved Always Saved?

[notIbutChrist]

actually, from an Arminian perspective, it is only Synergistic in saying that man has a small role in his salvation, but not to the point where he works for his salvation... no classical Arminian has ever stated that Arminianism is a gospel of works...

that is Calvinist propaganda

Very true.

 

[Zilla64007]

Hiya zone,

Gospel truth is always attacked by enthusiasts, pharisees and arminians.

5SOLAS

interesting you should say that, because 1400 years before Calvinism, NO ONE WAS A CALVINIST, nor held to Calvinistic concepts. They were all Non-Calvinists...

Justin Martyr
Irenaeus
Hippolytus
Methodius
Tatian
Polycarp
Second Clement
Clement of Rome
Clement of Alexandria
Tertullian
Origen
Commodianus
Cyprian
Victorinus
Lactantius

ALL Non-Calvinists

the gospel truth was attacked by Gnostics and Greek Philosophers... and that same epicurean philosophy has infiltrated almost all of Christianity

 

[zone]

Hiya zone,

Gospel truth is always attacked by enthusiasts, pharisees and arminians.

5SOLAS

amen.
yes, it is.

Finney and his ilk are favorites....in spite of their trashing of core doctrines, hey! they held 'revivals' and "millions" were "saved"....for a few months.

i wonder why folks never ask themselves why the METHODists are called METHODists?
LOL.

arminianism = lawlessness.

anybody who thinks they keep the Law doesn't need Jesus. He gets the nod though. helpful Jesus

 

[iamsoandso]

now that said of salvation,,,,,,,,,that is you can recieve it or you can try to save yourself,,,,,,,,,,,or else if you denie the cross youll try to figure out how to "get saved',,,,,,,,,,,,your works will show evedence of your faith,,,,,,what will you do will you believe you must do it????????or will you believe he did it??????????? one will rest from his works and be at peace,a great weight will be lifted off his shoulders, he will rest in the saboath,and the other will be thrust into agoney,,,,,,,,,,,,,,he will open the the scriptures and panic,,,,he will try to figure out what to do to get saved,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,"search ye the schripture,for in them you you think you might obtain life,but they are they which confess me"

 

[zone]

actually, from an Arminian perspective, it is only Synergistic in saying that man has a small role in his salvation, but not to the point where he works for his salvation... no classical Arminian has ever stated that Arminianism is a gospel of works...

that is Calvinist propaganda

what small role does man play in his salvation?
any role is synergism.

man decides, and God gets to act.

lucky God.

 

[Zilla64007]

amen.
yes, it is.

Finney and his ilk are favorites....in spite of their trashing of core doctrines, hey! they held 'revivals' and "millions" were "saved"....for a few months.

i wonder why folks never ask themselves why the METHODists are called METHODists?
LOL.

arminianism = lawlessness.

anybody who thinks they keep the Law doesn't need Jesus. He gets the nod though. helpful Jesus

so says a person who believes they can "SIN BOLDLY"... even deny the Loprd that bought them... and still be saved... I'm not a Methodist by the way...

Lutheranism = Gnosticism

anybody who thinks they can sin all they want and still be saved is doomed to burn in the lake of fire

 

[Zilla64007]

what small role does man play in his salvation?
any role is synergism.

man decides, and God gets to act.

lucky God.

not unlike you, who believes one can rape and murder a child, and still think they can be saved without repenting of it

and i never said man is saved by works. Neither Did ANY classical Arminian.

 

[notIbutChrist]

Originally Posted by zone

arminianism = lawlessness.

anybody who thinks they keep the Law doesn't need Jesus. He gets the nod though. helpful Jesus

Do you realize how ignorant you sound? arminianism = lawlessness, thats just plain dumb. And as far as not needing Jesus, there is no salvation through any other. Do you think anyone could obey Christ except they have Christ in them, and God's grace enabling them. You build a strawman just to knock down. Anyone can see you are being intellectually dishonest.

 

[zone]

so says a person who believes they can "SIN BOLDLY"... even deny the Loprd that bought them... and still be saved... I'm not a Methodist by the way...

Lutheranism = Gnosticism

anybody who thinks they can sin all they want and still be saved is doomed to burn in the lake of fire

so, instead of honoring my request (or just generally being honest) to actually put a stop to the myth and read the actual quote, you just carry on with it. why didn't read the actual quote?
that's okay.

you're entitled to any beliefs you like. we all are i reckon.

so Lutheranism is gnosticism too? oh my.

could you please explain what gnosticism is zilla?

i didn't say you were methodist. you're in the Holiness crowd. do you believe in the Second work of grace/Second baptism that burns out the sin nature and you're now sinless?

take care zilla.
zone.

 

[iamsoandso]

calvanism,,,,,,,,,,heres food for thought ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,"and death and hell gave up the dead that was in them",,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,both are raised from the dead ,,,,,,,,,but one is in torment and the other in peace,,,,,,,,,,,,but both are raised from the dead

 

[notIbutChrist]

do you believe in the Second work of grace/Second baptism that burns out the sin nature and you're now sinless?

take care zilla.
zone.

Second work of grace huh, the first work of grace makes us a new creation in the very image of Christ Himself. Was Jesus Christ not sinless?

 

[tribesman]

Finney and his ilk are favorites....in spite of their trashing of core doctrines, hey! they held 'revivals' and "millions" were "saved"....for a few months.

Basically both libertines and legalists are antinomian heresies by nature. Because none of them accepts what the law says about sin. One will say that their indulgement in sin is no sin or is a sign of grace, whilst the other will say that their sin is no sin, saying "I don't call that sin". Both are ignorant of the righteousness of God, which is revealed in the gospel.

 

[zone]

Do you realize how ignorant you sound? arminianism = lawlessness, thats just plain dumb. And as far as not needing Jesus, there is no salvation through any other. Do you think anyone could obey Christ except they have Christ in them, and God's grace enabling them. You build a strawman just to knock down. Anyone can see you are being intellectually dishonest.

arminianism = synergism.

synergism says you are able to reach the point of obeying the Law, thereby pleasing God by your righteousness (they'll say AFTER His initial Grace)

synergism is antinomianism (lawlessness) since it takes a very low view of sin, and a dangerously low view of God's Law.

well, i know the saved by my own righteousness crowd will see it as intellectual dishonesty and ignorance and dumb.

but that's never bothered me, i've been called worse.

zone.

 

[notIbutChrist]

Basically both libertines and legalists are antinomian heresies by nature. Because none of them accepts what the law says about sin. One will say that their indulgement in sin is no sin or is a sign of grace, whilst the other will say that their sin is no sin, saying "I don't call that sin". Both are ignorant of the righteousness of God, which is revealed in the gospel.

This is a true statement, but if you promote OSAS aren't you, yourself an antinomian

 

[zone]

Second work of grace huh, the first work of grace makes us a new creation in the very image of Christ Himself. Was Jesus Christ not sinless?

are you sinless?

 

[notIbutChrist]

arminianism = synergism.

synergism says you are able to reach the point of obeying the Law, thereby pleasing God by your righteousness (they'll say AFTER His initial Grace)

synergism is antinomianism (lawlessness) since it takes a very low view of sin, and a dangerously low view of God's Law.

well, i know the saved by my own righteousness crowd will see it as intellectual dishonesty and ignorance and dumb.

but that's never bothered me, i've been called worse.

zone.

Gentiles were never commanded to keep the law, but we are commanded to refrain from sin, and it is not our own righteousness that makes us able, but Christ is us, as we crucify our flesh

 

[notIbutChrist]

are you sinless?

I am. I have not sinned since my last confession. (Not to my priest, but to God). Therefore I have no unrepentant sin in my life rendering me sinless.

 

[zone]

Basically both libertines and legalists are antinomian heresies by nature. Because none of them accepts what the law says about sin. One will say that their indulgement in sin is no sin or is a sign of grace, whilst the other will say that their sin is no sin, saying "I don't call that sin". Both are ignorant of the righteousness of God, which is revealed in the gospel.

yes indeed.
one wonders if they've only ever listened to the revivalists, or have actually read the Law themselves, heard its pronouncement against them.

i suppose if they had, they'd be very pleased about the Finished Work of Christ, looking for a righteousness not their own.

c'est la vie.
zone.

 

[iamsoandso]

look it sounds bold but if you can do somthing to "get saved,earn your salvation" then you could thump christ on the nose and say "i didnt need you i saved myself",,,,,,,,,,,,,,,??????

 

[iamsoandso]

dont sound like the gosphel though does it????????